Author Topic: A Bit Annoyed that the Cs Aren't Being Credited for Winning  (Read 4628 times)

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Re: A Bit Annoyed that the Cs Aren't Being Credited for Winning
« Reply #45 on: May 25, 2018, 03:32:01 PM »

Offline smokeablount

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I think most human beings, given the choice between "I was wrong" and "that was just a fluke," will prefer the latter explanation for what's happened.

Yup.
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Re: A Bit Annoyed that the Cs Aren't Being Credited for Winning
« Reply #46 on: May 25, 2018, 03:35:47 PM »

Offline mctyson

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I am really annoyed at the "they are missing their best 2 players thing"

Hayward did not play all season.  They won 55 games without him.  Him not playing is irrelevant.

Kyrie was a big part of many of those 55 wins, but not really on the defensive side.  The team is better defensively with him off the floor.  Obviously much worse offensively as well, but the best aspect of this team is their defense, and this is their best rotation.

Re: A Bit Annoyed that the Cs Aren't Being Credited for Winning
« Reply #47 on: May 25, 2018, 03:47:05 PM »

Offline Erik

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I am really annoyed at the "they are missing their best 2 players thing"

Hayward did not play all season.  They won 55 games without him.  Him not playing is irrelevant.

Kyrie was a big part of many of those 55 wins, but not really on the defensive side.  The team is better defensively with him off the floor.  Obviously much worse offensively as well, but the best aspect of this team is their defense, and this is their best rotation.

With the way that Al is playing, I'm not so sure that Hayward is our 2nd best player. I guess it depends on your definition of best. Mine is "most valuable." I don't think we get to where we are now if Hayward was healthy and Horford was injured. The guy is just too important in our system. He's such a gem -- so rare.

Re: A Bit Annoyed that the Cs Aren't Being Credited for Winning
« Reply #48 on: May 25, 2018, 03:54:00 PM »

Offline johnnygreen

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Screw the media.  They're idiots, it p---es me off too, but then I wonder why I listen to them at all.

The most annoying thing to me is how our last 2 wins against the Cavs, to go up 2-0 and 3-2, the ECF did not lead off ESPN's NBA: The Jump despite being the only game that was played. 

But of course, when the Cavs won games 3 and 4, the ECF led the show off.  It's a subtle dig, but it's unmistakable, it's not subjective or debatable, and it hasn't happened to any other final 4 teams even a single time that I've streamed the show. 

National media = losers.  Keep embarrassing yourselves with your flimsy mental midgetry in front of millions of viewers, us Celtics fans are 1 win away from being above it all.  LET'S GO!

I noticed that too on ESPN's NBA: The Jump during yesterday's show. An hour long program for the NBA, and they barely mentioned the one NBA game played the night before.

I forgot to mention a segment on the Celtics from The Jump show. They had a clip of career highlights on Al Horford flinching during dead ball plays, after the ball hits the rim or backboard. I never noticed this before, and it was hilarious.

Re: A Bit Annoyed that the Cs Aren't Being Credited for Winning
« Reply #49 on: May 25, 2018, 04:02:51 PM »

Offline kraidstar

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This has been arguably one of the greatest NBA "Cinderella" stories of all-time.

If it were college hoops we would be the biggest story by far.

It's kinda funny how the national media hates underdogs in this sport.

Re: A Bit Annoyed that the Cs Aren't Being Credited for Winning
« Reply #50 on: May 25, 2018, 04:11:48 PM »

Offline mctyson

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This has been arguably one of the greatest NBA "Cinderella" stories of all-time.

If it were college hoops we would be the biggest story by far.

It's kinda funny how the national media hates underdogs in this sport.

They won 55 games.  Best defense in the league.  Call it Cinderella if you want to but they were a [dang] good team prior to the playoffs, just needed a collective effort on offense to replace Kyrie's output.

Re: A Bit Annoyed that the Cs Aren't Being Credited for Winning
« Reply #51 on: May 25, 2018, 04:19:11 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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While I personally love the blatant disrespect, and as a bit of an aside, has anyone else noticed as to the discrepancy between the manner in which ESPN has presented the box scores of the games between the Celtics and the Cavs during the ECF? Like, you know how they typically leave the, well, box scores from the previous evening's contests up until around noon of the next day all throughout the season? Well, that pattern has continued for each game of the WCF, but, and I kid you not, whenever the Celtics have beaten Lebron in this series, ESPN's calendar has immediately shifted to the next date once the clock has struck midnight, but when the Cavs have won, the calendar adheres to the normal pattern and the box score is left up until noon of the following day, LOL ::) ;D

Re: A Bit Annoyed that the Cs Aren't Being Credited for Winning
« Reply #52 on: May 25, 2018, 04:24:52 PM »

Online celticinorlando

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Nobody in the media thinks the Celtics will even compete tonight let alone win

Re: A Bit Annoyed that the Cs Aren't Being Credited for Winning
« Reply #53 on: May 25, 2018, 04:30:06 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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You really think Boston gets "less" attention from the national media than it "deserves"?


Obviously Boston in general gets lots of attention. 

I do think that for most of this Celtics playoff run, their opponents have been a greater focus in the coverage of each series than what the Celts themselves are doing.


I think Boris has it right, though -- it's easier to say that this is a fluke or that the team you thought would win is to blame than to readjust your assessment of the team that's unexpectedly winning.


There are plenty of places where the Celts are getting coverage, but I was struck by the fact that most of the articles I saw on places like The Ringer following that Game 5 were about either  LeBron being tired, LeBron's team not being good enough, or how disappointing it would be for the Celts to make the Finals.


Now imagine what the coverage would look like right now if, as many were thinking would happen as of a few weeks ago, the Sixers were currently up 3-2 on the Cavs on the strength of great play from Ben Simmons and Joel Embiid.

Do you think there would be many pieces lamenting the fact that we would be robbed of another LeBron Finals appearance because a young team was ahead of schedule?  No, there'd be a million pieces fawning over how great Simmons and Embiid are and saying The Process was worth it all along.

That and your various podcast hosts a la Chris Ryan would be talking about how awesome the next decade of Joel Embiid memes are going to be.
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Re: A Bit Annoyed that the Cs Aren't Being Credited for Winning
« Reply #54 on: May 25, 2018, 04:31:18 PM »

Offline rocknrollforyoursoul

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Celts will get ridiculous credit if they do the impossible.  Beating Cleveland is not the impossible I am talking about.

I think the popular narrative isn't really too far off from reality.  The Eastern Conference competition is weak enough to have a young, injured team like the C's only one game from a trip to the Finals.  I think people are passing this off as less "amazing" than it is a function of poor competition.  And it's hard to argue with that.  If the C's make it past Cleveland and then do some damage in the Finals, they'll be recognized for the accomplishment.  But I think (and rightly so), most experts and fans believe the Finals is being played right now in the West, and the C's, if they make it, will get their clock cleaned by whichever of GSW/Houston emerges.

I don't disagree, but I work with several Lakers fans (I live in L.A. County), and they like to jokingly remind me about how weak the East is ... while conveniently ignoring the fact that the West was pretty weak when the Lakers were good in the '80s. Some people have actually talked about realignment to balance out the two conferences, but I think realigning every time there's conference imbalance is a bad idea. If some of the top free agents in the West were smart, they'd sign with East teams to make their road to the Finals easier.
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Re: A Bit Annoyed that the Cs Aren't Being Credited for Winning
« Reply #55 on: May 25, 2018, 04:33:32 PM »

Offline Surferdad

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In addition to all comments so far, the national media doesn’t care as much for the Eastern Conference as compared to the WC.  Warriors, Rockets, Thunder etc. make for more ‘exciting’ storylines.
« Last Edit: May 25, 2018, 04:57:21 PM by Surferdad »

Re: A Bit Annoyed that the Cs Aren't Being Credited for Winning
« Reply #56 on: May 25, 2018, 04:34:18 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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Celts will get ridiculous credit if they do the impossible.  Beating Cleveland is not the impossible I am talking about.

I think the popular narrative isn't really too far off from reality.  The Eastern Conference competition is weak enough to have a young, injured team like the C's only one game from a trip to the Finals.  I think people are passing this off as less "amazing" than it is a function of poor competition.  And it's hard to argue with that.  If the C's make it past Cleveland and then do some damage in the Finals, they'll be recognized for the accomplishment.  But I think (and rightly so), most experts and fans believe the Finals is being played right now in the West, and the C's, if they make it, will get their clock cleaned by whichever of GSW/Houston emerges.

I don't disagree, but I work with several Lakers fans (I live in L.A. County), and they like to jokingly remind me about how weak the East is ... while conveniently ignoring the fact that the West was pretty weak when the Lakers were good in the '80s. Some people have actually talked about realignment to balance out the two conferences, but I think realigning every time there's conference imbalance is a bad idea. If some of the top free agents in the West were smart, they'd sign with East teams to make their road to the Finals easier.



On paper the East wasn't really very weak this year, the problem is that the Raptors once again imploded and one of the other "contenders" in the conference, the Sixers, were not quite as good as their record suggested thanks to their lack of experience.  And of course there was the Kyrie injury.

On paper it looked like there were four elite teams in the East as we approached the playoffs, it just didn't work out that way as things actually played out.
« Last Edit: May 25, 2018, 04:40:32 PM by PhoSita »
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Re: A Bit Annoyed that the Cs Aren't Being Credited for Winning
« Reply #57 on: May 25, 2018, 04:44:41 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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I think most human beings, given the choice between "I was wrong" and "that was just a fluke," will prefer the latter explanation for what's happened.

I think there's also an element here of media folks just being legitimately disappointed in the wake of that Game 5.  Given the choice between seeing the "ahead of schedule but still no chance at the title" young Celts or watching LeBron overcome the obstacles to make the Finals *yet again*, most neutral people in the media (and in general) would rather "witness history" i.e. see LeBron do something amazing.

To the extent it appears that won't happen, I think there's a noticeable deflation of interest in talking about this series.
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Re: A Bit Annoyed that the Cs Aren't Being Credited for Winning
« Reply #58 on: May 25, 2018, 04:52:05 PM »

Offline rocknrollforyoursoul

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You really think Boston gets "less" attention from the national media than it "deserves"?


Obviously Boston in general gets lots of attention. 

I do think that for most of this Celtics playoff run, their opponents have been a greater focus in the coverage of each series than what the Celts themselves are doing.


I think Boris has it right, though -- it's easier to say that this is a fluke or that the team you thought would win is to blame than to readjust your assessment of the team that's unexpectedly winning.


There are plenty of places where the Celts are getting coverage, but I was struck by the fact that most of the articles I saw on places like The Ringer following that Game 5 were about either  LeBron being tired, LeBron's team not being good enough, or how disappointing it would be for the Celts to make the Finals.


Now imagine what the coverage would look like right now if, as many were thinking would happen as of a few weeks ago, the Sixers were currently up 3-2 on the Cavs on the strength of great play from Ben Simmons and Joel Embiid.

Do you think there would be many pieces lamenting the fact that we would be robbed of another LeBron Finals appearance because a young team was ahead of schedule?  No, there'd be a million pieces fawning over how great Simmons and Embiid are and saying The Process was worth it all along.

In this playoff run, Boston has faced a lot of players who are personal binkies of the NBA and ESPN—Giannis, Embiid, Simmons, LeBron—and it seems that there's been as much emphasis on those individuals losing as there's been on Boston winning. I get it—stars are what sell, and this Boston team has no established, bonafide stars (maybe one or two in the making, but not there yet in terms of marketing hype)—but I'm tired of so many people being lapdogs for LeBron and the other "favored sons."
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Re: A Bit Annoyed that the Cs Aren't Being Credited for Winning
« Reply #59 on: May 25, 2018, 04:54:52 PM »

Offline rocknrollforyoursoul

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Celts will get ridiculous credit if they do the impossible.  Beating Cleveland is not the impossible I am talking about.

I think the popular narrative isn't really too far off from reality.  The Eastern Conference competition is weak enough to have a young, injured team like the C's only one game from a trip to the Finals.  I think people are passing this off as less "amazing" than it is a function of poor competition.  And it's hard to argue with that.  If the C's make it past Cleveland and then do some damage in the Finals, they'll be recognized for the accomplishment.  But I think (and rightly so), most experts and fans believe the Finals is being played right now in the West, and the C's, if they make it, will get their clock cleaned by whichever of GSW/Houston emerges.

I don't disagree, but I work with several Lakers fans (I live in L.A. County), and they like to jokingly remind me about how weak the East is ... while conveniently ignoring the fact that the West was pretty weak when the Lakers were good in the '80s. Some people have actually talked about realignment to balance out the two conferences, but I think realigning every time there's conference imbalance is a bad idea. If some of the top free agents in the West were smart, they'd sign with East teams to make their road to the Finals easier.



On paper the East wasn't really very weak this year, the problem is that the Raptors once again imploded and one of the other "contenders" in the conference, the Sixers, were not quite as good as their record suggested thanks to their lack of experience.  And of course there was the Kyrie injury.

On paper it looked like there were four elite teams in the East as we approached the playoffs, it just didn't work out that way as things actually played out.

I think people should've known that the Raptors weren't gonna change, and that a heavily inexperienced Philly team wasn't gonna go far (Boston has a lot of inexperience, but they do have a high-quality, high-impact vet in Horford, something Philly doesn't have).
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"You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body."

— C.S. Lewis