It is time to move on

[ctrey]

All this sentimentality is awful for the future of the Celtics. Both Pierce and KG should be moved. The most dangerous thing in the NBA is to be a middle of the road team, fighting for that 8 to 6 seed every year, never getting much better, never dipping into the heart of the lottery. Teams over the years like Atlanta, New York, Houston and Portland are perfect examples. Teams get to the top two ways in the NBA: Through the draft (Like the Thunder) or through free agency. (Miami Heat) Rarely do teams get better through trades. Frankly it was the Celtics who last did it in 2007. The Rockets have been the only team to take both routes: Trading for Harden while getting Asik and Lin as FA’s.

I submit that the Celtics have very little chance of ever getting better by snagging a top flight free agent. Why? A few reasons: One, the weather. It is cold and unpleasant for most of the playing season in Boston. Weather matters to players. Two, bad night life. Boston is considered by no one outside of Boston as a town you would ever pick to go to “Party” in. Three, it would appear that Doc may not stick around past this season. He would be the primary reason a player may come here and he looks like he could be gone by the time we have money to spend. Four, although it is not true and terribly unfair, Boston is still thought of as a racist and segregated town. Five, high tax rates. You lose an extra 10 to 15 percent playing for Boston in taxes.The reason teams in Texas and Florida do well getting FA's is no state or city income taxes. Greatly increases earnings. LA and NYC are immune to this tax issue because although taxes are high in both towns, their massive media markets allow for far more secondary streams of incomes for players. Along with the fact they are LA and NYC, the most high profile cities in the country.

So there are five reasons the C’s most likely not be a serious free agent player. Subsequently we have to get better in the draft. 2014 is the draft to do it even if we do not get the number one pick. An article I read recently stated that scouts say there are six to eight players in 2014 draft that if they were in the 2013 draft they would go number one. They say the 2014 may be better top to bottom than the 2003 draft with Lebron, Melo, Wade and the rest. Even if we got the 5th pick in that draft we would be adding a stunning talent to our team. I think we can safely say there is no way we are winning a title next year even if we “Kept the band together”. So if we do not win a title, would you rather pick 5th in 2014 or 16th again?

This team was mediocre all year. There is no arguing that point. By every metric, we were good enough to get in to the playoffs and then get bounced in the first round. I have no desire to watch the same thing next year for a “Farewell Tour”. This is the Celtics, not the Rolling Stones. I would prefer to start a serious rebuild now when we know that being in the lottery would mean aquiring an all star. Read around, they say the 2014 draft has 10 to 12 players with all star talent. If we must suffer through being bad, next year is the season to do it.

We have no cap space or assets to build around KG and PP like San Antonio did. Also frankly, Danny has not drafted as well as R.C. Buford in the back half of the draft over the last few years. Sad, but true. So there will be no situation next year where the C’s make a run like the Spurs unless Big Al comes and plays for the Vet Minimum out the goodness of his heart.

Yes, I will miss Pierce and KG. Still, I think letting them go find a place to grab one last ring is a better way to honor them than watching them play too many minutes to keep a mediocre team in the playoffs. It has been a joy to watch this team battle. We need to let them go now. It is time. KG and Pierce deserve to “Go to a better place”.

[lightspeed5]

one more year

[CelticConcourse]

one more year

ctrey's post makes the most sense but unfortunately, I don't think Danny or Doc or KG or Pierce or Rondo or the fanbase is ready to move on.... though it'd make sense to rebuild, I see us still going one more year

[17wasEZ]

All good points trey, but it's nice knowing I can have Russell, Bird, McHale, Hondo and others memorabilia and know they only wore one jersey in their career.  It's kind of a pride thing being a Celtic fan.

Even though KG didn't come to Boston until he was late in his career, he feels like a true Celtic because he takes that pride seriously.  I either wish they would retire together, or play this last season together.  I'm willing to live with the consequences.

[Sketch5]

If the Celts can bring in a Millsap or Smith with out giving up anything other than Bass,Lee,Bradley,Melo and any of the China guys I say do that, gives them one more year with a good chance with PP and KG. And still have a core of Rondo,Green,Sully,Smith/Millsap to add pieces to move ahead in the future and still compete.

But if they can't theres no reason not to move these guys if you can cut out 3 to 5 years of rebuilding. I love when these guys play well, its fun to watch, but those games have been few and fare in between. This was the fist season I really didn't enjoy much of, and was most frustrated watching. I enjoyed seeing Green get better and better and Sully do the same, PP was painful at times and KG was in cruze until the playoffs.

Its almost better watching a young inexperienced team loose than a team like last years, easier to root for, for some reason. Its like watching you kid play, they may not be good, but you love seeing them compete, and winning is the added bonus. 

[Yoki_IsTheName]

We move on if they are not productive anymore or they are moving on.

Until then, let's run it one more time.

[ctrey]

I understand the desire to see PP in particular retire a Celtic. It will be very hard to watch him play in another uniform. However, the the combination of a great draft with a decent chunk of money to spend in the 2014 off-season seems to me to be too good pass on.

[slamtheking]

easier said than done.  the biggest issue with this roster isn't KG and PP, it's the middle-tier players that underperformed - Bass, JET, Lee.  Add in that the lower-expectation players didn't perform either - Darko, Collins, Wilcox and AB.

Those players that are still on the roster are the first ones that should be shown the door but no one would take them.  even if you got rid of PP (as the best trade piece available) and pushed KG out as a result, that still leaves the team with a bunch of guys under contract for 2 more years that will be bad enough to miss the playoffs but with just enough talent to end up at the end of the lottery where the team should still be able to get a good prospect but not the franchise player you're anticipating.

[chambers]

easier said than done.  the biggest issue with this roster isn't KG and PP, it's the middle-tier players that underperformed - Bass, JET, Lee.  Add in that the lower-expectation players didn't perform either - Darko, Collins, Wilcox and AB.

Those players that are still on the roster are the first ones that should be shown the door but no one would take them.  even if you got rid of PP (as the best trade piece available) and pushed KG out as a result, that still leaves the team with a bunch of guys under contract for 2 more years that will be bad enough to miss the playoffs but with just enough talent to end up at the end of the lottery where the team should still be able to get a good prospect but not the franchise player you're anticipating.

Our role players have underpformed, but I disagree that we'd be a good enough team to avoid a top 6 pick. We'd be able to either tank or our team would probably suck enough to get bottom 4 quite easily.
Green, Rondo, Bradley, sully.... Sound good but without an all star defender big man they barely beat the Kings or bobcats. That's a team that struggles to score and struggles to defend.

[PhoSita]

I'm afraid the bottom line is going to rule here . . . the management knows even though the team won't be a contender next year they'll have much more fan interest if they hold onto Pierce and Garnett and forgo a descent into all-out rebuilding for as long as possible.

So we'll get to have farewell tour part 2, and by the end of the season at least 2-3 of the key players will be hobbled by injuries and they'll have an outside shot at making it to the second round, at best.

[slamtheking]

easier said than done.  the biggest issue with this roster isn't KG and PP, it's the middle-tier players that underperformed - Bass, JET, Lee.  Add in that the lower-expectation players didn't perform either - Darko, Collins, Wilcox and AB.

Those players that are still on the roster are the first ones that should be shown the door but no one would take them.  even if you got rid of PP (as the best trade piece available) and pushed KG out as a result, that still leaves the team with a bunch of guys under contract for 2 more years that will be bad enough to miss the playoffs but with just enough talent to end up at the end of the lottery where the team should still be able to get a good prospect but not the franchise player you're anticipating.

Our role players have underpformed, but I disagree that we'd be a good enough team to avoid a top 6 pick. We'd be able to either tank or our team would probably suck enough to get bottom 4 quite easily.
Green, Rondo, Bradley, sully.... Sound good but without an all star defender big man they barely beat the Kings or bobcats. That's a team that struggles to score and struggles to defend.

I disagree on that -- I think  they'd end up with between the 9th and 11th worst record.  there's still a lot of crappy teams out there.  I also believe that without KG and PP, there's no need to coast through the season so there'd be a better a regular season effort and record.

[Clench123]

I really don't get people's infatuation with rebuilding.  It's way worse than reloading.  With reloading, you're never far from being a contender (maybe one or two right moves).  With rebuilding you're starting at the back of the pack.  How many years would that take if you ever get there?

[PhoSita]

I really don't get people's infatuation with rebuilding.  It's way worse than reloading.  With reloading, you're never far from being a contender (maybe one or two right moves).  With rebuilding you're starting at the back of the pack.  How many years would that take if you ever get there?

The thing is, reloading is only worth it if you're actually reloading into being a contender.

If "reloading" means setting the team up to be second round fodder, with an outside shot at the conference finals if a couple of stars go down with season ending injuries, that's not particularly exciting.

Rebuilding at least gives you the hope that your team can turn into a dark horse contender like the Grizzlies or Pacers, if not a team with real superstars e.g. the Clippers or Thunder.

[mmmmm]

I really don't get people's infatuation with rebuilding.  It's way worse than reloading.  With reloading, you're never far from being a contender (maybe one or two right moves).  With rebuilding you're starting at the back of the pack.  How many years would that take if you ever get there?

The optimist sees only Oklahoma and thinks it only took from 2007 (Durant pick) to 2012 to reach the Finals.   Gee - only 5 years!  (Let's ignore that they started sucking back as far as 2005-06).

The pessimist sees the Bobcats ...  so, like, um .... forever ...

The reality is thus probably somewhere in between 5 years and forever ...

[mmmmm]

I really don't get people's infatuation with rebuilding.  It's way worse than reloading.  With reloading, you're never far from being a contender (maybe one or two right moves).  With rebuilding you're starting at the back of the pack.  How many years would that take if you ever get there?

The thing is, reloading is only worth it if you're actually reloading into being a contender.

If "reloading" means setting the team up to be second round fodder, with an outside shot at the conference finals if a couple of stars go down with season ending injuries, that's not particularly exciting.

Rebuilding at least gives you the hope that your team can turn into a dark horse contender like the Grizzlies or Pacers, if not a team with real superstars e.g. the Clippers or Thunder.

There are other ways to rebuild than to tank.

If you reload carefully, you assemble tradable assets while still contending.   These can then be converted into superstars via trade.

And by carefully timing the expiration of your contracts, you can maximize your cap space in a given FA season - which makes it possible to get superstars off the FA market.

Danny is clearly trying to set himself up to do either of these two paths.  But the timing would not be until before/during/after the 2014-2015 season.

If Danny can make a deal this season that actually, truly benefited the team in a big way - I'll be all for it.  But it doesn't make sense to move prematurely and deal from panic.   He's got a plan and should stick to it unless a major deal shows up that he can't refuse.