Author Topic: Danny has built a contender  (Read 1391 times)

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Re: Danny has built a contender
« Reply #30 on: May 16, 2018, 11:26:00 AM »

Online nickagneta

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AGAIN!!!

Danny Ainge has built a contender, AGAIN!!!

That makes it even more impressive.

Re: Danny has built a contender
« Reply #31 on: May 16, 2018, 11:37:02 AM »

Offline Sophomore

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I'm beginning to get concerned that Irving's ball dominance and iso heavy offensive style coupled with his bad defense will actually make Boston worse.

It's always a good idea to a have Plan C:
The play broke down, no easy shots, pass the ball to Kyrie and take the 46.2% that he makes it.

You're forgetting that Kyrie was part of the ball rotation except during those Plan C moments and the final 5 minutes.

The largest ball stopper is actually Marcus Morris.

The point about Morris is true x 1,000.

Re: Danny has built a contender
« Reply #32 on: May 16, 2018, 11:51:25 AM »

Offline seancally

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I agree with what Moranis is saying. I guess the question is how all this looks to Kyrie. He left Cleveland so he could be the alpha. Now he's watching what the young guns can do when they get a lot of room. How does he see himself fitting in when he comes back? Clearly, it can't be the way it was early this year. How does he see himself sharing the ball with three other scorers(!) who are either established all-stars (Hayward) or players trending that way fast (Brown and Tatum). Al is a swiss army knife - his awesomeness is, in part, his willingness to do whatever needs doing. Does Kyrie have that in him? Does he want to? I don't know.
Nobody knows, but you have to figure the pressure is taken off him by having 4 other legit scorers on the floor, most of the time.  That should giver him better looks and he doesn't always have to create his own shot.  What superstar wouldn't want that?

Russell Westbrook. Maybe LeBron. Hard to say.

I really don't know either. It's going to be next year's most interesting question. If everybody buys in and we hold on to Smart, this team could absolutely steamroll next year. A starting five that should be at least equal to Golden State, and a bench that is much, much better.

Not sure why anyone would be worried about adding two All-Stars to an already-good team - especially the type of players:

- An alpha dog scorer and ball-handler who will continue to improve and who has championship pedigree, the clutch gene, and who does not share the me-first mentality of superstar players, based on everything we've seen and heard from him.
- A do-it-all wing with great size, feel, and touch who can slide into any role and switch across positions on D.

Remember how CP3 and Harden wouldn't be able to share the ball? Or how there wouldn't be enough shots for Steph, KD and Klay? Yeah, not worried.
"The game honors toughness." - President Stevens

Re: Danny has built a contender
« Reply #33 on: May 16, 2018, 12:23:34 PM »

Offline cman88

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Nah, the east is just incredibly weak. They're about as good as they were last season, which means they'll get destroyed by any of the good teams out west.

We got steamrolled last year and then danny blew up the team. We are a much better team than last year. Even brad said last years team probably collapses after a run like lebrons.

Also, do people forget how good the celtics were with Irving this year? Rozier is as much a ball stopper as kyrie...except kyrie shot nearly 50%.

Not too worried about shots. You need a team like this to win in the age of the Warriors. If anything having so many options will just make it easier for everyone else.

Imagine a lineup with irving/brown/hayward/tatum/horford on the floor at the same time. All guys can take you off the dribble and shoot the 3. How do you defend that? You cant double and trap irving like they did this year.

Im not worried

Re: Danny has built a contender
« Reply #34 on: May 16, 2018, 12:24:07 PM »

Offline Moranis

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I agree with what Moranis is saying. I guess the question is how all this looks to Kyrie. He left Cleveland so he could be the alpha. Now he's watching what the young guns can do when they get a lot of room. How does he see himself fitting in when he comes back? Clearly, it can't be the way it was early this year. How does he see himself sharing the ball with three other scorers(!) who are either established all-stars (Hayward) or players trending that way fast (Brown and Tatum). Al is a swiss army knife - his awesomeness is, in part, his willingness to do whatever needs doing. Does Kyrie have that in him? Does he want to? I don't know.
Nobody knows, but you have to figure the pressure is taken off him by having 4 other legit scorers on the floor, most of the time.  That should giver him better looks and he doesn't always have to create his own shot.  What superstar wouldn't want that?

Russell Westbrook. Maybe LeBron. Hard to say.

I really don't know either. It's going to be next year's most interesting question. If everybody buys in and we hold on to Smart, this team could absolutely steamroll next year. A starting five that should be at least equal to Golden State, and a bench that is much, much better.

Not sure why anyone would be worried about adding two All-Stars to an already-good team - especially the type of players:

- An alpha dog scorer and ball-handler who will continue to improve and who has championship pedigree, the clutch gene, and who does not share the me-first mentality of superstar players, based on everything we've seen and heard from him.
- A do-it-all wing with great size, feel, and touch who can slide into any role and switch across positions on D.

Remember how CP3 and Harden wouldn't be able to share the ball? Or how there wouldn't be enough shots for Steph, KD and Klay? Yeah, not worried.
Harden and CP3 play an awful lot of my turn your turn on offense.  The Rockets offense in general is very iso heavy.  That isn't a great example of conforming to a pass happy offense. Klay, Steph, and KD have never been big iso players.  They've always been passers/shooters, so of course you could fit them in well together. 

Re: Danny has built a contender
« Reply #35 on: May 16, 2018, 05:11:53 PM »

Offline ozgod

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I agree with what Moranis is saying. I guess the question is how all this looks to Kyrie. He left Cleveland so he could be the alpha. Now he's watching what the young guns can do when they get a lot of room. How does he see himself fitting in when he comes back? Clearly, it can't be the way it was early this year. How does he see himself sharing the ball with three other scorers(!) who are either established all-stars (Hayward) or players trending that way fast (Brown and Tatum). Al is a swiss army knife - his awesomeness is, in part, his willingness to do whatever needs doing. Does Kyrie have that in him? Does he want to? I don't know.
Nobody knows, but you have to figure the pressure is taken off him by having 4 other legit scorers on the floor, most of the time.  That should giver him better looks and he doesn't always have to create his own shot.  What superstar wouldn't want that?

Russell Westbrook. Maybe LeBron. Hard to say.

I really don't know either. It's going to be next year's most interesting question. If everybody buys in and we hold on to Smart, this team could absolutely steamroll next year. A starting five that should be at least equal to Golden State, and a bench that is much, much better.

Not sure why anyone would be worried about adding two All-Stars to an already-good team - especially the type of players:

- An alpha dog scorer and ball-handler who will continue to improve and who has championship pedigree, the clutch gene, and who does not share the me-first mentality of superstar players, based on everything we've seen and heard from him.
- A do-it-all wing with great size, feel, and touch who can slide into any role and switch across positions on D.

Remember how CP3 and Harden wouldn't be able to share the ball? Or how there wouldn't be enough shots for Steph, KD and Klay? Yeah, not worried.

We're only going to be stronger next year with Kyrie and Gordon back. People forget that Kyrie was a big part of us winning 55 games this season and winning 16 in a row. It's Brad's job to make sure he assimilates them all into a team and everyone contributes no matter who is starting or how many minutes they are playing.

What I'm more concerned about is how we will be able to afford everyone, not necessarily next year but in 2019 onwards.  Smart is open to qualifying offers this summer and they will definitely be more than the 6m he is currently on. Kyrie has a player option for 2019 that he will probably opt out of to get a max. Morris' cap friendly $6m deal expires after next year. Al has a player option in 2020. Thankfully we have Brown and Tatum on rookie deals for at least 3 more years.

Who on this roster is expendable when the time comes to pay the likes of Smart and Kyrie? I'm hardly an expert on the salary cap so hopefully someone who knows more can provide insight.
The greatest glory in living lies not in never falling, but in rising every time we fall. - Nelson Mandela

Re: Danny has built a contender
« Reply #36 on: May 16, 2018, 05:21:45 PM »

Offline Spicoli

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I'm beginning to get concerned that Irving's ball dominance and iso heavy offensive style coupled with his bad defense will actually make Boston worse.

I think Kyrie is CLEARLY a better player than Rozier and it's not even close. However, this kind of concerns me as well. The one thing Rozier does well is give up the ball and not hold on to it for too long. Kyrie is the opposite. He probes until he finds an opening which causes a lot of the guys to stand around. I hope Kyrie is watching this and is coming to terms with how he's going to need to play while in Boston. If he buys in, we'll have a suped up version of scary terry on our hands.

Re: Danny has built a contender
« Reply #37 on: May 16, 2018, 05:24:42 PM »

Offline mctyson

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Some of the best moves he made was trading IT4, Crowder(best contract in basketball) and AB

There was a ton of resistance from fans of trading these guys.

He was forced to trade AB due to the salary cap coming in lower, otherwise AB is probably on the roster at least until the All Star break.

Selling IT4 was, in hindsight, a brilliant move.  He will never have a season like he did last year.

Re: Danny has built a contender
« Reply #38 on: May 16, 2018, 05:25:00 PM »

Offline bknova

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I'm beginning to get concerned that Irving's ball dominance and iso heavy offensive style coupled with his bad defense will actually make Boston worse.

I think Kyrie is CLEARLY a better player than Rozier and it's not even close. However, this kind of concerns me as well. The one thing Rozier does well is give up the ball and not hold on to it for too long. Kyrie is the opposite. He probes until he finds an opening which causes a lot of the guys to stand around. I hope Kyrie is watching this and is coming to terms with how he's going to need to play while in Boston. If he buys in, we'll have a suped up version of scary terry on our hands.

You don't think Kyrie is watching right now? You don't think he and Hayward are salivating at knowing how many options they have right now?  You don't think they're smart enough to pick their spots?

These guys are staring down multiple titles and a very long run as a top 3 to 4 contender every year.  It's not broke, so I'm confused as to what the hell everyone is trying to fix.  This is so weird!

Re: Danny has built a contender
« Reply #39 on: May 16, 2018, 05:26:15 PM »

Online rondofan1255

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I'm beginning to get concerned that Irving's ball dominance and iso heavy offensive style coupled with his bad defense will actually make Boston worse.

I think Kyrie is CLEARLY a better player than Rozier and it's not even close. However, this kind of concerns me as well. The one thing Rozier does well is give up the ball and not hold on to it for too long. Kyrie is the opposite. He probes until he finds an opening which causes a lot of the guys to stand around. I hope Kyrie is watching this and is coming to terms with how he's going to need to play while in Boston. If he buys in, we'll have a suped up version of scary terry on our hands.

Kyrie doesn’t hold on to it much longer than Rozier (barely more or less per possession) according to stats I saw posted on another site. Rozier tends to overdribble a lot, otherwise I agree that Kyrie doesn’t give up the ball enough

Re: Danny has built a contender
« Reply #40 on: May 16, 2018, 05:26:25 PM »

Offline mctyson

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I'm beginning to get concerned that Irving's ball dominance and iso heavy offensive style coupled with his bad defense will actually make Boston worse.

He creates way more offense for others than Rozier does, but I agree on the defense point.

Re: Danny has built a contender
« Reply #41 on: May 16, 2018, 05:31:09 PM »

Offline Bobshot

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I'm beginning to get concerned that Irving's ball dominance and iso heavy offensive style coupled with his bad defense will actually make Boston worse.

Something for Ainge/Stevens to consider after the season. Kyrie started the season dishing more than scoring, and by mid season he was scoring more than dishing, and the Celtics slowed down in the winning column.

The strength of the Celtics has always been ball distribution and even scoring--usually 5-6 guys in double figures. And that's been their identity in the playoffs so far, and undoubtedly a key to their success. It's one for all and all for one.

The play of Rozier has been unexpected. Given the opportunity with Irving's injury, he has broken out and must be considered serious competition for Kyrie. Though it's nice to have two top PGs in the backcourt.

Ainge will have his hands full sorting all this out after the season, with Hayward and Irving returning. He and Stevens never really found out how Hayward fits this season--just didn't play enough.

Perhaps they have hit on a special chemistry with Kyrie's injury. Maybe the answer will come with the rest of this series and the Championship finals, if they get there. It's possible Rozier gives them one more defensive piece. It's also possible Irving is learning something watching these games from the bench.

The NBA playoffs are about defense. The two best defensive teams are the Celtics and the Warriors. It looks like we'll see them both in the finals.

Re: Danny has built a contender
« Reply #42 on: May 16, 2018, 05:50:10 PM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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I'm beginning to get concerned that Irving's ball dominance and iso heavy offensive style coupled with his bad defense will actually make Boston worse.

I think Kyrie is CLEARLY a better player than Rozier and it's not even close. However, this kind of concerns me as well. The one thing Rozier does well is give up the ball and not hold on to it for too long. Kyrie is the opposite. He probes until he finds an opening which causes a lot of the guys to stand around. I hope Kyrie is watching this and is coming to terms with how he's going to need to play while in Boston. If he buys in, we'll have a suped up version of scary terry on our hands.

You don't think Kyrie is watching right now? You don't think he and Hayward are salivating at knowing how many options they have right now?  You don't think they're smart enough to pick their spots?

These guys are staring down multiple titles and a very long run as a top 3 to 4 contender every year.  It's not broke, so I'm confused as to what the hell everyone is trying to fix.  This is so weird!


I think you are exactly correct.    Why in the world would we assume otherwise?   If time and performance proves the contrary, so be it --- but till then, why not assume that Kyrie and Gordon are watching this thinking "I can't wait to be a part of it". 

They see GSW and they see how a team with multiple excellent parts can all be involved and all share in the glory.  How much better a life will it be to be one of 7 high-level players operating as a finely-tuned winning machine than to be a singular or dual force on a mediocre team.   They could be ego-maniacal fools -- but I doubt it -- I think they are smart, well-compensated, team players who are champing at the bit to be championship contenders on a well-balanced, well-coached, intensely driven team of ballers.

Re: Danny has built a contender
« Reply #43 on: May 16, 2018, 05:58:43 PM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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I am always hopeful, but at the same time I am always cautious about being overly optimistic.  Yet I can't help thinking that less than 60 wins next year would be a major disappointment if not a major shock.   How has Danny done this so quickly and without landing that transcendent draft pick (Lebron; Jordan; Bird; Magic) or the whoever the Lakers will get Free Agent.   Danny did it with good trades, smart picks, landing solid 2nd tier free agents, good salary management, and a little luck (hit #1 last year with the Nets pick).    Brilliant.   

So excited to be staring at a solid run of contention.... again.

Re: Danny has built a contender
« Reply #44 on: May 16, 2018, 07:06:54 PM »

Offline bknova

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I'm beginning to get concerned that Irving's ball dominance and iso heavy offensive style coupled with his bad defense will actually make Boston worse.

I think Kyrie is CLEARLY a better player than Rozier and it's not even close. However, this kind of concerns me as well. The one thing Rozier does well is give up the ball and not hold on to it for too long. Kyrie is the opposite. He probes until he finds an opening which causes a lot of the guys to stand around. I hope Kyrie is watching this and is coming to terms with how he's going to need to play while in Boston. If he buys in, we'll have a suped up version of scary terry on our hands.

You don't think Kyrie is watching right now? You don't think he and Hayward are salivating at knowing how many options they have right now?  You don't think they're smart enough to pick their spots?

These guys are staring down multiple titles and a very long run as a top 3 to 4 contender every year.  It's not broke, so I'm confused as to what the hell everyone is trying to fix.  This is so weird!


I think you are exactly correct.    Why in the world would we assume otherwise?   If time and performance proves the contrary, so be it --- but till then, why not assume that Kyrie and Gordon are watching this thinking "I can't wait to be a part of it". 

They see GSW and they see how a team with multiple excellent parts can all be involved and all share in the glory.  How much better a life will it be to be one of 7 high-level players operating as a finely-tuned winning machine than to be a singular or dual force on a mediocre team.   They could be ego-maniacal fools -- but I doubt it -- I think they are smart, well-compensated, team players who are champing at the bit to be championship contenders on a well-balanced, well-coached, intensely driven team of ballers.

Kyrie could play 30 mpg on this team next year and average 20 with 9 assist and the team could win 60 games.  He'll turn it on when he needs to turn it on.  He'll get his when the team needs him too.  Same with Hayward.  This whole narrative that "streaky "Terry is better for this team than Kyrie is, is ludicrous to me. 

Kyrie is the second best point guard in the game right now, about to enter his prime, with the best handles in the world, and he's on our team.  Thats a good thing!