Poll

Who is the best/most complete defender on this team?

Marcus Smart
Al Horford
Aron Baynes
Jaylen Brown
Semi Ojeleye
Other - comment please

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Who is the best/most complete defender on this team?
« on: January 08, 2018, 09:12:12 AM »

Offline Androslav

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Pretty straightforward question:
Who is the best/most complete defender on the Celtics right now?

By the best/the most complete I include:
- Being able to stay in front of fast ball-handlers.
- Can't be backed down easily.
- Being able to switch multiple assignments without creating an exploitable mismatch.
- Can control the defensive glass.
- Being able to play big minutes. If a player is often in foul trouble or even worse is injured, his usefulness is limited. Stamina issues would fit in here as well.
- Doesn't commit silly unnecessary fouls. Those put the team in early bonus and frustrate. It also messes up rotations.
- Has the confidence to lock down the best players on the opposing teams.
- Boxes out with discipline and regularity.
- Communicates; talks & directs teammates loud, early & often.
- Executes defensive game plan to detail.
- "Swallows" scouting reports like tasty pancakes.
- Instills confidence and a sense of dependability in his teammates. A guy you would share a trench with while being bombarded.
- Contests regularly without fouling. Especially while covering jump shots.
- Draws charges.
- Doesn't gamble for steals, but plays the passing lanes.
- Makes verticality plays, bumping guys with his chest while midair.
- Protects the rim like a cradle of his newborn baby.
- Can erase a shot, which can lead to "shyness", intimidation
- Uses proper technique for avoiding getting stuck on the screens.
- Makes the opposition think twice.
- His effort doesn't vain regardless of the result.
- Enjoys doing all of the aforementioned.

I am sure I missed some so feel free to add.

EDIT: If you're wondering why Ojeleye is here - it is cause CBS once said, paraphrasing "Semi will be a great defensive player, (then he paused for a split sec) if he is not already". And CBS is the church where I pray.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2018, 04:18:30 PM by Androslav »
"The joy of the balling under the rims."

Re: Who is the best/most complete defender on this team?
« Reply #1 on: January 08, 2018, 10:10:46 AM »

Offline ChillyWilly

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No Troz3? Let the flaming of Chilly Willy begin for mentioning him!
Self proclaimed president of the fictional Troz3 fan club.

Re: Who is the best/most complete defender on this team?
« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2018, 10:22:51 AM »

Offline Big333223

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No Troz3? Let the flaming of Chilly Willy begin for mentioning him!
Rozier is by no means my choice but if Semi makes the poll Rozier probably should as he's one of the better on-ball defenders on the team and probably the best at staying in front of quicker guards and really pressuring the ball.

I voted Smart although it disappoints me to see how few votes Horford is getting. He's a very smart defender, always knows where he should be and where everyone else is, and is surprisingly quick for a guy who is so slow end-to-end.
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Re: Who is the best/most complete defender on this team?
« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2018, 10:42:38 AM »

Offline azzenfrost

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I have to say Smart. There's aggression in his defense. Sometimes, pure will.
I moved the cheese.

Re: Who is the best/most complete defender on this team?
« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2018, 11:14:00 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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Horford.

Re: Who is the best/most complete defender on this team?
« Reply #5 on: January 08, 2018, 11:29:41 AM »

Offline keevsnick

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Now this is a hard one. I'd say it has to be one of Smart, Brown or Horford. Horford is fundamentally sound but isn't gonna lock anybody down, he ma also be the bets of the three at help defense. One on one I'd want Jaylen, he can stay in front of anybody and he never stops pursuing even when he gets caught on a screen. He may have the highest upside defensively of the three. Smart is just relentless, but he is a bit too foul prone and has trouble sticking with the fats guards at times. Still, I'd go smart. He just rips the ball out of someones hands once a game.

Re: Who is the best/most complete defender on this team?
« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2018, 11:32:13 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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Brown still is figuring it out, he's really good overall but you can see he still struggles at times against various veterans. First year as a primary rotation player though so I don't mind too much.

It is Horford for me by a pretty big margin over Marcus.

Re: Who is the best/most complete defender on this team?
« Reply #7 on: January 08, 2018, 11:42:19 AM »

Offline eja117

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This was a no brainer for me. I picked Smart immediately. I've seen him do things that seemed almost impossible. I'm not necessarily saying his defense is perfect or always on all the time or as great as the hype, but give a dog his due please.

I just went with....who would you most want not to be defended by. Like you have to score and your life depends on it or....one of them has to defend you and their livlihood depends on it....it was just an easy decision.

Re: Who is the best/most complete defender on this team?
« Reply #8 on: January 08, 2018, 11:44:20 AM »

Offline Chris22

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I have to go with Smart.
If there is a loose ball, Smart's coming out of the pack with it.

Tommy to Mike Gorman, "What do you think is Smart's best position?"

Mike to Tommy, "Strong safety."

Re: Who is the best/most complete defender on this team?
« Reply #9 on: January 08, 2018, 01:31:34 PM »

Offline td450

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My take is Brown is the best/most complete defender.

Smart makes the most impressive plays, but there are scorers who shoot with range that he just can't contain. Jaylen covers more space than anyone else on the team. Whether its Curry, Harden, Giannis or LeBron, if there are 10 seconds left, I'd rather have Jaylen covering them before anyone else.

Re: Who is the best/most complete defender on this team?
« Reply #10 on: January 08, 2018, 02:00:30 PM »

Offline Sophomore

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Smart over Brown by a nose.

I've seen Smart do things that are unpossible. Like checking Millsap in the playoffs two years ago, when Millsap had been unstoppable. Like the other night, when he got stuck on KAT pretty close to the block and goaded him into a miss. He was our best defender against Wall in the playoff series last year, even though he's not as quick as Avery. You could go on and on.

Jaylen has potential, but he still bites on upfakes and hasn't shown that genius Marcus has for positioning.

Al is also very, very solid, but he's not one of the speediest 4s laterally, which means he's not at the tip-top. Marcus and to a lesser extent Jaylen, are more unique.

Re: Who is the best/most complete defender on this team?
« Reply #11 on: January 08, 2018, 03:01:56 PM »

Offline colincb

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The answer is constrained by how the question was framed. For example: playing big minutes. Nothing said about being able to really defend bigs down low or defensive rebounding either.


The guys consistently on top of the advanced defensive stats are Baynes (#1 in NBA defensive real +/-), Horford, and Theis (#1 in defensive rating among players with any real minutes).


Horford's playing the most minutes of that trio and is my pick.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2018, 03:26:27 PM by colincb »
This is all about money laundering.

Re: Who is the best/most complete defender on this team?
« Reply #12 on: January 08, 2018, 03:46:28 PM »

Offline Androslav

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The answer is constrained by how the question was framed. For example: playing big minutes. Nothing said about being able to really defend bigs down low or defensive rebounding either.

The guys consistently on top of the advanced defensive stats are Baynes (#1 in NBA defensive real +/-), Horford, and Theis (#1 in defensive rating among players with any real minutes).

Horford's playing the most minutes of that trio and is my pick.

Thanks for the tip.

Defend bigs down low - would fit under the:
- Can't be backed down easily.
- Protects the rim like a cradle of his newborn baby

Defensive rebounding - would be
- Boxes out with discipline and regularity.
I did add it though. I knew I didn't grasp all of the defensive workload in my initial post.
For me it is not that important that the player gets credited for the board. If the team secures the ball, even better if TRoz or Kyrie get it, semi fast break can evolve in a second.

If a player can't play big minutes, than he either is not as good as his oponents are (and is therefore benched) or he is not reliable enough (injuries, foul trouble, technicals, suspensions or conditioning)
« Last Edit: January 08, 2018, 04:31:00 PM by Androslav »
"The joy of the balling under the rims."

Re: Who is the best/most complete defender on this team?
« Reply #13 on: January 08, 2018, 04:15:50 PM »

Offline Fireworks_Boom!

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How is Jayson Tatum not on this list?

I'm stunned by how amazing this kid is at both ends of the floor. His length (both height and arms) is amazing. Whoever he is matched up against is in for a long night.

I've watched him all season long and obviously have been impressed with his offensive capabilities (ability to create, take the big shot, and shooting). But his defense might be the most shocking thing about him.

Re: Who is the best/most complete defender on this team?
« Reply #14 on: January 08, 2018, 04:49:19 PM »

Offline Boris Badenov

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What's truly amazing here is the depth. For someone like Ojeleye or Rozier or Baynes to be something like the 6th best defender on their own team...think about that.

Heck, Tatum is a terrific defender, rookie or not, and he is barely in the conversation.

Really happy with the way this year has played out. I much prefer rooting for teams that thrive on defense, and know how to turn it up on that end in close games.