Author Topic: Let's Blow Up the Raptors  (Read 3486 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Re: Let's Blow Up the Raptors
« Reply #45 on: May 04, 2018, 09:53:33 PM »

Offline csfansince60s

  • Rajon Rondo
  • *****
  • Posts: 5508
  • Tommy Points: 2023
I canít see Ujiri giving up on this deep, talented regular season winner that he has created..not in the Toronto market where they are entertained sufficiently by winning and hanging ANY banner, even division titles.


I'm questioning whether it's actually true that the Toronto fanbase is going to continue to be entertained by this team when the team has been so thoroughly trounced year after year, regardless of its regular season performance.

I often think that us Boston fans tend to underestimate the extent to which other fanbases can find satisfaction in teams that are competitive and entertaining but that cannot contend for a title. 

Nonetheless, I think even small market fanbases can get sick of watching the same core group achieve the same result after five or six years.  Especially if that result involves the team consistently underperforming in the playoffs compared to the regular season.

Toronto LOVES Ujiri, hell all of Canada loves Ujiri.

The guy is a golden boy, and while he has no hardware to show for his work, he pretty much has carte blanche with that franchise and Canadaís teamís fan base, which is the whole country.

I canít see him dismantling his work anytime soon, but if heís taking notice of the new powers rising in the East, he may, OR he may think that the future is ours and the Sixers and think his best chance is this year or next year.

If Ujiri gets the Knicks job, I think they clean house. If not, I think Ujiri stays the course.

Re: Let's Blow Up the Raptors
« Reply #46 on: May 04, 2018, 10:32:49 PM »

Offline Moranis

  • Global Moderator
  • Bill Sharman
  • *******************
  • Posts: 19337
  • Tommy Points: 915
What about something like this

DeRozan, Valanciunas, Anunoby

For

Leonard, Gasol, Mills

Various other players and picks could be included.  Raptors get a legit star though maybe just a rental and the Spurs get a lesser player but with far more long term certainty while picking up a younger center and a nice wing prospect.  This trade seems like a pretty decent move for both teams given their current state of affairs

Re: Let's Blow Up the Raptors
« Reply #47 on: May 04, 2018, 11:04:54 PM »

Offline SparzWizard

  • Rajon Rondo
  • *****
  • Posts: 5623
  • Tommy Points: 332
Raptor fans/players be like "At least LeBron will be leaving the east next year." after falling 0-2.

But then Kyrie and Gordon Hayward will be in the East next year.  ;D ;D ;D

Re: Let's Blow Up the Raptors
« Reply #48 on: May 04, 2018, 11:11:03 PM »

Offline gouki88

  • Ray Allen
  • ***
  • Posts: 3746
  • Tommy Points: 61
What about something like this

DeRozan, Valanciunas, Anunoby

For

Leonard, Gasol, Mills

Various other players and picks could be included.  Raptors get a legit star though maybe just a rental and the Spurs get a lesser player but with far more long term certainty while picking up a younger center and a nice wing prospect.  This trade seems like a pretty decent move for both teams given their current state of affairs
Do you reckon Toronto would keep Lowry if they made this move? That would be some insane level fireworks

Re: Let's Blow Up the Raptors
« Reply #49 on: May 05, 2018, 12:27:01 AM »

Offline action781

  • Antoine Walker
  • ****
  • Posts: 4375
  • Tommy Points: 336
Toronto Trades
Kyle Lowry
Valanciunas

Milwaukee Trades
Eric Bledsoe
John Henson
Tony Snell
Future First Round Pick (two years after pick to Phoenix conveys)

Milwaukee gets back a significantly better version of Bledsoe and finally a real starting Center.  Toronto breaks up those contracts and gets a pick.  Maybe Bledsoe can even redeem some of his trade value and be flipped down the road.
2018 Mock Trade Deadline Philly 76ers

Guards:  A Bradley / Covington / Redick / Fultz / Bayless / Luwawu / Korkmaz
Forwards:  Saric / Simmons (point forward) / Trev Booker / J Anderson
Center:  Embiid / THE BOBAN / R Holmes

Picks: 2018 LAL 1st (if 1, 6-30), 2019 SAC 1st (if LAL 2-5), 2018 2nds from BKN, NYK, HOU, and 2019 SAC 2n

Re: Let's Blow Up the Raptors
« Reply #50 on: May 06, 2018, 02:03:39 AM »

Offline sawick48

  • Marcus Smart
  • Posts: 239
  • Tommy Points: 26
I'm gonna come clean.  I'm mad at the Raptors. 

I want somebody to beat LeBron.  I hate that the Cavs can half or quarter butt-cheek their way through a season and still make the Finals because they have LeBron and guys like Jeff Green or J.R. Smith will remember how to play for a game or two in a series.

The Raptors somehow suckered me into thinking they were actually as good as their record and their point differential.  Me, dummy.

So, as retribution, and because I think it's what would be best for their fans, the franchise, and the players involved, I think they should blow it up.

Let's help them!


It's hard to figure out how they could trade Lowry, who is 30+ and making a ton of money, or Derozan, who is nearing 30 and also making a ton of money.  Ibaka seems nigh untradeable.  Valanciunas has questionable trade value, though he's still young.


But let's try.  So give me your best ideas for how the Raps can trade away Lowry, Derozan, and Valanciunas.  Bonus points if you can figure out a reasonable Ibaka trade, though honestly I think he's just dead weight  (a "clattering boneyard" as Bruce Arthur brilliantly put it).


I want to see the Raptors enter next year with a roster that no longer includes Lowry or Derozan.  Ideally they should be featuring their young bench mob as their future.  These trades needn't be aimed at allowing them to stay relevant.  That ship has sailed.  It's time for a true reset in Toronto.

VanVleet, Wright, OG, Siakam, Poeltl  ---> That's the Raptors core.  Everybody else can go.


The 6ers panic trading for Lowry after missing out on LeBron and watching the Kawhi situation resolve itself without their consideration makes too much sense really. One of the few teams w/ need and cap space to just take the contract. Maybe McConnell, Luwau and a heavily protected pick?

Though I imagine they'd be awfully hesitant to deal their current playoff MVP  :laugh:

Re: Let's Blow Up the Raptors
« Reply #51 on: May 06, 2018, 02:06:09 AM »

Offline sawick48

  • Marcus Smart
  • Posts: 239
  • Tommy Points: 26
What about something like this

DeRozan, Valanciunas, Anunoby

For

Leonard, Gasol, Mills

Various other players and picks could be included.  Raptors get a legit star though maybe just a rental and the Spurs get a lesser player but with far more long term certainty while picking up a younger center and a nice wing prospect.  This trade seems like a pretty decent move for both teams given their current state of affairs
Do you reckon Toronto would keep Lowry if they made this move? That would be some insane level fireworks


there is a negative chance the Spurs do anything involving a Derozan for Kawhi trade.

If they trade Kawhi, they're doing it for young players and lottery picks. Pop isn't going to stick around to hope that one more year of Manu and Parker can mesh with a zero calorie version of Kawhi's game in the West.

Derozan's best hope is that Paul George some how spurns the Lakers and new Laker LeBron some how sees enough value in DeMar to implore the team to get him.

Re: Let's Blow Up the Raptors
« Reply #52 on: May 06, 2018, 02:48:11 AM »

Offline Green-18

  • Gordon Hayward
  • Posts: 594
  • Tommy Points: 55
What about something like this

DeRozan, Valanciunas, Anunoby

For

Leonard, Gasol, Mills

Various other players and picks could be included.  Raptors get a legit star though maybe just a rental and the Spurs get a lesser player but with far more long term certainty while picking up a younger center and a nice wing prospect.  This trade seems like a pretty decent move for both teams given their current state of affairs
Do you reckon Toronto would keep Lowry if they made this move? That would be some insane level fireworks


there is a negative chance the Spurs do anything involving a Derozan for Kawhi trade.

If they trade Kawhi, they're doing it for young players and lottery picks. Pop isn't going to stick around to hope that one more year of Manu and Parker can mesh with a zero calorie version of Kawhi's game in the West.

Derozan's best hope is that Paul George some how spurns the Lakers and new Laker LeBron some how sees enough value in DeMar to implore the team to get him.

Couldn't agree more.  The Raptors will struggle to get any significant value for DeRozan unless he is being added to a group of All-Stars.  I really don't understand why he never put in the work to become a better 3 point shooter.  He took more shots this year but the improvement was minimal at best.  It certainly hasn't translated to the playoffs.

Look at Jaylen Brown as a comparison.  He shot 29% from the college 3.  Two years later he is nearly a 40% three point shooter in the NBA.  It all boils down to putting in the work.

Re: Let's Blow Up the Raptors
« Reply #53 on: May 06, 2018, 03:25:59 AM »

Offline GreenEnvy

  • Ray Allen
  • ***
  • Posts: 3225
  • Tommy Points: 899
What about something like this

DeRozan, Valanciunas, Anunoby

For

Leonard, Gasol, Mills

Various other players and picks could be included.  Raptors get a legit star though maybe just a rental and the Spurs get a lesser player but with far more long term certainty while picking up a younger center and a nice wing prospect.  This trade seems like a pretty decent move for both teams given their current state of affairs
Do you reckon Toronto would keep Lowry if they made this move? That would be some insane level fireworks


there is a negative chance the Spurs do anything involving a Derozan for Kawhi trade.

If they trade Kawhi, they're doing it for young players and lottery picks. Pop isn't going to stick around to hope that one more year of Manu and Parker can mesh with a zero calorie version of Kawhi's game in the West.

Derozan's best hope is that Paul George some how spurns the Lakers and new Laker LeBron some how sees enough value in DeMar to implore the team to get him.

I still believe Lakers sign LeBron and CP3 and then trade Ball, Ingram and maybe even Kuzma for a third star. Fill out roster with ring chasers and take your shot at GSW for the privilege to lose to the Celtics.
I AM A CELTIC

Re: Let's Blow Up the Raptors
« Reply #54 on: May 06, 2018, 07:50:39 AM »

Offline gouki88

  • Ray Allen
  • ***
  • Posts: 3746
  • Tommy Points: 61
http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y8yd2o9a

I got bored on Trade Machine and made this mess of a trade, lol.

I don't know if any team agrees, but it would be some fun fireworks, which this thread is basically about.

Moving Ibaka is nigh on impossible

Re: Let's Blow Up the Raptors
« Reply #55 on: May 06, 2018, 11:19:47 AM »

Offline Phantom255x

  • Satch Sanders
  • *********
  • Posts: 9748
  • Tommy Points: 719
  • On To Banner 18!
Valanciunas has probably been the most frustrating player on the Raptors so far.

In Game 1, he MISSED two easy tip-ins at the end, either could have won TOR the game.

Then last night, it felt like he missed a ton of bunnies in the 2nd half that could have made the difference at the end.

He's a solid player but boy this series could have been so much more different if he just had one successful tip-in at Game 1.

But on a side note... HAPPY BIRTHDAY VALANCIUNAS!  ;D
2018 Mock Trade Deadline (New York Knicks)

Roster: Porzingis, Kanter, Hardaway Jr, Julius Randle, Schroder, Beasley, Alex Abrines, Jarrett Jack, Frank Ntilikina, Lance Thomas, Kyle Singler, Josh Huestis, Ron Baker, Trey Burke, Luke Kornet, Isaiah Hicks

Future Draft Picks: https://www.prosportstransactions.com/basketball/DraftTrades/Future/Knick

Re: Let's Blow Up the Raptors
« Reply #56 on: May 08, 2018, 07:58:37 AM »

Offline Green-18

  • Gordon Hayward
  • Posts: 594
  • Tommy Points: 55
That sweep did nothing but hurt the value of DeRozan in the trade market.  His scoring efficiency and PER 36 averages all dropped below regular season averages for the 4th straight postseason.  To put things in perspective, Marcus Smart has a nearly identical career TS% in the playoffs. 

If you are a GM where would DeMar fit into your plans?  Bringing him in as #1 scoring option wont work if you want to win playoff games.  His inability to move without the ball also makes him a non-factor as a complementary piece.  On top of that he is a mediocre team defender.  Doesn't that description sound just like Carmelo Anthony?

What might get lost in all of this is the fact that Kyle Lowry had a great postseason.  There should be multiple playoff suitors on the trade market.  Minnesota seems like an ideal fit. 

 

 

Re: Let's Blow Up the Raptors
« Reply #57 on: May 08, 2018, 08:03:17 AM »

Offline pearljammer10

  • Frank Ramsey
  • ************
  • Posts: 12421
  • Tommy Points: 845
That sweep did nothing but hurt the value of DeRozan in the trade market.  His scoring efficiency and PER 36 averages all dropped below regular season averages for the 4th straight postseason.  To put things in perspective, Marcus Smart has a nearly identical career TS% in the playoffs. 

If you are a GM where would DeMar fit into your plans?  Bringing him in as #1 scoring option wont work if you want to win playoff games.  His inability to move without the ball also makes him a non-factor as a complementary piece.  On top of that he is a mediocre team defender.  Doesn't that description sound just like Carmelo Anthony?

What might get lost in all of this is the fact that Kyle Lowry had a great postseason.  There should be multiple playoff suitors on the trade market.  Minnesota seems like an ideal fit. 

 

 

Don't disagree about Lowry but you can't go 2-7 in an elimination game is youre a "star" or "superstar."

1. The shooting percentage is low enough. But 2. You need to take more than 7 shots especially when you co-pilot has been ejected.

Derozan is good but like you mention he can't be a teams number one option. Where does he fit in todays NBA if hes a shooting guard that can't shoot 3 pointers? He was 0-13 in his last 5 post season games. Sure he is a legit scorer, but who is going to make a trade for him when he can't stretch the floor as a 2-guard?
CB Draft 2016:
PG:Tony Parker/Mo Williams
SG:Alec Burks/Manu Ginobili
SF:Al Farouq-Aminu/Jared Dudley/Tony Snell
PF:Dirk Nowitzki/JaMychal Green
C: Deandre Jordan/Roy Hibbert/Alex Len

Re: Let's Blow Up the Raptors
« Reply #58 on: May 08, 2018, 08:10:17 AM »

Offline Moranis

  • Global Moderator
  • Bill Sharman
  • *******************
  • Posts: 19337
  • Tommy Points: 915
That sweep did nothing but hurt the value of DeRozan in the trade market.  His scoring efficiency and PER 36 averages all dropped below regular season averages for the 4th straight postseason.  To put things in perspective, Marcus Smart has a nearly identical career TS% in the playoffs. 

If you are a GM where would DeMar fit into your plans?  Bringing him in as #1 scoring option wont work if you want to win playoff games.  His inability to move without the ball also makes him a non-factor as a complementary piece.  On top of that he is a mediocre team defender.  Doesn't that description sound just like Carmelo Anthony?

What might get lost in all of this is the fact that Kyle Lowry had a great postseason.  There should be multiple playoff suitors on the trade market.  Minnesota seems like an ideal fit. 

 

 

Don't disagree about Lowry but you can't go 2-7 in an elimination game is youre a "star" or "superstar."

1. The shooting percentage is low enough. But 2. You need to take more than 7 shots especially when you co-pilot has been ejected.

Derozan is good but like you mention he can't be a teams number one option. Where does he fit in todays NBA if hes a shooting guard that can't shoot 3 pointers? He was 0-13 in his last 5 post season games. Sure he is a legit scorer, but who is going to make a trade for him when he can't stretch the floor as a 2-guard?
DeRozan would actually be an interesting playing next to James.  If James opted in (or re-signed) maybe something like Clarkson, Smith, BKN for DeRozan.  Cleveland would be pretty interesting going forward with Hill, Korver, DeRozan, James, Love with a bench of Hood, Thompson, Nance, Osman, and whichever vets they added.  In that role DeRozan is a 2nd or 3rd offensive option and the Cavs can get away with his lesser shooting with Hill, Korver, and Love being the other starters. 

Re: Let's Blow Up the Raptors
« Reply #59 on: May 08, 2018, 08:36:00 AM »

Offline Androslav

  • Don Chaney
  • *
  • Posts: 1620
  • Tommy Points: 283
That sweep did nothing but hurt the value of DeRozan in the trade market.  His scoring efficiency and PER 36 averages all dropped below regular season averages for the 4th straight postseason.  To put things in perspective, Marcus Smart has a nearly identical career TS% in the playoffs. 

If you are a GM where would DeMar fit into your plans?  Bringing him in as #1 scoring option wont work if you want to win playoff games.  His inability to move without the ball also makes him a non-factor as a complementary piece.  On top of that he is a mediocre team defender.  Doesn't that description sound just like Carmelo Anthony?

What might get lost in all of this is the fact that Kyle Lowry had a great postseason.  There should be multiple playoff suitors on the trade market.  Minnesota seems like an ideal fit. 

 

 

Don't disagree about Lowry but you can't go 2-7 in an elimination game is youre a "star" or "superstar."

1. The shooting percentage is low enough. But 2. You need to take more than 7 shots especially when you co-pilot has been ejected.

Derozan is good but like you mention he can't be a teams number one option. Where does he fit in todays NBA if hes a shooting guard that can't shoot 3 pointers? He was 0-13 in his last 5 post season games. Sure he is a legit scorer, but who is going to make a trade for him when he can't stretch the floor as a 2-guard?
DeRozan would actually be an interesting playing next to James.  If James opted in (or re-signed) maybe something like Clarkson, Smith, BKN for DeRozan.  Cleveland would be pretty interesting going forward with Hill, Korver, DeRozan, James, Love with a bench of Hood, Thompson, Nance, Osman, and whichever vets they added.  In that role DeRozan is a 2nd or 3rd offensive option and the Cavs can get away with his lesser shooting with Hill, Korver, and Love being the other starters.
As a Celtic, I'd love to see that Cleveland lineup for years and years. To see that they used the BKN pick (Kyrie) for dumping bad salaries and a non-spacer next to LeBron - exquisite.
"The joy of the balling under the rims."