Author Topic: Did NBA agenda just show its' ugly head?  (Read 3793 times)

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Re: Did NBA agenda just show its' ugly head?
« Reply #60 on: April 19, 2018, 06:49:17 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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TP but I can't get the video to open here. I'll try again at home.
Sorry I don't know why they didn't show up as direct links.  The box scores on NBA.COM contain video of each and every play in the play by play.  People may also find the new defense and match up sections they have added this year interesting.

As to the 2 early fouls on Olidipo they were a pretty obvious charge and him blasting into Lebron's screen, both of which were correctly called in my opinion.  The Pacers were a mess to start that game and blaming the refs with these conspiracy theories is just nonsense.

Got it by going into play-by-play and clicking the play link there. 

Yeah I can't see Korver's feet there but he's definitely outside the area, it looks like a charge, and Oladipo doesn't even complain heading back up.  Not seeing a smoking gun here.  Honestly the sketchiest first half foul is the #3 where Love got him into the air and leaned into him to shoot, but that's something that's generally called unless the contact is glancing. It's just an annoying kind of play, unless it's Paul Pierce doing it  :)

What's interesting is that so many of these complaints (not by you) seem to collapse to the idea that refs should base their calls on game situations, how many fouls star players have, etc, which is also something cited as evidence of rigging.  Like it's inherently unfair for Dipo to get 2 fouls in a minute whether they're valid calls or not.

Korver is 100% moving there man. Come on. People want to argue this cause they want to say "nba officiating is great they never favor anything", and i get that makes the NBA easier to watch. But come on... I thought he was moving live and watching this frame by frame on this replay it is even more obvious he wasn't set. I have a screenshot on my desktop here that I can't figure out how to load, but Korvers feet are about 3.5 feet apart as oladipo starts his jump. I have never seen someone argue before with a straight face that you can be in a set position with your legs spread out 3 to 3.5 feet apart. I would call this a blocking foul if it was Paul pierce himself down there.
The day that that play is not called a charge is the day that the NBA is no longer worth watching as players wont be allowed to play defense at all!  Korver establishes position in Oladipo's path and draws a near perfectly executed drawn charge, well outside the restricted area, arms vertical, and does not appear to move sideways at all.  Oladipo should have pulled it out rather than attacking 2 defenders in solid position.  Oladipo himself does NOT even argue the call as he knew it was correct!!  You can toggle it back and forth a thousand times on NBA.COM your screenshot is meaningless.

This is so ridiculous to me, but we can agree to disagree and just pretend to mutually admire Korver's foot speed. I also find it hilarious you are using the fact that Oladipo, who is very soft spoken and rarely complains about anything, didn't throw a hissy fit as some evidence of it being a good call. If he whined and jumped around like Lebron does every time a foul is called on him you would take that as evidence of it being a bad call. Give me a break... .

Hope they never call that correctly and risk making the nba not worth watching. We all want more charges and guys ducking under players rather than playing real defense right?

Re: Did NBA agenda just show its' ugly head?
« Reply #61 on: April 19, 2018, 07:01:05 PM »

Online The Oracle

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TP but I can't get the video to open here. I'll try again at home.
Sorry I don't know why they didn't show up as direct links.  The box scores on NBA.COM contain video of each and every play in the play by play.  People may also find the new defense and match up sections they have added this year interesting.

As to the 2 early fouls on Olidipo they were a pretty obvious charge and him blasting into Lebron's screen, both of which were correctly called in my opinion.  The Pacers were a mess to start that game and blaming the refs with these conspiracy theories is just nonsense.

Got it by going into play-by-play and clicking the play link there. 

Yeah I can't see Korver's feet there but he's definitely outside the area, it looks like a charge, and Oladipo doesn't even complain heading back up.  Not seeing a smoking gun here.  Honestly the sketchiest first half foul is the #3 where Love got him into the air and leaned into him to shoot, but that's something that's generally called unless the contact is glancing. It's just an annoying kind of play, unless it's Paul Pierce doing it  :)

What's interesting is that so many of these complaints (not by you) seem to collapse to the idea that refs should base their calls on game situations, how many fouls star players have, etc, which is also something cited as evidence of rigging.  Like it's inherently unfair for Dipo to get 2 fouls in a minute whether they're valid calls or not.

Korver is 100% moving there man. Come on. People want to argue this cause they want to say "nba officiating is great they never favor anything", and i get that makes the NBA easier to watch. But come on... I thought he was moving live and watching this frame by frame on this replay it is even more obvious he wasn't set. I have a screenshot on my desktop here that I can't figure out how to load, but Korvers feet are about 3.5 feet apart as oladipo starts his jump. I have never seen someone argue before with a straight face that you can be in a set position with your legs spread out 3 to 3.5 feet apart. I would call this a blocking foul if it was Paul pierce himself down there.
The day that that play is not called a charge is the day that the NBA is no longer worth watching as players wont be allowed to play defense at all!  Korver establishes position in Oladipo's path and draws a near perfectly executed drawn charge, well outside the restricted area, arms vertical, and does not appear to move sideways at all.  Oladipo should have pulled it out rather than attacking 2 defenders in solid position.  Oladipo himself does NOT even argue the call as he knew it was correct!!  You can toggle it back and forth a thousand times on NBA.COM your screenshot is meaningless.

This is so ridiculous to me, but we can agree to disagree and just pretend to mutually admire Korver's foot speed. I also find it hilarious you are using the fact that Oladipo, who is very soft spoken and rarely complains about anything, didn't throw a hissy fit as some evidence of it being a good call. If he whined and jumped around like Lebron does every time a foul is called on him you would take that as evidence of it being a bad call. Give me a break... .

Hope they never call that correctly and risk making the nba not worth watching. We all want more charges and guys ducking under players rather than playing real defense right?
By every definition of the block charge rules in the NBA handbook that IS a charge.  Continue on with your conspiracy theory.

Re: Did NBA agenda just show its' ugly head?
« Reply #62 on: April 19, 2018, 07:01:57 PM »

Offline Ogaju

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TP but I can't get the video to open here. I'll try again at home.
Sorry I don't know why they didn't show up as direct links.  The box scores on NBA.COM contain video of each and every play in the play by play.  People may also find the new defense and match up sections they have added this year interesting.

As to the 2 early fouls on Olidipo they were a pretty obvious charge and him blasting into Lebron's screen, both of which were correctly called in my opinion.  The Pacers were a mess to start that game and blaming the refs with these conspiracy theories is just nonsense.

Got it by going into play-by-play and clicking the play link there. 

Yeah I can't see Korver's feet there but he's definitely outside the area, it looks like a charge, and Oladipo doesn't even complain heading back up.  Not seeing a smoking gun here.  Honestly the sketchiest first half foul is the #3 where Love got him into the air and leaned into him to shoot, but that's something that's generally called unless the contact is glancing. It's just an annoying kind of play, unless it's Paul Pierce doing it  :)

What's interesting is that so many of these complaints (not by you) seem to collapse to the idea that refs should base their calls on game situations, how many fouls star players have, etc, which is also something cited as evidence of rigging.  Like it's inherently unfair for Dipo to get 2 fouls in a minute whether they're valid calls or not.

Korver is 100% moving there man. Come on. People want to argue this cause they want to say "nba officiating is great they never favor anything", and i get that makes the NBA easier to watch. But come on... I thought he was moving live and watching this frame by frame on this replay it is even more obvious he wasn't set. I have a screenshot on my desktop here that I can't figure out how to load, but Korvers feet are about 3.5 feet apart as oladipo starts his jump. I have never seen someone argue before with a straight face that you can be in a set position with your legs spread out 3 to 3.5 feet apart. I would call this a blocking foul if it was Paul pierce himself down there.
The day that that play is not called a charge is the day that the NBA is no longer worth watching as players wont be allowed to play defense at all!  Korver establishes position in Oladipo's path and draws a near perfectly executed drawn charge, well outside the restricted area, arms vertical, and does not appear to move sideways at all.  Oladipo should have pulled it out rather than attacking 2 defenders in solid position.  Oladipo himself does NOT even argue the call as he knew it was correct!!  You can toggle it back and forth a thousand times on NBA.COM your screenshot is meaningless.

Well they did not call Giannis running a Celtic player over on the way to an 'and one' a charge on Tuesday but it seems that did not stop anyone rom watching the NBA.

Re: Did NBA agenda just show its' ugly head?
« Reply #63 on: April 19, 2018, 07:03:38 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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TP but I can't get the video to open here. I'll try again at home.
Sorry I don't know why they didn't show up as direct links.  The box scores on NBA.COM contain video of each and every play in the play by play.  People may also find the new defense and match up sections they have added this year interesting.

As to the 2 early fouls on Olidipo they were a pretty obvious charge and him blasting into Lebron's screen, both of which were correctly called in my opinion.  The Pacers were a mess to start that game and blaming the refs with these conspiracy theories is just nonsense.

Got it by going into play-by-play and clicking the play link there. 

Yeah I can't see Korver's feet there but he's definitely outside the area, it looks like a charge, and Oladipo doesn't even complain heading back up.  Not seeing a smoking gun here.  Honestly the sketchiest first half foul is the #3 where Love got him into the air and leaned into him to shoot, but that's something that's generally called unless the contact is glancing. It's just an annoying kind of play, unless it's Paul Pierce doing it  :)

What's interesting is that so many of these complaints (not by you) seem to collapse to the idea that refs should base their calls on game situations, how many fouls star players have, etc, which is also something cited as evidence of rigging.  Like it's inherently unfair for Dipo to get 2 fouls in a minute whether they're valid calls or not.

Korver is 100% moving there man. Come on. People want to argue this cause they want to say "nba officiating is great they never favor anything", and i get that makes the NBA easier to watch. But come on... I thought he was moving live and watching this frame by frame on this replay it is even more obvious he wasn't set. I have a screenshot on my desktop here that I can't figure out how to load, but Korvers feet are about 3.5 feet apart as oladipo starts his jump. I have never seen someone argue before with a straight face that you can be in a set position with your legs spread out 3 to 3.5 feet apart. I would call this a blocking foul if it was Paul pierce himself down there.
The day that that play is not called a charge is the day that the NBA is no longer worth watching as players wont be allowed to play defense at all!  Korver establishes position in Oladipo's path and draws a near perfectly executed drawn charge, well outside the restricted area, arms vertical, and does not appear to move sideways at all.  Oladipo should have pulled it out rather than attacking 2 defenders in solid position.  Oladipo himself does NOT even argue the call as he knew it was correct!!  You can toggle it back and forth a thousand times on NBA.COM your screenshot is meaningless.

This is so ridiculous to me, but we can agree to disagree and just pretend to mutually admire Korver's foot speed. I also find it hilarious you are using the fact that Oladipo, who is very soft spoken and rarely complains about anything, didn't throw a hissy fit as some evidence of it being a good call. If he whined and jumped around like Lebron does every time a foul is called on him you would take that as evidence of it being a bad call. Give me a break... .

Hope they never call that correctly and risk making the nba not worth watching. We all want more charges and guys ducking under players rather than playing real defense right?
By every definition of the block charge rules in the NBA handbook that IS a charge.  Continue on with your conspiracy theory.

He is moving! his feet are spread. He is not even upright! What freaking definition are you looking at?

Re: Did NBA agenda just show its' ugly head?
« Reply #64 on: April 19, 2018, 07:24:42 PM »

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The play where Giannis ran over Larkin at the FT line where Giannis got the call for an and one seems similar to me to the Oladipo foul after running into Korver. Which play is called right and which wrong? Both Korver and Larkin to me didn't finish setting feet but both may have established position. To me you gotta get your feet set.

I will say its a dang tough call to get right without replay.

But the megastar's team got the call in both situations. Lebron and Giannis' teams were the beneficiary.

Re: Did NBA agenda just show its' ugly head?
« Reply #65 on: April 19, 2018, 07:24:51 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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TP but I can't get the video to open here. I'll try again at home.
Sorry I don't know why they didn't show up as direct links.  The box scores on NBA.COM contain video of each and every play in the play by play.  People may also find the new defense and match up sections they have added this year interesting.

As to the 2 early fouls on Olidipo they were a pretty obvious charge and him blasting into Lebron's screen, both of which were correctly called in my opinion.  The Pacers were a mess to start that game and blaming the refs with these conspiracy theories is just nonsense.

Got it by going into play-by-play and clicking the play link there. 

Yeah I can't see Korver's feet there but he's definitely outside the area, it looks like a charge, and Oladipo doesn't even complain heading back up.  Not seeing a smoking gun here.  Honestly the sketchiest first half foul is the #3 where Love got him into the air and leaned into him to shoot, but that's something that's generally called unless the contact is glancing. It's just an annoying kind of play, unless it's Paul Pierce doing it  :)

What's interesting is that so many of these complaints (not by you) seem to collapse to the idea that refs should base their calls on game situations, how many fouls star players have, etc, which is also something cited as evidence of rigging.  Like it's inherently unfair for Dipo to get 2 fouls in a minute whether they're valid calls or not.

Korver is 100% moving there man. Come on. People want to argue this cause they want to say "nba officiating is great they never favor anything", and i get that makes the NBA easier to watch. But come on... I thought he was moving live and watching this frame by frame on this replay it is even more obvious he wasn't set. I have a screenshot on my desktop here that I can't figure out how to load, but Korvers feet are about 3.5 feet apart as oladipo starts his jump. I have never seen someone argue before with a straight face that you can be in a set position with your legs spread out 3 to 3.5 feet apart. I would call this a blocking foul if it was Paul pierce himself down there.
The day that that play is not called a charge is the day that the NBA is no longer worth watching as players wont be allowed to play defense at all!  Korver establishes position in Oladipo's path and draws a near perfectly executed drawn charge, well outside the restricted area, arms vertical, and does not appear to move sideways at all.  Oladipo should have pulled it out rather than attacking 2 defenders in solid position.  Oladipo himself does NOT even argue the call as he knew it was correct!!  You can toggle it back and forth a thousand times on NBA.COM your screenshot is meaningless.

Well they did not call Giannis running a Celtic player over on the way to an 'and one' a charge on Tuesday but it seems that did not stop anyone rom watching the NBA.

Clearly it was a borderline call and saying the NBA isn't worth watching if it doesn't go one way is beyond hyperbolic.

Re: Did NBA agenda just show its' ugly head?
« Reply #66 on: April 19, 2018, 07:26:25 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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Re: Did NBA agenda just show its' ugly head?
« Reply #67 on: April 19, 2018, 07:33:02 PM »

Offline Ogaju

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The play where Giannis ran over Larkin at the FT line where Giannis got the call for an and one seems similar to me to the Oladipo foul after running into Korver. Which play is called right and which wrong? Both Korver and Larkin to me didn't finish setting feet but both may have established position. To me you gotta get your feet set.

I will say its a dang tough call to get right without replay.

But the megastar's team got the call in both situations. Lebron and Giannis' teams were the beneficiary.

That is interesting Nick...So not only does Bron get megastar calls his teammates are now entitled to the same calls? Perhaps the NBA should pre designate a megastar for each team for special calls, in which case Oladipo would have been Pacers megastar and would have got the call on that bang bang play. Problem solved.

Re: Did NBA agenda just show its' ugly head?
« Reply #68 on: April 19, 2018, 08:01:50 PM »

Online nickagneta

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The play where Giannis ran over Larkin at the FT line where Giannis got the call for an and one seems similar to me to the Oladipo foul after running into Korver. Which play is called right and which wrong? Both Korver and Larkin to me didn't finish setting feet but both may have established position. To me you gotta get your feet set.

I will say its a dang tough call to get right without replay.

But the megastar's team got the call in both situations. Lebron and Giannis' teams were the beneficiary.

That is interesting Nick...So not only does Bron get megastar calls his teammates are now entitled to the same calls? Perhaps the NBA should pre designate a megastar for each team for special calls, in which case Oladipo would have been Pacers megastar and would have got the call on that bang bang play. Problem solved.
When the league wants to make sure a megastar's team has a distinct advantage, then yeah, his teammates get his calls. Isn't that the whole point of this thread?

Re: Did NBA agenda just show its' ugly head?
« Reply #69 on: April 19, 2018, 11:16:41 PM »

Offline Moranis

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The NBA rule for charging doesn't require no movement only that the defender has established a legal guarding position. You can be moving and be in a straight line position in front of the offensive player. 

Re: Did NBA agenda just show its' ugly head?
« Reply #70 on: April 19, 2018, 11:19:32 PM »

Offline liam

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Re: Did NBA agenda just show its' ugly head?
« Reply #71 on: April 20, 2018, 12:25:11 AM »

Offline celticsclay

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The NBA rule for charging doesn't require no movement only that the defender has established a legal guarding position. You can be moving and be in a straight line position in front of the offensive player.
You can't have your legs three feet apart and be leaning though. Which is the whole point here.

Obviously we would have all bet our life savings you would have said it was a good call though lol

Re: Did NBA agenda just show its' ugly head?
« Reply #72 on: April 20, 2018, 03:54:04 AM »

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Re: Did NBA agenda just show its' ugly head?
« Reply #73 on: April 20, 2018, 08:48:00 AM »

Offline Moranis

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The NBA rule for charging doesn't require no movement only that the defender has established a legal guarding position. You can be moving and be in a straight line position in front of the offensive player.
You can't have your legs three feet apart and be leaning though. Which is the whole point here.

Obviously we would have all bet our life savings you would have said it was a good call though lol
You are the one that is chiding people for not knowing the rule and it seems apparent you don't know the rule as you keep changing your argument when challenged. 


a. A dribbler shall not (1) charge into an opponent who has established a legal guarding position, or (2) attempt to dribble between two opponents, or (3) attempt to dribble between an opponent and a boundary, where sufficient space is not avail-able for illegal contact to be avoided.
 b. If a defender is able to establish a legal position in the straight line path of the dribbler, the dribbler must avoid contact by changing direction or ending his dribble.
 c. The dribbler must be in control of his body at all times. If illegal contact occurs, the responsibility is on the dribbler.
 PENALTY: The offender is assessed an offensive foul. There is no team foul. The ball is awarded to the offended team on the sideline nearest the spot where play was interrupted but no nearer to the baseline than the free throw line extended.
 EXCEPTION: Rule 3--Section I--a.
 d. If a dribbler has sufficient space to have his head and shoulders in advance of his defender, the responsibility for illegal contact is on the defender.
 e. If a dribbler has established a straight line path, a defender may not crowd him out of that path.
 PENALTY: The defender shall be assessed a personal foul and a team foul. If the penalty is not in effect, the offended team is awarded the ball on the sideline nearest the spot where play was interrupted but no nearer to the baseline than the free throw line extended. If the penalty is in effect, one free throw attempt plus a penalty free throw attempt is awarded.

Re: Did NBA agenda just show its' ugly head?
« Reply #74 on: April 20, 2018, 12:36:40 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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The NBA rule for charging doesn't require no movement only that the defender has established a legal guarding position. You can be moving and be in a straight line position in front of the offensive player.
You can't have your legs three feet apart and be leaning though. Which is the whole point here.

Obviously we would have all bet our life savings you would have said it was a good call though lol
You are the one that is chiding people for not knowing the rule and it seems apparent you don't know the rule as you keep changing your argument when challenged. 


a. A dribbler shall not (1) charge into an opponent who has established a legal guarding position, or (2) attempt to dribble between two opponents, or (3) attempt to dribble between an opponent and a boundary, where sufficient space is not avail-able for illegal contact to be avoided.
 b. If a defender is able to establish a legal position in the straight line path of the dribbler, the dribbler must avoid contact by changing direction or ending his dribble.
 c. The dribbler must be in control of his body at all times. If illegal contact occurs, the responsibility is on the dribbler.
 PENALTY: The offender is assessed an offensive foul. There is no team foul. The ball is awarded to the offended team on the sideline nearest the spot where play was interrupted but no nearer to the baseline than the free throw line extended.
 EXCEPTION: Rule 3--Section I--a.
 d. If a dribbler has sufficient space to have his head and shoulders in advance of his defender, the responsibility for illegal contact is on the defender.
 e. If a dribbler has established a straight line path, a defender may not crowd him out of that path.
 PENALTY: The defender shall be assessed a personal foul and a team foul. If the penalty is not in effect, the offended team is awarded the ball on the sideline nearest the spot where play was interrupted but no nearer to the baseline than the free throw line extended. If the penalty is in effect, one free throw attempt plus a penalty free throw attempt is awarded.

So a legal position includes your legs 3 feet apart and leaning?  Funny to paste the rules that have nothing to do with that and act like you have accomplished something. If your argument is that you can spread out your legs as far as you want someone like Giannis could literally block off 90% of the paint.

In the future, if you are gonna paste a rule in at least make it address what I am saying please.