Author Topic: Williams vs Ayton (full game)  (Read 3150 times)

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Re: Williams vs Ayton (full game)
« Reply #30 on: June 22, 2018, 09:04:24 PM »

Offline DefenseWinsChamps

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I also watched highlights. The dunks and blocks were impressive, but it's the other plays that tell you a story.

One of the highlights that stood out to me was at 3:18. The ball handling, timing, and long strides were unnatural for a big man. I was impressed with that move and wondered what he might look like in space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwMuMY73Tgo

Re: Williams vs Ayton (full game)
« Reply #31 on: June 22, 2018, 09:18:49 PM »

Offline tstorey_97

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To all, thank you or the research. I watched the game, it was awful. I watched other highlights for Williams and he really runs hot/cold. Projecting into the NBA is so difficult. Jordan Mickey was a "defensive player of the year" in his conference and got some stats, but, didn't translate.

I'm 0k with blaming the utterly strange A&M system, but, player has to figure things out for himself too.

Really gifted athlete for his size.   


Re: Williams vs Ayton (full game)
« Reply #32 on: June 22, 2018, 09:33:15 PM »

Offline Monkhouse

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I also watched highlights. The dunks and blocks were impressive, but it's the other plays that tell you a story.

One of the highlights that stood out to me was at 3:18. The ball handling, timing, and long strides were unnatural for a big man. I was impressed with that move and wondered what he might look like in space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwMuMY73Tgo

Oh yeah, I loved that part. My favorite block is at 5:52, his hand gets caught in the net cause he jumped so high. Think he's gonna take a while to develop, but he's got raw talent.
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Re: Williams vs Ayton (full game)
« Reply #33 on: June 22, 2018, 09:42:19 PM »

Offline DefenseWinsChamps

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I also watched highlights. The dunks and blocks were impressive, but it's the other plays that tell you a story.

One of the highlights that stood out to me was at 3:18. The ball handling, timing, and long strides were unnatural for a big man. I was impressed with that move and wondered what he might look like in space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwMuMY73Tgo

Oh yeah, I loved that part. My favorite block is at 5:52, his hand gets caught in the net cause he jumped so high. Think he's gonna take a while to develop, but he's got raw talent.

Yeah. I paused that on the replay to see how high his head was compared to the rim.

It was really close.

And he just hung up there waiting for the guard to actually shoot so he could spike it down.

Re: Williams vs Ayton (full game)
« Reply #34 on: June 22, 2018, 11:08:52 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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I also watched highlights. The dunks and blocks were impressive, but it's the other plays that tell you a story.

One of the highlights that stood out to me was at 3:18. The ball handling, timing, and long strides were unnatural for a big man. I was impressed with that move and wondered what he might look like in space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwMuMY73Tgo

They make space suits that large ;) ;D?

Re: Williams vs Ayton (full game)
« Reply #35 on: June 22, 2018, 11:16:26 PM »

Online Eddie20

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I also watched highlights. The dunks and blocks were impressive, but it's the other plays that tell you a story.

One of the highlights that stood out to me was at 3:18. The ball handling, timing, and long strides were unnatural for a big man. I was impressed with that move and wondered what he might look like in space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwMuMY73Tgo

They make space suits that large ;) ;D?

Hey Beat LA, isn't Williams better and considered to have the higher ceiling than your allergic to rebounding non-shotblocking binkie Patton?

Re: Williams vs Ayton (full game)
« Reply #36 on: June 22, 2018, 11:41:03 PM »

Online rondofan1255

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TPs for the excellent observations!!!  :D

Re: Williams vs Ayton (full game)
« Reply #37 on: June 22, 2018, 11:54:19 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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I also watched highlights. The dunks and blocks were impressive, but it's the other plays that tell you a story.

One of the highlights that stood out to me was at 3:18. The ball handling, timing, and long strides were unnatural for a big man. I was impressed with that move and wondered what he might look like in space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwMuMY73Tgo

They make space suits that large ;) ;D?

Hey Beat LA, isn't Williams better and considered to have the higher ceiling than your allergic to rebounding non-shotblocking binkie Patton?

Non-shotblocking ::)? I don't know about the rest, but at least Patton has considerably more skill with the motor and work ethic to succeed, among other things, imo.

Re: Williams vs Ayton (full game)
« Reply #38 on: June 23, 2018, 03:12:36 AM »

Offline smokeablount

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I also watched highlights. The dunks and blocks were impressive, but it's the other plays that tell you a story.

One of the highlights that stood out to me was at 3:18. The ball handling, timing, and long strides were unnatural for a big man. I was impressed with that move and wondered what he might look like in space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwMuMY73Tgo

They make space suits that large ;) ;D?

Hey Beat LA, isn't Williams better and considered to have the higher ceiling than your allergic to rebounding non-shotblocking binkie Patton?

Non-shotblocking ::)? I don't know about the rest, but at least Patton has considerably more skill with the motor and work ethic to succeed, among other things, imo.

But he’s demonstrated no more NBA success than Williams, and if williams came out last year he’d have gone notably higher than Patton. And we got him at #27.

Embrace it. It just makes you look crazy to be disappointed to draft Robert Williams, ESPN’s #12 player in the draft at our biggest position of need, at pick #27, especially when you were clamoring for undrafted Rawle Alkins at the same spot. I mean, this is an upgrade.
Give us this pick, Almighty Red
And forgive us our tanking
As we forgive those who tanked against us
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But deliver us from losing

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Re: Williams vs Ayton (full game)
« Reply #39 on: June 23, 2018, 03:38:56 AM »

Offline gouki88

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I also watched highlights. The dunks and blocks were impressive, but it's the other plays that tell you a story.

One of the highlights that stood out to me was at 3:18. The ball handling, timing, and long strides were unnatural for a big man. I was impressed with that move and wondered what he might look like in space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwMuMY73Tgo

They make space suits that large ;) ;D?

Hey Beat LA, isn't Williams better and considered to have the higher ceiling than your allergic to rebounding non-shotblocking binkie Patton?

Non-shotblocking ::)? I don't know about the rest, but at least Patton has considerably more skill with the motor and work ethic to succeed, among other things, imo.

But hes demonstrated no more NBA success than Williams, and if williams came out last year hed have gone notably higher than Patton. And we got him at #27.

Embrace it. It just makes you look crazy to be disappointed to draft Robert Williams, ESPNs #12 player in the draft at our biggest position of need, at pick #27, especially when you were clamoring for undrafted Rawle Alkins at the same spot. I mean, this is an upgrade.
Yeah, it really makes no sense. I expect Williams to be an awesome pickup for a #27 pick

Re: Williams vs Ayton (full game)
« Reply #40 on: June 23, 2018, 04:49:52 AM »

Offline Beat LA

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I also watched highlights. The dunks and blocks were impressive, but it's the other plays that tell you a story.

One of the highlights that stood out to me was at 3:18. The ball handling, timing, and long strides were unnatural for a big man. I was impressed with that move and wondered what he might look like in space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwMuMY73Tgo

They make space suits that large ;) ;D?

Hey Beat LA, isn't Williams better and considered to have the higher ceiling than your allergic to rebounding non-shotblocking binkie Patton?

Non-shotblocking ::)? I don't know about the rest, but at least Patton has considerably more skill with the motor and work ethic to succeed, among other things, imo.

But hes demonstrated no more NBA success than Williams, and if williams came out last year hed have gone notably higher than Patton. And we got him at #27.

Embrace it. It just makes you look crazy to be disappointed to draft Robert Williams, ESPNs #12 player in the draft at our biggest position of need, at pick #27, especially when you were clamoring for undrafted Rawle Alkins at the same spot. I mean, this is an upgrade.

Yes, and that's because he was hurt ::), but I also disagree with your assertion that Williams would have gone higher than Patton, last year, who was taken at 16 in a loaded draft -

https://www.basketball-reference.com/draft/NBA_2017.html

Beyond that, I'm quite comfortable with being treated as the village idiot, around here, although it's certainly not something that I seek out, like at all, lol ;D. Listen, it's fine. If Williams pans out - great :). If he doesn't, well, it's neither my money nor my problem, lol, as I did all that I could ;D.

I just view taking players with injury/motor/work ethic concerns, among other negative attributes, to be a cardinal sin when it comes to drafting, as history tells us that such guys rarely, if ever, work out (no pun intended) :-\, although it is pretty funny to see someone who references the "legendary" ;) ::) ;D Mark Blount in their profile to be seemingly enamored with another big guy who has a questionable motor and, at least imo, concerning work habits, and dude is already off to a great start ::).

Sigh.

Re: Williams vs Ayton (full game)
« Reply #41 on: June 23, 2018, 07:24:28 AM »

Online Eddie20

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I also watched highlights. The dunks and blocks were impressive, but it's the other plays that tell you a story.

One of the highlights that stood out to me was at 3:18. The ball handling, timing, and long strides were unnatural for a big man. I was impressed with that move and wondered what he might look like in space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwMuMY73Tgo

They make space suits that large ;) ;D?

Hey Beat LA, isn't Williams better and considered to have the higher ceiling than your allergic to rebounding non-shotblocking binkie Patton?

Non-shotblocking ::)? I don't know about the rest, but at least Patton has considerably more skill with the motor and work ethic to succeed, among other things, imo.

Yeah, non-shotblocking. I'd expect you to know more about a guy you're always hyping up than you do. BTW, if Patton has such a great motor then it's cause for concern that he still can't rebound or block shots.

Patton
College   -    MPG 25.3 - RPG 6.2 - BPG 1.4
GLeague -    MPG 23.2 - RPG 5.4 - BPG 1.3

Olynyk 
College   -    MPG 26.4 - RPG 7.3 - BPG 1.1

Williams
College (yr 1) - MPG 25.8 - RPG 8.2 - BPG 2.5
College (yr 2) - MPG 25.6 - RPG 9.2 - BPG 2.6


So as you can clearly see, Patton blocks shots and rebounds at a Olynyk type level, which is ironic since you've always made fun of Olynyk for his rebounding and shotblocking inability. Yet, you love Patton. It just doesn't make any sense.

Re: Williams vs Ayton (full game)
« Reply #42 on: June 23, 2018, 07:37:16 AM »

Online Eddie20

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I also watched highlights. The dunks and blocks were impressive, but it's the other plays that tell you a story.

One of the highlights that stood out to me was at 3:18. The ball handling, timing, and long strides were unnatural for a big man. I was impressed with that move and wondered what he might look like in space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwMuMY73Tgo

They make space suits that large ;) ;D?

Hey Beat LA, isn't Williams better and considered to have the higher ceiling than your allergic to rebounding non-shotblocking binkie Patton?

Non-shotblocking ::)? I don't know about the rest, but at least Patton has considerably more skill with the motor and work ethic to succeed, among other things, imo.

But hes demonstrated no more NBA success than Williams, and if williams came out last year hed have gone notably higher than Patton. And we got him at #27.

Embrace it. It just makes you look crazy to be disappointed to draft Robert Williams, ESPNs #12 player in the draft at our biggest position of need, at pick #27, especially when you were clamoring for undrafted Rawle Alkins at the same spot. I mean, this is an upgrade.

I also disagree with your assertion that Williams would have gone higher than Patton, last year, who was taken at 16 in a loaded draft -

Wrong again.

Williams was projected as the No. 10 overall pick by DraftExpress. That's important because DX nailed the first 13 picks of the draft correctly.

Also...respected draft expert Sam Vecinie had this...

Prior to his decision, Williams was ranked No. 12 in Sporting News NBA Draft Big Board, and his ranking was also the end of a tier of prospects for this evaluator. In the current NBA ecosystem, project big men tend to have more volatile draft stocks than their counterparts, both positively and negatively. Its a simple matter of behavioral economics.

As NBA teams start to play smaller lineups more consistently, the demand for big men falls as the supply entering the draft stays the same. However, Williams had emerged as the top choice among these project centers such as Justin Patton, John Collins, Ivan Rabb, Bam Adebayo and Harry Giles.

Re: Williams vs Ayton (full game)
« Reply #43 on: June 23, 2018, 07:53:59 AM »

Offline gouki88

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TP Eddie!

Re: Williams vs Ayton (full game)
« Reply #44 on: June 23, 2018, 08:54:01 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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I also watched highlights. The dunks and blocks were impressive, but it's the other plays that tell you a story.

One of the highlights that stood out to me was at 3:18. The ball handling, timing, and long strides were unnatural for a big man. I was impressed with that move and wondered what he might look like in space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwMuMY73Tgo

They make space suits that large ;) ;D?

Hey Beat LA, isn't Williams better and considered to have the higher ceiling than your allergic to rebounding non-shotblocking binkie Patton?

Non-shotblocking ::)? I don't know about the rest, but at least Patton has considerably more skill with the motor and work ethic to succeed, among other things, imo.

Yeah, non-shotblocking. I'd expect you to know more about a guy you're always hyping up than you do. BTW, if Patton has such a great motor then it's cause for concern that he still can't rebound or block shots.

Patton
College   -    MPG 25.3 - RPG 6.2 - BPG 1.4
GLeague -    MPG 23.2 - RPG 5.4 - BPG 1.3

Olynyk 
College   -    MPG 26.4 - RPG 7.3 - BPG 1.1

Williams
College (yr 1) - MPG 25.8 - RPG 8.2 - BPG 2.5
College (yr 2) - MPG 25.6 - RPG 9.2 - BPG 2.6


So as you can clearly see, Patton blocks shots and rebounds at a Olynyk type level, which is ironic since you've always made fun of Olynyk for his rebounding and shotblocking inability. Yet, you love Patton. It just doesn't make any sense.

Motor, imo, isn't just about rebounding and blocking shots - it also pertains to a player's all-around effort, which Patton has already demonstrated, and especially defensively, in spades.

I'm going to ask this as nicely as I possibly can - have you ever seen Patton play?

I also watched highlights. The dunks and blocks were impressive, but it's the other plays that tell you a story.

One of the highlights that stood out to me was at 3:18. The ball handling, timing, and long strides were unnatural for a big man. I was impressed with that move and wondered what he might look like in space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwMuMY73Tgo

They make space suits that large ;) ;D?

Hey Beat LA, isn't Williams better and considered to have the higher ceiling than your allergic to rebounding non-shotblocking binkie Patton?

Non-shotblocking ::)? I don't know about the rest, but at least Patton has considerably more skill with the motor and work ethic to succeed, among other things, imo.

But hes demonstrated no more NBA success than Williams, and if williams came out last year hed have gone notably higher than Patton. And we got him at #27.

Embrace it. It just makes you look crazy to be disappointed to draft Robert Williams, ESPNs #12 player in the draft at our biggest position of need, at pick #27, especially when you were clamoring for undrafted Rawle Alkins at the same spot. I mean, this is an upgrade.

I also disagree with your assertion that Williams would have gone higher than Patton, last year, who was taken at 16 in a loaded draft -

Wrong again.

Williams was projected as the No. 10 overall pick by DraftExpress. That's important because DX nailed the first 13 picks of the draft correctly.

Also...respected draft expert Sam Vecinie had this...

Prior to his decision, Williams was ranked No. 12 in Sporting News NBA Draft Big Board, and his ranking was also the end of a tier of prospects for this evaluator. In the current NBA ecosystem, project big men tend to have more volatile draft stocks than their counterparts, both positively and negatively. Its a simple matter of behavioral economics.

As NBA teams start to play smaller lineups more consistently, the demand for big men falls as the supply entering the draft stays the same. However, Williams had emerged as the top choice among these project centers such as Justin Patton, John Collins, Ivan Rabb, Bam Adebayo and Harry Giles.

Yes, because if history tells us anything, it's that teams often make their draft day decisions based on rankings and big boards compiled by sites such as DraftExpress ::). Come on, man.

Besides, I found that article, linked below, and as is your pattern, you seem to have only included the part of the piece that suits your argument, as the very next sentence after "However, Williams had emerged as the top choice among these project centers such as Justin Patton, John Collins, Ivan Rabb, Bam Adebayo and Harry Giles" reads, "Even a pessimistic projection would have had trouble seeing him fall out of the top 20." Did we not hear similar rumblings this year? ::)

Case in point, the much-maligned nbadraft.net, which nailed many picks during the most recent draft, had Williams going at 15 to the Wizards, so just because a guy is projected to be drafted in a certain spot does not always, if ever, guarantee that they will be selected at said part of the, well, draft, but whatever ::).

Still, I'll play along. Let's say that Williams had entered the draft following his freshman season - with questions surrounding his motor and work ethic, not to mention the problem(s) with his knee(s), as we saw this year, where do you think that he would have been taken, at the earliest, if not also the most likely, even without those concerns?

My best guess, as I really don't know, would have to be 10, to the Blazers, or 12 to the Pistons, perhaps, but I just don't see him being taken before Bam Bam because Kentucky, lol ::) ;D, and who knows as to what Charlotte would have done in such a hypothetical scenario, but either way, I'm probably wrong :-\.

http://www.sportingnews.com/ncaa-basketball/news/robert-williams-nba-draft-2017-texas-am-projection-mock-lottery/fmohpmwgtll31ctm3j0zn706e