Author Topic: Similarities Between the Bucks and Pelicans  (Read 533 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Similarities Between the Bucks and Pelicans
« on: July 22, 2018, 08:29:03 PM »

Online DefenseWinsChamps

  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2424
  • Tommy Points: 440
As I was running through the NBA teams and their cap situation on shamsports capulator, one thing that stuck out was the similarity between the Bucks and the Pelicans roster and situation.

Obviously, this similarity starts with Davis and Giannis. They both play the same position. They score at extremely efficient rates. Giannis is a much better creator and passer. Davis is a better shooter and defender (not by much on defense). Both players are in their prime. Both players are MVP candidates. Both players are potential HOFers.

Next, there is a very close similarity between the second options. Middleton and Holliday both play the wing (Holliday is more of a guard, but both play off ball). Both guys are fringe all-stars. Both are really good scorers at all three levels (though not elite). Both can play good defense as well.

Then you have your supporting cast. Mirotic and Illyasova are similar players, but Mirotic is better. Moore is a similar player to Snell (I'd take Moore). Dellavadova is a similar grinder at a different position to Hill - both on bad contracts. Payton and Bledsoe are similar players (I'd take Payton).

I might be stretching it here, but both Henson and Randle are lefty bigs with limitations (I'd take Randle). The Bucks have Brogdon, Wilson, and Maker as interesting prospects, but I think only Wilson has the chance to be a starter on a high level team, and even that is dubious. The Pelicans have Diallo and Jackson as interesting prospects, and I don't think either are rotation players on a high level team.

Giannis = Davis
Middleton = Holliday
Bledsoe = Payton
Illyasova < Mirotic
Henson < Randle
Dellavadova = Hill
Snell = Moore
Brogdon > Jackson
Maker = Diallo
Wilson = Miller
Lopez > Ajinca

Neither the Pelicans nor the Bucks are in a good financial situation. Holliday forced the Pelicans' hand last year, demanding a huge contract, knowing that if the Pelly's didn't pony up, it would likely lead to Davis leaving. I think Middleton does the same thing this off-season with the Bucks. I could see Middleton commanding 30 million a year, not because he's worth it, but because he knows the Bucks have no other way to replace his production and Middleton leaving might lead to Giannis leaving.

Honestly, the Pelicans aren't in terrible financial shape, but unless they get a MLE guy (or minimum guy) that outplays his contract by a lot, they also have no real way to take the next step forward into contention. They don't have the assets to swing a trade for a high level guy.

The Bucks, however, are in a much worse financial situation due to Snell's, Dellavadova's, and Henson's poor contracts. By my count, without resigning (and with renouncing) Bledsoe and Brogdon next year, they will be over the cap and only 12 million dollars from the luxury tax line. Assuming they sign one of the two of them back to play point guard for them, they start rubbing against the luxury tax really quick.

I think there is enough hope and flexibility in New Orleans that the Pelicans can try to keep Davis for one more year. For the Bucks, if their young players continue to lack development, I could see Giannis realizing he has no chance to make it to the finals in Milwaukee. I think both players want to get traded before the end of their contracts.

Side point: I think both teams are possible trade partners with the Hornets for Batum.

As far as the Celtics go, I'd love either player normally, but I really like this team. I also wonder how in the world the Cs avoid a 9 figure luxury tax bill in 3-4 years without losing one of Kyrie-Hayward-Horford-Tatum-Brown. Also, there is no way they can pay the luxury tax bill if they trade for one of those guys without giving up one of their core.


Re: Similarities Between the Bucks and Pelicans
« Reply #1 on: July 22, 2018, 10:19:25 PM »

Online JBcat

  • Jim Loscutoff
  • **
  • Posts: 2756
  • Tommy Points: 460
TP for the nice post.

For our team I would rather have Davis as I see him as a 4/5 and Giannis as a 3/4.  With Horford getting older he would be a great replacement for him.

Re: Similarities Between the Bucks and Pelicans
« Reply #2 on: July 23, 2018, 09:44:57 AM »

Offline timpiker

  • Bill Walton
  • *
  • Posts: 1286
  • Tommy Points: 82
Between those 2, I'd take Davis every time.  But, your last point - I don't see how in the hell the C's can keep the core together in 2 years.

Re: Similarities Between the Bucks and Pelicans
« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2018, 10:46:10 AM »

Offline Green-18

  • Gordon Hayward
  • Posts: 594
  • Tommy Points: 55
Between those 2, I'd take Davis every time.  But, your last point - I don't see how in the hell the C's can keep the core together in 2 years.

It's going to be interesting for sure.  The Horford option is going to play a large role in our financial flexibility.  At this stage in his career I wouldn't be surprised if Horford took a 3-4 year deal at somewhere around $15 million.  I think he values the stability and winning culture.

The other variable is the potential legalization of sports betting.  The NBA is already working on getting their share of revenues.  This would result in a HUGE spike in the salary cap. 

Re: Similarities Between the Bucks and Pelicans
« Reply #4 on: July 23, 2018, 11:13:11 AM »

Offline CFAN38

  • Ray Allen
  • ***
  • Posts: 3719
  • Tommy Points: 304
Between those 2, I'd take Davis every time.  But, your last point - I don't see how in the hell the C's can keep the core together in 2 years.

It's going to be interesting for sure.  The Horford option is going to play a large role in our financial flexibility.  At this stage in his career I wouldn't be surprised if Horford took a 3-4 year deal at somewhere around $15 million.  I think he values the stability and winning culture.

The other variable is the potential legalization of sports betting.  The NBA is already working on getting their share of revenues.  This would result in a HUGE spike in the salary cap.

I agree Al will a lynch pin for alot of the Cs future cap issues. Im hoping that he and the Cs play the long game and sign him for a long term contract that is a bargain in the first two year and a likely over pay in the last year. I want AL to be this teams version of later career Tim Duncan, who plays to near 40 in a consistently diminished role but provides stability and leadership to the roster. 

Re: Similarities Between the Bucks and Pelicans
« Reply #5 on: July 23, 2018, 12:01:10 PM »

Offline tazzmaniac

  • Antoine Walker
  • ****
  • Posts: 4091
  • Tommy Points: 364
We're in good shape with how the contracts fall.  Irving and Horford 1 year plus option.  Hayward 2 years plus option.  Brown and Tatum having 2 and 3 years left on their rookie contracts.  Assuming status quo, Hayward is most likely the odd man out. 

Re: Similarities Between the Bucks and Pelicans
« Reply #6 on: July 23, 2018, 12:23:42 PM »

Online Moranis

  • Global Moderator
  • Bill Sharman
  • *******************
  • Posts: 19561
  • Tommy Points: 927
You think Bledsoe and Payton are equal?  Really?  That truly is astonishing to me.

Re: Similarities Between the Bucks and Pelicans
« Reply #7 on: July 23, 2018, 12:43:36 PM »

Online DefenseWinsChamps

  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2424
  • Tommy Points: 440
You think Bledsoe and Payton are equal?  Really?  That truly is astonishing to me.

I'm not a big fan of Bledsoe's game. A few year's ago, he'd have the clear edge. But now, considering his laziness and Payton's contract, I'd actually rather have Payton because of upside.

Re: Similarities Between the Bucks and Pelicans
« Reply #8 on: July 23, 2018, 01:40:28 PM »

Offline KungPoweChicken

  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2044
  • Tommy Points: 226
I donít see much similarity.

Re: Similarities Between the Bucks and Pelicans
« Reply #9 on: July 23, 2018, 05:03:26 PM »

Offline Big333223

  • NCE
  • Antoine Walker
  • ****
  • Posts: 4718
  • Tommy Points: 527
The similarities are interesting. Probably indicative of similar strategies of small market teams desperate to keep their superstars happy.

It seems like that almost always goes wrong, btw. The teams that keep their stars are the teams that try to build culture and prioritize winning as a team and don't bend to the will of their individual star.

But we'll see.
1957, 1959, 1960, 1961, 1962, 1963, 1964, 1965, 1966, 1968, 1969, 1974, 1976, 1981, 1984, 1986, 2008, 2019

Re: Similarities Between the Bucks and Pelicans
« Reply #10 on: July 23, 2018, 05:16:29 PM »

Offline action781

  • Antoine Walker
  • ****
  • Posts: 4383
  • Tommy Points: 387
TP for the post.  What jumps to my attention is the similarity between these two superstars and their teams... and while cb is a constant stream of ideas and assumptions that the Pelicans need to trade away Ant Davis to Boston while they can, we almost never see similar trade ideas that include Giannis.
2018 Mock Trade Deadline Philly 76ers

Guards:  A Bradley / Covington / Redick / Fultz / Bayless / Luwawu / Korkmaz
Forwards:  Saric / Simmons (point forward) / Trev Booker / J Anderson
Center:  Embiid / THE BOBAN / R Holmes

Picks: 2018 LAL 1st (if 1, 6-30), 2019 SAC 1st (if LAL 2-5), 2018 2nds from BKN, NYK, HOU, and 2019 SAC 2n