Author Topic: CAVSMAGEDDON!!  (Read 18878 times)

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Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #75 on: February 08, 2018, 04:26:25 PM »

Offline Big333223

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The whole thing feels a little desperate to me. Which makes sense, the Cavs are desperate.

I think George Hill is going to be the X-Factor to this whole thing. If he keeps having the season he's been having, I don't see the Cavs making it out of the second round. If he was just bored in Sacramento and starts looking like he did last year in Utah, then he could be a nice compliment for Lebron and Love and then, who knows.
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Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #76 on: February 08, 2018, 04:42:30 PM »

Offline cman88

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they just shuffled role players around. Its alot to ask of a team to be able to Gel in 2 months and get to the playoffs. especially a team with a non-coach like Lue.

its Lebron and a bunch of role-players. This may be worse than the 2010 team that lost to the celtics.

Who is their 3rd best player?

Cavs basically lowered their ceiling but raised their floor. if IT4 is/was able to get healthy they would be deadly.

Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #77 on: February 08, 2018, 04:43:23 PM »

Offline tazzmaniac

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The whole thing feels a little desperate to me. Which makes sense, the Cavs are desperate.

I think George Hill is going to be the X-Factor to this whole thing. If he keeps having the season he's been having, I don't see the Cavs making it out of the second round. If he was just bored in Sacramento and starts looking like he did last year in Utah, then he could be a nice compliment for Lebron and Love and then, who knows.
Hill is leading the league in 3pt percentage.  His numbers aren't much different from last season and he has been on a much worse team playing 5 mpg less.

Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #78 on: February 08, 2018, 04:51:44 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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The whole thing feels a little desperate to me. Which makes sense, the Cavs are desperate.

I think George Hill is going to be the X-Factor to this whole thing. If he keeps having the season he's been having, I don't see the Cavs making it out of the second round. If he was just bored in Sacramento and starts looking like he did last year in Utah, then he could be a nice compliment for Lebron and Love and then, who knows.
Hill is leading the league in 3pt percentage.  His numbers aren't much different from last season and he has been on a much worse team playing 5 mpg less.

So is he their 3rd best player? He is a far cry from Kevin Love (who obviously is now the Cavs second best player). This could help them win the east for sure, but I don't see how the Rockets or Warriors wouldn't sweep them (and probably the thunder in 5).


Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #79 on: February 08, 2018, 04:55:23 PM »

Offline Big333223

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The whole thing feels a little desperate to me. Which makes sense, the Cavs are desperate.

I think George Hill is going to be the X-Factor to this whole thing. If he keeps having the season he's been having, I don't see the Cavs making it out of the second round. If he was just bored in Sacramento and starts looking like he did last year in Utah, then he could be a nice compliment for Lebron and Love and then, who knows.
Hill is leading the league in 3pt percentage.  His numbers aren't much different from last season and he has been on a much worse team playing 5 mpg less.

He's averaging 7 fewer ppg and almost all of his other numbers are down, except for his 3 point percentage. He also has not been playing the defense that he's known for playing. He has not been playing well for Sacramento.
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Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #80 on: February 08, 2018, 04:56:39 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #81 on: February 08, 2018, 04:59:59 PM »

Offline Ed Hollison

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I agree that looking at this season in a vacuum, this was a good move. That team as constituted wasn't going anywhere, and the team needed to take some risks. I guess the idea now is just to surround Lebron with as many talented role players as possible, and guys who can actually move and defend. The ceiling for this team is the Finals; there's no way they're winning it, but then again, there was no way they were winning it before the trades, either.

One thing I strongly disagree with is the idea that the team chemistry is certain to improve. Guys like IT, Crowder, and Wade weren't seen as problems for team chemistry when they joined the Cavs. On the contrary, I'd say they were each seen as bringing some veteran savvy and grit to the team. Consider the possibility that the Cavs organization is the reason why these players -- in particular IT -- are now thought of so negatively. It's entirely possible that the Cavs' new additions fall into the same trap in an environment where Lebron essentially controls the organization, and the coach has little ability to dictate team culture. Chemistry could still remain a problem, in fact it could get worse, especially with so little time between now and the end of the regular season.
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Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #82 on: February 08, 2018, 05:00:52 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

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So are the Lakers better or worse now? Is the 2018 LA pick all of a sudden in play again?
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Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #83 on: February 08, 2018, 05:05:16 PM »

Offline ChillyWilly

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What are the Lakers going to do with IT?
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Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #84 on: February 08, 2018, 05:10:38 PM »

Offline Surferdad

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I agree that looking at this season in a vacuum, this was a good move. That team as constituted wasn't going anywhere, and the team needed to take some risks. I guess the idea now is just to surround Lebron with as many talented role players as possible, and guys who can actually move and defend. The ceiling for this team is the Finals; there's no way they're winning it, but then again, there was no way they were winning it before the trades, either.

One thing I strongly disagree with is the idea that the team chemistry is certain to improve. Guys like IT, Crowder, and Wade weren't seen as problems for team chemistry when they joined the Cavs. On the contrary, I'd say they were each seen as bringing some veteran savvy and grit to the team. Consider the possibility that the Cavs organization is the reason why these players -- in particular IT -- are now thought of so negatively. It's entirely possible that the Cavs' new additions fall into the same trap in an environment where Lebron essentially controls the organization, and the coach has little ability to dictate team culture. Chemistry could still remain a problem, in fact it could get worse, especially with so little time between now and the end of the regular season.
Right.  It's not bad attitude player and may not even be due to the Cavs organization.  Then what's the problem?  Here's my wild theory:

Players were not committed so long as LeBron remained uncommitted to staying next year.  It's a subtle thing and may be even have been conscious on their part.  If the leader of the team can't say he's going to stay, the other players have to wonder about their own futures.  That shadow of a doubt about whether they are in the right place could translate to a lack of effort.  As I said, it's a wild theory, I have nothing to back it up, but I've seen such situations in my own professional field.  People stop talking to each other and seem to only be there to collect a paycheck.

Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #85 on: February 08, 2018, 05:17:29 PM »

Offline Donoghus

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The whole thing feels a little desperate to me. Which makes sense, the Cavs are desperate.

I think George Hill is going to be the X-Factor to this whole thing. If he keeps having the season he's been having, I don't see the Cavs making it out of the second round. If he was just bored in Sacramento and starts looking like he did last year in Utah, then he could be a nice compliment for Lebron and Love and then, who knows.

A wise man once said "Desperation is a stinky cologne". 

Can't blame CLE for what they're doing.  Long term, they might be better set up but in the now, they're going to need superhuman Lebron to get back to the Finals this season, IMO.


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Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #86 on: February 08, 2018, 05:35:40 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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So are the Lakers better or worse now? Is the 2018 LA pick all of a sudden in play again?

I think they're almost definitely worse if they're going to play him plenty of minutes and let him shoot a lot.  They have no defensive infrastructure around him, so they'll just give up a ton of points even if their offense improves.
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Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #87 on: February 09, 2018, 08:51:14 AM »

Offline Moranis

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The whole thing feels a little desperate to me. Which makes sense, the Cavs are desperate.

I think George Hill is going to be the X-Factor to this whole thing. If he keeps having the season he's been having, I don't see the Cavs making it out of the second round. If he was just bored in Sacramento and starts looking like he did last year in Utah, then he could be a nice compliment for Lebron and Love and then, who knows.
Hill is leading the league in 3pt percentage.  His numbers aren't much different from last season and he has been on a much worse team playing 5 mpg less.

So is he their 3rd best player? He is a far cry from Kevin Love (who obviously is now the Cavs second best player). This could help them win the east for sure, but I don't see how the Rockets or Warriors wouldn't sweep them (and probably the thunder in 5).
Love has been their 2nd best player all year.  I actually think they could be a better overall team than any time since Lebron has returned (except that first season when Love and Irving were injured in the playoffs) even though they have less top end talent.  They have a lot more cohesion and balance in the roster construction from top to bottom.  They got younger, more athletic, better defensively, with better shooters, and a roster that suits what James (and to a lesser extent Love) do well.  They have a very nice 2 deep rotation at every position (except center) and the players actually fit together well.  There will of course be games where they will miss what Irving can do offensively, but overall I think they might just be a better team (they will still almost certainly lose to the Warriors if they both get there, but they lost in 5 last year so that wouldn't be an unexpected result).  That of course assumes that Love returns and their roster actually gels and learns how to play together in the short time they have.  Those are two very big if's, but assuming both do actually happen, I'd be pretty surprised if the Cavs aren't in the Finals again.

Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #88 on: February 10, 2018, 09:05:05 AM »

Offline cman88

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The whole thing feels a little desperate to me. Which makes sense, the Cavs are desperate.

I think George Hill is going to be the X-Factor to this whole thing. If he keeps having the season he's been having, I don't see the Cavs making it out of the second round. If he was just bored in Sacramento and starts looking like he did last year in Utah, then he could be a nice compliment for Lebron and Love and then, who knows.
Hill is leading the league in 3pt percentage.  His numbers aren't much different from last season and he has been on a much worse team playing 5 mpg less.

So is he their 3rd best player? He is a far cry from Kevin Love (who obviously is now the Cavs second best player). This could help them win the east for sure, but I don't see how the Rockets or Warriors wouldn't sweep them (and probably the thunder in 5).
Love has been their 2nd best player all year.  I actually think they could be a better overall team than any time since Lebron has returned (except that first season when Love and Irving were injured in the playoffs) even though they have less top end talent.  They have a lot more cohesion and balance in the roster construction from top to bottom.  They got younger, more athletic, better defensively, with better shooters, and a roster that suits what James (and to a lesser extent Love) do well.  They have a very nice 2 deep rotation at every position (except center) and the players actually fit together well.  There will of course be games where they will miss what Irving can do offensively, but overall I think they might just be a better team (they will still almost certainly lose to the Warriors if they both get there, but they lost in 5 last year so that wouldn't be an unexpected result).  That of course assumes that Love returns and their roster actually gels and learns how to play together in the short time they have.  Those are two very big if's, but assuming both do actually happen, I'd be pretty surprised if the Cavs aren't in the Finals again.


this is just a hilarious take. Stars win in the NBA in the playoffs, not role-players. Celtics fans should know that of everyone because our team of gutty role-players and IT4 dragged the team all the way to the eastern conference finals where talent finally took over and we got wrecked.

look at the talent on even last years team, and to say this years has more is just a hot take. just Irving alone is worth more than those roleplayers. Unless you trust them to win you a game and get tough points..

Re: CAVSMAGEDDON!!
« Reply #89 on: February 10, 2018, 09:14:06 AM »

Offline Moranis

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The whole thing feels a little desperate to me. Which makes sense, the Cavs are desperate.

I think George Hill is going to be the X-Factor to this whole thing. If he keeps having the season he's been having, I don't see the Cavs making it out of the second round. If he was just bored in Sacramento and starts looking like he did last year in Utah, then he could be a nice compliment for Lebron and Love and then, who knows.
Hill is leading the league in 3pt percentage.  His numbers aren't much different from last season and he has been on a much worse team playing 5 mpg less.

So is he their 3rd best player? He is a far cry from Kevin Love (who obviously is now the Cavs second best player). This could help them win the east for sure, but I don't see how the Rockets or Warriors wouldn't sweep them (and probably the thunder in 5).
Love has been their 2nd best player all year.  I actually think they could be a better overall team than any time since Lebron has returned (except that first season when Love and Irving were injured in the playoffs) even though they have less top end talent.  They have a lot more cohesion and balance in the roster construction from top to bottom.  They got younger, more athletic, better defensively, with better shooters, and a roster that suits what James (and to a lesser extent Love) do well.  They have a very nice 2 deep rotation at every position (except center) and the players actually fit together well.  There will of course be games where they will miss what Irving can do offensively, but overall I think they might just be a better team (they will still almost certainly lose to the Warriors if they both get there, but they lost in 5 last year so that wouldn't be an unexpected result).  That of course assumes that Love returns and their roster actually gels and learns how to play together in the short time they have.  Those are two very big if's, but assuming both do actually happen, I'd be pretty surprised if the Cavs aren't in the Finals again.


this is just a hilarious take. Stars win in the NBA in the playoffs, not role-players. Celtics fans should know that of everyone because our team of gutty role-players and IT4 dragged the team all the way to the eastern conference finals where talent finally took over and we got wrecked.

look at the talent on even last years team, and to say this years has more is just a hot take. just Irving alone is worth more than those roleplayers. Unless you trust them to win you a game and get tough points..
you misunderstood my post.  So let me clarify,  James has always been Cleveland's best player.  He and Irving weren't a very good fit.  Their offense would often stagnant with them just taking turns doing their thing.  They had no real cohesion and they both often ignored each other and Love, who is a great offensive player in his own right.   If this team makes it work, it will have significantly better cohesion and a much clearer sense of team and identity.  It is James' team, James' offense, etc.  Obviously there are times where Irving's ability to get a basket will be misssed, but overall the team is constructed to better utilize its best player and in the process also better utilize Love.  It has mich better defense overall as well and when the Cavs lose, they lose on that end of the floor.