Author Topic: Ainge got his big at pick 27. Welcome Robert Williams  (Read 11361 times)

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Re: Ainge got his big at pick 27. Welcome Robert Williams
« Reply #150 on: June 22, 2018, 10:23:47 AM »

Online saltlover

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Some very smart posters here, like Salt and Roy, seem very bearish on Williams.  Don't be fooled, I've scouted pretty well over the past decade to 12 years when I bother to watch, and I think Williams is a great pick, and attones for passing on DeAndre Jordan.

For reference, I was on record for Tatum last year, was perhaps the most vocal Kyrie trade supporter (i posted videos of IT and Kyrie showing how Kyrie was simply better, stats be [dang]ed) and after we got Morris I immediately researched and stated we won that trade. 

So I feel my opinion has been overall pretty solid the past year, and I love this pick.  This is not like selecting Fab Melo or Deyonta Davis, it's like picking DeAndre Jordan or Willie Caulie-Stein.

Not sure the motor criticisms are fair. His drb% is on par with the tops in the country, and much higher than JJJ and he has a very high block % as well.

Itís not like picking Willie Cauley-Stein.  WCS is not and will never be a perfect player, but he took a step forward in college every year.  Williams was the same player this year as he was last year.  He got suspended for 3 games at the beginning of the season for violating team rules (presumably pot). His on-court effort issues are widely agreed upon.

I get the pick.  I think it was the correct one.  I just think people are way too excited about him and are setting themselves up for disappointment.  Itís a lot easier for me to see him never making it into the Celtics rotation than it is for me to see him as a foundational piece, or even really a useful on that leaves after his rookie deal.  I hope he reaches his considerable ceiling, or even gets 80% of the way there. That would make the Celtics future even more bright than it already is.  I donít see it happening, but Iíd love to be wrong.

Just curious if you did indeed watch A&M games at all, or just basing this on what you've seen on highlights/draft videos?

There was absolutely no floor spacing. There were a lot of injuries.

Robert Williams fell supposedly due to his motor, and knee issues, but from what I've seen. He is a threat for a lob every time.

I watched a few.  I understand that A&M misused him terribly, and Billy Gillespie is on my list of worst college coaches.  But I also saw him get lit up by Mo Wagner in the tournament, both inside and out.  Thatís problematic if heís going to have trouble with stretch bigs.

Again, he has talent.  Iím not questioning it.  So did Larry Sanders.

The Celtics didnít work him out.  I believe the last two players they didnít work out and selected in the first round were also high-ceiling, lottery-projected players who fell ó James Young and Gerald Green.

He skipped the draft combine, which is a bit odd for a player who was being talked about as on the fringe of the lottery.  The teams who worked him out and interviewed him all decided they liked someone more at that spot.  Thereís a lot of information out there that says he most likely wonít pan out, so Iím just not going to get overly excited about him in advance, and save my exuberance if he does make it.

Youíre of course all free to call him the second-coming of Bill Russell or Robert Parish.  Itís fun to be excited ó Iím just not.
ďWhen an alien resides with you in your land, you shall not oppress the alien. The alien who resides with you shall be to you as the citizen among you; you shall love the alien as yourself, for you were aliens in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.Ē

Leviticus 19:33-34

Re: Ainge got his big at pick 27. Welcome Robert Williams
« Reply #151 on: June 22, 2018, 10:26:40 AM »

Offline footey

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This was a good pick,  7'5" wingspan, can guard the perimeter, 6'10" with a 40 inch vertical !

https://www.facebook.com/bleacherreport/videos/10154878620491006/

He lacks skills but lordy does he have potential.


Stevens said he's very high on him.

I still wanted Spellman, but I'm gonna trust Steven's judgement.

I don't like the fact he had immaturity issues and terrible shooting mechanics, but we gotta give him a chance.

Man, they say that same crap every year, lol ::) ;D. Didn't Stevens also say that R.J. Hunter was going to have a great career ::)? I just, I can't, lol ;D.

Don't get me wrong, I'll certainly be watching the guy in the Summer League, etc., but it's just never a good idea to take any guy with a sub-par motor and/or work ethic, imo, as those are characteristics that you simply cannot teach, in my view. You've either got it or you don't, to me, but we'll see as to what happens.

Had Williams been drafted by the Warriors, for example, I could have seen that possibly panning out owing to Draymond and company constantly being in his ear and all that comes with being immersed in a championship environment, but I really don't know about this one, man, and what's the deal with Khyri Thomas?

All this complaining about Williams when your binky didn't even get drafted? ROFL

Yes, I have legitimate concerns about Williams - sue me ::).

Given your track record of Celtic picks you have disparaged in the past (Jaylen Brown, Terry Rozier), Williams will probablyl turn out to be a spectacular pick.

Re: Ainge got his big at pick 27. Welcome Robert Williams
« Reply #152 on: June 22, 2018, 10:34:55 AM »

Offline footey

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Danny at the press conference:

"Our roster...we don't, we don't need more young players, really. We feel good about adding 1."

So I am guessing no adding other young guys this year. Just vets?
That's how I see it. Probably trying to run it back with Baynes and Smart (if reasonable)

Honestly if they resign Smart and keep Bird, Williams could very well be the only new face on the roster (with Baynes departing).  I think they keep the 15th spot open until buyout season.  This will both offer them flexibility and help keep them below the tax after Smartís new deal is signed.

I think they still need to sign Baynes if possible.  They need him to defend big 5's like Embiid; Williams too young, and may not have right frame (narrow hips) to defend strong centers the way Baynes can. Unless they think Semi/Yabu can handle that load.

Re: Ainge got his big at pick 27. Welcome Robert Williams
« Reply #153 on: June 22, 2018, 10:44:43 AM »

Offline footey

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Some very smart posters here, like Salt and Roy, seem very bearish on Williams.  Don't be fooled, I've scouted pretty well over the past decade to 12 years when I bother to watch, and I think Williams is a great pick, and attones for passing on DeAndre Jordan.

For reference, I was on record for Tatum last year, was perhaps the most vocal Kyrie trade supporter (i posted videos of IT and Kyrie showing how Kyrie was simply better, stats be [dang]ed) and after we got Morris I immediately researched and stated we won that trade. 

So I feel my opinion has been overall pretty solid the past year, and I love this pick.  This is not like selecting Fab Melo or Deyonta Davis, it's like picking DeAndre Jordan or Willie Caulie-Stein.

Not sure the motor criticisms are fair. His drb% is on par with the tops in the country, and much higher than JJJ and he has a very high block % as well.

Itís not like picking Willie Cauley-Stein.  WCS is not and will never be a perfect player, but he took a step forward in college every year.  Williams was the same player this year as he was last year.  He got suspended for 3 games at the beginning of the season for violating team rules (presumably pot). His on-court effort issues are widely agreed upon.

I get the pick.  I think it was the correct one.  I just think people are way too excited about him and are setting themselves up for disappointment.  Itís a lot easier for me to see him never making it into the Celtics rotation than it is for me to see him as a foundational piece, or even really a useful on that leaves after his rookie deal.  I hope he reaches his considerable ceiling, or even gets 80% of the way there. That would make the Celtics future even more bright than it already is.  I donít see it happening, but Iíd love to be wrong.

Just curious if you did indeed watch A&M games at all, or just basing this on what you've seen on highlights/draft videos?

There was absolutely no floor spacing. There were a lot of injuries.

Robert Williams fell supposedly due to his motor, and knee issues, but from what I've seen. He is a threat for a lob every time.

I watched a few.  I understand that A&M misused him terribly, and Billy Gillespie is on my list of worst college coaches.  But I also saw him get lit up by Mo Wagner in the tournament, both inside and out.  Thatís problematic if heís going to have trouble with stretch bigs.

Again, he has talent.  Iím not questioning it.  So did Larry Sanders.

The Celtics didnít work him out.  I believe the last two players they didnít work out and selected in the first round were also high-ceiling, lottery-projected players who fell ó James Young and Gerald Green.

He skipped the draft combine, which is a bit odd for a player who was being talked about as on the fringe of the lottery.  The teams who worked him out and interviewed him all decided they liked someone more at that spot.  Thereís a lot of information out there that says he most likely wonít pan out, so Iím just not going to get overly excited about him in advance, and save my exuberance if he does make it.

Youíre of course all free to call him the second-coming of Bill Russell or Robert Parish.  Itís fun to be excited ó Iím just not.

Thanks for your sobering thoughts, Saltlover.

Hope you are wrong. I know you hope you are wrong too!

Just curious, why do you think the Ohio State kid dropped so far? I know you liked him a lot, and thought he'd be gone before 27.

Re: Ainge got his big at pick 27. Welcome Robert Williams
« Reply #154 on: June 22, 2018, 10:46:06 AM »

Online Sophomore

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On a scale of Mickey to DeAndre Jordan, I think the most likely outcome here is Mickey.

I will be thrilled to be wrong. If he’s even serviceable as a rotation defender that would be a good outcome from the 27 pick. In addition to the obvious concerns, there are the knee issues that nbadraft.net low-key profiled. Worrying in a guy who depends on elite ability and skipped the combine. I hope we stole one here, but I doubt it.

Re: Ainge got his big at pick 27. Welcome Robert Williams
« Reply #155 on: June 22, 2018, 10:51:04 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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I think they still need to sign Baynes if possible.  They need him to defend big 5's like Embiid; Williams too young, and may not have right frame (narrow hips) to defend strong centers the way Baynes can. Unless they think Semi/Yabu can handle that load.
They're sending Baynes as the Celtics representative to the NBA awards ceremony. It sure sounds like Baynes and the team are confident he's going to stick around.

Re: Ainge got his big at pick 27. Welcome Robert Williams
« Reply #156 on: June 22, 2018, 10:51:58 AM »

Online saltlover

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Danny at the press conference:

"Our roster...we don't, we don't need more young players, really. We feel good about adding 1."

So I am guessing no adding other young guys this year. Just vets?
That's how I see it. Probably trying to run it back with Baynes and Smart (if reasonable)

Honestly if they resign Smart and keep Bird, Williams could very well be the only new face on the roster (with Baynes departing).  I think they keep the 15th spot open until buyout season.  This will both offer them flexibility and help keep them below the tax after Smartís new deal is signed.

I think they still need to sign Baynes if possible.  They need him to defend big 5's like Embiid; Williams too young, and may not have right frame (narrow hips) to defend strong centers the way Baynes can. Unless they think Semi/Yabu can handle that load.

Unless they trade Morris or Yabusele, I donít think thereís room for Baynes on the roster.  If you look at a starting five of Irving-Brown-Hayward-Tatum-Horford, then you have Smart, Rozier, Morris, and Theis as your 9-man rotation, with Ojeleye in there as well.  Williams obviously needs some room for developmental minutes, and presumably Yabusele also does if the team hasnít given up on him.  Getting a rotation-level big/keeping Baynes is going to push us into the luxury tax, and that just doesnít make all that much sense given the lack of room in the rotation as is. 

So without a trade, it makes more sense to wait for the buyout period and at that point pay someone the most you can afford without going over the tax to be the big to bang with Embiid in the playoffs.  In the meanwhile, it gets to be Horford, Theis, and one of the young bigs.  If thereís someone you canít pass on whoís available for the minimum after Smart has signed his deal, you can re-evaluate then.  And again, if thereís a trade itís obviously a different discussion.  But if you assume weíre keeing Smart, as I have done, thereís not much room for a pure center.
ďWhen an alien resides with you in your land, you shall not oppress the alien. The alien who resides with you shall be to you as the citizen among you; you shall love the alien as yourself, for you were aliens in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.Ē

Leviticus 19:33-34

Re: Ainge got his big at pick 27. Welcome Robert Williams
« Reply #157 on: June 22, 2018, 10:53:09 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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I like taking a swing at a talented big man. Just looking at the roster balance going forward he's the sort of player that the C's currently do not have. Plenty of young wings/guards not so much for big men.

C's hoping to get something about of him or Yabu.

Re: Ainge got his big at pick 27. Welcome Robert Williams
« Reply #158 on: June 22, 2018, 10:55:50 AM »

Online saltlover

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Some very smart posters here, like Salt and Roy, seem very bearish on Williams.  Don't be fooled, I've scouted pretty well over the past decade to 12 years when I bother to watch, and I think Williams is a great pick, and attones for passing on DeAndre Jordan.

For reference, I was on record for Tatum last year, was perhaps the most vocal Kyrie trade supporter (i posted videos of IT and Kyrie showing how Kyrie was simply better, stats be [dang]ed) and after we got Morris I immediately researched and stated we won that trade. 

So I feel my opinion has been overall pretty solid the past year, and I love this pick.  This is not like selecting Fab Melo or Deyonta Davis, it's like picking DeAndre Jordan or Willie Caulie-Stein.

Not sure the motor criticisms are fair. His drb% is on par with the tops in the country, and much higher than JJJ and he has a very high block % as well.

Itís not like picking Willie Cauley-Stein.  WCS is not and will never be a perfect player, but he took a step forward in college every year.  Williams was the same player this year as he was last year.  He got suspended for 3 games at the beginning of the season for violating team rules (presumably pot). His on-court effort issues are widely agreed upon.

I get the pick.  I think it was the correct one.  I just think people are way too excited about him and are setting themselves up for disappointment.  Itís a lot easier for me to see him never making it into the Celtics rotation than it is for me to see him as a foundational piece, or even really a useful on that leaves after his rookie deal.  I hope he reaches his considerable ceiling, or even gets 80% of the way there. That would make the Celtics future even more bright than it already is.  I donít see it happening, but Iíd love to be wrong.

Just curious if you did indeed watch A&M games at all, or just basing this on what you've seen on highlights/draft videos?

There was absolutely no floor spacing. There were a lot of injuries.

Robert Williams fell supposedly due to his motor, and knee issues, but from what I've seen. He is a threat for a lob every time.

I watched a few.  I understand that A&M misused him terribly, and Billy Gillespie is on my list of worst college coaches.  But I also saw him get lit up by Mo Wagner in the tournament, both inside and out.  Thatís problematic if heís going to have trouble with stretch bigs.

Again, he has talent.  Iím not questioning it.  So did Larry Sanders.

The Celtics didnít work him out.  I believe the last two players they didnít work out and selected in the first round were also high-ceiling, lottery-projected players who fell ó James Young and Gerald Green.

He skipped the draft combine, which is a bit odd for a player who was being talked about as on the fringe of the lottery.  The teams who worked him out and interviewed him all decided they liked someone more at that spot.  Thereís a lot of information out there that says he most likely wonít pan out, so Iím just not going to get overly excited about him in advance, and save my exuberance if he does make it.

Youíre of course all free to call him the second-coming of Bill Russell or Robert Parish.  Itís fun to be excited ó Iím just not.

Thanks for your sobering thoughts, Saltlover.

Hope you are wrong. I know you hope you are wrong too!

Just curious, why do you think the Ohio State kid dropped so far? I know you liked him a lot, and thought he'd be gone before 27.

Lack of upside.  Once he dropped out of the end of the first round, it was a run of teams early in the second round who werenít looking for cheap rotation players but rather cheap home runs, since they werenít contenders.  Minnesota got a bargain.

And yes, I would love to be wrong on Williams.
ďWhen an alien resides with you in your land, you shall not oppress the alien. The alien who resides with you shall be to you as the citizen among you; you shall love the alien as yourself, for you were aliens in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.Ē

Leviticus 19:33-34

Re: Ainge got his big at pick 27. Welcome Robert Williams
« Reply #159 on: June 22, 2018, 10:56:40 AM »

Offline PAOBoston

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I'm ok with the pick. At 27, I think he represented what it sounds like BPA and also solved a need for the team (basically a project big man/Monroe replacement).

He certainly has some physical tools to work with and he probably will benefit from getting drafted by a strong organization like the C's. Hope he takes that to heart and learns from Horford.

Offensively, not expecting much from him this year outside of Smart lobs for alley oops. He's gonna need to figure out the FT shooting to at least become passable. I don't understand how a basketball player

I think Capella has a similar FT percentage, and is about to get offered a $15 to $20mm per year contract. If Williams was an 80% FT shooter, would not have dropped to 27, get real.
Sorry I'm not full on green cool aid like most in here today.

I never said I disliked the pick. Just tempering expectations. He's a project and will need time. 43% FT is abysmal at any level. Not saying he can't turn it around, just pointing out the obvious that he will need to make an effort to improve that to be at least passable.

People in here make it sound like Cs just drafted a HOFer. This guy will likely be in Maine for large chunks of the year if they bring back Baynes.

Re: Ainge got his big at pick 27. Welcome Robert Williams
« Reply #160 on: June 22, 2018, 10:57:30 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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"Not having room" for Baynes sounds like a great way end up with Horford playing 100% of his minutes at center or forcing Yabu/Williams into the rotation. Theis is coming back from a knee injury after all.

Even if Baynes ends up going somewhere else they'll sign some big to make sure that doesn't happen.

Re: Ainge got his big at pick 27. Welcome Robert Williams
« Reply #161 on: June 22, 2018, 11:03:52 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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Apparently the C's have already lost track of Williams and are delaying a conference call press event with him.

Re: Ainge got his big at pick 27. Welcome Robert Williams
« Reply #162 on: June 22, 2018, 11:06:13 AM »

Offline JHTruth

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I'm ok with the pick. At 27, I think he represented what it sounds like BPA and also solved a need for the team (basically a project big man/Monroe replacement).

He certainly has some physical tools to work with and he probably will benefit from getting drafted by a strong organization like the C's. Hope he takes that to heart and learns from Horford.

Offensively, not expecting much from him this year outside of Smart lobs for alley oops. He's gonna need to figure out the FT shooting to at least become passable. I don't understand how a basketball player

I think Capella has a similar FT percentage, and is about to get offered a $15 to $20mm per year contract. If Williams was an 80% FT shooter, would not have dropped to 27, get real.
Sorry I'm not full on green cool aid like most in here today.

I never said I disliked the pick. Just tempering expectations. He's a project and will need time. 43% FT is abysmal at any level. Not saying he can't turn it around, just pointing out the obvious that he will need to make an effort to improve that to be at least passable.

People in here make it sound like Cs just drafted a HOFer. This guy will likely be in Maine for large chunks of the year if they bring back Baynes.

Who's saying we drafted a "HOFer"? He's an athletic freak with crazy wingspan with very high college block and DRB % who fills a role on our team we desperately need.

What's not to be excited about? I mean if you're the type of guy that just loves drafting obscure guards for bench fodder just so you can tell yourself you're some type of amazing talent evaluator that doesn't buy into the "hype" I guess you might hate the pick.Other than that he's a steal at 27..

Re: Ainge got his big at pick 27. Welcome Robert Williams
« Reply #163 on: June 22, 2018, 11:06:38 AM »

Online saltlover

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"Not having room" for Baynes sounds like a great way end up with Horford playing 100% of his minutes at center or forcing Yabu/Williams into the rotation. Theis is coming back from a knee injury after all.

Even if Baynes ends up going somewhere else they'll sign some big to make sure that doesn't happen.

Unless and until they trade one of Morris or Yabusele, or they let Smart go in free agency, they donít have room.  Both in terms of minutes and in space under the tax line.

I like Baynes, and Iíd happily move Morris to make room for him.  I just donít think we can assume that a trade to the Celtics liking will avail itself.
ďWhen an alien resides with you in your land, you shall not oppress the alien. The alien who resides with you shall be to you as the citizen among you; you shall love the alien as yourself, for you were aliens in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.Ē

Leviticus 19:33-34

Re: Ainge got his big at pick 27. Welcome Robert Williams
« Reply #164 on: June 22, 2018, 11:07:04 AM »

Online saltlover

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Apparently the C's have already lost track of Williams and are delaying a conference call press event with him.

Is this for real? 

EDIT:  Just saw the tweet.  Yeesh.
ďWhen an alien resides with you in your land, you shall not oppress the alien. The alien who resides with you shall be to you as the citizen among you; you shall love the alien as yourself, for you were aliens in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.Ē

Leviticus 19:33-34