Author Topic: Rozier + 27th for 6th. Fair deal?  (Read 2301 times)

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Re: Rozier + 27th for 6th. Fair deal?
« Reply #45 on: May 16, 2018, 06:58:23 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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I love Scary Terry, but if I were another team I'd be extremely wary that Terry might be another Jae Crowder / Evan Turner in the sense of having a lot of value for Boston but not so much value to some other team.
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Re: Rozier + 27th for 6th. Fair deal?
« Reply #46 on: May 16, 2018, 07:02:40 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Rather keep Rozier through next year to go all in for a title next year. Injuries happen, as we all know, and having Rozier around to be insurance to play a bigger role due to injury to another player, in a year you are going for it all, is huge. We can deal with either resigning him or sign and trading him after next year's playoffs.


The only question there is whether he’ll accept his role for another year. He’s already called himself a starter. Does he go back to the bench for 65+ games next year heading into restricted free agency?

Quote
“I know in the future that I want to be a starter,” Rozier said, according to NBC Sports. “I’m going to be a starter. I came in. I played after Isaiah Thomas, and I’m playing after Kyrie (Irving) now, and that’s the only reason I don’t start. That’s how I’m looking at it. But I know I’ll be a starter in this league.

That was in December. He’s crushed it since then. Can we keep him (and his agent) happy?
Rozier has never shown any sign of being problematic about playing time, role, shots, or stats. He has been nothing but a team guy from the outset. I am sure he will know his role for next year, perform it to his best capabilities and be the team guy about it he has always been. Then if he wants to start as a player and wants to do it elsewhere, we can work something out in a sign and trade for him.

If he starts to become a problem behind the scenes over his role, then you trade him at the deadline. If not, Terry is definitely the type of player you want to have available to help win a title.

Re: Rozier + 27th for 6th. Fair deal?
« Reply #47 on: May 16, 2018, 07:46:11 PM »

Offline cman88

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someone from Yahoo was on 98.5 and said he believes the celtics will hold onto Rozier for next year. If they are going for a championship next year, having Rozier makes them a better team and gives them more depth. I agree. maybe the value is less, but keep him for a run and then trade him in a sign and trade if need be.

Kyrie/Brown/Hayward/Tatum/Horford/Smart/Rozier/theis/Monroe/Baynes is a scary deep team that should run through the east.

Re: Rozier + 27th for 6th. Fair deal?
« Reply #48 on: May 16, 2018, 07:48:07 PM »

Offline CELTICSofBOSTON

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Rozier may be able to get us #9 from New York but we’d have to include our pick this year and probably another future pick.

I’m a huge Wendell Carter fan and think he will be there at #9.

Re: Rozier + 27th for 6th. Fair deal?
« Reply #49 on: May 16, 2018, 07:58:33 PM »

Offline footey

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I think #16 + #31 from Phoenix is more realistic, if they decided to take Ayton.

That's idiotic. So now that Rozier is a proven NBA baller, he's only worth the exact same slot at which he was selected plus a crappy 2nd rounder? While fans tend to over-project their draft picks, good GMs don't. They know the track record of draft positions. Lets do the same by looking at the last 15 guys selected at #16 (pre-Rozier):

Jusuf Nurkic
Lucas Nogueira
Royce White
Nikola Vucevic
Luke Babbitt
James Johnson
Marreese Speights
Nick Young
Rodney Carney
Joey Graham
Kirk Snyder
Troy Bell
Jiri Welch
Kirk Haston

That's a couple of good players, a couple of role players and a whole lot of busts. That's what is expected from that slot. GMs know this. They know a bird in hand is worth a lot more than two in the bush. At 17/5/5 - which is what Rozier has put up the last 1/2 of a season - and good defense Rozier could be considered the best out of that entire list. That's worth a HELLUVA lot more than the 16th pick. That's insulting.

In fact, let's look at the #6 picks in that same time frame:

Marcus Smart
Nerlens Noel
Damian Lillard
Jan Vesley
Ekpe Udoh
Jonny Flynn
Danilo Gallinari
Yi Jianlian
Brandon Roy
Martell Webster
Josh Childress
Chris Kaman
Dajuan Wagner
Shane Battier

Rozier is better than half of that list already and is a known quantity. So yeah, Rozier for the #6 pick isn't that far fetched when someone actually understands the danger of drafting and how many players outside of the top 5 bust.

And yet, when you look at history, you see guys like Eric Bledsoe, Jeff Teague and Reggie Jackson being traded for modest returns.  “Idiotic” or not, the market hasn’t shown much value for PGs lately.

None of those guys led their teams as point guard to NBA finals. If a Terry does, his value will go up. If we win championship, his value will skyrocket.

Re: Rozier + 27th for 6th. Fair deal?
« Reply #50 on: May 16, 2018, 08:00:09 PM »

Offline footey

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I just don’t see Terry being traded unless and until Kyrie proves to be 100%. That won’t be before start of next season.

Re: Rozier + 27th for 6th. Fair deal?
« Reply #51 on: May 16, 2018, 08:00:18 PM »

Offline kgwannabe

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I said over the weekend, Rozier for #12 to the Clippers (who also have #13). Take Zhaire Smith as someone to groom. The Clippers get better, increasing the likelihood of their pick going to us next year, while we take a high floor player (maybe Brunson) at #27.

Re: Rozier + 27th for 6th. Fair deal?
« Reply #52 on: May 16, 2018, 08:04:28 PM »

Offline mef730

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I think we need to be in the top 4-5 in this draft if we're gonna trade up, and it will take Rozier plus the Sac pick to get there. I'm not interested. Well, unless Danny's interested. He seems to be pretty good at this GMing thing.

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Re: Rozier + 27th for 6th. Fair deal?
« Reply #53 on: May 16, 2018, 09:03:13 PM »

Offline jambr380

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Rozier may be able to get us #9 from New York but we’d have to include our pick this year and probably another future pick.

I’m a huge Wendell Carter fan and think he will be there at #9.

The better we do in these playoffs, the more the writing is on the wall for Terry's future with the Cs. While I would absolutely love to keep him, I understand that there probably aren't enough minutes to keep him happy (unless of course we trade Kyrie). Getting the #8-10 pick and selecting Carter or even Porter would be a great way to turn Rozier into a positive asset.

I mentioned this a couple of weeks ago, but if we are dealing with Orlando, I wonder if a deal of Terry for Isaac would be of interest to both teams. We get a stretch big with a couple of extra years of control and ORL doesn't give up the potential with their unknown draft pick. Like it or not, most draft picks are like new cars - they cost way too much until they are driven off the lot. Picking up a guy like Isaac (#6 pick last year) is probably a lot more likely than the unknown #6 pick this year. If Orlando selects a big, that opens up the door even more.

Re: Rozier + 27th for 6th. Fair deal?
« Reply #54 on: May 16, 2018, 09:14:54 PM »

Offline eja117

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I don't think most GMs and coaches do that unless they are afraid that if they don't improve right now they'll be fired.

I don't Danny does this until he knows Kyrie is very healthy. He can trade him later.

Re: Rozier + 27th for 6th. Fair deal?
« Reply #55 on: May 17, 2018, 06:28:20 PM »

Offline Boris Badenov

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Rather keep Rozier through next year to go all in for a title next year. Injuries happen, as we all know, and having Rozier around to be insurance to play a bigger role due to injury to another player, in a year you are going for it all, is huge. We can deal with either resigning him or sign and trading him after next year's playoffs.


Exactly. I feel like a lot of the Smart/Rozier talk around here is all-nothing, either we sign them long-term or let them go. But we could do lots of other things. We could re-sign Smart and trade him next summer, and then re-sign Rozier, for example.
plus what’s the point of trading for a middle of the pack draft pick ? I get having assets but we are beyond that point of asset collection, we have a good amount of draft picks remaining that we don’t even know what to do with. Roll with rozier and see what happens

The point of trading Rozier for a "middle of the pack" draft pick is that in all likelihood 2 of 3 of Bamba, Jackson, Carter will be available with the 6th pick. All project highly as versatile bigs. I got news for you people - Al Horford is going to be 32 years old. Whose replacing him on the front line? Does Daniel Theis all of a sudden become an all nba player? Best to get someone in here using an asset in Rozier -which we probably have for a year more at best- so that we can have someone good over the height of 6 foot 9 on the roster, because despite recent trends size is still important in the pros.

This would make more sense if we didn't have all the picks we have. Horford's not in decline yet, and we have as many as 4 first rounders next year, including one that could be a top 5 pick.

Re: Rozier + 27th for 6th. Fair deal?
« Reply #56 on: May 17, 2018, 06:59:59 PM »

Offline keevsnick

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Rather keep Rozier through next year to go all in for a title next year. Injuries happen, as we all know, and having Rozier around to be insurance to play a bigger role due to injury to another player, in a year you are going for it all, is huge. We can deal with either resigning him or sign and trading him after next year's playoffs.


Exactly. I feel like a lot of the Smart/Rozier talk around here is all-nothing, either we sign them long-term or let them go. But we could do lots of other things. We could re-sign Smart and trade him next summer, and then re-sign Rozier, for example.
plus what’s the point of trading for a middle of the pack draft pick ? I get having assets but we are beyond that point of asset collection, we have a good amount of draft picks remaining that we don’t even know what to do with. Roll with rozier and see what happens

The point of trading Rozier for a "middle of the pack" draft pick is that in all likelihood 2 of 3 of Bamba, Jackson, Carter will be available with the 6th pick. All project highly as versatile bigs. I got news for you people - Al Horford is going to be 32 years old. Whose replacing him on the front line? Does Daniel Theis all of a sudden become an all nba player? Best to get someone in here using an asset in Rozier -which we probably have for a year more at best- so that we can have someone good over the height of 6 foot 9 on the roster, because despite recent trends size is still important in the pros.

This would make more sense if we didn't have all the picks we have. Horford's not in decline yet, and we have as many as 4 first rounders next year, including one that could be a top 5 pick.

Ya but that doesnt matter if their aren't any bigs worthy of a high pick. This draft is seen a such stronger big man wise than 2019.  Of course hard to tell for sure a year out.

Re: Rozier + 27th for 6th. Fair deal?
« Reply #57 on: May 17, 2018, 07:11:32 PM »

Offline CelticsElite

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Rather keep Rozier through next year to go all in for a title next year. Injuries happen, as we all know, and having Rozier around to be insurance to play a bigger role due to injury to another player, in a year you are going for it all, is huge. We can deal with either resigning him or sign and trading him after next year's playoffs.


Exactly. I feel like a lot of the Smart/Rozier talk around here is all-nothing, either we sign them long-term or let them go. But we could do lots of other things. We could re-sign Smart and trade him next summer, and then re-sign Rozier, for example.
plus what’s the point of trading for a middle of the pack draft pick ? I get having assets but we are beyond that point of asset collection, we have a good amount of draft picks remaining that we don’t even know what to do with. Roll with rozier and see what happens

The point of trading Rozier for a "middle of the pack" draft pick is that in all likelihood 2 of 3 of Bamba, Jackson, Carter will be available with the 6th pick. All project highly as versatile bigs. I got news for you people - Al Horford is going to be 32 years old. Whose replacing him on the front line? Does Daniel Theis all of a sudden become an all nba player? Best to get someone in here using an asset in Rozier -which we probably have for a year more at best- so that we can have someone good over the height of 6 foot 9 on the roster, because despite recent trends size is still important in the pros.

This would make more sense if we didn't have all the picks we have. Horford's not in decline yet, and we have as many as 4 first rounders next year, including one that could be a top 5 pick.

Ya but that doesnt matter if their aren't any bigs worthy of a high pick. This draft is seen a such stronger big man wise than 2019.  Of course hard to tell for sure a year out.
I don't get the obsession with big men. They are hardest to develop and bigger bust potential

I'd rather replace horford with a free agent when the time comes

Re: Rozier + 27th for 6th. Fair deal?
« Reply #58 on: May 17, 2018, 07:22:17 PM »

Offline tonydelk

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Why would a team not pay good value for Rozier.  Any team needing a PG will offer him a large contract.  If you don't think anyone will then why wouldn't the CS just resign him for a cheap contract.  I think he and the 27 pick is worth the 6 pick easy.   He's putting up allstar numbers in the playoffs against the best competition in the world.  He's improved every year is young and the team who trades for him gets his bird rights and can match any contract he signs.  Big value there.

Re: Rozier + 27th for 6th. Fair deal?
« Reply #59 on: May 18, 2018, 09:29:23 PM »

Offline vjcsmoke

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The #12 pick is usually a garbage player 8/10 times though.  So what's the point?

Number 12 Overall Picks:

2017 Luke Kennard, Duke – Detroit Pistons
2016 Taurean Prince, Baylor – Utah Jazz
2015 Trey Lyles, Kentucky – Utah Jazz
2014 Dario Saric, Croatia – Orlando Magic
2013 Steven Adams, Pittsburgh – Oklahoma City Thunder
2012 Jeremy Lamb, Connecticut – Houston Rockets
2011 Alec Burks, Colorado – Utah Jazz
2010 Xavier Henry, Kansas – Memphis Grizzlies


We know that Terry can play on this roster and perform in the playoffs.

Terry has 2 more years on his contract.  We don't need to make a move until next year.

Next year we can challenge for the title if we get everybody back.

Until then we can afford to wait and only trade him if a great offer is made.  Or we could package him in a bigger deal as a sweetner.