Author Topic: Durant: “I want to retire in 5 years”  (Read 1392 times)

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Re: Durant: “I want to retire in 5 years”
« Reply #30 on: June 12, 2018, 04:23:50 AM »

Online Erik

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I know we are worse without him, but I'm glad he didn't come here.  It would have forced me to again root for a player I absolutely despised (KG was the other).
you despised kd before the decision?

and why did you hate KG?

he was a fighter with a garbage cast in Minnesota


but you love lebron?

what am i missing?
yeah I never liked Durant in OKC. He always just seemed phoney to me. Tried to act like the good guy and always let Russ take the brunt of everything whike he sjated by and then when he got any criticism acted like someone killed hia family.  Always just a phoney to me.  The extent of his arrogance and pettiness is on full display in the Bay.

As for KG he is and always has been the biggest prick on the court. I just don't like the way he would go after rookies or backups like he was a tough guy and he never went after vets.  Just a real **** on the court.

I would respect and understand your position on KD if it weren’t inconsistent with LeBron. LeBron is everything that you mentioned about KD and more. The NBA will be significantly better once he’s finally gone (just in time for Rich Paul to sign his kid to continue the entitlement parade).

Re: Durant: “I want to retire in 5 years”
« Reply #31 on: June 12, 2018, 08:14:09 AM »

Offline Moranis

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I know we are worse without him, but I'm glad he didn't come here.  It would have forced me to again root for a player I absolutely despised (KG was the other).
you despised kd before the decision?

and why did you hate KG?

he was a fighter with a garbage cast in Minnesota


but you love lebron?

what am i missing?
yeah I never liked Durant in OKC. He always just seemed phoney to me. Tried to act like the good guy and always let Russ take the brunt of everything whike he sjated by and then when he got any criticism acted like someone killed hia family.  Always just a phoney to me.  The extent of his arrogance and pettiness is on full display in the Bay.

As for KG he is and always has been the biggest prick on the court. I just don't like the way he would go after rookies or backups like he was a tough guy and he never went after vets.  Just a real **** on the court.

I would respect and understand your position on KD if it weren’t inconsistent with LeBron. LeBron is everything that you mentioned about KD and more. The NBA will be significantly better once he’s finally gone (just in time for Rich Paul to sign his kid to continue the entitlement parade).
Lebron doesn't pretend to be something he is not.  Lebron's arrogance has always been on full display.  Same as Kobe, Shaq, Jordan, Bird, Magic, etc.  All great players are arrogant, I just don't like the way the Durant hid his and pretended he was something he wasn't.  It comes off as phoney and fake. 

Re: Durant: “I want to retire in 5 years”
« Reply #32 on: June 12, 2018, 11:03:46 AM »

Offline rocknrollforyoursoul

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5 more years gives him just enough time to breeze past Jordan's 6 titles.

Not gonna happen, unless he joins Boston in the next couple of years.
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Re: Durant: “I want to retire in 5 years”
« Reply #33 on: June 12, 2018, 11:09:11 AM »

Offline pearljammer10

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5 more years gives him just enough time to breeze past Jordan's 6 titles.

Not gonna happen, unless he joins Boston in the next couple of years.

Won't be a breeze and he already has a finals loss.... I can stomach the MJ vs LJ debate....Don't even bring up Durant vs MJ. Its even further apart than the LJ debate in my eyes.
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Re: Durant: “I want to retire in 5 years”
« Reply #34 on: June 12, 2018, 11:21:58 AM »

Offline Moranis

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Durant doesn't have a complete enough all around game to be in the same league as Jordan and James in the all time great discussion.  He could potentially get into the back end of the top 10 all time though, but right now he has a long way to go to even get in the discussion with someone like Bryant (a top 20ish all time player). 

Re: Durant: “I want to retire in 5 years”
« Reply #35 on: June 12, 2018, 11:41:05 AM »

Online Erik

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I know we are worse without him, but I'm glad he didn't come here.  It would have forced me to again root for a player I absolutely despised (KG was the other).
you despised kd before the decision?

and why did you hate KG?

he was a fighter with a garbage cast in Minnesota


but you love lebron?

what am i missing?
yeah I never liked Durant in OKC. He always just seemed phoney to me. Tried to act like the good guy and always let Russ take the brunt of everything whike he sjated by and then when he got any criticism acted like someone killed hia family.  Always just a phoney to me.  The extent of his arrogance and pettiness is on full display in the Bay.

As for KG he is and always has been the biggest prick on the court. I just don't like the way he would go after rookies or backups like he was a tough guy and he never went after vets.  Just a real **** on the court.

I would respect and understand your position on KD if it weren’t inconsistent with LeBron. LeBron is everything that you mentioned about KD and more. The NBA will be significantly better once he’s finally gone (just in time for Rich Paul to sign his kid to continue the entitlement parade).
Lebron doesn't pretend to be something he is not.  Lebron's arrogance has always been on full display.  Same as Kobe, Shaq, Jordan, Bird, Magic, etc.  All great players are arrogant, I just don't like the way the Durant hid his and pretended he was something he wasn't.  It comes off as phoney and fake.

And yet you were able to see through the phony and find the arrogance. Maybe it's not as hidden as you think it is, or you yourself are arrogant :)

Re: Durant: “I want to retire in 5 years”
« Reply #36 on: June 12, 2018, 12:44:45 PM »

Online celticsclay

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I know we are worse without him, but I'm glad he didn't come here.  It would have forced me to again root for a player I absolutely despised (KG was the other).
you despised kd before the decision?

and why did you hate KG?

he was a fighter with a garbage cast in Minnesota


but you love lebron?

what am i missing?
yeah I never liked Durant in OKC. He always just seemed phoney to me. Tried to act like the good guy and always let Russ take the brunt of everything whike he sjated by and then when he got any criticism acted like someone killed hia family.  Always just a phoney to me.  The extent of his arrogance and pettiness is on full display in the Bay.

As for KG he is and always has been the biggest prick on the court. I just don't like the way he would go after rookies or backups like he was a tough guy and he never went after vets.  Just a real **** on the court.

But you like Lebron? His phoniness and whinning doesn't bother you?

I respect Lebron as an all-time great player, but he's a phony as a leader, throws his teammates under the bus, never admits any blame for anything, intimidates his teammates and refs, whines after almost every play, and forces the front offices of his teams into bad decisions.
everyone whines. You wouldn't like anyone if you didn't like whiners.  James doesn't come off as phoney to me.  I think that is exactly who he is.  He isn't a sociopath like  KD or a fake tough guy bully like KG.
[/quote
Durant and Lebron are very similar. Both great players. Both went and played with their friends on super teams. Both very sensitive. Hard to imagine hating one and loving the other

Re: Durant: “I want to retire in 5 years”
« Reply #37 on: June 12, 2018, 12:46:40 PM »

Online celticsclay

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Durant doesn't have a complete enough all around game to be in the same league as Jordan and James in the all time great discussion.  He could potentially get into the back end of the top 10 all time though, but right now he has a long way to go to even get in the discussion with someone like Bryant (a top 20ish all time player).

Something to keep in mind Durant may end up with twice as many rings as Lebron. If he doesn't retire early he would end up very very high on all scoring list. Perhaps top 3. You would still have him barely in the top 20?

Re: Durant: “I want to retire in 5 years”
« Reply #38 on: June 12, 2018, 12:49:43 PM »

Offline Moranis

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Durant doesn't have a complete enough all around game to be in the same league as Jordan and James in the all time great discussion.  He could potentially get into the back end of the top 10 all time though, but right now he has a long way to go to even get in the discussion with someone like Bryant (a top 20ish all time player).

Something to keep in mind Durant may end up with twice as many rings as Lebron. If he doesn't retire early he would end up very very high on all scoring list. Perhaps top 3. You would still have him barely in the top 20?
You really don't read my posts before you respond to them do you?

Re: Durant: “I want to retire in 5 years”
« Reply #39 on: June 12, 2018, 01:01:19 PM »

Online celticsclay

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Durant doesn't have a complete enough all around game to be in the same league as Jordan and James in the all time great discussion.  He could potentially get into the back end of the top 10 all time though, but right now he has a long way to go to even get in the discussion with someone like Bryant (a top 20ish all time player).

Something to keep in mind Durant may end up with twice as many rings as Lebron. If he doesn't retire early he would end up very very high on all scoring list. Perhaps top 3. You would still have him barely in the top 20?
You really don't read my posts before you respond to them do you?

I do. Do you read mine? Make less childish responses. Most people think Durant has elevated himself to being a very good defensive player. Ironically he has bothered James with his length at times. He is also a very good rebounder. He clearly is a worse passer than James, but on the flip side is a better shooter and scorer. Just cause I don't live in Cleveland and haven't built up Lebron into being a god, doesn't mean I didn't read your post just cause I don't agree with it. Now having said that, if Durant gets up with twice as many titles as Lebron and is top 3 all time in scoring, you are going to be in the minority opinion if you have him ranked 20th.

Re: Durant: “I want to retire in 5 years”
« Reply #40 on: June 12, 2018, 01:23:17 PM »

Offline Moranis

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Durant doesn't have a complete enough all around game to be in the same league as Jordan and James in the all time great discussion. He could potentially get into the back end of the top 10 all time though, but right now he has a long way to go to even get in the discussion with someone like Bryant (a top 20ish all time player).

Something to keep in mind Durant may end up with twice as many rings as Lebron. If he doesn't retire early he would end up very very high on all scoring list. Perhaps top 3. You would still have him barely in the top 20?
You really don't read my posts before you respond to them do you?

I do. Do you read mine? Make less childish responses. Most people think Durant has elevated himself to being a very good defensive player. Ironically he has bothered James with his length at times. He is also a very good rebounder. He clearly is a worse passer than James, but on the flip side is a better shooter and scorer. Just cause I don't live in Cleveland and haven't built up Lebron into being a god, doesn't mean I didn't read your post just cause I don't agree with it. Now having said that, if Durant gets up with twice as many titles as Lebron and is top 3 all time in scoring, you are going to be in the minority opinion if you have him ranked 20th.
I bolded the part you apparently didn't read.

Re: Durant: “I want to retire in 5 years”
« Reply #41 on: June 12, 2018, 04:52:09 PM »

Online celticsclay

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Durant doesn't have a complete enough all around game to be in the same league as Jordan and James in the all time great discussion. He could potentially get into the back end of the top 10 all time though, but right now he has a long way to go to even get in the discussion with someone like Bryant (a top 20ish all time player).

Something to keep in mind Durant may end up with twice as many rings as Lebron. If he doesn't retire early he would end up very very high on all scoring list. Perhaps top 3. You would still have him barely in the top 20?
You really don't read my posts before you respond to them do you?

I do. Do you read mine? Make less childish responses. Most people think Durant has elevated himself to being a very good defensive player. Ironically he has bothered James with his length at times. He is also a very good rebounder. He clearly is a worse passer than James, but on the flip side is a better shooter and scorer. Just cause I don't live in Cleveland and haven't built up Lebron into being a god, doesn't mean I didn't read your post just cause I don't agree with it. Now having said that, if Durant gets up with twice as many titles as Lebron and is top 3 all time in scoring, you are going to be in the minority opinion if you have him ranked 20th.
I bolded the part you apparently didn't read.

Sigh. You said Durant was not a complete player like James, I pointed out that he was actually quite a good rebounder and had become a very good defensive player. You said he had a long way to go to get ranked even in the top 20 near someone like Bryant. You then made a note about him maybe making the top 10 when all is said and done. I am not really sure what how you are quantifying your "long way to go to get near top 20ish like Kobe" (though hate to break it to you a lot of people think Kobe is top 10). So I tried to respond to your jumbled post as best I could. Instead of a debate about what he needs to do to be a more complete player (Durant got 31 all defensive votes compared to 1 for James), you just write back saying I didn't read your post.


To add even more meat here, Durant is 6th in points scored of active players and scores about 2k points a season if he stays healthy. Even if he only plays 6 more years through his age 35 seaons, he would get pretty close to top 5 all time if not top 3 with good health. Is that the long way you are referencing?



Re: Durant: “I want to retire in 5 years”
« Reply #42 on: June 13, 2018, 08:35:03 AM »

Offline Moranis

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ESPN has Kevin Durant at 22 in their all time ranking ahead of Curry, Baylor, and Pippen who they had at 23-25.  I think you could pretty reasonably argue all of those players are ahead of Durant (especially 2 MVP and 3 championship Curry), but that is really preference and I can totally see the argument for Durant.  21st was Kevin Garnett.  I don't think Durant, right now, is all that close to KG in all time rankings, though if Durant were to win the MVP again next year, I think that starts to get him in that conversation along with most of the back half of the top 20 which in order were K. Malone, Dirk, Charles, Stockton, and Robinson.  11-15 they had Oscar, Kobe, West, Dr. J, and M. Malone.  Those rankings seems about right to me.  Their top 10 in order were Jordan, Kareem, Lebron, Magic, Wilt, Bird, Russell, Duncan, Shaq, Hakeem.  That again doesn't seem that strange to me.  I'd personally have Magic a bit lower and Wilt higher, but again nothing seems strange there. 

At the end of the day, I just think Durant needs to do more to be widely regarded as a top 20 player all time, and to get into the conversation for the top 10 all time he has to do a very significant amount.  If he wants to get there it would be a lot easier for him, if he left the Warriors and won a title.  He will never get full credit playing for the Warriors (nor should he really). 

As for things like defense, Durant has never made an All Defense Team.  Lebron has 5 1st team and 1 2nd Team (he has also finished 2nd in DPOY voting).  His peak he was a much better defender than Durant has ever been (Lebron's 2nd Team, his last, he was the same age as Durant is now).  Lebron has now gone 12 straight seasons finishing in the top 5 in MVP voting.  He has been on 11 straight 1st Team All NBA Teams (and has another and a couple of 2nd's).  Durant just picked up his 6th 1st Team (he also a couple of 2nd's as well).  There is no real comparison between those two, which is why James is compared to guys like Jordan and Durant is not and won't ever be. 

Re: Durant: “I want to retire in 5 years”
« Reply #43 on: June 13, 2018, 12:47:40 PM »

Online celticsclay

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ESPN has Kevin Durant at 22 in their all time ranking ahead of Curry, Baylor, and Pippen who they had at 23-25.  I think you could pretty reasonably argue all of those players are ahead of Durant (especially 2 MVP and 3 championship Curry), but that is really preference and I can totally see the argument for Durant.  21st was Kevin Garnett.  I don't think Durant, right now, is all that close to KG in all time rankings, though if Durant were to win the MVP again next year, I think that starts to get him in that conversation along with most of the back half of the top 20 which in order were K. Malone, Dirk, Charles, Stockton, and Robinson.  11-15 they had Oscar, Kobe, West, Dr. J, and M. Malone.  Those rankings seems about right to me.  Their top 10 in order were Jordan, Kareem, Lebron, Magic, Wilt, Bird, Russell, Duncan, Shaq, Hakeem.  That again doesn't seem that strange to me.  I'd personally have Magic a bit lower and Wilt higher, but again nothing seems strange there. 

At the end of the day, I just think Durant needs to do more to be widely regarded as a top 20 player all time, and to get into the conversation for the top 10 all time he has to do a very significant amount.  If he wants to get there it would be a lot easier for him, if he left the Warriors and won a title.  He will never get full credit playing for the Warriors (nor should he really). 

As for things like defense, Durant has never made an All Defense Team.  Lebron has 5 1st team and 1 2nd Team (he has also finished 2nd in DPOY voting).  His peak he was a much better defender than Durant has ever been (Lebron's 2nd Team, his last, he was the same age as Durant is now).  Lebron has now gone 12 straight seasons finishing in the top 5 in MVP voting.  He has been on 11 straight 1st Team All NBA Teams (and has another and a couple of 2nd's).  Durant just picked up his 6th 1st Team (he also a couple of 2nd's as well).  There is no real comparison between those two, which is why James is compared to guys like Jordan and Durant is not and won't ever be.

Durant still has a really good chance to fill out his resume though and get a boatload of rings. His defense is getting way more respect than it used to (and frankly he is just playing better). In 2016-2017 he got 7 total votes. This year he was 14th in total voting and got 7 first team votes. If he starts making all-defensive teams, which it seems is probably a goal of his, that certainly elevates his ceiling as a player. All these players follow different career arcs, and I think it is too early to dismiss Durant if he ends up the leagues all time leading scorer and has 6-7 rings.

Also with respect to the Warriors, do you think in fans eyes he would start getting more respect winning rings with the Warriors if they lost Draymond? At that point the team would seem to be pretty similar to Lebron's heat teams, and most people don't view those rings as 100% cheap.


Re: Durant: “I want to retire in 5 years”
« Reply #44 on: June 13, 2018, 01:02:37 PM »

Offline Moranis

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ESPN has Kevin Durant at 22 in their all time ranking ahead of Curry, Baylor, and Pippen who they had at 23-25.  I think you could pretty reasonably argue all of those players are ahead of Durant (especially 2 MVP and 3 championship Curry), but that is really preference and I can totally see the argument for Durant.  21st was Kevin Garnett.  I don't think Durant, right now, is all that close to KG in all time rankings, though if Durant were to win the MVP again next year, I think that starts to get him in that conversation along with most of the back half of the top 20 which in order were K. Malone, Dirk, Charles, Stockton, and Robinson.  11-15 they had Oscar, Kobe, West, Dr. J, and M. Malone.  Those rankings seems about right to me.  Their top 10 in order were Jordan, Kareem, Lebron, Magic, Wilt, Bird, Russell, Duncan, Shaq, Hakeem.  That again doesn't seem that strange to me.  I'd personally have Magic a bit lower and Wilt higher, but again nothing seems strange there. 

At the end of the day, I just think Durant needs to do more to be widely regarded as a top 20 player all time, and to get into the conversation for the top 10 all time he has to do a very significant amount.  If he wants to get there it would be a lot easier for him, if he left the Warriors and won a title.  He will never get full credit playing for the Warriors (nor should he really). 

As for things like defense, Durant has never made an All Defense Team.  Lebron has 5 1st team and 1 2nd Team (he has also finished 2nd in DPOY voting).  His peak he was a much better defender than Durant has ever been (Lebron's 2nd Team, his last, he was the same age as Durant is now).  Lebron has now gone 12 straight seasons finishing in the top 5 in MVP voting.  He has been on 11 straight 1st Team All NBA Teams (and has another and a couple of 2nd's).  Durant just picked up his 6th 1st Team (he also a couple of 2nd's as well).  There is no real comparison between those two, which is why James is compared to guys like Jordan and Durant is not and won't ever be.

Durant still has a really good chance to fill out his resume though and get a boatload of rings. His defense is getting way more respect than it used to (and frankly he is just playing better). In 2016-2017 he got 7 total votes. This year he was 14th in total voting and got 7 first team votes. If he starts making all-defensive teams, which it seems is probably a goal of his, that certainly elevates his ceiling as a player. All these players follow different career arcs, and I think it is too early to dismiss Durant if he ends up the leagues all time leading scorer and has 6-7 rings.

Also with respect to the Warriors, do you think in fans eyes he would start getting more respect winning rings with the Warriors if they lost Draymond? At that point the team would seem to be pretty similar to Lebron's heat teams, and most people don't view those rings as 100% cheap.
Maybe if they lose Draymond and keep winning the back end ones will have more long term value (much like James gets far more respect for the 1 in Cleveland than the 2 in Miami), but I think he will always be hurt by joining the winningest team in NBA history that eliminated his team after he choked away a 3-1 lead.  I just don't see him really overcoming that and ending up in the conversation with the all time all time greats unless he leaves and wins more titles on a different sort of team. 

Unless Durant leaves (or Curry does), Curry will always have more titles than him.  Curry currently has 2 MVP's to Durant's 1.  I think Durant will have a hard time truly eclipsing Curry if they remain on the same team.  Durant is also going to have a hard time getting the totals in Golden State.  He has never been overly healthy and his numbers have taken a hit in GS (for obvious reasons).  Even if he starts averaging 75 games a year and maintains his 26 ppg that is only about 1950 points a year.  He'd have to do that for 9 more years to pass Kareem and who knows where James will actually end up.  I think he will find it very difficult to pass Malone and even Kobe still has him by 12,730 points (that is 6.5 seasons of 75 games and 26 ppg just to catch him).  He still has to do that for over 5 seasons to catch Wilt, Dirk, and Lebron (where he currently sits).  Top 10 all time scoring is certainly doable and barring injury fairly likely, but I wouldn't bet on him ending up in the top 5 (Jordan would likely be sitting in 5th by then at 32,292 total points - just about 6 seasons of 26 ppg and 75 games). 

Now if Durant were to leave and be a clear cut #1 scoring option, those things become more likely.  And if he wins a title (not on the Warriors) or another MVP (even on the Warriors is fine for that one), then he has a real shot at ending up as a top 10 player all time, though I don't see him ever really reaching the top 5 discussion.