Are we tanking this year?

[BudweiserCeltic]

  Say we boil down talent into a basic video game 5 star system.



 

That sums up my basic disagreements with your view on the game of basketball.

That's fair.  I think that's what you said last time I brought this up.   That was back when you were expecting 40+ wins and playoff contention and I was expecting 26 wins based on our garbage roster.    This is obviously very overly simplified, but it's an easy way to come to grips with our team's talent.   The point I'm trying to illustrate is that adding a couple more 2.5 star players isn't going to dramatically improve this team.  Especially considering the 2.5 star talent we've added are positions we arguably are at our strongest (PG and SF).  We're still going to struggle to win 30 games this year.

Someone bring me that bottle of Nyquil.

And, for the record, I predicted 35+ wins, not 40+ wins.  I was wrong, very wrong, but not as wrong as you are suggesting.

To humor your video game rankings, let me also add that I give Rondo good odds to return to playing like a "four" this year.   

Many "optimistic" opinions last year also came with the condition that Rondo would be ready to play earlier than he did.

Also interesting to note that before we traded Lee, we were on pace for a 32-win season... of course it's not a straight-line, every season has it's up and downs, but worth considering about how "off" predictions were when taking into account had the conditions in which those prediction were offered were met.

[Neurotic Guy]

. . . and, it begins anew.

For me, personally, the worst part of being a Celtics fan last year was not the product on the court, but the blatant rooting for losses by a large contingent of the fan base.

Frankly, I found it distasteful, and will continue to find it distasteful this season.  I don't mean to tell anyone how to root for their favorite team, but I just wanted to share my thoughts on the matter.

Like last year, I'll be here to root for my team to win games throughout the season.  I expect bumps, but my commitment to wanting to see the Celtics win every time they play won't waiver.

And, while I may be setting myself up for disappointment, I fully expect this year's team to win considerably more games than last year's squad.

I still think there is a difference between wanting to lose and just have the expectations the team is going lose.


I want to see the Celtics win, I just don't expect it to happen.

Fair enough.  There are certainly plenty of posters who would prefer to see the team win 25 games to seeing them win 35 games.  And, while I understand the logic in that ("if we aren't likely to make the playoffs, and definitely not likely to be a serious contender if we manage to sneak in, we are better off maximizing our chances at ping pong balls"), I won't subscribe to that way of thinking.

If for no other reason, I'm pretty sure it would suck the joy out of what it means for me to be a sports fan.

I agree with this, too. Openly advocating for tanking seems to be counterproductive at best, and the byproduct of insipid arrogance at worst.

As the games went on last year, I began to hope for as high draft picks as possible.  I was Ok with Celtics losses and rooted for Nets losses and wins by LA, Sac, Utah, Bucks, etc.   

As the year unfolds, I can't say for sure whether I'll wind up again rooting for lottery position, but I am starting the year rooting all out for wins.   Mostly, I am rooting for excellent play by all celtics players -- increasing each player's value as we head into the trade deadline, and eventually, end of the year deals.   

There is no real upside to losing at this point.  This may change if the C's look awful and we end up challenging for a top 5 pick.  For now, though, I'll root hard for great play, improvement, and wins.

[greece66]

This is important to bear in mind:
"Under the terms of the new proposal, the league's four worst teams will have an equal 12 percent chance of earning the top pick, with the next two teams following with only slightly worse odds."
ie, [assuming the proposal goes through] you do not have to tank all the way like Phily did last year, but  it makes a lot of sense to be among the worst six teams.
http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2014/10/3/6902609/nba-draft-lottery-reform-2015-philadelphia-76ers-tank

[greece66]

I still think there is a difference between wanting to lose and just have the expectations the team is going lose.
I want to see the Celtics win, I just don't expect it to happen.

Precisely

[greece66]

We aren't tanking. We also aren't making stupid, short-sighted moves to get a little better now at the cost of next year or the year after.
The reality is that we would be willing to move guys who can contribute now, like Green, Thorton or Turner, for future assets.

OK, so the problem is that the word 'tanking' sounds bad.
Let's call it re-building. Or a five-year plan. Does this change reality one bit?

[LooseCannon]

If the Celtics would barely make the playoffs with Jeff Green but miss the playoffs if they make a trade jettisoning Green in exchange for a future top-ten protected first and a former lottery pick who still hasn't won consistent playing time after 2-3 seasons despite above-average athleticism, I'd rather keep Green and make the playoffs.  I'd like it if Ainge and Stevens felt the same way.

[Moranis]

. . . and, it begins anew.

For me, personally, the worst part of being a Celtics fan last year was not the product on the court, but the blatant rooting for losses by a large contingent of the fan base.

Frankly, I found it distasteful, and will continue to find it distasteful this season.  I don't mean to tell anyone how to root for their favorite team, but I just wanted to share my thoughts on the matter.

Like last year, I'll be here to root for my team to win games throughout the season.  I expect bumps, but my commitment to wanting to see the Celtics win every time they play won't waiver.

And, while I may be setting myself up for disappointment, I fully expect this year's team to win considerably more games than last year's squad.

The Boston Celtics are about winning championships, not about barely making the playoffs.  The best way to win championships is to have Gold Medal Superstar players.  The best way to get those is through the draft. 

[bostonsportsforlife]

I want to see wins, like really badly, but with the stage of the rebuild that we're at, I won't be that disappointed or angered by a bad season. I'm all in for a few years of this rebuild. I'm confident Danny has a plan that will pay off eventually.

[D.o.s.]

. . . and, it begins anew.

For me, personally, the worst part of being a Celtics fan last year was not the product on the court, but the blatant rooting for losses by a large contingent of the fan base.

Frankly, I found it distasteful, and will continue to find it distasteful this season.  I don't mean to tell anyone how to root for their favorite team, but I just wanted to share my thoughts on the matter.

Like last year, I'll be here to root for my team to win games throughout the season.  I expect bumps, but my commitment to wanting to see the Celtics win every time they play won't waiver.

And, while I may be setting myself up for disappointment, I fully expect this year's team to win considerably more games than last year's squad.

The Boston Celtics are about winning championships, not about barely making the playoffs. The best way to win championships is to have Gold Medal Superstar players.  The best way to get those is through the draft.

Bleh. The 'Titletown' nonsense is bad enough when you have to suffer through it in person.

[PAOBoston]

I'm for this team playing their young players to see what they have. This is Olynyk's 2nd year, Sullinger's 3rd, Smart's 1st. They have a bunch of other young players (Bradley/Zeller/Young) and possible reclamation projects (Turner, Thornton). If they win, great. If they dont, well, they are still rebuilding. I recognize it's a process. Tanking ala Philly doesnt guarantee squat. Cleveland won close to 30 games i think last year and still got the 1st pick overall. Instead of focusing on the wins/losses, focus on the players improvements, style of play, etc. That's what really matters in my opinion.

[cb8883]

. . . and, it begins anew.

For me, personally, the worst part of being a Celtics fan last year was not the product on the court, but the blatant rooting for losses by a large contingent of the fan base.

Frankly, I found it distasteful, and will continue to find it distasteful this season.  I don't mean to tell anyone how to root for their favorite team, but I just wanted to share my thoughts on the matter.

Like last year, I'll be here to root for my team to win games throughout the season.  I expect bumps, but my commitment to wanting to see the Celtics win every time they play won't waiver.

And, while I may be setting myself up for disappointment, I fully expect this year's team to win considerably more games than last year's squad.

The Boston Celtics are about winning championships, not about barely making the playoffs.  The best way to win championships is to have Gold Medal Superstar players.  The best way to get those is through the draft.

Absolutely correct. Tanking is the only way a star player comes to Boston. No one is signing here as a free agent. Stars run the league and are needed to win. No marginal rosters or amount of players over 28 on this team will change that.

[LooseCannon]

Tanking is the only way a star player comes to Boston.

Completely and utterly wrong.  You might as well tell me that Mike Brown is an awesome coach.

[Smokeeye123]

. . . and, it begins anew.

For me, personally, the worst part of being a Celtics fan last year was not the product on the court, but the blatant rooting for losses by a large contingent of the fan base.

Frankly, I found it distasteful, and will continue to find it distasteful this season.  I don't mean to tell anyone how to root for their favorite team, but I just wanted to share my thoughts on the matter.

Like last year, I'll be here to root for my team to win games throughout the season.  I expect bumps, but my commitment to wanting to see the Celtics win every time they play won't waiver.

And, while I may be setting myself up for disappointment, I fully expect this year's team to win considerably more games than last year's squad.

You would think, that after the number of times the C's have deliberately decided to suck, throw away whole seasons, and still ended up p---ed off on lotto night that people would be more interested in trying to actually win some games and get better, organically. 

Nope.  "We didn't tank hard enough last year!!!!"  Well, what the **** good would THAT have done us?

Oh I dont know, maybe land us a future allstar instead of another PG who cannot shoot?

One more loss and we would of had Dante Exum who is an infinitely better prospect than Smart.   And if we had the worst record we would of had one of Wiggins/Parker/Embiid with basically a 100% probability. So yes...we didnt tank hard enough.

[Smokeeye123]

Tanking is the only way a star player comes to Boston.

Completely and utterly wrong.  You might as well tell me that Mike Brown is an awesome coach.

If you added *And trades* to his statement I agree with it. No major free agent will ever sign with Boston.

[Celtics18]

. . . and, it begins anew.

For me, personally, the worst part of being a Celtics fan last year was not the product on the court, but the blatant rooting for losses by a large contingent of the fan base.

Frankly, I found it distasteful, and will continue to find it distasteful this season.  I don't mean to tell anyone how to root for their favorite team, but I just wanted to share my thoughts on the matter.

Like last year, I'll be here to root for my team to win games throughout the season.  I expect bumps, but my commitment to wanting to see the Celtics win every time they play won't waiver.

And, while I may be setting myself up for disappointment, I fully expect this year's team to win considerably more games than last year's squad.

The Boston Celtics are about winning championships, not about barely making the playoffs.  The best way to win championships is to have Gold Medal Superstar players.  The best way to get those is through the draft.

Your second and third statements are both highly debatable.