Author Topic: Can We Keep Both Smart+Rozier?  (Read 2576 times)

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Re: Can We Keep Both Smart+Rozier?
« Reply #15 on: March 17, 2018, 10:05:38 PM »

Offline Greyman

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I would love this but Honestly, I don't know if Rozier would do it...  I think someone is going to offer him a chance to start somewhere.  I can't see him passing that up.

I wouldn't have agreed with this prior to this season, TR has made me believe. The chance of being a bench player on a championship contender rather than a starter on a rebuilding team may keep him in Boston in the short term. He probably hasn't quite hit his ceiling though and I think he will get offers.

it would be great to know though that you had him for when Kyrie gets injured or will benefit from rest, which will happen during a season. He has done a great job in that capacity this season.

Re: Can We Keep Both Smart+Rozier?
« Reply #16 on: March 18, 2018, 12:35:27 PM »

Offline Phantom255x

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I'm not going to compare the two players, but it's clear they have unique skillsets and potential going forward, and I like the idea of having a back court of Kyrie, Smart (or Hayward in spurts), with Rozier being the "ideal" 6th man type guard/player who is more than capable of starting games as well in case of injuries or match ups.


Where's Jaylen Brown in this discussion?

OMG wow I'm such an idiot. TP for the catch. How the hell did I forget Jaylen in this  :P

And sorry for the late response, after making that post I was just really really busy yesterday.
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Re: Can We Keep Both Smart+Rozier?
« Reply #17 on: March 19, 2018, 11:38:22 AM »

Offline Erik

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I have '20-'21 penciled in as the start of a ~5-8 year dynasty. I'd ideally like to not go over the salary cap until then to avoid any repeater tax prior to "final form."

Hayward: 30 years old, declines player option and plays out final year in contract prior to resigning to max deal.
Irving: 28 years old, 1st year into max contract (or 2nd year into max contract)
Horford: 34 year old, some kind of low level exception
Brown: 24 years old, max extension
Tatum: 22 years old, last year in team option
Anthony Davis: 28 years old, Takes the player option and signs with us: 1st year into max contract

Anyone not listed above is not part of my future plan and should be waived or traded for draft picks  & expiring contracts unless they're willing to take a contract that keeps us under the salary cap & creates cap flexibility by 2020. I'd fill in the holes with cheap draft picks, exceptions, and high value contracts.

Once that team falls apart due to aging superstars, the rebuild happens around Brown & Tatum.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2018, 11:43:32 AM by Erik »

Re: Can We Keep Both Smart+Rozier?
« Reply #18 on: March 19, 2018, 11:46:00 AM »

Offline KGBirdBias

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I would prefer to keep Rozier over Smart. He's a good defender and a better scorer. Smart is a better defender but far less of a scorer.

Re: Can We Keep Both Smart+Rozier?
« Reply #19 on: March 19, 2018, 11:59:27 AM »

Offline CFAN38

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I would love this but Honestly, I don't know if Rozier would do it...  I think someone is going to offer him a chance to start somewhere.  I can't see him passing that up.

I agree

To answer the original post. Yes the Cs can retain both but I do not think that will be the long term plan as it will not be beneficial to the team or the players.

I agree Rozier is going to want a chance to start in the NBA. Smart is more likely to except a long term bench role as he has proven super valuable as a high minute 6th man.

I suspect DAs plan moving forward will be to try to sign Smart to a reasonable deal and after he is locked up long term star entertaining the idea of moving Rozier. The ideal situation is for Terry to be a key piece in another star trade (IE A Davis).   

Re: Can We Keep Both Smart+Rozier?
« Reply #20 on: March 19, 2018, 02:00:02 PM »

Offline KGBirdBias

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If Cousins resigns with the Pelicans, we can forget getting AD with any package. That would be the thing to keep an eye on. We have a chance if Cousins leaves.

Re: Can We Keep Both Smart+Rozier?
« Reply #21 on: March 19, 2018, 02:06:01 PM »

Offline Phantom255x

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If Cousins resigns with the Pelicans, we can forget getting AD with any package. That would be the thing to keep an eye on. We have a chance if Cousins leaves.

I know Davis ALWAYS kills us, but I'm honestly not sure if acquiring him is really the wise move going forward (long term), even if he is "made available" or Pelicans take calls sometime in the next year or two.
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Re: Can We Keep Both Smart+Rozier?
« Reply #22 on: March 19, 2018, 02:11:28 PM »

Offline tonydelk

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I would love this but Honestly, I don't know if Rozier would do it...  I think someone is going to offer him a chance to start somewhere.  I can't see him passing that up.

Rozier wants to start and if someone gives him a big contract the C's can't afford it.  Rozier is probably a trade candidate after this year.  A team would love to grab him and his bird rights.  Not sure what the C's could get but it has to be some significance.

Re: Can We Keep Both Smart+Rozier?
« Reply #23 on: March 19, 2018, 02:11:55 PM »

Offline KGs Knee

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Technically, yes they can. Practically, not likely, as doing so would add a lot of payroll (and lux tax dollars) for what will always be bench players for Boston.

It will probably be one or the other, and that most likely depends on what type of contract offers Smart receives this summer. My guess is Smart is re-signed on a deal roughly equivalent to the non-taxpayer MLE, and Ainge then try to recoup some sort of assets for Rozier next season before losing him to FA.

Re: Can We Keep Both Smart+Rozier?
« Reply #24 on: March 19, 2018, 10:10:39 PM »

Offline Phantom255x

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I would love this but Honestly, I don't know if Rozier would do it...  I think someone is going to offer him a chance to start somewhere.  I can't see him passing that up.

Rozier wants to start and if someone gives him a big contract the C's can't afford it.  Rozier is probably a trade candidate after this year.  A team would love to grab him and his bird rights.  Not sure what the C's could get but it has to be some significance.

If so, I hope we can deal Rozier for some young, cost controlled big, since I'm not sure we'll be able to keep both Monroe and Baynes after this season (we probably keep one with MLE), and we certainly could use the depth behind Horford, Theis.
2018 Mock Trade Deadline (New York Knicks)

Roster: Porzingis, Kanter, Hardaway Jr, Julius Randle, Schroder, Beasley, Alex Abrines, Jarrett Jack, Frank Ntilikina, Lance Thomas, Kyle Singler, Josh Huestis, Ron Baker, Trey Burke, Luke Kornet, Isaiah Hicks

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Re: Can We Keep Both Smart+Rozier?
« Reply #25 on: March 21, 2018, 06:22:59 PM »

Offline GRADYCOLNON

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I would love this but Honestly, I don't know if Rozier would do it...  I think someone is going to offer him a chance to start somewhere.  I can't see him passing that up.

Rozier wants to start and if someone gives him a big contract the C's can't afford it.  Rozier is probably a trade candidate after this year.  A team would love to grab him and his bird rights.  Not sure what the C's could get but it has to be some significance.

If so, I hope we can deal Rozier for some young, cost-controlled big, since I'm not sure we'll be able to keep both Monroe and Baynes after this season (we probably keep one with MLE), and we certainly could use the depth behind Horford, Theis.

We still hold Rozier's bird rights entering into negotiations with restricted.  We are expected to dip heavily into the Luxury Tax in 2019.  The team isn't going to be adding anymore talent beside thrift store finds.  Keeping Rozier seems reckless financially; however, the frugal ship sailed away when we signed two maximum stars so why not keep a rising stud.  I've previously argued that trading him this offseason would be the best way to retain his value.  But now I think trading him in 2020 would be smarter.

Signing him to a deal would involve avoiding committing too much.  Let him go if another team is going to overpay.  It is probably the only risk in this strategy.  And maybe getting stuck with his contract.  The benefit is trading him for more than just one cost-controlled asset.  He becomes a legitimate player once he is on his second contract.  In the eyes of other teams, they can sell that he has proved he belongs and deserves starting.  That means more return and a return that is deeper into this window.

Re: Can We Keep Both Smart+Rozier?
« Reply #26 on: March 21, 2018, 10:53:35 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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As much as Rozier's consistent scoring has thoroughly impressed me, his complete lack of point guard skills is keeping me from joining Team Terry, not to mention the fact that between his constantly getting picked off, and his fg%, which has fallen to .4005847..., there are still far too many times when he goes Full Rozier for my taste, lol ;D.

I'll give him credit, though, as he certainly seems to have a penchant for hitting big shots, and even though I did not want him in the 2015 draft, it was easy to see why Ainge liked the guy, given his ability to create his own shot, etc., so I tip my hat to Danny and Rozier, lol. The only question now, at least for me, is as to whether or not the latter can keep his fg% above 40% until the end of the year. Ugh.

Re: Can We Keep Both Smart+Rozier?
« Reply #27 on: March 22, 2018, 11:49:04 AM »

Offline Phantom255x

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I would love this but Honestly, I don't know if Rozier would do it...  I think someone is going to offer him a chance to start somewhere.  I can't see him passing that up.

Rozier wants to start and if someone gives him a big contract the C's can't afford it.  Rozier is probably a trade candidate after this year.  A team would love to grab him and his bird rights.  Not sure what the C's could get but it has to be some significance.

If so, I hope we can deal Rozier for some young, cost-controlled big, since I'm not sure we'll be able to keep both Monroe and Baynes after this season (we probably keep one with MLE), and we certainly could use the depth behind Horford, Theis.

We still hold Rozier's bird rights entering into negotiations with restricted.  We are expected to dip heavily into the Luxury Tax in 2019.  The team isn't going to be adding anymore talent beside thrift store finds.  Keeping Rozier seems reckless financially; however, the frugal ship sailed away when we signed two maximum stars so why not keep a rising stud.  I've previously argued that trading him this offseason would be the best way to retain his value.  But now I think trading him in 2020 would be smarter.

Signing him to a deal would involve avoiding committing too much.  Let him go if another team is going to overpay.  It is probably the only risk in this strategy.  And maybe getting stuck with his contract.  The benefit is trading him for more than just one cost-controlled asset.  He becomes a legitimate player once he is on his second contract.  In the eyes of other teams, they can sell that he has proved he belongs and deserves starting.  That means more return and a return that is deeper into this window.

We'll first have to see what happens with the C's and Smart.

If he leaves/walks, then I think keeping Rozier honestly becomes a priority.

But it will be interesting to see what happens with Rozier IF the C's keep Smart at a modest rate. I'm curious to see what Danny does in 1-2 years.
2018 Mock Trade Deadline (New York Knicks)

Roster: Porzingis, Kanter, Hardaway Jr, Julius Randle, Schroder, Beasley, Alex Abrines, Jarrett Jack, Frank Ntilikina, Lance Thomas, Kyle Singler, Josh Huestis, Ron Baker, Trey Burke, Luke Kornet, Isaiah Hicks

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Re: Can We Keep Both Smart+Rozier?
« Reply #28 on: March 22, 2018, 12:10:52 PM »

Offline Granath

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The OP asked the wrong question. It's not "can we?". That answer is yes. Both will be RFAs over the next two years and teams don't generally lose RFAs they want to hold on to.

The real question is "will we?" and I believe that answer is no.

I think Marcus' lack of shooting and self-inflicted injury has played himself out of any sizable contract this offseason. There's not that much money floating around this offseason and Marcus has really hurt his stock. Ainge isn't going to let him get away for nothing. Smart should be resigned at a reasonable value and will be the backup PG unless Ainge pulls off a sign-and-trade.

Rozier, on the other hand, is showing that he can play and the more he plays the better he gets. As a starter (in limited starts) he is averaging 17/7/6 in 36 minutes. Those are really good numbers for his current contract. The last two months, with more playing time (30mpg) and more freedom he's averaging 15.5/4.7/4 with a TS around .530. Someone is going to look at those stats and game film and believe that TR could be a guy that, if given the offensive freedom, might average close to 20/5/5 and provide some good defensive value to boot. He's be a valuable trade chip.

We all know what Ainge does with trade chips. But maybe he keeps both. I just believe that long term one of them is out the door and right now the better trade chip is Rozier. Of course, it's possible that Ainge signs Smart to a 4 year, $20m deal and trades him 3 months later.  You can't tell with Danny.
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Re: Can We Keep Both Smart+Rozier?
« Reply #29 on: March 22, 2018, 12:27:19 PM »

Offline ChillyWilly

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The OP asked the wrong question. It's not "can we?". That answer is yes. Both will be RFAs over the next two years and teams don't generally lose RFAs they want to hold on to.

The real question is "will we?" and I believe that answer is no.

I think Marcus' lack of shooting and self-inflicted injury has played himself out of any sizable contract this offseason. There's not that much money floating around this offseason and Marcus has really hurt his stock. Ainge isn't going to let him get away for nothing. Smart should be resigned at a reasonable value and will be the backup PG unless Ainge pulls off a sign-and-trade.

Rozier, on the other hand, is showing that he can play and the more he plays the better he gets. As a starter (in limited starts) he is averaging 17/7/6 in 36 minutes. Those are really good numbers for his current contract. The last two months, with more playing time (30mpg) and more freedom he's averaging 15.5/4.7/4 with a TS around .530. Someone is going to look at those stats and game film and believe that TR could be a guy that, if given the offensive freedom, might average close to 20/5/5 and provide some good defensive value to boot. He's be a valuable trade chip.

We all know what Ainge does with trade chips. But maybe he keeps both. I just believe that long term one of them is out the door and right now the better trade chip is Rozier. Of course, it's possible that Ainge signs Smart to a 4 year, $20m deal and trades him 3 months later.  You can't tell with Danny.

I'm with you on this. If Terry is moved it's because he played himself out of a reasonable contract. No way someone is paying Marcus what we thought he could get back in October. I like both of them together as they each bring something different but my bias gut says Terry still has upside while Marcus is what he is.

Who knows maybe this is Terry's peak and its the Brad effect. Either way it's nice seeing one of the 2 grow every year in an AB sort of way.
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