Poll

So what says you, will the Lakers make the playoffs as currently constructed?

No
Yes, easily
Yes, but barely

Author Topic: As currently constructed do you think the Lakers will make the playoffs?  (Read 7706 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Neurotic Guy

  • Dave Cowens
  • ***********************
  • Posts: 23317
  • Tommy Points: 2509
The window is the thing.  If the Lakers think they are championship-ready (this is not adding Shaq to Kobe!) now -- even with Kawhi this year, I think they are probably premature.   Without Kawhi, they have a ways to go.

LBJ will be 34 in December, and the current contract takes him through 37.   I have no doubt that he'll be a star player for the duration, however, what's the bet that he'll be a top 5 guy over the last 2 years of his contract?   MJ could not carry a team in his late 30's; neither could Kobe.  Kareem had Magic and Worthy into his later years.  Malone had Stockton.   MJ, Malone and Kareem began in the NBA at 21/22, LBJ at 18.  LBJ has some serious wear on his tires. 

He'll need a co-number 1 by year 3.  Kawhi might be that guy.  Hope not.





Offline celticsclay

  • Reggie Lewis
  • ***************
  • Posts: 15739
  • Tommy Points: 1386
LeBron is NOT missing the playoffs.

Indeed. Look at the team that LBJ dragged to more than 50 wins last year. The Lakers miss the playoffs only if he's injured.

That 50 win team went 15-15 against the west last year. If you take their conference winning percentages and move CLE to the west, they would have been 46-36 and tied for 9th. Kevin Love, Tristan Thompson, George Hill, Rodney Hood, Kyle Korver... all these guys would start or get heavy minutes for this Lakers team.

It's not clear the Lakers are a better team than that, with Randle gone, Nance gone, Clarkson gone, Ball hurt, Lopez a free agent.

Personally I think as long as Kuzma and Ingram continue to develop (or get them Kawhi) and they find a big man better than Javale McGee, they'll be fine playoff-wise, but it's no slam dunk as of today.
Korver is probably not starting on a single team in the NBA right now. He is probably physically incapable of playing that many minutes. He is old as heck and gets absolutely destroyed on defense by any team's starters
Way to nitpick my point - that's why I said "or get heavy minutes", and on a Lakers squad with a roster so gutted they just signed Javale McGee on purpose.

He played 2000 minutes over 95 games and made 200 3PT this year at a 44% clip and continues to be one of the best shooters of All-Time.

The point of course is that we've been told over and over how terrible LeBron's supporting cast was in Cleveland, but the majority of them would fit right in on LA's current roster.

I am not really sure I am getting *most of these takes. Mghee actually started a few games for the warriors in the finals and did just fine. The Warriors were also interested in having him back. I am not sure how to understand the argument that he isn't good enough to be on a playoff team when he just won a chip starting....

With respect to the other points, I agree Love is better than anyone else on the Lakers but I think some of your other players are really stretching it. Hill was absolutely awful last year and definitely seems to have a lost a step or two. Is he having a huge bounce back at 32 with a history of injuries? I don't think he would get minutes over either Rondo or Ball (if both stay on their roster). Rodney Hood was basically out of the rotation throughout the playoffs and had one ok game in the finals. It seems strange to think he would be better than Ingram who was very good last year and only 20 minutes or why he would even be worth playing over kuzma.

I also think most of this is moot because the Lakers don't have a full roster right now and i don't why people want to vote on their team before they do.

Offline Sophomore

  • Paul Silas
  • ******
  • Posts: 6227
  • Tommy Points: 823
LeBron is NOT missing the playoffs.

Indeed. Look at the team that LBJ dragged to more than 50 wins last year. The Lakers miss the playoffs only if he's injured.

That 50 win team went 15-15 against the west last year. If you take their conference winning percentages and move CLE to the west, they would have been 46-36 and tied for 9th. Kevin Love, Tristan Thompson, George Hill, Rodney Hood, Kyle Korver... all these guys would start or get heavy minutes for this Lakers team.

It's not clear the Lakers are a better team than that, with Randle gone, Nance gone, Clarkson gone, Ball hurt, Lopez a free agent.

Personally I think as long as Kuzma and Ingram continue to develop (or get them Kawhi) and they find a big man better than Javale McGee, they'll be fine playoff-wise, but it's no slam dunk as of today.
Korver is probably not starting on a single team in the NBA right now. He is probably physically incapable of playing that many minutes. He is old as heck and gets absolutely destroyed on defense by any team's starters
Way to nitpick my point - that's why I said "or get heavy minutes", and on a Lakers squad with a roster so gutted they just signed Javale McGee on purpose.

He played 2000 minutes over 95 games and made 200 3PT this year at a 44% clip and continues to be one of the best shooters of All-Time.

The point of course is that we've been told over and over how terrible LeBron's supporting cast was in Cleveland, but the majority of them would fit right in on LA's current roster.

Remember that Cleveland blew up its lineup in February. For the first 53, Cleveland was playing with Iman Shumpert, Derrick Rose, Jae Crowder, and the remains of Dwyane Wade. That was a *bad* group of players. And if you like  Kevin Love (I’m not impressed) he missed 23 games with injuries. That team was weak sauce.

It’s hard to make other comparisons in the abstract. LBJ has recently preferred shooters to playmakers or defenders. In a vacuum, do I take Ingram over any 2 on the Cavs’ roster, and do I take Ball/Rondo over any PG on the Cavs? Absolutely. I probably take Love over Kuzma, but not by a lot; he left me very unimpressed last year; his injury in the playoffs saved Ty Lue from himself when it was clear the Cs has Love  solved. Thompson is an OK, average player; I’ll be surprised if the Lakers can’t replicate that level of performance. 
« Last Edit: July 03, 2018, 04:30:28 PM by Sophomore »

Offline Surferdad

  • Cedric Maxwell
  • **************
  • Posts: 14456
  • Tommy Points: 972
  • "He fiddles...and diddles..."
I can't get over this group. Stephenson, McGee, and Rondo along with Lebron being temperamental, and throw in Lavar Ball on the periphery. I hope this powder keg goes off.
Yeah, and imagine if the prevailing theory came true: Boogie to LAL. That would have been the all-time hothead team.

Offline Moranis

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 33461
  • Tommy Points: 1533
Evans off the market, signs with the Pacers.  Lakers decent free agent options are drying up.
2023 Historical Draft - Brooklyn Nets - 9th pick

Bigs - Pau, Amar'e, Issel, McGinnis, Roundfield
Wings - Dantley, Bowen, J. Jackson
Guards - Cheeks, Petrovic, Buse, Rip

Offline byennie

  • Webmaster
  • Jim Loscutoff
  • **
  • Posts: 2572
  • Tommy Points: 3033
I am not really sure I am getting *most of these takes. Mghee actually started a few games for the warriors in the finals and did just fine. The Warriors were also interested in having him back. I am not sure how to understand the argument that he isn't good enough to be on a playoff team when he just won a chip starting....

With respect to the other points, I agree Love is better than anyone else on the Lakers but I think some of your other players are really stretching it. Hill was absolutely awful last year and definitely seems to have a lost a step or two. Is he having a huge bounce back at 32 with a history of injuries? I don't think he would get minutes over either Rondo or Ball (if both stay on their roster). Rodney Hood was basically out of the rotation throughout the playoffs and had one ok game in the finals. It seems strange to think he would be better than Ingram who was very good last year and only 20 minutes or why he would even be worth playing over kuzma.

I also think most of this is moot because the Lakers don't have a full roster right now and i don't why people want to vote on their team before they do.
McGee averaged about 10 MPG all year and played 54 minutes in 4 games in The Finals. Calling him a starter is pretty meaningless. Jordan Bell played more than him as a rookie 2nd rounder.

Hood was putting up 17 points in 28 minutes in Utah and averaging almost a 3PT every 10 minutes (39%). So he's a 25 year-old starter on a west coast playoff team and their #2 scoring option. How is that not comparable to an Ingram or a Kuzma at present?

Hill was challenging for the league lead in 3PT% before he came to CLE. He's past his prime, sure, but notice how everyone looks worse next to a certain superstar? That's inferior to a 33 year-old Rondo who averaged 8/8 passing to Anthony Davis and made 25 free throws the entire season? What Hill would do this year is irrelevant; we're comparing last year CLE to this year LAL.

Larry Nance was one of the better backup bigs in the league for LA last year. I assume he would be again if he was back in LA.

Korver we covered, he's no world beater but will LA really have 8+ guys better this year?

As for the roster not being complete, clearly that's true, but the entire point of this thread is "as currently constructed", so...





Offline byennie

  • Webmaster
  • Jim Loscutoff
  • **
  • Posts: 2572
  • Tommy Points: 3033
Remember that Cleveland blew up its lineup in February. For the first 53, Cleveland was playing with Iman Shumpert, Derrick Rose, Jae Crowder, and the remains of Dwyane Wade. That was a *bad* group of players. And if you like  Kevin Love (I’m not impressed) he missed 23 games with injuries. That team was weak sauce.

It’s hard to make other comparisons in the abstract. LBJ has recently preferred shooters to playmakers or defenders. In a vacuum, do I take Ingram over any 2 on the Cavs’ roster, and do I take Ball/Rondo over any PG on the Cavs? Absolutely. I probably take Love over Kuzma, but not by a lot; he left me very unimpressed last year; his injury in the playoffs saved Ty Lue from himself when it was clear the Cs has Love  solved. Thompson is an OK, average player; I’ll be surprised if the Lakers can’t replicate that level of performance.

Fair point re: trades. I don't think you have to be "high" on Kevin Love to admit that 18/9 with 40%+ from range is at least a useful 2nd banana. He's a decent team defender even if eventually he got exposed by a pretty good Boston team. If he was on LA last year, 100% chance he gives them 20/10 and gets All-Star consideration.

Thompson, Korver and Smith were all there all year.

Crowder is not a bad player. He was better before (Boston) and after (Utah). Per usual, Cleveland brought out the worst in him.

Anyway, my intention is not to hype that Cleveland squad, I just think that:

1) LeBron's lack of support has become a tiresome, overstated narrative. The guy has only ever won when he had 2 other All-Stars on his team, and anything short of that is always the team's fault. Everyone seems to magically look worse playing with him than without. Imagine if Hood was scoring 15-20/night and Hill was leading the league in 3PT% in Cleveland? All of a sudden his cast is good, right? Same players.

2) In the narrow context of this thread, the LA roster is really thin. They have zero big men above end-of-the-bench level. Ingram, Kuzma, Ball are all nice young talents but have zero efficient or winning seasons between them. Rondo is a backup PG with major flaws at age 33.

We'll see what happens, LA is obviously not done (if they can help it). But, how many opportunities do they have left if SAS doesn't play ball?


Online Who

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 47135
  • Tommy Points: 2401
I like Zubac. I think he deserved more playing time last year and the year before.

I am looking forward to him getting more opportunity to play. I think he will continue to improve and do well with the opportunity.

Offline greece66

  • Tiny Archibald
  • *******
  • Posts: 7395
  • Tommy Points: 1342
  • Head Paperboy at Greenville
I voted no, but it'll be close. I think this Lakers team wins 44-48 games. Denver missed it with 46 last season.

Last year's Cavs were a 50 win team, why do you they will be worse than this Lakers squad? Im interested to read your opinion.
I think the Lakers are a worse team for a lot of reasons and are less likely to make the playoffs (just being in the west).  The West is a lot deeper than the East.  You put that team in the East and Lebron gets them to the playoffs, in the West it is a lot harder to make the playoffs.  That is just a fact.  I mean there are 7 teams you would say are a legit playoff teams in the East right now (Boston, Philly, Toronto, Washington, Milwaukee, Indiana, and Miami).  And let's be clear a number of those teams wouldn't make the playoffs in the West.  But after those 7 who is the 8th best team in the East right now.  It might in fact be Cleveland when Detroit and Charlotte are the best competition for that spot. 

Taking the conference aside, Kevin Love, right now, is by the best player on either the Cavs or Lakers (obviously outside of James).  I don't think it is particularly close at this point, though Ingram is obviously trending in the upward trajectory and will pass Love at some point in the future (I just don't think it is this year).  Hill, obviously not as talented as Ball or maybe even peak Rondo, is almost the perfect type of PG to play next to James.  He is a great shooter, solid defender, and can handle the ball in a pinch.  He is just a much better fit next to James.  Thompson is better than McGee.  Nance, Clarkson, and Smith are better bench players then their respective counterparts.  Korver, one of the greatest shooters ever, is a perfect fit next to James.  KCP vs. Hood is basically a crap shoot.  I mean Hood was scoring 18 a game last year on the Jazz before the late season trade to the Cavs.  I'd probably lean Hood as better, but KCP is probably a better fit next to James.

The Cavs salary structure is a mess and they have a lot of overpaid players, but by and large those overpaid players were acquired to play next to James.  They just fit better with him and because they had 4 years to assemble the supporting cast, the Cavs were a much deeper team then what the Lakers currently have. 

Again Kyle Kuzma is going to play center for large portions of games because the only centers on the Lakers roster are McGee and Zubac and the only way to get their 3 best players on the floor is to either play Kuzma at center or Ingram at SG, and neither of those are great options. Kuzma's backup is a late 1st round pick.  Stephenson is a basically a poor man's JR Smith at this point.  KCP just isn't very good.  Ball and Rondo are fine PG's, but neither can shoot, which is a problem next to James.

The Lakers are an absolute mess of a team right now, and they play in what might be the deepest conference in NBA history.  Unless they make some drastic moves, I really just don't see them making the playoffs.

Thanks for the detailed reply Moranis, appreciated.

My gut feeling remains that Lebron will find his way to the playoffs, but I can't write an answer that will be well argued enough to do justice to your post.

Offline keevsnick

  • Rajon Rondo
  • *****
  • Posts: 5515
  • Tommy Points: 549
I think yes, LeBron is good enough I think he ca carta just about any team that far by himself. But its not a lock either

Offline Phantom255x

  • Larry Bird
  • *****************************
  • Posts: 29509
  • Tommy Points: 2923
  • On To Banner 18!
Yes, but probably as somewhere between a 5-7 seed.

I feel like folks are overrating the Lakers a bit tbh. Most assume Kawhi gets traded to LAL, but that's still no guarantee. Meanwhile, if this is basically the team that they field next year, then I suspect there'll be tons of drama lol. Rondo, Ball Family, McGee, Lance? YIKES.

Also, Golden State and Houston are the cream of the West, but then you got a sturdy field of OKC, POR, MIN, Utah, Denver, etc. to deal with, and NONE of them are pushovers IMHO.

This isn't like the East where 40 wins could get you in the playoffs. We've seen teams with close to 50 not make it or make it as a 7-8 seed. Now do you think, even with Lebron, this Lakers team as CURRENTLY CONSTRUCTED can pull off 50+ wins in a loaded west? Doubt it.
"Tough times never last, but tough people do." - Robert H. Schuller

Offline fairweatherfan

  • Johnny Most
  • ********************
  • Posts: 20738
  • Tommy Points: 2365
  • Be the posts you wish to see in the world.
As currently constructed I'm really not sure.  But I don't think we'll ever find out because they'll at minimum pick up another decent big man in free agency and of course quite possibly Kawhi.

I don't see anything to suggest they're contenders even with Kawhi and Brook or even Capela at this point. You just need too much to catch up with the Warriors.

Offline Ogaju

  • Bill Sharman
  • *******************
  • Posts: 19479
  • Tommy Points: 1871
Yes, but probably as somewhere between a 5-7 seed.

I feel like folks are overrating the Lakers a bit tbh. Most assume Kawhi gets traded to LAL, but that's still no guarantee. Meanwhile, if this is basically the team that they field next year, then I suspect there'll be tons of drama lol. Rondo, Ball Family, McGee, Lance? YIKES.

Also, Golden State and Houston are the cream of the West, but then you got a sturdy field of OKC, POR, MIN, Utah, Denver, etc. to deal with, and NONE of them are pushovers IMHO.

This isn't like the East where 40 wins could get you in the playoffs. We've seen teams with close to 50 not make it or make it as a 7-8 seed. Now do you think, even with Lebron, this Lakers team as CURRENTLY CONSTRUCTED can pull off 50+ wins in a loaded west? Doubt it.

If LeBron is engaged they will go the conference finals at least. He is that good.

Offline SparzWizard

  • JoJo White
  • ****************
  • Posts: 16057
  • Tommy Points: 990
Yes, but probably as somewhere between a 5-7 seed.

I feel like folks are overrating the Lakers a bit tbh. Most assume Kawhi gets traded to LAL, but that's still no guarantee. Meanwhile, if this is basically the team that they field next year, then I suspect there'll be tons of drama lol. Rondo, Ball Family, McGee, Lance? YIKES.

Also, Golden State and Houston are the cream of the West, but then you got a sturdy field of OKC, POR, MIN, Utah, Denver, etc. to deal with, and NONE of them are pushovers IMHO.

This isn't like the East where 40 wins could get you in the playoffs. We've seen teams with close to 50 not make it or make it as a 7-8 seed. Now do you think, even with Lebron, this Lakers team as CURRENTLY CONSTRUCTED can pull off 50+ wins in a loaded west? Doubt it.

If LeBron is engaged they will go the conference finals at least. He is that good.

In the east that's highly likely.

In the west, well that's a different story.


#JTJB (Just Trade Jaylen Brown)
#JFJM (Just Fire Joe Mazzulla)

Offline Ogaju

  • Bill Sharman
  • *******************
  • Posts: 19479
  • Tommy Points: 1871
As currently constructed I'm really not sure.  But I don't think we'll ever find out because they'll at minimum pick up another decent big man in free agency and of course quite possibly Kawhi.

I don't see anything to suggest they're contenders even with Kawhi and Brook or even Capela at this point. You just need too much to catch up with the Warriors.

arent you confusing contending with actually winning it all. Of course they are contenders with that haul you just mentioned.