Author Topic: Can the Celtics waive their protection on the Laker pick?  (Read 2063 times)

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Re: Can the Celtics waive their protection on the Laker pick?
« Reply #15 on: April 13, 2018, 07:50:33 AM »

Offline tazzmaniac

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I know it's different, but the Blazers agreed to take the 2017 Cavs 1st instead of the 2018 one so that the Cavs could send their 2019 1st to Atlanta in the Korver trade.
I don't remember that trade adjustment.  The key part is both teams have to agree to the change and then they've got to get league approval too. 

Re: Can the Celtics waive their protection on the Laker pick?
« Reply #16 on: April 13, 2018, 08:07:06 AM »

Offline jambr380

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Almost positive that once terms of a trade have been submitted to the league office, the terms are final and complete. The only way the C's could change the terms of the trade would be to create another trade that changes the terms of the first trade.

So Boston and Philly would have to complete a trade where if the Lakers pick doesn't convey to Boston based on the terms of the original trade, the pick would convey to Boston no matter where the pick lands in exchange for....

What that exchange is would be important. My guess is it wouldn't be for just swapping the 2018 conveyance for the 2019 Sac. conveyance. Gotta remember, the Sixers could still end up with the 1st pick this year and the first pick next year. Gonna take a lot to have them give up that chance for the Cs to get the LA pick this year.

I imagine a trade would come after the lottery, in which case we would already know if it was pick #10 or a top 3 pick. Of course PHI would not deal the pick if it ended up #1, but I have to imagine they would jump at the chance to grab that SAC pick for the paltry 10th selection in this draft. This draft may seem better right now, but there is still a decent chance kids just out of high school are going to be allowed to enter next year in addition to the usual crop of rookies.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2018, 10:57:21 AM by jambr380 »

Re: Can the Celtics waive their protection on the Laker pick?
« Reply #17 on: April 13, 2018, 08:53:12 AM »

Offline Vermont Green

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If the pick is #1, Philly would keep the pick and no way they trade it.

If the pick is #2 or #3, we get the pick and wouldn't need to trade for it.

If it ends up at #10 (or near this slot), Philly could pick who we want and then we trade that player for the Sac/Philly pick that we would own at that point.

I think the logistics of this pick exchange are easy enough.  The question is which would have more value.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2018, 09:16:19 AM by Vermont Green »

Re: Can the Celtics waive their protection on the Laker pick?
« Reply #18 on: April 13, 2018, 09:36:28 AM »

Offline tonydelk

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Sure, if the Sixers agreed. In which case they would keep Sac 2019 pick. Doubt they would agree though. Interesting question.

If the pick is at 8 why would they not consider it?  Sacramento will most likely stink and be a top 5 pick next year.  I know the talent is good in this draft but after the top 6 it drops. 

Re: Can the Celtics waive their protection on the Laker pick?
« Reply #19 on: April 13, 2018, 09:40:01 AM »

Offline BringToughnessBack

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If a great enough player slides, you can be sure the Sixers will be pouncing on that. This wont matter anyway when the Lakers defy the Gods and end up in the 2nd position :)

I would hold onto Kings pick for next year and let the cards fall where they may. It is highly possible that we can draft a high school graduate in the next draft and that could mean a potential future center superstar.

Re: Can the Celtics waive their protection on the Laker pick?
« Reply #20 on: April 13, 2018, 09:48:28 AM »

Offline Vermont Green

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To clarify, the only options for the Lakers pick are the following:

Pick 1, 2, or 3:          Need to win the lottery (picked for one of first 3 picks), very slim odds
Pick 10:                    87% Chance that this is where it ends up
Pick 11, 12, or 13:     Slim odds if someone behind them wins the lottery and moves up

It is impossible for the pick to be 4-9 or 14

Re: Can the Celtics waive their protection on the Laker pick?
« Reply #21 on: April 13, 2018, 10:02:50 AM »

Offline celts55

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And to clarify a little more, if it's the first pick, Philadelphia gets to keep it.

Also, if I'm not mistaken, if Sacramento's pick next year is number one the Celtics don't get it. 
They would get the 76's pick instead. Is that correct?

Re: Can the Celtics waive their protection on the Laker pick?
« Reply #22 on: April 13, 2018, 10:11:45 AM »

Offline mef730

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Of course they could. Itís called trading our Kings pick to Philly for their Lakers pick. Nothing stopping that if Philly wanted the deal.

I'm giving you a TP because that answer was so blindingly obvious and I feel silly not having thought of it.

Mike
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Re: Can the Celtics waive their protection on the Laker pick?
« Reply #23 on: April 13, 2018, 10:51:45 AM »

Offline Roy H.

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And to clarify a little more, if it's the first pick, Philadelphia gets to keep it.

Also, if I'm not mistaken, if Sacramento's pick next year is number one the Celtics don't get it. 
They would get the 76's pick instead. Is that correct?

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Re: Can the Celtics waive their protection on the Laker pick?
« Reply #24 on: April 13, 2018, 11:31:15 AM »

Offline Ogaju

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Of course they could. Itís called trading our Kings pick to Philly for their Lakers pick. Nothing stopping that if Philly wanted the deal.

I'm giving you a TP because that answer was so blindingly obvious and I feel silly not having thought of it.

Mike

The response is an option, a viable one, but it really does not answer my question. My question does not require a trade with anyone. Anyone can make a trade, heck Danny could trade the Sacramento pick rights to any team that is willing to trade for it so today it could be flipped to Phily is a given.

My question, on the other hand, is whether the Boston protection on the Laker pick comes with a Boston option. If it does, Boston would not need Philly's consent, they would have the unfettered right to waive the protection. So who knows wether or not this option exists?

Re: Can the Celtics waive their protection on the Laker pick?
« Reply #25 on: April 13, 2018, 11:32:46 AM »

Offline celticsclay

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Almost positive that once terms of a trade have been submitted to the league office, the terms are final and complete. The only way the C's could change the terms of the trade would be to create another trade that changes the terms of the first trade.

So Boston and Philly would have to complete a trade where if the Lakers pick doesn't convey to Boston based on the terms of the original trade, the pick would convey to Boston no matter where the pick lands in exchange for....

What that exchange is would be important. My guess is it wouldn't be for just swapping the 2018 conveyance for the 2019 Sac. conveyance. Gotta remember, the Sixers could still end up with the 1st pick this year and the first pick next year. Gonna take a lot to have them give up that chance for the Cs to get the LA pick this year.

I imagine a trade would come after the lottery, in which case we would already know if it was pick #10 or a top 3 pick. Of course PHI would not deal the pick if it ended up #1, but I have to imagine they would jump at the chance to grab that SAC pick for the paltry 10th selection in this draft. This draft may seem better right now, but there is still a decent chance kids just out of high school are going to be allowed to enter next year in addition to the usual crop of rookies.

Yes. 100%. We would be incredibly stupid to trade for the 8th pick for what has a great chance of being 2-6 next year

Re: Can the Celtics waive their protection on the Laker pick?
« Reply #26 on: April 13, 2018, 11:33:05 AM »

Offline Erik

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In the current universe, the sac 19 is worth more than lal18 outright. It's not only expected to be a better number pick, the cap hit is delayed 1 year, and the draft odds restructuring happens next season. It's the Celtics that wouldn't agree to waiving protections. They never wanted lal18 unless it was 1 through 5.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2018, 11:41:51 AM by Erik »

Re: Can the Celtics waive their protection on the Laker pick?
« Reply #27 on: April 13, 2018, 11:36:53 AM »

Offline Erik

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Of course they could. Itís called trading our Kings pick to Philly for their Lakers pick. Nothing stopping that if Philly wanted the deal.

I dont think its exactly that simple. We don't own the pick to trade. We own the pick if it's 2 through 5, so we could make a conditional trade. So sac 19 OR phi19 for lal18. Not sac 19 for lal18 straight up. You can't trade for an asset now with an  asset that you may or may not own.

Re: Can the Celtics waive their protection on the Laker pick?
« Reply #28 on: April 13, 2018, 11:40:56 AM »

Online Moranis

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In the current universe, sac 19 is worth more than lal18. It's not only expected to be a better number pick, the cap hit is delayed 1 year, and the draft odds restructuring happens next season. It's the Celtics that wouldn't agree to waiving protections. They never wanted lal18 unless it was 1 through 5.
Maybe, maybe not.  Sacramento might not be terrible next year.  Or Sacramento might be so terrible they end up with the #1 pick and Boston ends up with the Sixers pick which will almost certainly be in the 20's.  Maybe, Boston, or some other team, actually wants a player in this draft and thus rates that player highly.  Maybe Boston actually wants the salary of the rookie so it can be used in a trade (i.e. Tatum, Morris, Rookie, crap filler for Leonard).  Maybe Collin Sexton, or whomever is 10th is a better prospect than Rui Hachimura, Zion Williamson, Sekou Doumbouya, Nazreon Reid, Kris Wilkes (currently projected 4-8 by nbadraft.net).  I mean nbadraft.net currently has Bruno Fernando, who is eligible for this draft, at #2 next year.  Outside of RJ Barrett, who Boston will never be able to acquire with the Sacto pick, the 2019 draft is pretty weak. 

Sometimes the player in hand is worth a lot more than the unknown player, especially with so much uncertainty as to where that unknown player is actually drafted. 
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Re: Can the Celtics waive their protection on the Laker pick?
« Reply #29 on: April 13, 2018, 11:47:24 AM »

Offline Erik

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Yeah maybe 100 different things. Not the point. In the current universe Sacramento is not projected to be better than 20th best and the Celtics are obviously trying to push out their luxury tax commitment to 2019 on the Kyrie extension. Also future draft picks are generally always worth more than a drafted player of equal perceived value due to the "depreciation" of the rookie contract. While your world may be better, it's not likely.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2018, 11:58:18 AM by Erik »