Fan banned forever by cavaliers for heckling Patty Mills

[Atzar]

This is an overreaction, IMHO. 

I think people need to differentiate between hate speech and a bad joke.  This was the latter to me.  Crass?  Sure.  Hateful or discriminatory?  I don't see it.  This doesn't feel like an offense worthy of an indefinite ban to me.  Strikes me as an organization making an example of somebody in order to be seen as proactive and progressive. 

[Moranis]

You could hear the fan scream it while Mills was shooting FT’s.  The second shot he yelled it again, I remember thinking that it wasn’t funny the first time and the second time didn’t make it magically better.  I thought it was ignorant and. It even slightly funny but I didnt find it racist.  I can definitely see why some would feel that way though.

So ban him for being lame, making a lame joke. Or ban him for yelling from certain seats. But don't accuse him of being a racist when that remark is not necessarily racial. Are you telling me his hair doesn't look legitimately bad?

so you are saying all Jamaicans have bad hair?  Or just those on the Jamaican Bobsled team?  What if the guy with the bad hair isn't Jamaican at all?

He didn't make fun of his hair, he made a comment about ethnicity and skin color, which makes it racist.  Sure there are far more offensive things he could have said, but that doesn't mean what he said wasn't racist.

[Erik]

I don't think it's racist. I think it's pretty ignorant and bigoted but not racist. Either way I think the appropriate action was taken.

Many of us plebe readers may read this as a distinction without a difference. Care to expound?

If I understand things correctly, a bigot is a very broad term of someone who is intolerant to someone else's opinions, beliefs or lifestyle. It could be very minor (a lot of liberals and conservatives are bigoted towards each other) or major such as a racist. It could encompass sexist, homophobe, xenophobe, etc. It's a very broad term. You could call someone who is sexist but not a homophobe, xenophone or a racist a bigot. I think you only need to check at least one box to qualify.

[Moranis]

I don't think it's racist. I think it's pretty ignorant and bigoted but not racist. Either way I think the appropriate action was taken.

Many of us plebe readers may read this as a distinction without a difference. Care to expound?

If I understand things correctly, a bigot is a very broad term of someone who is intolerant to someone else's opinions, beliefs or lifestyle. It could be very minor (a lot of liberals and conservatives are bigoted towards each other) or major such as a racist. It could encompass sexist, homophobe, xenophobe, etc. It's a very broad term. You could call someone who is sexist but not a homophobe, xenophone or a racist a bigot. I think you only need to check at least one box to qualify.

well yeah, but how could this particular comment be perceived as bigoted but not racist.  I think that was the point he was getting at.

[Roy H.]

You could hear the fan scream it while Mills was shooting FT’s.  The second shot he yelled it again, I remember thinking that it wasn’t funny the first time and the second time didn’t make it magically better.  I thought it was ignorant and. It even slightly funny but I didnt find it racist.  I can definitely see why some would feel that way though.

So ban him for being lame, making a lame joke. Or ban him for yelling from certain seats. But don't accuse him of being a racist when that remark is not necessarily racial. Are you telling me his hair doesn't look legitimately bad?

so you are saying all Jamaicans have bad hair?  Or just those on the Jamaican Bobsled team?  What if the guy with the bad hair isn't Jamaican at all?

He didn't make fun of his hair, he made a comment about ethnicity and skin color, which makes it racist.  Sure there are far more offensive things he could have said, but that doesn't mean what he said wasn't racist.

Dreadlocks are a hair style closely associated with Jamaica. The comment wasn’t any deeper than that, I think.

If somebody made a House Party joke in reference to flattop-era Nerlens Noel, is that racist? Racial? Or just a lame joke?

[Jiri Welsch]

So it seems people are drawing distinctions between:

Racist: “I dislike Patty Mills because he’s Black and has dreads”

Bigoted: “I am going to mock Patty Mills because he’s Black and has dreads”

Ignorant: “Patty Mills is Black and has dreads, he must be from Jamaica”

I think regardless of how you categorize the incident, there’s no place for it in a public setting.

[Roy H.]

So it seems people are drawing distinctions between:

Racist: “I dislike Patty Mills because he’s Black and has dreads”

Bigoted: “I am going to mock Patty Mills because he’s Black and has dreads”

Ignorant: “Patty Mills is Black and has dreads, he must be from Jamaica”

I think regardless of how you categorize the incident, there’s no place for it in a public setting.

Or immature: I feel the need to be loud and obnoxious, so I’m going to yell at this guy for his hair.

I don’t think he’s actually confused about Mills being Jamaican.

Would “Hey, Mills, you smell like patchouli oil have been more or less racist? Racial? Bigoted? Ignorant?

I do agree that loud comments like this should be shouted at games. I’m pretty much anti-heckling in games.

[celticsclay]

I don't think it's racist. I think it's pretty ignorant and bigoted but not racist. Either way I think the appropriate action was taken.

Many of us plebe readers may read this as a distinction without a difference. Care to expound?

I don’t know that it’s racist or bigoted. It’s using the guy’s hair to heckle him. Being called “Jamaican” isn’t a slur, it’s a reference to dreads.  This may be racial, but it’s not necessarily racist.

Is it any different than calling a tall white guy Lurch?

What is this? I have never heard this in my life but it sounds like an interesting term and story...

Ha!  I'm not sure anyone under 30 will get the reference.  Nice job, Roy! 

Addams Family.

Haha. It’s sad when the culture you grew up with becomes dated. I grew up playing an Atari on a black and white TV in my room.

Here’s Dirk in Lurch costume:

I am 35 and remember the show/movies being popular, but don't think I ever knew the guys name (or have forgotten it). So maybe feel bad. I also briefly had an atari but was more regular nintendo.

[bdm860]

You could hear the fan scream it while Mills was shooting FT’s.  The second shot he yelled it again, I remember thinking that it wasn’t funny the first time and the second time didn’t make it magically better.  I thought it was ignorant and. It even slightly funny but I didnt find it racist.  I can definitely see why some would feel that way though.

So ban him for being lame, making a lame joke. Or ban him for yelling from certain seats. But don't accuse him of being a racist when that remark is not necessarily racial. Are you telling me his hair doesn't look legitimately bad?

so you are saying all Jamaicans have bad hair?  Or just those on the Jamaican Bobsled team?  What if the guy with the bad hair isn't Jamaican at all?

He didn't make fun of his hair, he made a comment about ethnicity and skin color, which makes it racist.  Sure there are far more offensive things he could have said, but that doesn't mean what he said wasn't racist.

Dreadlocks are a hair style closely associated with Jamaica. The comment wasn’t any deeper than that, I think.

I don't even think it's that deep.  I think it's in reference to that one guy from the movie about the Jamaican bob sled team.

He's not talking about Jamicans or bobsledders, he's talking about Doug E. Doug/Sanka Coffie, the most distintive character from a popular Disney movie.


Look the hair is even made light of on the cover art:

If somebody made a House Party joke in reference to flattop-era Nerlens Noel, is that racist? Racial? Or just a lame joke?

Or even sticking with Mills, if the heckler instead said, "Whoopie called, she wants her hair back." would that be considered racist too, since he'd only be compared to Whoopie Goldberg because he's black and has dreads?

[coffee425]

Couldnt be more excited to see this fan suspension.

Just because you paid for a ticket doesn't give you the right to yell derogatory phrases or run up onto the court (russell westbrook).

I will always side for players over fans.

[libermaniac]

You could hear the fan scream it while Mills was shooting FT’s.  The second shot he yelled it again, I remember thinking that it wasn’t funny the first time and the second time didn’t make it magically better.  I thought it was ignorant and. It even slightly funny but I didnt find it racist.  I can definitely see why some would feel that way though.

So ban him for being lame, making a lame joke. Or ban him for yelling from certain seats. But don't accuse him of being a racist when that remark is not necessarily racial. Are you telling me his hair doesn't look legitimately bad?

so you are saying all Jamaicans have bad hair?  Or just those on the Jamaican Bobsled team?  What if the guy with the bad hair isn't Jamaican at all?

He didn't make fun of his hair, he made a comment about ethnicity and skin color, which makes it racist.  Sure there are far more offensive things he could have said, but that doesn't mean what he said wasn't racist.

Dreadlocks are a hair style closely associated with Jamaica. The comment wasn’t any deeper than that, I think.

If somebody made a House Party joke in reference to flattop-era Nerlens Noel, is that racist? Racial? Or just a lame joke?

I tend to be very liberal, but I agree with Roy on this.  We are making way too big of a deal out of this.  It can certainly be perceived as racist when you go hunting for it, but I think Roy's Lurch comments are spot-on.

[green_bballers13]

I wonder if this would have been an issue if the TV broadcast did not carry it.

[Roy H.]

I wonder if this would have been an issue if the TV broadcast did not carry it.

Maybe moreso, because players heard it and interpreted it as “Jamaican dog”.

[celticsclay]

You could hear the fan scream it while Mills was shooting FT’s.  The second shot he yelled it again, I remember thinking that it wasn’t funny the first time and the second time didn’t make it magically better.  I thought it was ignorant and. It even slightly funny but I didnt find it racist.  I can definitely see why some would feel that way though.

So ban him for being lame, making a lame joke. Or ban him for yelling from certain seats. But don't accuse him of being a racist when that remark is not necessarily racial. Are you telling me his hair doesn't look legitimately bad?

so you are saying all Jamaicans have bad hair?  Or just those on the Jamaican Bobsled team?  What if the guy with the bad hair isn't Jamaican at all?

He didn't make fun of his hair, he made a comment about ethnicity and skin color, which makes it racist.  Sure there are far more offensive things he could have said, but that doesn't mean what he said wasn't racist.

Dreadlocks are a hair style closely associated with Jamaica. The comment wasn’t any deeper than that, I think.

If somebody made a House Party joke in reference to flattop-era Nerlens Noel, is that racist? Racial? Or just a lame joke?

I tend to be very liberal, but I agree with Roy on this.  We are making way too big of a deal out of this.  It can certainly be perceived as racist when you go hunting for it, but I think Roy's Lurch comments are spot-on.

This is probably where i am falling too

[GRADYCOLNON]

I never like it when Americans are banned from attending a sporting event.  The way prices have gone, paying those prices means you need flush only adds to the insult.

I'm not a fan of how sports leagues have pushed its diehard fans out to sitting at home watching on a computer or TV.  Those diehards have used sports for generations to escape the realities of the real world.  The general assault on that culture is because there is an overemphasis on bringing in new viewers.  It's a money grab and a disservice to the lifers.  One of the major reasons why they don't want hecklers anymore is the league wants to make this a safe space for parents to bring their kids.  I get it.  Parents are big money source.  Still, it cheapens the overall liveliness of sports, and I think we are going to regret it. 

As for protecting players, what is the point of a homecourt advantage?  Also, are we so sensitive to think being called a Jamaican is a racial slur?  They have a long history good culture.  I get it, it was how the guy was implying it, but isn't our responsibility to control how words offend us?