Fan banned forever by cavaliers for heckling Patty Mills

[Erik]

I think that the bottom line is that we don't have enough information to conclude that he's racist -- a label that is quite possibly the worst that you can put on an American, given our history. I think that we should use this word very, very selectively because of the weight that it bears.

[Moranis]

You could hear the fan scream it while Mills was shooting FT’s.  The second shot he yelled it again, I remember thinking that it wasn’t funny the first time and the second time didn’t make it magically better.  I thought it was ignorant and. It even slightly funny but I didnt find it racist.  I can definitely see why some would feel that way though.

So ban him for being lame, making a lame joke. Or ban him for yelling from certain seats. But don't accuse him of being a racist when that remark is not necessarily racial. Are you telling me his hair doesn't look legitimately bad?

so you are saying all Jamaicans have bad hair?  Or just those on the Jamaican Bobsled team?  What if the guy with the bad hair isn't Jamaican at all?

He didn't make fun of his hair, he made a comment about ethnicity and skin color, which makes it racist.  Sure there are far more offensive things he could have said, but that doesn't mean what he said wasn't racist.

Dreadlocks are a hair style closely associated with Jamaica. The comment wasn’t any deeper than that, I think.

I don't even think it's that deep.  I think it's in reference to that one guy from the movie about the Jamaican bob sled team.

He's not talking about Jamicans or bobsledders, he's talking about Doug E. Doug/Sanka Coffie, the most distintive character from a popular Disney movie.


Look the hair is even made light of on the cover art:

If somebody made a House Party joke in reference to flattop-era Nerlens Noel, is that racist? Racial? Or just a lame joke?

Or even sticking with Mills, if the heckler instead said, "Whoopie called, she wants her hair back." would that be considered racist too, since he'd only be compared to Whoopie Goldberg because he's black and has dreads?

I think there is a very big difference between saying something like Whoopi called she wants her back and what he said.  Heck even if he would have said Cool Runnings called and wants their hair back, then this is an entirely different conversation.  Heck even just mentioning his awful hair and it is different.  You are saying it is about the hair when there is nothing at all that he said that could lead you to that conclusion except for your own interpretation taking it in the best possible light, when it absolutely could have been meant in a racist way.  When there is no indication in the actual language teams should alway assume the worst and act accordingly

[Roy H.]

You could hear the fan scream it while Mills was shooting FT’s.  The second shot he yelled it again, I remember thinking that it wasn’t funny the first time and the second time didn’t make it magically better.  I thought it was ignorant and. It even slightly funny but I didnt find it racist.  I can definitely see why some would feel that way though.

So ban him for being lame, making a lame joke. Or ban him for yelling from certain seats. But don't accuse him of being a racist when that remark is not necessarily racial. Are you telling me his hair doesn't look legitimately bad?

so you are saying all Jamaicans have bad hair?  Or just those on the Jamaican Bobsled team?  What if the guy with the bad hair isn't Jamaican at all?

He didn't make fun of his hair, he made a comment about ethnicity and skin color, which makes it racist.  Sure there are far more offensive things he could have said, but that doesn't mean what he said wasn't racist.

Dreadlocks are a hair style closely associated with Jamaica. The comment wasn’t any deeper than that, I think.

I don't even think it's that deep.  I think it's in reference to that one guy from the movie about the Jamaican bob sled team.

He's not talking about Jamicans or bobsledders, he's talking about Doug E. Doug/Sanka Coffie, the most distintive character from a popular Disney movie.


Look the hair is even made light of on the cover art:

If somebody made a House Party joke in reference to flattop-era Nerlens Noel, is that racist? Racial? Or just a lame joke?

Or even sticking with Mills, if the heckler instead said, "Whoopie called, she wants her hair back." would that be considered racist too, since he'd only be compared to Whoopie Goldberg because he's black and has dreads?

I think there is a very big difference between saying something like Whoopi called she wants her back and what he said.  Heck even if he would have said Cool Runnings called and wants their hair back, then this is an entirely different conversation.  Heck even just mentioning his awful hair and it is different.  You are saying it is about the hair when there is nothing at all that he said that could lead you to that conclusion except for your own interpretation taking it in the best possible light, when it absolutely could have been meant in a racist way.  When there is no indication in the actual language teams should alway assume the worst and act accordingly

If not about hair, what do you think the comment was referring to?

I don’t even fully understand, in the worst possible interpretation, what’s racist here. Does calling a black Australian a Jamaican imply racial animus? Is that some sort of disparaging racial insult? 

But, this is 100% about the hair, I think.

[No Nickname]

You could hear the fan scream it while Mills was shooting FT’s.  The second shot he yelled it again, I remember thinking that it wasn’t funny the first time and the second time didn’t make it magically better.  I thought it was ignorant and. It even slightly funny but I didnt find it racist.  I can definitely see why some would feel that way though.

So ban him for being lame, making a lame joke. Or ban him for yelling from certain seats. But don't accuse him of being a racist when that remark is not necessarily racial. Are you telling me his hair doesn't look legitimately bad?

so you are saying all Jamaicans have bad hair?  Or just those on the Jamaican Bobsled team?  What if the guy with the bad hair isn't Jamaican at all?

He didn't make fun of his hair, he made a comment about ethnicity and skin color, which makes it racist.  Sure there are far more offensive things he could have said, but that doesn't mean what he said wasn't racist.

Dreadlocks are a hair style closely associated with Jamaica. The comment wasn’t any deeper than that, I think.

I don't even think it's that deep.  I think it's in reference to that one guy from the movie about the Jamaican bob sled team.

He's not talking about Jamicans or bobsledders, he's talking about Doug E. Doug/Sanka Coffie, the most distintive character from a popular Disney movie.


Look the hair is even made light of on the cover art:

If somebody made a House Party joke in reference to flattop-era Nerlens Noel, is that racist? Racial? Or just a lame joke?

Or even sticking with Mills, if the heckler instead said, "Whoopie called, she wants her hair back." would that be considered racist too, since he'd only be compared to Whoopie Goldberg because he's black and has dreads?

I think there is a very big difference between saying something like Whoopi called she wants her back and what he said.  Heck even if he would have said Cool Runnings called and wants their hair back, then this is an entirely different conversation.  Heck even just mentioning his awful hair and it is different.  You are saying it is about the hair when there is nothing at all that he said that could lead you to that conclusion except for your own interpretation taking it in the best possible light, when it absolutely could have been meant in a racist way.  When there is no indication in the actual language teams should alway assume the worst and act accordingly

If not about hair, what do you think the comment was referring to?

I don’t even fully understand, in the worst possible interpretation, what’s racist here. Does calling a black Australian a Jamaican imply racial animus? Is that some sort of disparaging racial insult? 

But, this is 100% about the hair, I think.

His dad is Jamaican and his mom is Aboriginal Australian. He wasn’t making fun of him because he looks Jamaican. It’s because he is half Jamaican.  Not that this is a reason to taunt anyone. But that’s how he derived his stupid taunt.

Apologies if this was mentioned in the earlier pages. Too many comments to wade through.

[bdm860]

You are saying it is about the hair when there is nothing at all that he said that could lead you to that conclusion except for your own interpretation taking it in the best possible light, when it absolutely could have been meant in a racist way.  When there is no indication in the actual language teams should alway assume the worst and act accordingly

Nothing except for the bobsled part.

I guess opinions can differ, but I would have guessed the vast majority of Americans think of Cool Runnings first when they hear Jamaican bobsledder.   It's not trying to spin this in the best possible light, it's actually the first (and only) thing I think of when I hear Jamaican bobsledder. 

But then again, before today I would have assumed everybody knew who Lurch was too.  Celticsclay proved me wrong.

[bdm860]

His dad is Jamaican and his mom is Aboriginal Australian. He wasn’t making fun of him because he looks Jamaican. It’s because he is half Jamaican.  Not that this is a reason to taunt anyone. But that’s how he derived his stupid taunt.

Apologies if this was mentioned in the earlier pages. Too many comments to wade through.

Everything I've read today about all this says otherwise.  Straight from wikipedia:  "Mills' father, Benny, is a Torres Strait Islander, and his mother, Yvonne, is an Aboriginal Australian."

And what is a Torres Strait Islander?  Again from wikipedia: "Torres Strait Islanders are the indigenous people of the Torres Strait Islands, part of Queensland, Australia. They are distinct from the Aboriginal people of the rest of Australia, and are generally referred to separately."

So no Mills is not half Jamaican.  100% Australian.

[Roy H.]

You could hear the fan scream it while Mills was shooting FT’s.  The second shot he yelled it again, I remember thinking that it wasn’t funny the first time and the second time didn’t make it magically better.  I thought it was ignorant and. It even slightly funny but I didnt find it racist.  I can definitely see why some would feel that way though.

So ban him for being lame, making a lame joke. Or ban him for yelling from certain seats. But don't accuse him of being a racist when that remark is not necessarily racial. Are you telling me his hair doesn't look legitimately bad?

so you are saying all Jamaicans have bad hair?  Or just those on the Jamaican Bobsled team?  What if the guy with the bad hair isn't Jamaican at all?

He didn't make fun of his hair, he made a comment about ethnicity and skin color, which makes it racist.  Sure there are far more offensive things he could have said, but that doesn't mean what he said wasn't racist.

Dreadlocks are a hair style closely associated with Jamaica. The comment wasn’t any deeper than that, I think.

I don't even think it's that deep.  I think it's in reference to that one guy from the movie about the Jamaican bob sled team.

He's not talking about Jamicans or bobsledders, he's talking about Doug E. Doug/Sanka Coffie, the most distintive character from a popular Disney movie.


Look the hair is even made light of on the cover art:

If somebody made a House Party joke in reference to flattop-era Nerlens Noel, is that racist? Racial? Or just a lame joke?

Or even sticking with Mills, if the heckler instead said, "Whoopie called, she wants her hair back." would that be considered racist too, since he'd only be compared to Whoopie Goldberg because he's black and has dreads?

I think there is a very big difference between saying something like Whoopi called she wants her back and what he said.  Heck even if he would have said Cool Runnings called and wants their hair back, then this is an entirely different conversation.  Heck even just mentioning his awful hair and it is different.  You are saying it is about the hair when there is nothing at all that he said that could lead you to that conclusion except for your own interpretation taking it in the best possible light, when it absolutely could have been meant in a racist way.  When there is no indication in the actual language teams should alway assume the worst and act accordingly

If not about hair, what do you think the comment was referring to?

I don’t even fully understand, in the worst possible interpretation, what’s racist here. Does calling a black Australian a Jamaican imply racial animus? Is that some sort of disparaging racial insult? 

But, this is 100% about the hair, I think.

His dad is Jamaican and his mom is Aboriginal Australian. He wasn’t making fun of him because he looks Jamaican. It’s because he is half Jamaican.  Not that this is a reason to taunt anyone. But that’s how he derived his stupid taunt.

Apologies if this was mentioned in the earlier pages. Too many comments to wade through.

His father is from the Torres Straight Islands in Australia. His mother is Aboriginal.

[KGs Knee]

When did Jamaican become a race?

The comments of this 'fan' literally cannot be racist, as nothing said was about race.

Now, maybe you could say the comments were culturally insensitive, as I suppose implying that all Jamaicans are nothing more than bobsledders seems like it fits the description of stereotyping, but that is about the extent of the derogatory nature possible here.

As for mistaking his identity as Jamaican, when Mills is in fact a Pacific Islander, I'm not sure that qualifies as any type of derogatory remark.  Not unless its being used in a way to imply Jamaicans are somehow inferior, which I don't think that was what happened here.  It's probably rather ignorant, however.

[Moranis]

You could hear the fan scream it while Mills was shooting FT’s.  The second shot he yelled it again, I remember thinking that it wasn’t funny the first time and the second time didn’t make it magically better.  I thought it was ignorant and. It even slightly funny but I didnt find it racist.  I can definitely see why some would feel that way though.

So ban him for being lame, making a lame joke. Or ban him for yelling from certain seats. But don't accuse him of being a racist when that remark is not necessarily racial. Are you telling me his hair doesn't look legitimately bad?

so you are saying all Jamaicans have bad hair?  Or just those on the Jamaican Bobsled team?  What if the guy with the bad hair isn't Jamaican at all?

He didn't make fun of his hair, he made a comment about ethnicity and skin color, which makes it racist.  Sure there are far more offensive things he could have said, but that doesn't mean what he said wasn't racist.

Dreadlocks are a hair style closely associated with Jamaica. The comment wasn’t any deeper than that, I think.

I don't even think it's that deep.  I think it's in reference to that one guy from the movie about the Jamaican bob sled team.

He's not talking about Jamicans or bobsledders, he's talking about Doug E. Doug/Sanka Coffie, the most distintive character from a popular Disney movie.


Look the hair is even made light of on the cover art:

If somebody made a House Party joke in reference to flattop-era Nerlens Noel, is that racist? Racial? Or just a lame joke?

Or even sticking with Mills, if the heckler instead said, "Whoopie called, she wants her hair back." would that be considered racist too, since he'd only be compared to Whoopie Goldberg because he's black and has dreads?

I think there is a very big difference between saying something like Whoopi called she wants her back and what he said.  Heck even if he would have said Cool Runnings called and wants their hair back, then this is an entirely different conversation.  Heck even just mentioning his awful hair and it is different.  You are saying it is about the hair when there is nothing at all that he said that could lead you to that conclusion except for your own interpretation taking it in the best possible light, when it absolutely could have been meant in a racist way.  When there is no indication in the actual language teams should alway assume the worst and act accordingly

If not about hair, what do you think the comment was referring to?

I don’t even fully understand, in the worst possible interpretation, what’s racist here. Does calling a black Australian a Jamaican imply racial animus? Is that some sort of disparaging racial insult? 

But, this is 100% about the hair, I think.

I have no idea what it is about. Probably the hair but that still makes the comment highly offensive if not racist i, in and of itself since he implies Jamaican bobsledders have terrible hair, which they don't . I mean I just watched the Winter Olympics with a Jamaican Bobsled team.  I didn't see them having awful hair cuts.

[Celtics4ever]

Quote
When did Jamaican become a race?

Race of all should be human....

[jaketwice]

So it seems people are drawing distinctions between:

Racist: “I dislike Patty Mills because he’s Black and has dreads”

Bigoted: “I am going to mock Patty Mills because he’s Black and has dreads”

Ignorant: “Patty Mills is Black and has dreads, he must be from Jamaica”

I think regardless of how you categorize the incident, there’s no place for it in a public setting.

...or, Patty Mills, a man who plays basketball, has an ugly haircut.

Is his hair immune from criticism because of his race? I don't think his publicist should be! Patty, what are you doing To your brand?

[Roy H.]

I mean I just watched the Winter Olympics with a Jamaican Bobsled team.  I didn't see them having awful hair cuts.

Maybe they’re hiding the bad hair under their hats.

[Eja117]

I don't think it's racist. I think it's pretty ignorant and bigoted but not racist. Either way I think the appropriate action was taken.

Many of us plebe readers may read this as a distinction without a difference. Care to expound?

I don’t know that it’s racist or bigoted. It’s using the guy’s hair to heckle him. Being called “Jamaican” isn’t a slur, it’s a reference to dreads.  This may be racial, but it’s not necessarily racist.

Is it any different than calling a tall white guy Lurch?

I think Scal has been called some weird stuff too. I don't know if I call it racist, but I wouldn't want my kid getting the idea it's ok to heckle strangers over their possibly cultural hair.
Maybe just ban him for being an idiotic jerk. 

[celticsclay]

I mean I just watched the Winter Olympics with a Jamaican Bobsled team.  I didn't see them having awful hair cuts.

Maybe they’re hiding the bad hair under their hats.

Lol. I agree that this is him making fun of the hair. I don't know how good or bad that is, but I do think acting like this is some vile racist thing is overblowing it.

[sahara]

This seems about as offensive as someone would heckle Jonas Jerebko to make some Karelian Stew.

- A Karelian since at least 1620 (Official documents won´t go any further than that)