Author Topic: How much is Rozier or dare I say Kyrie worth?  (Read 1478 times)

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How much is Rozier or dare I say Kyrie worth?
« on: May 04, 2018, 12:54:06 PM »

Offline Humble G

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Like what is the worth of each player? It seems that keeping Rozier and trading Kyrie is the new crazy idea floating around the web these days and it makes some sense......or does it?

1. Could we trade Kyrie and get a top pick in this draft from like Dallas, Suns, Magic etc? Then draft our starting Big.
PG: Rozier/Smart
SG: Brown/??
SF: Hayward/Tatum
PF: Horford/Theis
C: DraftPick/ Baynes


OR

2. Trade Rozier for something I dunno what. I saw a trade idea with the Suns :
Suns - Terry Rozier
Celtics - Troy Daniels, No. 16, No. 31, Milwaukee pick
https://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2018/5/1/17307820/terry-rozier-meteoric-rise-sets-him-up-as-the-perfect-trade-target-this-summer-for-phoenix-suns-nba
* Funny that we drafted him at 16 in 2015


Whats everyone's thoughts on which would be better fit/value  Rozier or Kyrie
2018 NBA Mock Trade Deadline: Nuggets
PG: Murray, Mudiay, Monte Morris
SG: Harris, Barton, Malik Beasley
SF: Barnes, MKG,Torrey Craig, Jefferson
PF: Millsap, Lyles, Juan Hernangomez, Tyler Lydon
C: Jokic, Mason Plumlee
 2nd GS, 2018 2nd POR, 2019 2nd WAS

Re: How much is Rozier or dare I say Kyrie worth?
« Reply #1 on: May 04, 2018, 01:11:45 PM »

Offline jambr380

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I accidentally watched First Take this morning (I know, I know) and there was an entire segment on this in regards to Kawhi.

SAS thought we should trade Kyrie for Kawhi in a straight up trade of 'five star' players. Here, Rozier and Smart would take over playmaking duties and the rest of our team would be a switching nightmare for other teams.

Kellerman thought that a trade of Hayward/Rozier/a pick for Kawhi would be best since we would get to keep both 'five star' players while taking advantage of Rozier's increased value the year before his contract expires.

I realize there is an entire thread on Kawhi that has gotten quite extensive, but I am not sure I want to give up Rozier at all right now. Not that I definitely want to deal Kyrie, but Rozier is finally combining some control with his elite athleticism. He is also so engaged on both ends - the dude is just electric. I would hate to just deal him for a mid-1st.

Re: How much is Rozier or dare I say Kyrie worth?
« Reply #2 on: May 06, 2018, 04:57:19 PM »

Offline sdceltsfan

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Small sample size, but Rozier has shown steady improvement since summer league up until now. The high level and consistent play in the playoffs is the end game, so as long as he doesn't bomb the rest of the post-season, I honestly think he can fetch a pick between 6-12 range.

There aren't as many NBA ready PG's in this draft, and there are a lot of teams in need of the skill set that Rozier offers.

I think by draft night, teams will be willing to trade a guy like Bamba or Wendell Carter, who yes offer a ton of upside, but are not as "surefire" as Ayton/Bagley. Plenty of teams would likely rather hedge the risk of one of these guys being a bust, to bring a proven talent like Rozier.

Bamba/Carter would be a great addition once Kyrie returns as the starting PG.

Baynes has had a very mercurial post season, and Monroes inability to get on the court, proves our need for a rim protector to also allow Horford to do more of what he is best at, would be huge for Stevens in terms of personnel.

Re: How much is Rozier or dare I say Kyrie worth?
« Reply #3 on: May 06, 2018, 05:22:58 PM »

Offline Erik

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I don't think rozier can get a high lotto pick unless he's part of a larger trade. I think he's worth about 15th pick by himself.

Re: How much is Rozier or dare I say Kyrie worth?
« Reply #4 on: May 06, 2018, 05:29:17 PM »

Offline Birdman

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I would trade kyrie for leonard straight up
C/PF-Horford, Baynes, Noel, Theis, Morris,
SF/SG- Tatum, Brown, Hayward, Smart, Semi, Clark
PG- Irving, Rozier, Larkin

Re: How much is Rozier or dare I say Kyrie worth?
« Reply #5 on: May 06, 2018, 05:34:55 PM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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Small sample size, but Rozier has shown steady improvement since summer league up until now. The high level and consistent play in the playoffs is the end game, so as long as he doesn't bomb the rest of the post-season, I honestly think he can fetch a pick between 6-12 range.

There aren't as many NBA ready PG's in this draft, and there are a lot of teams in need of the skill set that Rozier offers.

I think by draft night, teams will be willing to trade a guy like Bamba or Wendell Carter, who yes offer a ton of upside, but are not as "surefire" as Ayton/Bagley. Plenty of teams would likely rather hedge the risk of one of these guys being a bust, to bring a proven talent like Rozier.

Bamba/Carter would be a great addition once Kyrie returns as the starting PG.

Baynes has had a very mercurial post season, and Monroes inability to get on the court, proves our need for a rim protector to also allow Horford to do more of what he is best at, would be huge for Stevens in terms of personnel.

I don't know anything about college players, but I've been reading/hearing about the top of this draft for 2 years.   

You really think Terry Rozier gets a top 7 pick from Suns, Griz, Mavs, Hawks, Magic, Bulls or Kings?   I think it would be like if the C's got the 5th pick from LAL and traded it for, say, Elfrid Payton or Reggie Jackson.  And this would be giving Terry the benefit of the doubt because he's "proven" himself in only about half a season.  I really have no idea if I'm correct, but I would think Danny would be ecstatic and dumbfounded if he could get a top 7 pick for Terry in this draft.   

I'd be glad to be wrong as TR's value to this team, while great to have on the bench, is MUCH decreased when KI returns.


Re: How much is Rozier or dare I say Kyrie worth?
« Reply #6 on: May 06, 2018, 05:56:20 PM »

Offline bopna

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Im sure DA will seize the opportunity and gauge Terry's value around the league.

If he fetches a pick in the 6-10 range then i'll think long and hard about it.

Terry is coming to a point that he has to be given a starting gig somewhere and im sure Danny may oblige specially if it nets a fair return..

Don't laugh at me but Ive seen something in Jabari Bird in his very short stint near the end of the season to say that maybe he can take over Terry's job coming off the bench to relieve Kyrie...sure Terry is better but its not out of the realm of imposibility that Bird can do a Terry rozier improvement in his 2nd season...Terry did also made some small strides in year 2.

Re: How much is Rozier or dare I say Kyrie worth?
« Reply #7 on: May 06, 2018, 05:59:17 PM »

Offline bopna

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I don't think rozier can get a high lotto pick unless he's part of a larger trade. I think he's worth about 15th pick by himself.

too low...the guy was already a 16th pick himself on his own draft class and in a redraft now of 2015, Terry is going at least top 6 the way he is playing out of his mind.

Re: How much is Rozier or dare I say Kyrie worth?
« Reply #8 on: May 06, 2018, 06:07:33 PM »

Offline KGs Knee

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I don't think rozier can get a high lotto pick unless he's part of a larger trade. I think he's worth about 15th pick by himself.

too low...the guy was already a 16th pick himself on his own draft class and in a redraft now of 2015, Terry is going at least top 6 the way he is playing out of his mind.

Where Rozier would fall in a redraft of his draft class is irrelevant. It has nothing to do with his current value amongst all players league wide and the prospects available in the upcoming draft. That is what you have to compare Rozier's value to in order to determine if he is worth a lottery pick in the upcoming draft.

And I think asking for a lottery pick is just too much. I'd wager you could probably get a pick somewhere in the late teens though. Maybe some team desperate for a starting PG would give up a pick in the 11-14 range, but I think that is very questionable.

Re: How much is Rozier or dare I say Kyrie worth?
« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2018, 06:10:18 PM »

Online CelticsElite

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I don't think rozier can get a high lotto pick unless he's part of a larger trade. I think he's worth about 15th pick by himself.

too low...the guy was already a 16th pick himself on his own draft class and in a redraft now of 2015, Terry is going at least top 6 the way he is playing out of his mind.
rozier is an expiring contract. You realize that right

Re: How much is Rozier or dare I say Kyrie worth?
« Reply #10 on: May 06, 2018, 06:12:05 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Quote
I don't think rozier can get a high lotto pick unless he's part of a larger trade. I think he's worth about 15th pick by himself.

I think he is worth a little more folks.  GMs know what they are getting in Terry.   They don't with a pick.   I doubt he could get a top five pick, but maybe a 6-12 range.   We would still need a backup guard because who do we have that can score besides Kyrie reliably in the back court?

Re: How much is Rozier or dare I say Kyrie worth?
« Reply #11 on: May 06, 2018, 06:33:18 PM »

Offline KGs Knee

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I don't think rozier can get a high lotto pick unless he's part of a larger trade. I think he's worth about 15th pick by himself.

too low...the guy was already a 16th pick himself on his own draft class and in a redraft now of 2015, Terry is going at least top 6 the way he is playing out of his mind.
rozier is an expiring contract. You realize that right

Rozier's contract status isn't really a factor, at least not in a significant manner. He has one more year on his rookie deal and then will be a RFA, giving any team that trades for him right of first refusal. This is far different from trading for a veteran who would be a UFA.

The issue is, rarely do teams give up lottery picks for players who probably aren't even top 10 at their position.

Re: How much is Rozier or dare I say Kyrie worth?
« Reply #12 on: May 06, 2018, 06:51:21 PM »

Offline keevsnick

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I think the George Hill trade is a good baseline. That was a 3 teamer with Jeff Teague and the 12th pick. Both pf those guys were starters at the time. Maybe Rozier is with a little more due to hi youth so id say 10-12 is probably the range, little highest uf we package 27.

And im not trading Kyrie.

Re: How much is Rozier or dare I say Kyrie worth?
« Reply #13 on: May 06, 2018, 06:51:26 PM »

Offline Sophomore

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I don't think rozier can get a high lotto pick unless he's part of a larger trade. I think he's worth about 15th pick by himself.

too low...the guy was already a 16th pick himself on his own draft class and in a redraft now of 2015, Terry is going at least top 6 the way he is playing out of his mind.
rozier is an expiring contract. You realize that right

Rozier's contract status isn't really a factor, at least not in a significant manner. He has one more year on his rookie deal and then will be a RFA, giving any team that trades for him right of first refusal. This is far different from trading for a veteran who would be a UFA.

The issue is, rarely do teams give up lottery picks for players who probably aren't even top 10 at their position.

I dunno. Look at the Clips, picking 11 and 12. Suppose they decide they want a PG. Who can they get at 11, and what are the odds that player is better than Rozier? I think everything depends on who you think TR is. Is he playoff Terry, getting a very efficient 20 ppg (TS% above 60), 6-7 assists on very low turnovers, 5 rpg, and solid defense, all against motivated playoff competition? Or is he the guy who was much less efficient before the playoffs, making more than his share of bad basketball plays.

If you believe playoff Terry is for real, that could be your guy even for a lotto pick.  The other parts of this, that are harder to assess, involve where the team is in its development and salary structure. To get a high pick you need a team that wants to start getting better fairly soon and doesn't mind spending to keep him a year from now. They'd be spending decent money on a player who is good but doesn't project as a true franchise player. That involves a lot of variables. I kind of wish Orlando was few picks worse in the draft - say, 8th - because for them it might make sense.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2018, 07:12:47 PM by Sophomore »

Re: How much is Rozier or dare I say Kyrie worth?
« Reply #14 on: May 06, 2018, 07:20:00 PM »

Offline Erik

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Quote
I don't think rozier can get a high lotto pick unless he's part of a larger trade. I think he's worth about 15th pick by himself.

I think he is worth a little more folks.  GMs know what they are getting in Terry.   They don't with a pick.   I doubt he could get a top five pick, but maybe a 6-12 range.   We would still need a backup guard because who do we have that can score besides Kyrie reliably in the back court?

I don't think rozier can get a high lotto pick unless he's part of a larger trade. I think he's worth about 15th pick by himself.

too low...the guy was already a 16th pick himself on his own draft class and in a redraft now of 2015, Terry is going at least top 6 the way he is playing out of his mind.
rozier is an expiring contract. You realize that right

Rozier's contract status isn't really a factor, at least not in a significant manner. He has one more year on his rookie deal and then will be a RFA, giving any team that trades for him right of first refusal. This is far different from trading for a veteran who would be a UFA.

The issue is, rarely do teams give up lottery picks for players who probably aren't even top 10 at their position.

You two have convinced me. I know how good he is compared to an unknown, however, I didn’t consider the restricted free agent factor at all. I think Rozier could get a top 10 pick in a specific situation. If we can take the Suns pick for Rozier I’m naming my next boy Daniel.