Author Topic: CAVSMAGEDDON!!  (Read 17863 times)

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Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #165 on: February 15, 2018, 11:24:13 AM »

Offline Moranis

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Cavs have improved a lot since the trade, in part because it has re-energized Lebron, and who can blame him.

I really like their second unit.  Always liked Clarkson and Nance.  Hood was a steal.  GM of the year just on this trade alone.

GM of the year?! This might have re-energized Lebron (for who knows how long - don't forget the Cavs had a 13 game win streak earlier in the year), but that award usually goes to a GM who has a noticeably better team than the previous year. I think we can all objectively say that is not the case.

Koby Altman may have moved up from [literally] last place on the list, but look no further than our own Danny Ainge if you are looking for front runners for the award.

Yeah, the Kyrie trade counts in his annual evaluation.  The Cavs are worse now than they were last year.
Are you really so sure of that?  Yes, they don't have as much top end talent, and top end talent often is the most important thing, but it doesn't always work that way.  Irving and James weren't a great fit offensively as they are both incredibly ball dominant offensive players and their offense would often just be a your turn/my turn type of offense, which generally didn't yield the best results, especially for the other players on the team.  Obviously, there will be times when not having Irving's ability to create a shot out of nothing will be a problem for the Cavs, but I wouldn't be so sure the team this year won't end up being better than the Cavs team from last year.  They have a much more cohesive unit, have a much younger and more athletic bench that not only has better shooters, but also much better defenders.  Remember the Cavs bench in the playoffs last year was Kyle Korver, Richard Jefferson, Deron Williams, and Iman Shumpert with guys like Derrick Williams, Dahntay Jones, Channing Frye, and James Jones playing here and there.  You don't necessarily win playoff series with your bench, but you can certainly lose them.  And for as great as Irving is, he was -32 against the Warriors in the 5 games, while James was -7.  The Cavs will only be as good as James, and I wouldn't bet against the current group being a better fit with James and thus making James even better.

I’m sure of it, yes. 

The Cavs cruised into the Finals at 12-1 in the East last year.  Replacing Kyrie’s 26 ppg will be easier said than done.
I don't think it will be as hard as you think as the Cavs just weren't a balanced scoring team, especially in the playoffs, with Lebron at 33, Irving at 26, and Love at 17, after that they had Thompson and Smith at just over 8 and Korver at just below 6. 

I'd expect Love to go up into the low 20's, picking up 3 or 4 ppg pretty easily (and his 16.8 was on just 12.1 shots, so he was efficient just not enough shots).  I would expect Hood, Clarkson, and Hill to all be over 10 a game and Smith might very well be as well.  Korver will likely see a boost and Nance and Thompson collectively will be well above 8.  This current team is going to be able to spread the wealth around a lot more and won't be so reliant on James or Irving playing the ISO ball they did so well for 3 years.

EDIT: What is odd is the Cavs would currently play the exact same 3 teams if the playoffs started today and their opponent wasn't upset along the way.  They would play Boston in the ECS and Toronto in the ECF, so a reverse of last year, but Indiana is currently their round 1 opponent just like last year.  I doubt they make it through with only 1 loss, but I honestly don't see Indiana challenging them at all and without Hayward don't think Boston is more than a 5 or 6 game series.  Toronto is a lot better than last year, but I still don't see them beating a Lebron James led team in the playoffs.  Let's say that is 6 games with Cleveland clinching at home.

Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #166 on: February 15, 2018, 12:03:39 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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I feel like we are approaching 10% of all posts on this forum talking about how great the cavs are and everything with them is perfect. Good grief.

Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #167 on: February 15, 2018, 12:22:16 PM »

Offline tarheelsxxiii

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I feel like we are approaching 10% of all posts on this forum talking about how great the cavs are and everything with them is perfect. Good grief.

It was just as bad in the opposite direction before that 1 game, though.
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Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #168 on: February 15, 2018, 01:31:38 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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I feel like we are approaching 10% of all posts on this forum talking about how great the cavs are and everything with them is perfect. Good grief.

It was just as bad in the opposite direction before that 1 game, though.

I think it's pretty natural for fans of a team to take delight in the struggles of a rival. It's pretty much part of the definition of fandom. Reading the constant worship of said rival on a fan board is not.

Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #169 on: February 15, 2018, 01:49:59 PM »

Offline Birdman

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Ugh..still  can't believe Danny didn't get Evans..went off again last night
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Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #170 on: February 15, 2018, 02:08:06 PM »

Offline Moranis

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Ugh..still  can't believe Danny didn't get Evans..went off again last night
I was thinking about this.  I really believe that when the Cavs made all of their moves, Danny decided against using assets for a rental because I don't think he believed a rental (say Evans) would make a difference in a playoff series against Cleveland.  Had Cleveland not made all of the moves, I think Danny would have moved Boston's 1st for a guy like Evans to give Boston a real shot at making the Finals. 

Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #171 on: February 15, 2018, 02:29:18 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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I feel like we are approaching 10% of all posts on this forum talking about how great the cavs are and everything with them is perfect. Good grief.

It was just as bad in the opposite direction before that 1 game, though.

I think it's pretty natural for fans of a team to take delight in the struggles of a rival. It's pretty much part of the definition of fandom. Reading the constant worship of said rival on a fan board is not.
People are allowed to be fans of any other team or player they want and post it on this board. If you don't like their fandom of other teams or players, ignore the posts or threads.

Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #172 on: February 15, 2018, 02:44:52 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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I feel like we are approaching 10% of all posts on this forum talking about how great the cavs are and everything with them is perfect. Good grief.

It was just as bad in the opposite direction before that 1 game, though.

I think it's pretty natural for fans of a team to take delight in the struggles of a rival. It's pretty much part of the definition of fandom. Reading the constant worship of said rival on a fan board is not.
People are allowed to be fans of any other team or player they want and post it on this board. If you don't like their fandom of other teams or players, ignore the posts or threads.

Just pointed out the volume of it and that it was unusual for a fan forum. Definitely Didn't say it should be banned or anything. There is also lots of relevant and good discourse about Cleveland, they are an interesting team. Before that it was Philly. There was lots of interesting discussion about then during their rebuild. Funnily enough there is a lot less posts about them now that they are .500 (also probably tied to them trading okafor and Noel who many people wanted at times.

Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #173 on: February 15, 2018, 02:50:20 PM »

Offline Moranis

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I feel like we are approaching 10% of all posts on this forum talking about how great the cavs are and everything with them is perfect. Good grief.

It was just as bad in the opposite direction before that 1 game, though.

I think it's pretty natural for fans of a team to take delight in the struggles of a rival. It's pretty much part of the definition of fandom. Reading the constant worship of said rival on a fan board is not.
People are allowed to be fans of any other team or player they want and post it on this board. If you don't like their fandom of other teams or players, ignore the posts or threads.

Just pointed out the volume of it and that it was unusual for a fan forum. Definitely Didn't say it should be banned or anything. There is also lots of relevant and good discourse about Cleveland, they are an interesting team. Before that it was Philly. There was lots of interesting discussion about then during their rebuild. Funnily enough there is a lot less posts about them now that they are .500 (also probably tied to them trading okafor and Noel who many people wanted at times.
I don't think any of that is particular unusual, especially with those two teams who have been closely linked with the Celtics for awhile given their relative positions in the conference (Cavs main rival and Sixers divisional rival).  There have been something like 10 Anthony Davis posts during this season.  This summer, I'd almost expect 1 of those a week.  The Lakers have been a hot topic.  Again, there are obvious reasons for both of those as well.  If Lebron leaves Cleveland, especially if he stays East, I'd expect whatever team he ends up on to be a big topic of discussion on this board again (just like the Heat were during the last couple of the Big 3 seasons). 

Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #174 on: February 15, 2018, 02:56:52 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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I feel like we are approaching 10% of all posts on this forum talking about how great the cavs are and everything with them is perfect. Good grief.

It was just as bad in the opposite direction before that 1 game, though.

I think it's pretty natural for fans of a team to take delight in the struggles of a rival. It's pretty much part of the definition of fandom. Reading the constant worship of said rival on a fan board is not.
People are allowed to be fans of any other team or player they want and post it on this board. If you don't like their fandom of other teams or players, ignore the posts or threads.

Just pointed out the volume of it and that it was unusual for a fan forum. Definitely Didn't say it should be banned or anything. There is also lots of relevant and good discourse about Cleveland, they are an interesting team. Before that it was Philly. There was lots of interesting discussion about then during their rebuild. Funnily enough there is a lot less posts about them now that they are .500 (also probably tied to them trading okafor and Noel who many people wanted at times.
I don't think any of that is particular unusual, especially with those two teams who have been closely linked with the Celtics for awhile given their relative positions in the conference (Cavs main rival and Sixers divisional rival).  There have been something like 10 Anthony Davis posts during this season.  This summer, I'd almost expect 1 of those a week.  The Lakers have been a hot topic.  Again, there are obvious reasons for both of those as well.  If Lebron leaves Cleveland, especially if he stays East, I'd expect whatever team he ends up on to be a big topic of discussion on this board again (just like the Heat were during the last couple of the Big 3 seasons).

Seems like a stretch to call the 76ers a division rival at this point. We have met them what once in the playoffs in the last 15 years. We were actually knocked out by the Knicks more recently. If embiid stays healthy and/or they are able to get someone in free agency the rivalry could be reignited like the 80s. It is possible we could play them this year, but I think they make way too many turnovers to win a playoff series when things tighten up

Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #175 on: February 18, 2018, 04:05:09 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Turns out that it was Wade, not IT, who initially called out Kevin Love:

Quote
Thomas was upset that Kevin Love went home with an illness before a 24-point loss to Oklahoma City had concluded on Jan. 20, and that he was not at practice the following day. But, sources said, it was Wade who first made an issue of it on Monday, challenging Lue to disclose where Love had been. Numerous players verbally attacked Love, who eventually explained his absence as part of a wide-ranging, heated discussion in which virtually no one was immune from criticism.

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/report-dwyane-wade-not-isaiah-230845876.html

Funny how the media covered for Wade until now.


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Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #176 on: February 18, 2018, 04:49:02 PM »

Offline Big333223

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Turns out that it was Wade, not IT, who initially called out Kevin Love:

Quote
Thomas was upset that Kevin Love went home with an illness before a 24-point loss to Oklahoma City had concluded on Jan. 20, and that he was not at practice the following day. But, sources said, it was Wade who first made an issue of it on Monday, challenging Lue to disclose where Love had been. Numerous players verbally attacked Love, who eventually explained his absence as part of a wide-ranging, heated discussion in which virtually no one was immune from criticism.

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/report-dwyane-wade-not-isaiah-230845876.html

Funny how the media covered for Wade until now.

Almost like the Cavs were trying to sour fans on IT before shipping him out. But a stand-up organization like Cleveland wouldn't do that...
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Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #177 on: February 18, 2018, 05:14:25 PM »

Offline Moranis

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Turns out that it was Wade, not IT, who initially called out Kevin Love:

Quote
Thomas was upset that Kevin Love went home with an illness before a 24-point loss to Oklahoma City had concluded on Jan. 20, and that he was not at practice the following day. But, sources said, it was Wade who first made an issue of it on Monday, challenging Lue to disclose where Love had been. Numerous players verbally attacked Love, who eventually explained his absence as part of a wide-ranging, heated discussion in which virtually no one was immune from criticism.

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/report-dwyane-wade-not-isaiah-230845876.html

Funny how the media covered for Wade until now.
the IT stories were that he led the charge not that he was the first to complain.  If Wade brought it up first but then IT really piled on, was the most vocal, kept bringing it up, etc. then I see no issues with any of the reporting on that point.

Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #178 on: February 18, 2018, 05:32:09 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Turns out that it was Wade, not IT, who initially called out Kevin Love:

Quote
Thomas was upset that Kevin Love went home with an illness before a 24-point loss to Oklahoma City had concluded on Jan. 20, and that he was not at practice the following day. But, sources said, it was Wade who first made an issue of it on Monday, challenging Lue to disclose where Love had been. Numerous players verbally attacked Love, who eventually explained his absence as part of a wide-ranging, heated discussion in which virtually no one was immune from criticism.

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/report-dwyane-wade-not-isaiah-230845876.html

Funny how the media covered for Wade until now.
the IT stories were that he led the charge not that he was the first to complain.  If Wade brought it up first but then IT really piled on, was the most vocal, kept bringing it up, etc. then I see no issues with any of the reporting on that point.

Wade called the meeting, is described as the “instigator” and challenged Lue about Love and the legitimacy of Love’s illness. That’s not really as innocent as you’re implying.

That Vardon article is really interestinG, in that it doesn’t pull a lot of punches. Lebron and Lue get some blame, which is a media rarity.


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Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #179 on: February 18, 2018, 06:25:19 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Said that I didn't really think it was IT that called out Love due to their history together. Wade being Wade makes more sense and I do believe this report.