Author Topic: Any chance a Rozier trade package can get us Mohamed Bamba?  (Read 3281 times)

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Re: Any chance a Rozier trade package can get us Mohamed Bamba?
« Reply #30 on: May 11, 2018, 02:30:18 PM »

Offline CFAN38

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This thread is full of a fallacies

Ainge is not going to trade Rozier for a guy who will need to hit the weight room for a couple of years and who can't spread the floor.   So kiss Bamba and Noel goodbye, they are not our type of guys and do not fit our system.   There is also the lack of toughness from both of them.   We have a tough team now and are looking for certain types of players.   I think this off season this team has found it's identity.
pretty much agree with this.

Noel doesn't bring enough on offense.  Bambi's a bean pole who will likely need 2 years to start filling out and his offense isn't much to speak of.

I truly think the best option for next year is to run it back with Rozier, Smart and Baynes.  Keep Rozier.  Use the MLE on Baynes if he'll take it.  Resign Smart to a reasonable deal.  I don't see him commanding $15 mill per year.  very likely MLE to $10 mill per year.

Kyrie, Hayward, Al, Brown, Tatum is a really strong starting 5.  Add Morris, Rozier, Smart and Baynes as the primary guys off the bench and that's a contender.  A year of development with Semi and Yabu will help.  Bird might be good enough to bring in as an end of bench guy as well. 

Nader, Monroe and possibly Allen are moving on.  C's should be able to get a vet min player or 2 to add for more depth.   C's don't really need to throw players and picks at a prospect who's a known project

Decide what to do with Rozier the following offseason.  Let's take a run at the championship with him having another year to develop consistency and provide a potent 1-2 punch with Smart off the bench for the backcourt.

The issue with this plan is the Luxury tax. It has been widley reported that the Cs need to stay under the luxury line next season in order to avoid major repeater tax issues in the coming years. This will likely dictate how the Cs handle Smart, Baynes and to a lesser extent Rozier.

If the Cs do not move Rozier this off-season or at the deadline they will likely loose him for nothing like they did KO.


I would also have to disagree if Ainge was given the option of trading Bamba for Rozier he 100% takes that deal. Bamba isn't the perfect big man prospect. He needs to gain weight/strength, refine his offense, and prove that he is a capable passer. However he has elite length, solid mobility, and was a very productive college player.

Re: Any chance a Rozier trade package can get us Mohamed Bamba?
« Reply #31 on: May 11, 2018, 02:33:25 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Tatum was also considered a player that was skinny and that didn't deter Ainge from taking him. In addition, I'm not sure why you think Bamba can't spread the floor. He shot 27.5% from 3, which isn't bad for a still developing big, and his 68.1% from the FT line also shows that his shooting touch is there.

Just like Sullinger?  Not thanks, 27% is a guy who should be shooting them only in practice and 68% is not great from the line either.   We are making a title run next year and forgive me if I would rather have the best backup PG in the league than a raw developing big man who need locked in the weight room.

Also, Tatum is great offensive talent not a kid who has limited moves.  Nice try but not very convincing.   If Ainge picks I fully support him but we want to win now, I bet next year.


Re: Any chance a Rozier trade package can get us Mohamed Bamba?
« Reply #32 on: May 11, 2018, 02:33:27 PM »

Offline CFAN38

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This thread is full of a fallacies

Ainge is not going to trade Rozier for a guy who will need to hit the weight room for a couple of years and who can't spread the floor.   So kiss Bamba and Noel goodbye, they are not our type of guys and do not fit our system.   There is also the lack of toughness from both of them.   We have a tough team now and are looking for certain types of players.   I think this off season this team has found it's identity.

On Bamba...

Tatum was also considered a player that was skinny and that didn't deter Ainge from taking him. In addition, I'm not sure why you think Bamba can't spread the floor. He shot 27.5% from 3, which isn't bad for a still developing big, and his 68.1% from the FT line also shows that his shooting touch is there.

To be honest, I'm not sure if getting Bamba is attainable, but dismissing it because you think Ainge won't move Rozier for him is really shortsighted and not thinking about Rozier's contract next summer.

Here is a recent video of Bamba shooting 3's. Nice compact stroke and great follow through.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6EOrdk_H2-s

Here are Ainge's and Zarren watching Bamba...


Agree  Bamba will likely never be a knock down shoot but if he can shoot enough to keep teams honest while hitting his FTs he can be very good.

Re: Any chance a Rozier trade package can get us Mohamed Bamba?
« Reply #33 on: May 11, 2018, 02:40:31 PM »

Offline mef730

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Re: Any chance a Rozier trade package can get us Mohamed Bamba?
« Reply #34 on: May 11, 2018, 02:41:17 PM »

Offline mef730

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I don't understand the pretense of this entire thread.

Are people nervous that Bamba is not going to be available when we are picking at #2 in June?

Mike
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Re: Any chance a Rozier trade package can get us Mohamed Bamba?
« Reply #35 on: May 11, 2018, 02:43:09 PM »

Offline Eddie20

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Tatum was also considered a player that was skinny and that didn't deter Ainge from taking him. In addition, I'm not sure why you think Bamba can't spread the floor. He shot 27.5% from 3, which isn't bad for a still developing big, and his 68.1% from the FT line also shows that his shooting touch is there.

Just like Sullinger?  Not thanks, 27% is a guy who should be shooting them only in practice and 68% is not great from the line either.   We are making a title run next year and forgive me if I would rather have the best backup PG in the league than a raw developing big man who need locked in the weight room.

Also, Tatum is great offensive talent not a kid who has limited moves.  Nice try but not very convincing.   If Ainge picks I fully support him but we want to win now, I bet next year.

Are you seriously trying to compare Sullinger with Bamba? Bamba is a physically gifted player that has the potential to be an absolute game changer defensively. If he can stretch the floor, in addition to rim run (which he can already do), then you're talking about a Gobert type talent that can stretch the floor.

If Stevens can do what he did for Theis, Amir, and Baynes, which is basically reinvent those guys, then imagine what he can do with a blank slate like Bamba who is already hitting 3's and has solid form. 
« Last Edit: May 11, 2018, 02:50:06 PM by Eddie20 »

Re: Any chance a Rozier trade package can get us Mohamed Bamba?
« Reply #36 on: May 11, 2018, 03:01:40 PM »

Offline CelticsQuestFor18

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Most mock projections don't have Bamba in the Top-5 of their mocks, but most have him going somewhere in the 6-9 range (with a few having him go at 5). I think that's fair to be honest, considering the risks involved with him as well. W/o those risks, Bamba could be in the same tier as Ayton who is projected to be a Top-2 pick this June.

I'm enjoying our current playoff run with Scary Terry, but looking ahead I think there's three options going forward:

(1) Keep Rozier for next season to make a legit run at Banner 18, and likely lose him next summer in FA (Some team offers him near-max or something which we don't match)

(2) Lose Smart in RFA, so Ainge keeps Rozier and works an extension with him (even if it's for a lot more $$$ than expected)

(3) Sell high on Rozier THIS summer

Seeing what Ainge has done previously, I honestly think either (2) or (3) is done. Ainge won't just lose Rozier for absolutely nothing if the writing is in the wall (and it seems it is, as Rozier will command a big pay day and will probably want to start understandably). I also predict Smart's market is a bit over-exaggerated and he won't command as much as people think, so Ainge re-signs him in the 9-12M a year range (still a great pay day, but not 15M+ a year).

So is there a chance Rozier + asset(s) (NOT Kings Pick) can get us into the 6-9 range to select Bamba, or is Bamba simply out of our range? I'm pretty high on Bamba, even if he is currently "raw" and isn't as polished as the others yet. Or are you all just not Bamba fans lol?

Anyways, GO C'S! Keep proving the doubters wrong!

There is no way Scary Terry (who if a Free Agent) in a year, will be able to bring you back a top 10 pick

Unless he is the MVP of the ECF

Well, I assumed Rozier would be in a package with another asset or two involved, but yeah it's probably unlikely. That said, I would be upset if we traded Rozier (a former 16th pick) and only got back like another mid-1st rounder (in 15-20 range).

In that case, yeah it's probably just best to bring back Rozier for another year and see what he commands in RFA next summer. In my utopian world, we keep Smart and Rozier long term (Smart on a cheap, reasonable deal) and form a "Big 4" of a back court (Kyrie and Brown starting, with Smart and Rozier off the bench)... but with luxury tax implications it unfortunately won't happen.

Re: Any chance a Rozier trade package can get us Mohamed Bamba?
« Reply #37 on: May 11, 2018, 03:49:28 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Are you seriously trying to compare Sullinger with Bamba? Bamba is a physically gifted player that has the potential to be an absolute game changer defensively. If he can stretch the floor, in addition to rim run (which he can already do), then you're talking about a Gobert type talent that can stretch the floor.

Let me explain to you, Sullinger was a %.365 Shooter from three in college.  He never mastered the pro shot.  Ainge likes guys who can stay in front of his man and to him and CBS that is more important than shot blocking.   This is not the NBA of the past.

As far as being a game changer defensively, he could be or he could be this :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0cbBg1eptQg

Bagley ate him alive and he was not so game changing.

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/boxscore?gameId=400999722


Quote
If Stevens can do what he did for Theis, Amir, and Baynes, which is basically reinvent those guys, then imagine what he can do with a blank slate like Bamba who is already hitting 3's and has solid form.

27% is not hitting to many threes, when you get right down to it.  That is pretty poor, quit pretending it is good it is not.  CBS can make guys better but he choose to let Moose sit.  the first time a muscle guy pushes Bamba out of the way, he is coming out of the bench.  He needs a lot of work on his strength base in his legs.

Here is a scouting report
Quote
Weaknesses: As obvious is as length is, it's also not hard to notice he'll need to continue to add strength to play the paint in the next level ... At the 2017 Hoop Summit, he only weighed in at 216 pounds ... Ideally, you'd like to see Bamba at least around 240 in a year or two, or possibly 250 ... I think those weights are achievable for him judging by his length, and how he's added muscle since high school ... His awareness with his back to the basket and in the paint on offense is a work in progress too ... He'll need to continue to work on his awareness of spacing and cutting players, as well as adjusting to double teams and pressure from guards ... When he's feeling it offensively, he could take over a game at the college level, but he could also be too passive when he'd get bothered ... Restraint is good from a team game perspective, but with his physical tools he should have been more aggressive at times while playing for the Longhorns ... A solid athlete, but much of his wow factor is due to length and not explosiveness or leaping ability

http://www.nbadraft.net/players/mohamed-bamba

If he was so good why didn't he average more than 12.9 PPG?

I can recall you hyping Bender in thread.   I can post them if you wish.

« Last Edit: May 11, 2018, 04:01:31 PM by Celtics4ever »

Re: Any chance a Rozier trade package can get us Mohamed Bamba?
« Reply #38 on: May 11, 2018, 04:25:24 PM »

Offline footey

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Orlando seems like the perfect team to make a deal with, but not sure they want to deal a chance a franchise player for Rozier.

What about a trade of Rozier and Nader for Isaac? Too much, too little? This would allow the Magic to build around Gordon and whatever big they get in this draft along with Rozier and Fournier. We would get two additional years of rookie scale contract in a versatile big in Isaac.

I would be into a Rozier for Bamba trade, but wouldnít throw in the Sac or Mem picks. I honestly donít want to give up Rozier at all, but our salary is about to explode and there really isnít much choice unless we trade Irving.

I forgot about Isaac.  That is intriguing proposal.  Really good athlete/3 point shooter, defender.
 Would be good sub for Al, and eventual replacement if he develops. 

ORL may have to give up more, though, if they want Terry.  Terry's production is incredible. 

TP

Re: Any chance a Rozier trade package can get us Mohamed Bamba?
« Reply #39 on: May 11, 2018, 04:30:36 PM »

Offline Eddie20

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Are you seriously trying to compare Sullinger with Bamba? Bamba is a physically gifted player that has the potential to be an absolute game changer defensively. If he can stretch the floor, in addition to rim run (which he can already do), then you're talking about a Gobert type talent that can stretch the floor.

Let me explain to you, Sullinger was a %.365 Shooter from three in college.  He never mastered the pro shot.  Ainge likes guys who can stay in front of his man and to him and CBS that is more important than shot blocking.   This is not the NBA of the past.

As far as being a game changer defensively, he could be or he could be this :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0cbBg1eptQg

Bagley ate him alive and he was not so game changing.

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/boxscore?gameId=400999722


Quote
If Stevens can do what he did for Theis, Amir, and Baynes, which is basically reinvent those guys, then imagine what he can do with a blank slate like Bamba who is already hitting 3's and has solid form.

27% is not hitting to many threes, when you get right down to it.  That is pretty poor, quit pretending it is good it is not.  CBS can make guys better but he choose to let Moose sit.  the first time a muscle guy pushes Bamba out of the way, he is coming out of the bench.  He needs a lot of work on his strength base in his legs.

Here is a scouting report
Quote
Weaknesses: As obvious is as length is, it's also not hard to notice he'll need to continue to add strength to play the paint in the next level ... At the 2017 Hoop Summit, he only weighed in at 216 pounds ... Ideally, you'd like to see Bamba at least around 240 in a year or two, or possibly 250 ... I think those weights are achievable for him judging by his length, and how he's added muscle since high school ... His awareness with his back to the basket and in the paint on offense is a work in progress too ... He'll need to continue to work on his awareness of spacing and cutting players, as well as adjusting to double teams and pressure from guards ... When he's feeling it offensively, he could take over a game at the college level, but he could also be too passive when he'd get bothered ... Restraint is good from a team game perspective, but with his physical tools he should have been more aggressive at times while playing for the Longhorns ... A solid athlete, but much of his wow factor is due to length and not explosiveness or leaping ability

http://www.nbadraft.net/players/mohamed-bamba

If he was so good why didn't he average more than 12.9 PPG?

I can recall you hyping Bender in thread.   I can post them if you wish.

I think you're really missing the point. You seem to be viewing this as Bamba vs Rozier without taking into consideration contractual obligations. That said, it's pretty bizarre that you don't think Ainge would trade Rozier for a likely top 7 pick, which will be cost controlled for several seasons.

Bamba could be a total bust, there is no denying that, but he also has an extremely high ceiling. In addition, you keep moving goalposts with your argument. You initially grouped Bamba with Noel as players that couldn't spread the floor. While 27% is not exactly stellar, it shows at least respectability where a defender will have to at least be cognizant of him shooting a 3. Which, yes, subsequently creates spacing. I think Okynyk shot 30% from 3 as a RS college junior, so 27% for a true freshman isn't really all that bad.

As for Bender, yeah, I think he still has potential, which was always the crux of my argument. It's not about short term with him, just like Bamba, it's about longterm. Not unlike a player like Rozier who while still in the midst of his 3rd season was getting pummeled for his play on this very board.

Re: Any chance a Rozier trade package can get us Mohamed Bamba?
« Reply #40 on: May 11, 2018, 04:34:03 PM »

Offline sdceltsfan

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I think a lot of people are undervaluing Bambas skill-set, as raw as it may seem. I would say simply that this guy still has physical growth left that will naturally polish and unlock his abilities.

With a mentor like Horford and Stevens as a coach, I could see him being our version of Clint Cappella. The baskets won't come nearly as easy at first, but he knows his role as player.

If a team is offering a #6-9 pick for T-Roz with Bamba still on the board, I think Ainge will absolutely consider it, from the cost-controlled contract/upside alone. Bamba can easily put on another 15-20 lbs and he will be an absolute monster.

Re: Any chance a Rozier trade package can get us Mohamed Bamba?
« Reply #41 on: May 11, 2018, 04:39:25 PM »

Offline footey

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This thread is full of a fallacies

Ainge is not going to trade Rozier for a guy who will need to hit the weight room for a couple of years and who can't spread the floor.   So kiss Bamba and Noel goodbye, they are not our type of guys and do not fit our system.   There is also the lack of toughness from both of them.   We have a tough team now and are looking for certain types of players.   I think this off season this team has found it's identity.

On Bamba...

Tatum was also considered a player that was skinny and that didn't deter Ainge from taking him. In addition, I'm not sure why you think Bamba can't spread the floor. He shot 27.5% from 3, which isn't bad for a still developing big, and his 68.1% from the FT line also shows that his shooting touch is there.

To be honest, I'm not sure if getting Bamba is attainable, but dismissing it because you think Ainge won't move Rozier for him is really shortsighted and not thinking about Rozier's contract next summer.

Here is a recent video of Bamba shooting 3's. Nice compact stroke and great follow through.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6EOrdk_H2-s

Here are Ainge's and Zarren watching Bamba...


Agree  Bamba will likely never be a knock down shoot but if he can shoot enough to keep teams honest while hitting his FTs he can be very good.

That wing span is dope.

Re: Any chance a Rozier trade package can get us Mohamed Bamba?
« Reply #42 on: May 11, 2018, 04:49:46 PM »

Offline footey

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1. I think Mitchell Robinson is better athlete than Bamba. His stock is artificially low because he skipped out on Western Kentucky. To me that creates an opportunity, where we don't have to give up as much in assets to draft him (projected to go 15 or later).
2. Rather than draft, need to consider existing players with size whom the Celtics could trade Rozier for. Someone brought up Jonathan Isaac (ORL). Someone else brought up Bender (PHX).  By the way, Bender is only 20 years old!! Other possibilities:
3. If Bamba slides in draft, reconsider him.
4. If we can sign Noel, trade Rozier for future pick.
5.  Keep Rozier.

Re: Any chance a Rozier trade package can get us Mohamed Bamba?
« Reply #43 on: May 11, 2018, 05:01:12 PM »

Offline CFAN38

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1. I think Mitchell Robinson is better athlete than Bamba. His stock is artificially low because he skipped out on Western Kentucky. To me that creates an opportunity, where we don't have to give up as much in assets to draft him (projected to go 15 or later).
2. Rather than draft, need to consider existing players with size whom the Celtics could trade Rozier for. Someone brought up Jonathan Isaac (ORL). Someone else brought up Bender (PHX).  By the way, Bender is only 20 years old!! Other possibilities:
3. If Bamba slides in draft, reconsider him.
4. If we can sign Noel, trade Rozier for future pick.
5.  Keep Rozier.

I think Robinson and J Porter are two possible targets in a Rozier trade.

Existing players are tough to trade for. Teams ussually are attached to their players. With that being said Bender or Chriss seem like players who could be moved for Rozier. I had mentioned that in a previous post.

I dont think Noel is a good option fit on this team. If the Cs traded up for Bamba they could still bring in a vet big or bring back Baynes (if he will sign for cheap enough) this will give Bamba time to deveop and get stronger. Signing Noel means that he is fighting Theis for rotational minutes and neither player gives the big body needed to defend Embiid.

Re: Any chance a Rozier trade package can get us Mohamed Bamba?
« Reply #44 on: May 11, 2018, 06:06:31 PM »

Offline knuckleballer

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I realize people don't like the idea of trading Rozier, but what is his role next year assuming the team is healthy?  Come the playoffs, Kyrie will play 40 minutes a game.  So will Brown who will be the starting shooting guard.  Smart, assuming we re-sign him, will play backup at both guard spots.  Rozier's offense has been great, but it won't be as necessary with a healthy Kyrie and Gordon and an improved Tatum and Brown.

The 2019 draft is full of guards and wings, but no bigs that are top prospects that I'm aware of. This draft is full of bigs at the top of the draft.  Ayton, Bagley, and Jackson will likely all go in the top four or five picks.  I doubt we could trade up that high.  Carter and Bamba may each slip a bit.

Carter is the guy I'd like.  He reminds me a lot of Horford.  They both have a low post game and their shooting range stretch out to the three point line.  Carter shot 41% from three and 74% from the free throw line.  He also grabbed 9.1 boards a game and bocked 2.1 shots.  He's also a good passer averaging 2 assists as a center.  He's a little under sized as a center, but he's about the same size a Horford and he already has a decent physique.

I'd trade Rozier and the 2019 Sac pick to get him.  I'd even throw in the Clippers pick.  I might do the same for Bamba, but I haven't seen him play as much and he seems to be more of a project.

I'm not sure which team would be a viable trade partner.  One possible way to work out trade would be to invole the Clippers.  They have the 12th and 13th pick.  They might prefer to use just one of those and take the Sac pick.  Then trade the Clippers pick to a a team selecting several picks or so earlier along with Rozier and possibly another pick.

Bottom line, I'd really like to grab one of this draft's bigs and would be willing to sacrifice Rozier and the Sac pick to do so.