Author Topic: Gun Control?  (Read 19916 times)

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Re: Gun Control?
« Reply #105 on: February 16, 2018, 04:40:15 PM »

Online nickagneta

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Grouping semi-automatic killing machines with handguns and rifles makes no sense to me.

They are more like tanks in terms of their impact.  Why doesn't NRA want tanks to be as available as AR-15s?

Most rifles and handguns are semi-automatic. Anything that uses a magazine is fairly similar in its firing mechanism, and thus it’s killing capacity.

For instance, a Glock 9mm can fire a 33 round magazine in approximately 3 seconds.

Correct. I mean you do have single action/double action which reduces firing time, but yeah, in a nutshell it's the same.

Obviously an AR causes more damage and is a more efficient tool in mass shootings, but handguns are responsible for many more deaths due to it's concealment.
Handguns are definitely a bigger problem in this country than assault rifles.

Re: Gun Control?
« Reply #106 on: February 16, 2018, 04:47:31 PM »

Offline Eddie20

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Gun control would have done nothing to prevent the vegas , florida school mass murders

These killers had no previous criminal records.

Well how about then prevent sale to people with known mental problems?  What if a gun owner develops mental issues after owning a gun?

Bumper stocks should have been automatically banned after the Vegas shooting. But the NRA opposed for whatever bs reason as usual.
Semi automatics are still here. And weapons are getting fancier and more advanced

Only real solution is to ban guns outright.

This solution assumes that banned guns = people don't have guns.

Would you ban all guns on domestic, civilian lands? Like no police or military weapons? They shouldn't need them if guns are banned for everyone else.

No.  Purpose of gun ownership for police and military would be different.   I would still allows hunters to rent guns as well.

You want to protect your house from thieves? Buy a guard dog instead.

Ok, how about licensed security guards? Particularly those that work in banks, hospitals, operate Brinks trucks, etc.? What about when an officer retires? Should he have to give up his weapon even though the track record has been exemplary throughout his career? Same goes for miltary personnel, but how about reservists? Do you see the slippery slope you get into?

This dog notion really needs to stop. Baiting a dog with meat and then locking him up happens more routinely that you might think. Also, what constitutes a "guard dog"? Does that mean a big dog or one trained by credible K9 type schools? What if the dog you purchased doesn't have the disposition for protecting property? Do you keep purchasing dogs until one is ideal for your needs? I'm sure PETA would be very supportive of an idea that would cause the numbers of dogs to enter facilities for euthanasia to increase exponentially.

Re: Gun Control?
« Reply #107 on: February 16, 2018, 04:52:40 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Quote
The Second Amendment is designed to prevent government tyranny. But in reality, small arms (even assault weapons) are going to have no effect against government forces. A machine gun doesn't matter against napalm or planes with missiles.

I tell this to people all the time and I am a veteran with combat arms experience.   All the AR-15s in the world would be little help against a M-1 Abrahms tank or an Apache or Cobra helicopter.   The days of minute men over throwing the government are long gone.  How about a scout laser ginding a Joint Direct Attack Munition from F-22 Raptor and the M61A2 Vulcan 20 mm rotary cannon.

So it should be clear the military edge sides with the government.   Not to mention Billy Bob Redneck would pee his pants if faced with military ordinance today.   Our civilian populace is pretty soft, too.   There is no safety space on the battlefield.

Quote
How long would it take you to fire off 33 bullets? 10 seconds? 15?

Most people should be able to get shot-to-shot splits at about 0.20 seconds, easy. I think I've done some 0.12 second splits with my Ruger 10-22. Assuming it takes 0.4 seconds for the first trigger pull, then 29 additional 0.15 second splits, that's about 4.7 seconds for a 30 round mag.  You won't be accurate but if the people are densely packed does it matter.   

One bullet from an AR-15 can go through several people folks.  Movies often show car doors blowing them but that is wishful thinking folks.  Penetration of US steel helmet through one side at 500 yards.  Penetration of .135-inch steel plate at 500 yards.  Look at how many boards the round plowed through here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAOW59Ck9LU

Additionally, this round tumbles and causes massive damage and hydrostatic shock

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dr7dpEDNNC4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPzxBJSIaGA

This means if you watch those that is makes a huge space of damage within the human body.   Like an 8" long by 3" wide cavity of damage.

Quote
Handguns are definitely a bigger problem in this country than assault rifles.

Definitely, easier to hide and more likely to be used in anger.   Just look at poor Chicago.

FBI was warned about this guy and didn't follow protocol, too.

Quote
The FBI said Friday that it failed to follow "protocols" when it received a tip earlier this year about the teenager accused of killing 17 in a mass shooting at a South Florida high school.

In January, person close to the accused shooter, 19-year old Nikolas Cruz, called the FBI's public tipline and raised concerns about his gun ownership, desire to kill and warned of a possible school shooting.

But the FBI never reported the tip to its Miami field office or investigated the claim, the bureau said Friday.

"Under established protocols, the information provided by the caller should have been assessed as a potential threat to life," the FBI said in a statement. "The information then should have been forwarded to the FBI Miami field office, where appropriate investigative steps would have been taken.

"We have determined that these protocols were not followed for the information received by the [Public Access Line] on January 5. The information was not provided to the Miami field office, and no further investigation was conducted at that time."

http://thehill.com/homenews/news/374231-fbi-did-not-act-on-tip-warning-of-high-school-shooter

Which made this whole thing preventable....
« Last Edit: February 16, 2018, 05:00:18 PM by Celtics4ever »

Re: Gun Control?
« Reply #108 on: February 16, 2018, 05:00:45 PM »

Offline Eddie20

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The Second Amendment is designed to prevent government tyranny. But in reality, small arms (even assault weapons) are going to have no effect against government forces. A machine gun doesn't matter against napalm or planes with missiles.

I tell this to people all the time and I am a veteran with combat arms experience.   All the AR-15s in the world would be little help against a M-1 Abrahms tank or an Apache or Cobra helicopter.   The days of minute men over throwing the government are long gone.  How about a scout laser ginding a Joint Direct Attack Munition from F-22 Raptor and the M61A2 Vulcan 20 mm rotary cannon.

So it should be clear the military edge sides with the government.   Not to mention Billy Bob Redneck would pee his pants if faced with military ordinance today.   Our civilian populace is pretty soft, too.   There is no safety space on the battlefield.

Quote
How long would it take you to fire off 33 bullets? 10 seconds? 15?

Most people should be able to get shot-to-shot splits at about 0.20 seconds, easy. I think I've done some 0.12 second splits with my Ruger 10-22. Assuming it takes 0.4 seconds for the first trigger pull, then 29 additional 0.15 second splits, that's about 4.7 seconds for a 30 round mag.  You won't be accurate but if the people are densely packed does it matter.   

One bullet from an AR-15 can go through several people folks.  Movies often show car doors blowing them but that is wishful thinking folks.  Penetration of US steel helmet through one side at 500 yards.  Penetration of .135-inch steel plate at 500 yards.  Look at how many boards the round plowed through here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAOW59Ck9LU

Additionally, this round tumbles and causes massive damage and hydrostatic shock

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dr7dpEDNNC4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPzxBJSIaGA

This means if you watch those that is makes a huge space of damage within the human body.   Like an 8" long by 3" wide cavity of damage.


Quote
Handguns are definitely a bigger problem in this country than assault rifles.

Definitely, easier to hide and more likely to be used in anger.   Just look at poor Chicago.

Especially when using 223 hollow point rounds

Re: Gun Control?
« Reply #109 on: February 16, 2018, 05:14:17 PM »

Offline liam

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Gun control would have done nothing to prevent the vegas , florida school mass murders

These killers had no previous criminal records.

Well how about then prevent sale to people with known mental problems?  What if a gun owner develops mental issues after owning a gun?

Bumper stocks should have been automatically banned after the Vegas shooting. But the NRA opposed for whatever bs reason as usual.
Semi automatics are still here. And weapons are getting fancier and more advanced

Only real solution is to ban guns outright.

This solution assumes that banned guns = people don't have guns.

Would you ban all guns on domestic, civilian lands? Like no police or military weapons? They shouldn't need them if guns are banned for everyone else.

No.  Purpose of gun ownership for police and military would be different.   I would still allows hunters to rent guns as well.

You want to protect your house from thieves? Buy a guard dog instead.

Ok, how about licensed security guards? Particularly those that work in banks, hospitals, operate Brinks trucks, etc.? What about when an officer retires? Should he have to give up his weapon even though the track record has been exemplary throughout his career? Same goes for miltary personnel, but how about reservists? Do you see the slippery slope you get into?

This dog notion really needs to stop. Baiting a dog with meat and then locking him up happens more routinely that you might think. Also, what constitutes a "guard dog"? Does that mean a big dog or one trained by credible K9 type schools? What if the dog you purchased doesn't have the disposition for protecting property? Do you keep purchasing dogs until one is ideal for your needs? I'm sure PETA would be very supportive of an idea that would cause the numbers of dogs to enter facilities for euthanasia to increase exponentially.

Buy a Doberman or a German Shepard, they are breed to be guard dogs. I have been around dogs my whole life and have never seen or heard of one being bated into a cage. That seems like something from a cartoon. My dogs and all the dogs of people I know have protected their owners and property every time it has come in to question. I have also owned guns and have never had to use them on anyone. No one wants to enter a property with a dog or dogs patrolling it. Have you ever owned a dog? Mine would and have protected me with there lives.

Re: Gun Control?
« Reply #110 on: February 16, 2018, 05:17:36 PM »

Offline triboy16f

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Ind states can start adopting Isaraels school protection policy

No fed approval required.

Main doors are locked during class.

Re: Gun Control?
« Reply #111 on: February 16, 2018, 05:22:23 PM »

Offline Eddie20

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Gun control would have done nothing to prevent the vegas , florida school mass murders

These killers had no previous criminal records.

Well how about then prevent sale to people with known mental problems?  What if a gun owner develops mental issues after owning a gun?

Bumper stocks should have been automatically banned after the Vegas shooting. But the NRA opposed for whatever bs reason as usual.
Semi automatics are still here. And weapons are getting fancier and more advanced

Only real solution is to ban guns outright.

This solution assumes that banned guns = people don't have guns.

Would you ban all guns on domestic, civilian lands? Like no police or military weapons? They shouldn't need them if guns are banned for everyone else.

No.  Purpose of gun ownership for police and military would be different.   I would still allows hunters to rent guns as well.

You want to protect your house from thieves? Buy a guard dog instead.

Ok, how about licensed security guards? Particularly those that work in banks, hospitals, operate Brinks trucks, etc.? What about when an officer retires? Should he have to give up his weapon even though the track record has been exemplary throughout his career? Same goes for miltary personnel, but how about reservists? Do you see the slippery slope you get into?

This dog notion really needs to stop. Baiting a dog with meat and then locking him up happens more routinely that you might think. Also, what constitutes a "guard dog"? Does that mean a big dog or one trained by credible K9 type schools? What if the dog you purchased doesn't have the disposition for protecting property? Do you keep purchasing dogs until one is ideal for your needs? I'm sure PETA would be very supportive of an idea that would cause the numbers of dogs to enter facilities for euthanasia to increase exponentially.

Buy a Doberman or a German Shepard, they are breed to be guard dogs. I have been around dogs my whole life and have never seen or heard of one being bated into a cage. That seems like something from a cartoon. My dogs and all the dogs of people I know have protected their owners and property every time it has come in to question. I have also owned guns and have never had to use them on anyone. No one wants to enter a property with a dog or dogs patrolling it. Have you ever owned a dog? Mine would and have protected me with there lives.

Have had dogs my entire life.

I'm sure you've never heard of it because why would MO ever be publicized, but it's reality. Just like a taser on a dog. You use that on dog and it's completely done. Once the 5 second cycle is off, he runs and hides. The most vicious of dog turns into a complete lamb. It's crazy to see.

Re: Gun Control?
« Reply #112 on: February 16, 2018, 05:32:35 PM »

Offline liam

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Gun control would have done nothing to prevent the vegas , florida school mass murders

These killers had no previous criminal records.

Well how about then prevent sale to people with known mental problems?  What if a gun owner develops mental issues after owning a gun?

Bumper stocks should have been automatically banned after the Vegas shooting. But the NRA opposed for whatever bs reason as usual.
Semi automatics are still here. And weapons are getting fancier and more advanced

Only real solution is to ban guns outright.

This solution assumes that banned guns = people don't have guns.

Would you ban all guns on domestic, civilian lands? Like no police or military weapons? They shouldn't need them if guns are banned for everyone else.

No.  Purpose of gun ownership for police and military would be different.   I would still allows hunters to rent guns as well.

You want to protect your house from thieves? Buy a guard dog instead.

Ok, how about licensed security guards? Particularly those that work in banks, hospitals, operate Brinks trucks, etc.? What about when an officer retires? Should he have to give up his weapon even though the track record has been exemplary throughout his career? Same goes for miltary personnel, but how about reservists? Do you see the slippery slope you get into?

This dog notion really needs to stop. Baiting a dog with meat and then locking him up happens more routinely that you might think. Also, what constitutes a "guard dog"? Does that mean a big dog or one trained by credible K9 type schools? What if the dog you purchased doesn't have the disposition for protecting property? Do you keep purchasing dogs until one is ideal for your needs? I'm sure PETA would be very supportive of an idea that would cause the numbers of dogs to enter facilities for euthanasia to increase exponentially.

Buy a Doberman or a German Shepard, they are breed to be guard dogs. I have been around dogs my whole life and have never seen or heard of one being bated into a cage. That seems like something from a cartoon. My dogs and all the dogs of people I know have protected their owners and property every time it has come in to question. I have also owned guns and have never had to use them on anyone. No one wants to enter a property with a dog or dogs patrolling it. Have you ever owned a dog? Mine would and have protected me with there lives.

Have had dogs my entire life.

I'm sure you've never heard of it because why would MO ever be publicized, but it's reality. Just like a taser on a dog. You use that on dog and it's completely done. Once the 5 second cycle is off, he runs and hides. The most vicious of dog turns into a complete lamb. It's crazy to see.

What are you doing tasering your dog? You're dogs are ****es, mine aren't.... Your taser would just make my dogs mad.How you going to taser 10 dogs? What do you have some Pomeranians?

Re: Gun Control?
« Reply #113 on: February 16, 2018, 05:34:52 PM »

Offline liam

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Gun control would have done nothing to prevent the vegas , florida school mass murders

These killers had no previous criminal records.

Well how about then prevent sale to people with known mental problems?  What if a gun owner develops mental issues after owning a gun?

Bumper stocks should have been automatically banned after the Vegas shooting. But the NRA opposed for whatever bs reason as usual.
Semi automatics are still here. And weapons are getting fancier and more advanced

Only real solution is to ban guns outright.

This solution assumes that banned guns = people don't have guns.

Would you ban all guns on domestic, civilian lands? Like no police or military weapons? They shouldn't need them if guns are banned for everyone else.

No.  Purpose of gun ownership for police and military would be different.   I would still allows hunters to rent guns as well.

You want to protect your house from thieves? Buy a guard dog instead.

Ok, how about licensed security guards? Particularly those that work in banks, hospitals, operate Brinks trucks, etc.? What about when an officer retires? Should he have to give up his weapon even though the track record has been exemplary throughout his career? Same goes for miltary personnel, but how about reservists? Do you see the slippery slope you get into?

This dog notion really needs to stop. Baiting a dog with meat and then locking him up happens more routinely that you might think. Also, what constitutes a "guard dog"? Does that mean a big dog or one trained by credible K9 type schools? What if the dog you purchased doesn't have the disposition for protecting property? Do you keep purchasing dogs until one is ideal for your needs? I'm sure PETA would be very supportive of an idea that would cause the numbers of dogs to enter facilities for euthanasia to increase exponentially.

Buy a Doberman or a German Shepard, they are breed to be guard dogs. I have been around dogs my whole life and have never seen or heard of one being bated into a cage. That seems like something from a cartoon. My dogs and all the dogs of people I know have protected their owners and property every time it has come in to question. I have also owned guns and have never had to use them on anyone. No one wants to enter a property with a dog or dogs patrolling it. Have you ever owned a dog? Mine would and have protected me with there lives.

Have had dogs my entire life.

I'm sure you've never heard of it because why would MO ever be publicized, but it's reality. Just like a taser on a dog. You use that on dog and it's completely done. Once the 5 second cycle is off, he runs and hides. The most vicious of dog turns into a complete lamb. It's crazy to see.

Why are you tasering your dogs?

Re: Gun Control?
« Reply #114 on: February 16, 2018, 05:39:25 PM »

Offline Eddie20

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Gun control would have done nothing to prevent the vegas , florida school mass murders

These killers had no previous criminal records.

Well how about then prevent sale to people with known mental problems?  What if a gun owner develops mental issues after owning a gun?

Bumper stocks should have been automatically banned after the Vegas shooting. But the NRA opposed for whatever bs reason as usual.
Semi automatics are still here. And weapons are getting fancier and more advanced

Only real solution is to ban guns outright.

This solution assumes that banned guns = people don't have guns.

Would you ban all guns on domestic, civilian lands? Like no police or military weapons? They shouldn't need them if guns are banned for everyone else.

No.  Purpose of gun ownership for police and military would be different.   I would still allows hunters to rent guns as well.

You want to protect your house from thieves? Buy a guard dog instead.

Ok, how about licensed security guards? Particularly those that work in banks, hospitals, operate Brinks trucks, etc.? What about when an officer retires? Should he have to give up his weapon even though the track record has been exemplary throughout his career? Same goes for miltary personnel, but how about reservists? Do you see the slippery slope you get into?

This dog notion really needs to stop. Baiting a dog with meat and then locking him up happens more routinely that you might think. Also, what constitutes a "guard dog"? Does that mean a big dog or one trained by credible K9 type schools? What if the dog you purchased doesn't have the disposition for protecting property? Do you keep purchasing dogs until one is ideal for your needs? I'm sure PETA would be very supportive of an idea that would cause the numbers of dogs to enter facilities for euthanasia to increase exponentially.

Buy a Doberman or a German Shepard, they are breed to be guard dogs. I have been around dogs my whole life and have never seen or heard of one being bated into a cage. That seems like something from a cartoon. My dogs and all the dogs of people I know have protected their owners and property every time it has come in to question. I have also owned guns and have never had to use them on anyone. No one wants to enter a property with a dog or dogs patrolling it. Have you ever owned a dog? Mine would and have protected me with there lives.

Have had dogs my entire life.

I'm sure you've never heard of it because why would MO ever be publicized, but it's reality. Just like a taser on a dog. You use that on dog and it's completely done. Once the 5 second cycle is off, he runs and hides. The most vicious of dog turns into a complete lamb. It's crazy to see.

What are you doing tasering your dog? You're dogs are ****es, mine aren't.... Your taser would just make my dogs mad.How you going to taser 10 dogs? What do you have some Pomeranians?

Who said I've tasered my dog? Why on earth would anyone do that?

I know you don't want to believe me because dogs often provide a false sense of security when individuals overestimate their abilities. That's cool. This though is the reaction I've always seen.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=d-Itfr_V424

Oh and I've had all types of dogs from Rott's to Amstaff's.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2018, 05:48:17 PM by Eddie20 »

Re: Gun Control?
« Reply #115 on: February 16, 2018, 05:51:49 PM »

Offline liam

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Gun control would have done nothing to prevent the vegas , florida school mass murders

These killers had no previous criminal records.

Well how about then prevent sale to people with known mental problems?  What if a gun owner develops mental issues after owning a gun?

Bumper stocks should have been automatically banned after the Vegas shooting. But the NRA opposed for whatever bs reason as usual.
Semi automatics are still here. And weapons are getting fancier and more advanced

Only real solution is to ban guns outright.

This solution assumes that banned guns = people don't have guns.

Would you ban all guns on domestic, civilian lands? Like no police or military weapons? They shouldn't need them if guns are banned for everyone else.

No.  Purpose of gun ownership for police and military would be different.   I would still allows hunters to rent guns as well.

You want to protect your house from thieves? Buy a guard dog instead.

Ok, how about licensed security guards? Particularly those that work in banks, hospitals, operate Brinks trucks, etc.? What about when an officer retires? Should he have to give up his weapon even though the track record has been exemplary throughout his career? Same goes for miltary personnel, but how about reservists? Do you see the slippery slope you get into?

This dog notion really needs to stop. Baiting a dog with meat and then locking him up happens more routinely that you might think. Also, what constitutes a "guard dog"? Does that mean a big dog or one trained by credible K9 type schools? What if the dog you purchased doesn't have the disposition for protecting property? Do you keep purchasing dogs until one is ideal for your needs? I'm sure PETA would be very supportive of an idea that would cause the numbers of dogs to enter facilities for euthanasia to increase exponentially.

Buy a Doberman or a German Shepard, they are breed to be guard dogs. I have been around dogs my whole life and have never seen or heard of one being bated into a cage. That seems like something from a cartoon. My dogs and all the dogs of people I know have protected their owners and property every time it has come in to question. I have also owned guns and have never had to use them on anyone. No one wants to enter a property with a dog or dogs patrolling it. Have you ever owned a dog? Mine would and have protected me with there lives.

Have had dogs my entire life.

I'm sure you've never heard of it because why would MO ever be publicized, but it's reality. Just like a taser on a dog. You use that on dog and it's completely done. Once the 5 second cycle is off, he runs and hides. The most vicious of dog turns into a complete lamb. It's crazy to see.

What are you doing tasering your dog? You're dogs are ****es, mine aren't.... Your taser would just make my dogs mad.How you going to taser 10 dogs? What do you have some Pomeranians?

Who said I've tasered my dog? Why on earth would anyone do that?

I know you don't want to believe me because dogs often provide a false sense of security when individuals overestimate their abilities. That's cool. This though is the reaction I've always seen.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=d-Itfr_V424

Oh and I've had all types of dogs from Rott's to Amstaff's.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1348238/Owner-orders-police-kill-pit-bull-tasers-fail-stop-dog-attacking-girlfriend.html

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/510664/Pit-bull-ignores-police-tasers-vicious-attack-smaller-dog-sprawls-street

https://myeverettnews.com/2011/08/30/everett-police-shoot-and-kill-pit-bull-after-taser-fails-to-stop-attack-on-officers/

Re: Gun Control?
« Reply #116 on: February 16, 2018, 05:57:51 PM »

Offline Eddie20

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Gun control would have done nothing to prevent the vegas , florida school mass murders

These killers had no previous criminal records.

Well how about then prevent sale to people with known mental problems?  What if a gun owner develops mental issues after owning a gun?

Bumper stocks should have been automatically banned after the Vegas shooting. But the NRA opposed for whatever bs reason as usual.
Semi automatics are still here. And weapons are getting fancier and more advanced

Only real solution is to ban guns outright.

This solution assumes that banned guns = people don't have guns.

Would you ban all guns on domestic, civilian lands? Like no police or military weapons? They shouldn't need them if guns are banned for everyone else.

No.  Purpose of gun ownership for police and military would be different.   I would still allows hunters to rent guns as well.

You want to protect your house from thieves? Buy a guard dog instead.

Ok, how about licensed security guards? Particularly those that work in banks, hospitals, operate Brinks trucks, etc.? What about when an officer retires? Should he have to give up his weapon even though the track record has been exemplary throughout his career? Same goes for miltary personnel, but how about reservists? Do you see the slippery slope you get into?

This dog notion really needs to stop. Baiting a dog with meat and then locking him up happens more routinely that you might think. Also, what constitutes a "guard dog"? Does that mean a big dog or one trained by credible K9 type schools? What if the dog you purchased doesn't have the disposition for protecting property? Do you keep purchasing dogs until one is ideal for your needs? I'm sure PETA would be very supportive of an idea that would cause the numbers of dogs to enter facilities for euthanasia to increase exponentially.

Buy a Doberman or a German Shepard, they are breed to be guard dogs. I have been around dogs my whole life and have never seen or heard of one being bated into a cage. That seems like something from a cartoon. My dogs and all the dogs of people I know have protected their owners and property every time it has come in to question. I have also owned guns and have never had to use them on anyone. No one wants to enter a property with a dog or dogs patrolling it. Have you ever owned a dog? Mine would and have protected me with there lives.

Have had dogs my entire life.

I'm sure you've never heard of it because why would MO ever be publicized, but it's reality. Just like a taser on a dog. You use that on dog and it's completely done. Once the 5 second cycle is off, he runs and hides. The most vicious of dog turns into a complete lamb. It's crazy to see.

What are you doing tasering your dog? You're dogs are ****es, mine aren't.... Your taser would just make my dogs mad.How you going to taser 10 dogs? What do you have some Pomeranians?

Who said I've tasered my dog? Why on earth would anyone do that?

I know you don't want to believe me because dogs often provide a false sense of security when individuals overestimate their abilities. That's cool. This though is the reaction I've always seen.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=d-Itfr_V424

Oh and I've had all types of dogs from Rott's to Amstaff's.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1348238/Owner-orders-police-kill-pit-bull-tasers-fail-stop-dog-attacking-girlfriend.html

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/510664/Pit-bull-ignores-police-tasers-vicious-attack-smaller-dog-sprawls-street

https://myeverettnews.com/2011/08/30/everett-police-shoot-and-kill-pit-bull-after-taser-fails-to-stop-attack-on-officers/

You need both prongs to connect, if not it's ineffective. Or if one prong misses you can dry stun and it'll have a complete connection. The distance between the two points is important because that's the part it's impacting. It only impacts from point A to point B, so the bigger the spread the better.

Re: Gun Control?
« Reply #117 on: February 16, 2018, 06:01:13 PM »

Offline liam

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Gun control would have done nothing to prevent the vegas , florida school mass murders

These killers had no previous criminal records.

Well how about then prevent sale to people with known mental problems?  What if a gun owner develops mental issues after owning a gun?

Bumper stocks should have been automatically banned after the Vegas shooting. But the NRA opposed for whatever bs reason as usual.
Semi automatics are still here. And weapons are getting fancier and more advanced

Only real solution is to ban guns outright.

This solution assumes that banned guns = people don't have guns.

Would you ban all guns on domestic, civilian lands? Like no police or military weapons? They shouldn't need them if guns are banned for everyone else.

No.  Purpose of gun ownership for police and military would be different.   I would still allows hunters to rent guns as well.

You want to protect your house from thieves? Buy a guard dog instead.

Ok, how about licensed security guards? Particularly those that work in banks, hospitals, operate Brinks trucks, etc.? What about when an officer retires? Should he have to give up his weapon even though the track record has been exemplary throughout his career? Same goes for miltary personnel, but how about reservists? Do you see the slippery slope you get into?

This dog notion really needs to stop. Baiting a dog with meat and then locking him up happens more routinely that you might think. Also, what constitutes a "guard dog"? Does that mean a big dog or one trained by credible K9 type schools? What if the dog you purchased doesn't have the disposition for protecting property? Do you keep purchasing dogs until one is ideal for your needs? I'm sure PETA would be very supportive of an idea that would cause the numbers of dogs to enter facilities for euthanasia to increase exponentially.

Buy a Doberman or a German Shepard, they are breed to be guard dogs. I have been around dogs my whole life and have never seen or heard of one being bated into a cage. That seems like something from a cartoon. My dogs and all the dogs of people I know have protected their owners and property every time it has come in to question. I have also owned guns and have never had to use them on anyone. No one wants to enter a property with a dog or dogs patrolling it. Have you ever owned a dog? Mine would and have protected me with there lives.

Have had dogs my entire life.

I'm sure you've never heard of it because why would MO ever be publicized, but it's reality. Just like a taser on a dog. You use that on dog and it's completely done. Once the 5 second cycle is off, he runs and hides. The most vicious of dog turns into a complete lamb. It's crazy to see.

What are you doing tasering your dog? You're dogs are ****es, mine aren't.... Your taser would just make my dogs mad.How you going to taser 10 dogs? What do you have some Pomeranians?

Who said I've tasered my dog? Why on earth would anyone do that?

I know you don't want to believe me because dogs often provide a false sense of security when individuals overestimate their abilities. That's cool. This though is the reaction I've always seen.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=d-Itfr_V424

Oh and I've had all types of dogs from Rott's to Amstaff's.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1348238/Owner-orders-police-kill-pit-bull-tasers-fail-stop-dog-attacking-girlfriend.html

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/510664/Pit-bull-ignores-police-tasers-vicious-attack-smaller-dog-sprawls-street

https://myeverettnews.com/2011/08/30/everett-police-shoot-and-kill-pit-bull-after-taser-fails-to-stop-attack-on-officers/

You need both prongs to connect, if not it's ineffective. Or if one prong misses you can dry stun and it'll have a complete connection. The distance between the two points is important because that's the part it's impacting. It only impacts from point A to point B, so the bigger the spread the better.

Video two is with a hand taser. They are touching the dog, no effect....

Re: Gun Control?
« Reply #118 on: February 16, 2018, 06:08:18 PM »

Offline liam

  • Ed Macauley
  • ***********
  • Posts: 11211
  • Tommy Points: 728
Gun control would have done nothing to prevent the vegas , florida school mass murders

These killers had no previous criminal records.

Well how about then prevent sale to people with known mental problems?  What if a gun owner develops mental issues after owning a gun?

Bumper stocks should have been automatically banned after the Vegas shooting. But the NRA opposed for whatever bs reason as usual.
Semi automatics are still here. And weapons are getting fancier and more advanced

Only real solution is to ban guns outright.

This solution assumes that banned guns = people don't have guns.

Would you ban all guns on domestic, civilian lands? Like no police or military weapons? They shouldn't need them if guns are banned for everyone else.

No.  Purpose of gun ownership for police and military would be different.   I would still allows hunters to rent guns as well.

You want to protect your house from thieves? Buy a guard dog instead.

Ok, how about licensed security guards? Particularly those that work in banks, hospitals, operate Brinks trucks, etc.? What about when an officer retires? Should he have to give up his weapon even though the track record has been exemplary throughout his career? Same goes for miltary personnel, but how about reservists? Do you see the slippery slope you get into?

This dog notion really needs to stop. Baiting a dog with meat and then locking him up happens more routinely that you might think. Also, what constitutes a "guard dog"? Does that mean a big dog or one trained by credible K9 type schools? What if the dog you purchased doesn't have the disposition for protecting property? Do you keep purchasing dogs until one is ideal for your needs? I'm sure PETA would be very supportive of an idea that would cause the numbers of dogs to enter facilities for euthanasia to increase exponentially.

Buy a Doberman or a German Shepard, they are breed to be guard dogs. I have been around dogs my whole life and have never seen or heard of one being bated into a cage. That seems like something from a cartoon. My dogs and all the dogs of people I know have protected their owners and property every time it has come in to question. I have also owned guns and have never had to use them on anyone. No one wants to enter a property with a dog or dogs patrolling it. Have you ever owned a dog? Mine would and have protected me with there lives.

Have had dogs my entire life.

I'm sure you've never heard of it because why would MO ever be publicized, but it's reality. Just like a taser on a dog. You use that on dog and it's completely done. Once the 5 second cycle is off, he runs and hides. The most vicious of dog turns into a complete lamb. It's crazy to see.

What are you doing tasering your dog? You're dogs are ****es, mine aren't.... Your taser would just make my dogs mad.How you going to taser 10 dogs? What do you have some Pomeranians?

Who said I've tasered my dog? Why on earth would anyone do that?

I know you don't want to believe me because dogs often provide a false sense of security when individuals overestimate their abilities. That's cool. This though is the reaction I've always seen.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=d-Itfr_V424

Oh and I've had all types of dogs from Rott's to Amstaff's.

Guns give a false sense of security: "Owning a gun has been linked to higher risks of homicide, suicide, and accidental death by gun.
• For every time a gun is used in self-defense in the home, there are 7 assaults or murders, 11 suicide attempts, and 4 accidents involving guns in or around a home.
• 43 percent of homes with guns and kids have at least one unlocked firearm.
• In one experiment, one third of 8-to-12-year-old boys who found a handgun pulled the trigger."

Dogs, not so much...
« Last Edit: February 16, 2018, 08:24:12 PM by liam »

Re: Gun Control?
« Reply #119 on: February 16, 2018, 06:09:02 PM »

Offline Eddie20

  • Don Nelson
  • ********
  • Posts: 8123
  • Tommy Points: 875
Gun control would have done nothing to prevent the vegas , florida school mass murders

These killers had no previous criminal records.

Well how about then prevent sale to people with known mental problems?  What if a gun owner develops mental issues after owning a gun?

Bumper stocks should have been automatically banned after the Vegas shooting. But the NRA opposed for whatever bs reason as usual.
Semi automatics are still here. And weapons are getting fancier and more advanced

Only real solution is to ban guns outright.

This solution assumes that banned guns = people don't have guns.

Would you ban all guns on domestic, civilian lands? Like no police or military weapons? They shouldn't need them if guns are banned for everyone else.

No.  Purpose of gun ownership for police and military would be different.   I would still allows hunters to rent guns as well.

You want to protect your house from thieves? Buy a guard dog instead.

Ok, how about licensed security guards? Particularly those that work in banks, hospitals, operate Brinks trucks, etc.? What about when an officer retires? Should he have to give up his weapon even though the track record has been exemplary throughout his career? Same goes for miltary personnel, but how about reservists? Do you see the slippery slope you get into?

This dog notion really needs to stop. Baiting a dog with meat and then locking him up happens more routinely that you might think. Also, what constitutes a "guard dog"? Does that mean a big dog or one trained by credible K9 type schools? What if the dog you purchased doesn't have the disposition for protecting property? Do you keep purchasing dogs until one is ideal for your needs? I'm sure PETA would be very supportive of an idea that would cause the numbers of dogs to enter facilities for euthanasia to increase exponentially.

Buy a Doberman or a German Shepard, they are breed to be guard dogs. I have been around dogs my whole life and have never seen or heard of one being bated into a cage. That seems like something from a cartoon. My dogs and all the dogs of people I know have protected their owners and property every time it has come in to question. I have also owned guns and have never had to use them on anyone. No one wants to enter a property with a dog or dogs patrolling it. Have you ever owned a dog? Mine would and have protected me with there lives.

Have had dogs my entire life.

I'm sure you've never heard of it because why would MO ever be publicized, but it's reality. Just like a taser on a dog. You use that on dog and it's completely done. Once the 5 second cycle is off, he runs and hides. The most vicious of dog turns into a complete lamb. It's crazy to see.

What are you doing tasering your dog? You're dogs are ****es, mine aren't.... Your taser would just make my dogs mad.How you going to taser 10 dogs? What do you have some Pomeranians?

Who said I've tasered my dog? Why on earth would anyone do that?

I know you don't want to believe me because dogs often provide a false sense of security when individuals overestimate their abilities. That's cool. This though is the reaction I've always seen.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=d-Itfr_V424

Oh and I've had all types of dogs from Rott's to Amstaff's.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1348238/Owner-orders-police-kill-pit-bull-tasers-fail-stop-dog-attacking-girlfriend.html

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/510664/Pit-bull-ignores-police-tasers-vicious-attack-smaller-dog-sprawls-street

https://myeverettnews.com/2011/08/30/everett-police-shoot-and-kill-pit-bull-after-taser-fails-to-stop-attack-on-officers/

You need both prongs to connect, if not it's ineffective. Or if one prong misses you can dry stun and it'll have a complete connection. The distance between the two points is important because that's the part it's impacting. It only impacts from point A to point B, so the bigger the spread the better.

Video two is with a hand taser. They are touching the dog, no effect....

Again, that's ineffective. You need two points. The greater the spread, the more muscle mass it impacts.

Taser tested their X26's on bulls. Bulls! They would drop like a ton of bricks. If two prongs connect, it's over. I've never seen anything, human or animal, be able to fight through 2 properly connected prongs. What I've seen is one catching and the other not, either via a straight miss or as a result of thick clothing, so that doesn't do anything.

Believe me when I tell you that I'm probably one of the most experienced people you'll find on this board regarding Tasers.