Author Topic: HHS Civil Rights Division  (Read 899 times)

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HHS Civil Rights Division
« on: January 18, 2018, 11:49:52 AM »

Offline kozlodoev

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That's not even conservative, it's reactionary. Fantastic time for health workers who will not prescribe you treatment because they have religious objections over what you want to do with your own body. Huzzah!


https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/trump-administration-creating-civil-rights-division-to-shield-health-workers-with-moral-or-religious-objections/2018/01/17/5663d1c0-fbe2-11e7-8f66-2df0b94bb98a_story.html
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Re: HHS Civil Rights Division
« Reply #1 on: January 18, 2018, 12:17:56 PM »

Online nickagneta

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Just another move to infringe upon the rights of women and the LGBT community. Way to continue to set back women's and civil rights President Trump.

Re: HHS Civil Rights Division
« Reply #2 on: January 18, 2018, 12:25:05 PM »

Offline TomHeinsohn

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Trump hardly gives back anything of substance or value to his base, but he gives them what they really want, and that's triggering the libs.

Re: HHS Civil Rights Division
« Reply #3 on: January 18, 2018, 12:30:26 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

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Trump hardly gives back anything of substance or value to his base, but he gives them what they really want, and that's triggering the libs.
By and large, do you believe it's ok for health workers to refuse to prescribe you contraceptives because they don't believe in birth control?
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Re: HHS Civil Rights Division
« Reply #4 on: January 18, 2018, 12:41:29 PM »

Offline TomHeinsohn

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Trump hardly gives back anything of substance or value to his base, but he gives them what they really want, and that's triggering the libs.
By and large, do you believe it's ok for health workers to refuse to prescribe you contraceptives because they don't believe in birth control?

Absolutely not. I'm a BSN student right now. The patient is supposed to have agency over their own care.

Re: HHS Civil Rights Division
« Reply #5 on: January 18, 2018, 01:11:20 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Itís a complex issue, and Iím not sure we can go there without discussing the ďAĒ word, so I donít expect this to be a fruitful discussion.  However, it seems like this is about enforcing existing law (the opposite of reactionary):

Quote
At the heart of the creation of the new division at HHS is a push by religious liberty and faith-based groups to enforce federal anti-abortion conscience laws, like the 1990s Coats-Snowe amendment and the 1970s Church amendment, which give nondiscrimination protections to federally funded programs that do not provide abortion services, and the Weldon Amendment, started under President George W. Bush.

The move Thursday could be viewed as an expansion of the Weldon amendment, which prohibits any state or local government receiving federal HHS funds from discriminating against any health care organization based on its refusal to ďprovide, pay for, provide coverage of, or refer forĒ abortions. The Obama administration pulled back the regulations, instead leaving HHS's Office of Civil Rights to field complaints for violations of conscience and religious freedom laws.

"Enforcing these statutes," said Hargan, "will expand the already excellent work OCR does to protect civil rights."

https://www.google.com/amp/abcnews.go.com/amp/Politics/trump-administration-announce-conscience-religious-freedom-division-hhs/story%3fid=52434480

So, thatís the background. Again, thatís not an invitation to discuss abortion.


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Re: HHS Civil Rights Division
« Reply #6 on: January 18, 2018, 01:11:41 PM »

Offline KGs Knee

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Trump hardly gives back anything of substance or value to his base, but he gives them what they really want, and that's triggering the libs.
By and large, do you believe it's ok for health workers to refuse to prescribe you contraceptives because they don't believe in birth control?

Private practitioners, yes. Practitioners employed by publicly funded treatment centers, no.

Free people can make their own choices. The government shouldn't be dictating everything.

Re: HHS Civil Rights Division
« Reply #7 on: January 18, 2018, 01:24:42 PM »

Online nickagneta

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Trump hardly gives back anything of substance or value to his base, but he gives them what they really want, and that's triggering the libs.
By and large, do you believe it's ok for health workers to refuse to prescribe you contraceptives because they don't believe in birth control?

Private practitioners, yes. Practitioners employed by publicly funded treatment centers, no.

Free people can make their own choices. The government shouldn't be dictating everything.
But aren't private practitioners violating their Hippocratic oath then?

Re: HHS Civil Rights Division
« Reply #8 on: January 18, 2018, 01:26:51 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

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Trump hardly gives back anything of substance or value to his base, but he gives them what they really want, and that's triggering the libs.
By and large, do you believe it's ok for health workers to refuse to prescribe you contraceptives because they don't believe in birth control?

Private practitioners, yes. Practitioners employed by publicly funded treatment centers, no.

Free people can make their own choices. The government shouldn't be dictating everything.
Sure. I also think it will be only fair for such practitioners to be barred from being compensated for their services with public funds. So no Medicare/Medicaid payments for physicians who refuse to prescribe treatment to their patients.
(Formerly) managing Rilski Sportist to glory at http://www.buzzerbeater.com

Re: HHS Civil Rights Division
« Reply #9 on: January 18, 2018, 01:34:30 PM »

Offline KGs Knee

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Trump hardly gives back anything of substance or value to his base, but he gives them what they really want, and that's triggering the libs.
By and large, do you believe it's ok for health workers to refuse to prescribe you contraceptives because they don't believe in birth control?

Private practitioners, yes. Practitioners employed by publicly funded treatment centers, no.

Free people can make their own choices. The government shouldn't be dictating everything.
Sure. I also think it will be only fair for such practitioners to be barred from being compensated for their services with public funds. So no Medicare/Medicaid payments for physicians who refuse to prescribe treatment to their patients.

Is contraception actually even a treatment? What exactly is contraception treating?

Re: HHS Civil Rights Division
« Reply #10 on: January 18, 2018, 01:39:13 PM »

Offline KGs Knee

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Trump hardly gives back anything of substance or value to his base, but he gives them what they really want, and that's triggering the libs.
By and large, do you believe it's ok for health workers to refuse to prescribe you contraceptives because they don't believe in birth control?

Private practitioners, yes. Practitioners employed by publicly funded treatment centers, no.

Free people can make their own choices. The government shouldn't be dictating everything.
But aren't private practitioners violating their Hippocratic oath then?

No, I don't believe so.

By the way, have you ever read the original version of the oath?

Re: HHS Civil Rights Division
« Reply #11 on: January 18, 2018, 01:52:06 PM »

Online jpotter33

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Trump hardly gives back anything of substance or value to his base, but he gives them what they really want, and that's triggering the libs.
By and large, do you believe it's ok for health workers to refuse to prescribe you contraceptives because they don't believe in birth control?

Absolutely not. I'm a BSN student right now. The patient is supposed to have agency over their own care.

That is true, but it's not absolute. Patients do not have the moral right to force healthcare workers to provide treatments that are against their conscience (based on professional autonomy), and this goes beyond religious and cultural values, too. As a clinical ethics consultant in a secular institution I am regularly consulted on issues with critical care physicians asking what their moral and professional obligations are for continuing aggressive care at the end of life, and I advise them that they are not morally obligated to provide treatments that are counter to their conscience and potentially inappropriate or futile. This is a well-accepted norm in medical ethics from a secular perspective, so this goes beyond merely religious liberty.

But the issue at hand is rather complex. I think the vast majority of people believe in the legitimacy of some sort of conscience clause that protects individuals from being forced to be involved with issues that they find morally objectionable. For example, I think you'd be hard-pressed to find anyone who believes that the general Catholic nurse from Mt. Sinai Hospital in New York (Cathy Cenzon-DeCarlo) should've been conscripted into helping with that treatment against her explicit objections.

On the other hand, the majority of these types of cases come in specific/specialized contexts and/or roles, and many times they can be considered an integral function of the job role/description. (This is at least true in my experiences at larger healthcare institutions like CC - e.g. there is a multidisciplinary team that takes care of all components of transgender health, meaning there wouldn't necessarily be conflict there. Perhaps in smaller healthcare institutions roles are more spread out and conflated, but even then it's hard to rationalize cases such as Catholic OB/GYNs refusing to prescribe contraceptives in secular healthcare institutions, since that's such an integral component of the OB/GYN's role in modern medicine, along with being the standard of care in many contexts.)

So while I think there is certainly a need for some type of conscience clause to avoid generalized healthcare workers being conscripted into treatments that they find morally objectionable, there are certainly limits when it comes to more specialized roles in healthcare.
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Re: HHS Civil Rights Division
« Reply #12 on: January 18, 2018, 01:57:06 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

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Trump hardly gives back anything of substance or value to his base, but he gives them what they really want, and that's triggering the libs.
By and large, do you believe it's ok for health workers to refuse to prescribe you contraceptives because they don't believe in birth control?

Private practitioners, yes. Practitioners employed by publicly funded treatment centers, no.

Free people can make their own choices. The government shouldn't be dictating everything.
Sure. I also think it will be only fair for such practitioners to be barred from being compensated for their services with public funds. So no Medicare/Medicaid payments for physicians who refuse to prescribe treatment to their patients.

Is contraception actually even a treatment? What exactly is contraception treating?
As long as it's only available with prescription, it's treatment. With this being said, it IS over the counter in many places, and I'm fine with that. The government shouldn't be dictating everything.
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Re: HHS Civil Rights Division
« Reply #13 on: January 18, 2018, 02:48:27 PM »

Offline Bankshot

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Trump hardly gives back anything of substance or value to his base, but he gives them what they really want, and that's triggering the libs.
By and large, do you believe it's ok for health workers to refuse to prescribe you contraceptives because they don't believe in birth control?

Private practitioners, yes. Practitioners employed by publicly funded treatment centers, no.

Free people can make their own choices. The government shouldn't be dictating everything.
Sure. I also think it will be only fair for such practitioners to be barred from being compensated for their services with public funds. So no Medicare/Medicaid payments for physicians who refuse to prescribe treatment to their patients.

Is contraception actually even a treatment? What exactly is contraception treating?
As long as it's only available with prescription, it's treatment. With this being said, it IS over the counter in many places, and I'm fine with that. The government shouldn't be dictating everything.

Personally, I don't believe contraception should be available over the counter, with the exception of emergency contraception like the morning after pill.  Contraception is not a one size fits all.  I can't tell you how many different types I went through.  Some made me sick so I had to switch to another and so on until the doctor found one that worked for me.  Also, contraception is not only prescribed for birth control.  There are a whole host of other ailments that birth control pills are prescribed for, other than for birth control, even prescribed to young girls for certain ailments.  So doctors who refuse to prescribe contraception should choose another medical field and leave women and girls alone!  Just my opinion.
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Re: HHS Civil Rights Division
« Reply #14 on: January 18, 2018, 03:50:43 PM »

Online nickagneta

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Trump hardly gives back anything of substance or value to his base, but he gives them what they really want, and that's triggering the libs.
By and large, do you believe it's ok for health workers to refuse to prescribe you contraceptives because they don't believe in birth control?

Private practitioners, yes. Practitioners employed by publicly funded treatment centers, no.

Free people can make their own choices. The government shouldn't be dictating everything.
Sure. I also think it will be only fair for such practitioners to be barred from being compensated for their services with public funds. So no Medicare/Medicaid payments for physicians who refuse to prescribe treatment to their patients.

Is contraception actually even a treatment? What exactly is contraception treating?
As long as it's only available with prescription, it's treatment. With this being said, it IS over the counter in many places, and I'm fine with that. The government shouldn't be dictating everything.

Personally, I don't believe contraception should be available over the counter, with the exception of emergency contraception like the morning after pill.  Contraception is not a one size fits all.  I can't tell you how many different types I went through.  Some made me sick so I had to switch to another and so on until the doctor found one that worked for me.  Also, contraception is not only prescribed for birth control.  There are a whole host of other ailments that birth control pills are prescribed for, other than for birth control, even prescribed to young girls for certain ailments.  So doctors who refuse to prescribe contraception should choose another medical field and leave women and girls alone!  Just my opinion.
Yeah, my ex wife had to take birth control pills when she was young for endomitriosis and cysts on her ovaries. In later years she had to take them to prevent her serious migraines. Birth control pills are for so much more in woman's health than just preventing pregnancy.