Author Topic: Political hypothetical: Knowing what we know now, would you vote Romney in 2012?  (Read 2205 times)

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Online Roy H.

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Letís make an assumption that if Romney wins in 2012 he also wins in 2016, and that Trump never becomes a political force.

Which of the following would you prefer:

Obama 2012 - Trump 2016 - possibility of Trump 2020

Romney 2012 - Romney 2016 - unknown 2020



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Offline chicagoceltic

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Interesting question Roy.  In hindsight, I think I would have rather had 1 term for Obama than any terms for Trump.  Better yet I wish Kasich would have won the Republican nomination in 2016.
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Online Roy H.

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This one is easy for me.  Romney is an adult. I prefer conservatives to centrists in many areas, but most of all I want leaders who attempt to unite rather than divide. Itís why Reagan and JFK still inspire people, and why Obamaís 2008 campaign was so successful: people like an aspirational America.  Romney isnít Reagan, but heís not Trump, either.

Itís also a reason why we should refrain from demonizing people just because theyíre of the other party. Do that enough, and it creates a sense of complacency and tune out when thereís a real demon at the gates.


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Offline chicagoceltic

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This one is easy for me.  Romney is an adult. I prefer conservatives to centrists in many areas, but most of all I want leaders who attempt to unite rather than divide. Itís why Reagan and JFK still inspire people, and why Obamaís 2008 campaign was so successful: people like an aspirational America.  Romney isnít Reagan, but heís not Trump, either.

Itís also a reason why we should refrain from demonizing people just because theyíre of the other party. Do that enough, and it creates a sense of complacency and tune out when thereís a real demon at the gates.
Of course it is an easy one for you...in that scenario you replace 4 years of Obama (who I believe you do not love) and 4 years of Trump (who I also believe you do not love) with 8 years of Romney so it is an extra 4 years of a Republican White House with the bonus of no Trump presidency.  For a Democrat like myself it is a far more difficult hypothetical.  A more challenging question for you is are you still happy with voting for Trump over Clinton?
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Online Roy H.

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.  A more challenging question for you is are you still happy with voting for Trump over Clinton?

Sadly, thatís still not challenging.

If you replaced Hillary with somebody like Joe Manchin or Joe Donnelly , I might be able to get behind him.


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Online slamtheking

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If I'm following the premise correctly, you're asking would people rather have a guy who was caught on tape not caring about the '47%' over someone who did.  Also, this approach would have rewarded the Republicans in Congress for constantly stonewalling Obama since the 2010 midterms when they took over Congress (and really the 2 years prior to that).

I'll still take Obama over Romney.  What turned me off of Romney was that he constantly trashed the healthcare system he drove to create in Mass.   it was his signature legislative win while he was governor.  if he's that scummy to disavow his proudest accomplishment for political expediency, he's not someone I'd vote for.

If I'm going to re-invent history in a what-if, I'll take the Republican party nominating anyone but Trump in 2016.   I'll do the reach-across-the-aisle move here and say that the one good thing that came from Trump  winning the election is it should be the final nail in the coffin for Hillary running for president again. 

Online slamtheking

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.  A more challenging question for you is are you still happy with voting for Trump over Clinton?

Sadly, thatís still not challenging.

If you replaced Hillary with somebody like Joe Manchin or Joe Donnelly , I might be able to get behind him.
well, that IS sad.  When Trump's presented as the Republican candidate and you can't consider voting Democrat in that instance, I don't know what to say.

Trump is as big a pile of human excrement as there is.  I was firmly in the "anyone but Hillary" camp until this ass-clown was presented as the other option.  As much as I despise Hillary, she'd at least have filled a cabinet with qualified leaders for the most part (I'm sure a few politically-based nominations would have been handed out) and we wouldn't be cozying up to Russia and North Korea while alienating our allies. 

Pre-election I was hoping that we'd only have to contend with 4 years of Hillary and then vote her out when the Reps put up a qualified candidate in 2020.  Now, I'm hoping that someone in the Rep party grows a pair and takes on Trump in the primaries and that the Dems find someone in their ranks who offers an actual plan for the country and can handle Trump in the debates. 

Offline BudweiserCeltic

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Anyone who goes into the election cycle courting the extreme right as some of these candidates have shown (even if just for show), they don't get my vote period.

From what I recall I liked Jon Huntsman in 2012, and Kasich in 2016. I would've gone with those.

Then again, you have someone like Paul Ryan and how he presented himself on his candidacy, and then compare it on how he comported himself as Speaker and it gives you some pause on how to judge a candidate. I just wish the Republican rhetoric changed, and it has a long way to go on that regard. Too much money and power behind the scenes forcing the issue.

Offline action781

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If I'm following the premise correctly, you're asking would people rather have a guy who was caught on tape not caring about the '47%' over someone who did.  Also, this approach would have rewarded the Republicans in Congress for constantly stonewalling Obama since the 2010 midterms when they took over Congress (and really the 2 years prior to that).

I'll still take Obama over Romney.  What turned me off of Romney was that he constantly trashed the healthcare system he drove to create in Mass.   it was his signature legislative win while he was governor.  if he's that scummy to disavow his proudest accomplishment for political expediency, he's not someone I'd vote for.

If I'm going to re-invent history in a what-if, I'll take the Republican party nominating anyone but Trump in 2016.   I'll do the reach-across-the-aisle move here and say that the one good thing that came from Trump  winning the election is it should be the final nail in the coffin for Hillary running for president again.

I thought that for a while, but have come around.  One can think universal healthcare in MA is a good idea where the majority of the state population would be in favor of increased taxes to implement such a thing.  But then also think universal healthcare in the USA is not a good idea since the majority of that population does not want a tax increase to support it.  I find that to be a pretty reasonable change.
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Offline action781

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Letís make an assumption that if Romney wins in 2012 he also wins in 2016, and that Trump never becomes a political force.

Which of the following would you prefer:

Obama 2012 - Trump 2016 - possibility of Trump 2020

Romney 2012 - Romney 2016 - unknown 2020

A lot of people are making up their own options to this question which are easy ways out while not addressing the hypothetical at hand, which is challenging to answer.  I was a big Obama fan, but I am dissatisfied enough with Trump that I think I'd choose Romney, but will have to look deeper into it.

Would the ACA be overturned under Romney? - I think not since they could not overturn it in a Trump WH that has a Republican House and Senate.  Senate went Republican in 2015 so it's possible it could go then, but I'm not sure it would sweep the Republican Senators.  So likely no difference there.

Regulatory Effects - Trump has basically undone everything that Obama did in this regard and gone further.  I think some sensible regulations are often a good thing, so I would prefer Romney.

Guns - Obama was anti-guns, but it didn't really do anything.  Trump is very pro guns.  Romney is probably somewhere in the middle.  Overall, there probably would be little to no difference.

International/Foreign Affairs - When traveling abroad, Obama was well respected by people of other countries and that reflected positively on their opinions of Americans as well.  GW Bush on the other hand was not respected.  I haven't traveled a lot in the last two years, but having heard stories from others I think Trump has done a lot of damage in that regard and Romney would be the better option.

OK I'm getting tired of doing this and someone else can take on immigration, gay/women/minority rights, international and domestic terrorism, but so far I would lean towards 8 years of Romney rather than 4 Obama and 4 Trump.
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Online Roy H.

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well, that IS sad.  When Trump's presented as the Republican candidate and you can't consider voting Democrat in that instance, I don't know what to say.

Did you stop reading halfway through?  Or do you just have strong opinions without knowing who Manchin and Donnelly are? Iíd consider voting Democrat, just not for Clinton.


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Online Roy H.

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Letís make an assumption that if Romney wins in 2012 he also wins in 2016, and that Trump never becomes a political force.

Which of the following would you prefer:

Obama 2012 - Trump 2016 - possibility of Trump 2020

Romney 2012 - Romney 2016 - unknown 2020

A lot of people are making up their own options to this question which are easy ways out while not addressing the hypothetical at hand, which is challenging to answer.  I was a big Obama fan, but I am dissatisfied enough with Trump that I think I'd choose Romney, but will have to look deeper into it.

Would the ACA be overturned under Romney? - I think not since they could not overturn it in a Trump WH that has a Republican House and Senate.  Senate went Republican in 2015 so it's possible it could go then, but I'm not sure it would sweep the Republican Senators.  So likely no difference there.

Regulatory Effects - Trump has basically undone everything that Obama did in this regard and gone further.  I think some sensible regulations are often a good thing, so I would prefer Romney.

Guns - Obama was anti-guns, but it didn't really do anything.  Trump is very pro guns.  Romney is probably somewhere in the middle.  Overall, there probably would be little to no difference.

International/Foreign Affairs - When traveling abroad, Obama was well respected by people of other countries and that reflected positively on their opinions of Americans as well.  GW Bush on the other hand was not respected.  I haven't traveled a lot in the last two years, but having heard stories from others I think Trump has done a lot of damage in that regard and Romney would be the better option.

OK I'm getting tired of doing this and someone else can take on immigration, gay/women/minority rights, international and domestic terrorism, but so far I would lean towards 8 years of Romney rather than 4 Obama and 4 Trump.

Thanks for answering.

I think one potential positive is that Romney could have found a middle ground to amend Obamacare, rather than gutting it. I also think heíd be willing to work across the aisle on at least some gun control. He doesnít strike me as the guy who would force through a partisan agenda after being elected. My guess is that weíd have a Dreamers fix, nothing would have changed from the current status quo regarding gay marriage, etc.

If I was a Democrat, my question would be the Supreme Court, but since Obama didnít get anybody confirmed in his second term, itís a non-issue. If anything, youíve got Romney replacing Scalia and Kennedy rather than Trump, which is neutral at worst.



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Offline Erik

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A more challenging question for you is are you still happy with voting for Trump over Clinton?

Always vote for the correct ideology. America needs to be unraveling outdated social programs, not adding to them. Trump is *far* better than Hillary because his ideology is correct, despite being a complete embarrassment of a human being.

Offline Vermont Green

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well, that IS sad.  When Trump's presented as the Republican candidate and you can't consider voting Democrat in that instance, I don't know what to say.

Did you stop reading halfway through?  Or do you just have strong opinions without knowing who Manchin and Donnelly are? Iíd consider voting Democrat, just not for Clinton.

I understood your original point but I am still surprised that people hated Clinton enough to hold their nose and vote for Trump.

What exactly did you think Hilary would do that would have been so harmful that you thought that Trump would be better (and apparently still do)?

I know many were convinced that she had a secret plot to take away all guns in America (similar to the plan that Obama had) but I suspect you do not believe that.  Others believed Trump when he said Hilary was going to let in 200,000,000 immigrants but I bet you are smarter than that too.  Was it the emails?  Was it because of her husband's behavior with women?

Offline chicagoceltic

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During the run up to the primaries I was convinced that the only candidate for either party who would be a worse President than Trump was Ben Carson.  I was wrong...I now wish we had President Carson.
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