Author Topic: ESPN Patriots Article (MERGED)  (Read 4630 times)

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Re: Just found this on 98.5 Twitter page...
« Reply #30 on: January 05, 2018, 03:35:33 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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What was weird about the timing of the trade?

They didn't trade him in that off season, because they needed to see if Brady could still actually make it happen in games.

Once they got up to the deadline, and Brady still clearly has 'it's, they faced the choice of keeping Jimmy and losing him for nothing at the end of the season for nothing, or getting something for him now.

I am not saying the Kraft-Brady deal didn't occur, and it seems certainly possible,  but the timing of this trade was not in any way "weird".

Get a high second, or a late third comp pick.

Or trade Brady.

But something had to be done. Keeping both was not an option.

Yea I agree that it could definitely be this, or any number of other reasons (or the story could be mostly true too). It could be that the staff didn't like the way Garrapolo was looking in practice. It could be that Graapolo's agent made it clear in September (but not May) that was he would never sign here this offseason. It could be that the team thought Brady looked better than he would at age 40 and became more comfortable. The timing of the article also seems like it has an agenda of trying to disrupt the playoffs right before the playoffs start.
If anyone on the Patriots staff didn't like how Jimmy G was looking, they should be fired immediately because Jimmy G clearly has that special factor.  Look at what he did for San Fran.

Ok so I listed 3 reasons and you disagree with 1. Are the other two not believable?

Also interesting to think about this comparison:

Colin Kaepernick last five full games in 2016:

64.6 completion percentage on 164 attempts
1,093 passing yards for 9 TD, 2 INT and passer rating of 96.9
27 rushes for 188 yards and 1 TD

Jimmy Garoppolo last five full games in 2017:

67.1 completion percentage on 176 attempts
1,542 passing yards for 6 TD, 5 INT and passer rating of 94.0
14 rushes for 7 yards and 1 TD

I think Garoppolo could be an excellent player, but he is definitely getting a ton of extra hype from the fact that the 49ers got a streak going with 2 impressive wins and 3 games they may have won anyways (in the final week the Rams start Mannion at qb and Brown at RB).

I think he could very well have a great year next year, but lets not assume he is all-time great just yet.

I saw that garbage stat/argument today. Funny how the article never mentioned that the 49ers got worse every year Kaepernick played. And in those final 6 games, I believe his record was 1-5. Jimmy G started the last 5 games for a 1-10 team and still went 5-0, while taking two snaps or so as a sub in that first game (to come up with their 6 game argument). Also, lost in the argument, is the fact that Kaepernick was already a 5 year starter, while Jimmy G had only started 2 or 3 games previously in his career. Talk about cherry picking stats to try to make an argument.

I wasn't trying to say Jimmy G won't be better than Kapernick, but point out how much of the hype is tied to the record. He definitely deserves lots of credit for a great start, but it would be about half the hype if he was 2-3 or 1-4 and their defense certainly played well at the end of the season. In their win over the bears they won without even getting a touchdown. Against the  Texans they went up against a turd sandwich of Savage and Yates. The games against the Rams was against all backups.  Would like to see how he performs over the course of the next year before I call him a top ten qb etc as others have started to say.

Re: Just found this on 98.5 Twitter page...
« Reply #31 on: January 05, 2018, 03:39:51 PM »

Online gouki88

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What was weird about the timing of the trade?

They didn't trade him in that off season, because they needed to see if Brady could still actually make it happen in games.

Once they got up to the deadline, and Brady still clearly has 'it's, they faced the choice of keeping Jimmy and losing him for nothing at the end of the season for nothing, or getting something for him now.

I am not saying the Kraft-Brady deal didn't occur, and it seems certainly possible,  but the timing of this trade was not in any way "weird".

Get a high second, or a late third comp pick.

Or trade Brady.

But something had to be done. Keeping both was not an option.

Yea I agree that it could definitely be this, or any number of other reasons (or the story could be mostly true too). It could be that the staff didn't like the way Garrapolo was looking in practice. It could be that Graapolo's agent made it clear in September (but not May) that was he would never sign here this offseason. It could be that the team thought Brady looked better than he would at age 40 and became more comfortable. The timing of the article also seems like it has an agenda of trying to disrupt the playoffs right before the playoffs start.
If anyone on the Patriots staff didn't like how Jimmy G was looking, they should be fired immediately because Jimmy G clearly has that special factor.  Look at what he did for San Fran.

Ok so I listed 3 reasons and you disagree with 1. Are the other two not believable?

Also interesting to think about this comparison:

Colin Kaepernick last five full games in 2016:

64.6 completion percentage on 164 attempts
1,093 passing yards for 9 TD, 2 INT and passer rating of 96.9
27 rushes for 188 yards and 1 TD

Jimmy Garoppolo last five full games in 2017:

67.1 completion percentage on 176 attempts
1,542 passing yards for 6 TD, 5 INT and passer rating of 94.0
14 rushes for 7 yards and 1 TD

I think Garoppolo could be an excellent player, but he is definitely getting a ton of extra hype from the fact that the 49ers got a streak going with 2 impressive wins and 3 games they may have won anyways (in the final week the Rams start Mannion at qb and Brown at RB).

I think he could very well have a great year next year, but lets not assume he is all-time great just yet.

I saw that garbage stat/argument today. Funny how the article never mentioned that the 49ers got worse every year Kaepernick played. And in those final 6 games, I believe his record was 1-5. Jimmy G started the last 5 games for a 1-10 team and still went 5-0, while taking two snaps or so as a sub in that first game (to come up with their 6 game argument). Also, lost in the argument, is the fact that Kaepernick was already a 5 year starter, while Jimmy G had only started 2 or 3 games previously in his career. Talk about cherry picking stats to try to make an argument.

I wasn't trying to say Jimmy G won't be better than Kapernick, but point out how much of the hype is tied to the record. He definitely deserves lots of credit for a great start, but it would be about half the hype if he was 2-3 or 1-4 and their defense certainly played well at the end of the season. In their win over the bears they won without even getting a touchdown. Against the  Texans they went up against a turd sandwich of Savage and Yates. The games against the Rams was against all backups.  Would like to see how he performs over the course of the next year before I call him a top ten qb etc as others have started to say.
TP, agree completely. People have jumped the gun entirely - probably out of spite towards the Pats

Re: Just found this on 98.5 Twitter page...
« Reply #32 on: January 05, 2018, 03:49:47 PM »

Offline Moranis

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I don't think anyone is calling him a top 10 QB, but Jimmy G can clearly play and the Patriots knew it.  They would have traded him to the Browns before the last draft for 12 (and maybe more) if they didn't think he had special talent.  But that is what makes the timing of the trade so weird.  They waited until his value was the smallest it was ever going to be.  They traded him when he was 1 of just 2 QB's on the roster.  They traded him when they didn't have to because they always could have just put a franchise tag on him and ensured they kept him (or could have traded him after the tagging when his value would have been higher).  It just doesn't make sense as a Bill move, so Bill was almost certainly not behind it, and if Bill wasn't behind it, that speaks to a much larger issue in the organization, because Bill has been behind every move for years.

Re: Just found this on 98.5 Twitter page...
« Reply #33 on: January 05, 2018, 03:51:51 PM »

Offline johnnygreen

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What was weird about the timing of the trade?

They didn't trade him in that off season, because they needed to see if Brady could still actually make it happen in games.

Once they got up to the deadline, and Brady still clearly has 'it's, they faced the choice of keeping Jimmy and losing him for nothing at the end of the season for nothing, or getting something for him now.

I am not saying the Kraft-Brady deal didn't occur, and it seems certainly possible,  but the timing of this trade was not in any way "weird".

Get a high second, or a late third comp pick.

Or trade Brady.

But something had to be done. Keeping both was not an option.

Yea I agree that it could definitely be this, or any number of other reasons (or the story could be mostly true too). It could be that the staff didn't like the way Garrapolo was looking in practice. It could be that Graapolo's agent made it clear in September (but not May) that was he would never sign here this offseason. It could be that the team thought Brady looked better than he would at age 40 and became more comfortable. The timing of the article also seems like it has an agenda of trying to disrupt the playoffs right before the playoffs start.
If anyone on the Patriots staff didn't like how Jimmy G was looking, they should be fired immediately because Jimmy G clearly has that special factor.  Look at what he did for San Fran.

Ok so I listed 3 reasons and you disagree with 1. Are the other two not believable?

Also interesting to think about this comparison:

Colin Kaepernick last five full games in 2016:

64.6 completion percentage on 164 attempts
1,093 passing yards for 9 TD, 2 INT and passer rating of 96.9
27 rushes for 188 yards and 1 TD

Jimmy Garoppolo last five full games in 2017:

67.1 completion percentage on 176 attempts
1,542 passing yards for 6 TD, 5 INT and passer rating of 94.0
14 rushes for 7 yards and 1 TD

I think Garoppolo could be an excellent player, but he is definitely getting a ton of extra hype from the fact that the 49ers got a streak going with 2 impressive wins and 3 games they may have won anyways (in the final week the Rams start Mannion at qb and Brown at RB).

I think he could very well have a great year next year, but lets not assume he is all-time great just yet.

I saw that garbage stat/argument today. Funny how the article never mentioned that the 49ers got worse every year Kaepernick played. And in those final 6 games, I believe his record was 1-5. Jimmy G started the last 5 games for a 1-10 team and still went 5-0, while taking two snaps or so as a sub in that first game (to come up with their 6 game argument). Also, lost in the argument, is the fact that Kaepernick was already a 5 year starter, while Jimmy G had only started 2 or 3 games previously in his career. Talk about cherry picking stats to try to make an argument.

I wasn't trying to say Jimmy G won't be better than Kapernick, but point out how much of the hype is tied to the record. He definitely deserves lots of credit for a great start, but it would be about half the hype if he was 2-3 or 1-4 and their defense certainly played well at the end of the season. In their win over the bears they won without even getting a touchdown. Against the  Texans they went up against a turd sandwich of Savage and Yates. The games against the Rams was against all backups.  Would like to see how he performs over the course of the next year before I call him a top ten qb etc as others have started to say.
TP, agree completely. People have jumped the gun entirely - probably out of spite towards the Pats

You guys have got to be kidding me. If Brady was traded to the 49ers instead and went 5-0, you guys would say that is why Brady is the GOAT. The fact of the matter is Jimmy G did go 5-0 on a 1-10 team. He did have end of games drives to put his team in a position to win multiple times. During Brady's four game suspension, the talk around here was the Pats could go 0-4. Amazingly enough, the Pats went 3-1 with apparently two scrubs. To me, that says either Brady's backups were good, or Brady might be the most overrated player in history because anyone could win on the Pats team.

Re: Just found this on 98.5 Twitter page...
« Reply #34 on: January 05, 2018, 04:01:55 PM »

Offline kraidstar

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Kraft has meddled before, and he's driven away great coaches before.

He had an infamously poor relationship with Bill Parcells, which led to Parcells leaving immediately after a Super Bowl appearance.

He admits to not giving Pete Carroll the power to implement his vision:
http://www.patriots.com/video/2015/01/31/new-england-patriots-owner-robert-kraft-didnt-give-pete-carroll-power-he-should

And now this nonsense with BB.

We're seeing a pattern here. If he's smart Kraft steps back, apologizes profusely, and gives Belichick complete power from here on out.

Re: Just found this on 98.5 Twitter page...
« Reply #35 on: January 05, 2018, 04:05:17 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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What was weird about the timing of the trade?

They didn't trade him in that off season, because they needed to see if Brady could still actually make it happen in games.

Once they got up to the deadline, and Brady still clearly has 'it's, they faced the choice of keeping Jimmy and losing him for nothing at the end of the season for nothing, or getting something for him now.

I am not saying the Kraft-Brady deal didn't occur, and it seems certainly possible,  but the timing of this trade was not in any way "weird".

Get a high second, or a late third comp pick.

Or trade Brady.

But something had to be done. Keeping both was not an option.

Yea I agree that it could definitely be this, or any number of other reasons (or the story could be mostly true too). It could be that the staff didn't like the way Garrapolo was looking in practice. It could be that Graapolo's agent made it clear in September (but not May) that was he would never sign here this offseason. It could be that the team thought Brady looked better than he would at age 40 and became more comfortable. The timing of the article also seems like it has an agenda of trying to disrupt the playoffs right before the playoffs start.
If anyone on the Patriots staff didn't like how Jimmy G was looking, they should be fired immediately because Jimmy G clearly has that special factor.  Look at what he did for San Fran.

Ok so I listed 3 reasons and you disagree with 1. Are the other two not believable?

Also interesting to think about this comparison:

Colin Kaepernick last five full games in 2016:

64.6 completion percentage on 164 attempts
1,093 passing yards for 9 TD, 2 INT and passer rating of 96.9
27 rushes for 188 yards and 1 TD

Jimmy Garoppolo last five full games in 2017:

67.1 completion percentage on 176 attempts
1,542 passing yards for 6 TD, 5 INT and passer rating of 94.0
14 rushes for 7 yards and 1 TD

I think Garoppolo could be an excellent player, but he is definitely getting a ton of extra hype from the fact that the 49ers got a streak going with 2 impressive wins and 3 games they may have won anyways (in the final week the Rams start Mannion at qb and Brown at RB).

I think he could very well have a great year next year, but lets not assume he is all-time great just yet.

I saw that garbage stat/argument today. Funny how the article never mentioned that the 49ers got worse every year Kaepernick played. And in those final 6 games, I believe his record was 1-5. Jimmy G started the last 5 games for a 1-10 team and still went 5-0, while taking two snaps or so as a sub in that first game (to come up with their 6 game argument). Also, lost in the argument, is the fact that Kaepernick was already a 5 year starter, while Jimmy G had only started 2 or 3 games previously in his career. Talk about cherry picking stats to try to make an argument.

I wasn't trying to say Jimmy G won't be better than Kapernick, but point out how much of the hype is tied to the record. He definitely deserves lots of credit for a great start, but it would be about half the hype if he was 2-3 or 1-4 and their defense certainly played well at the end of the season. In their win over the bears they won without even getting a touchdown. Against the  Texans they went up against a turd sandwich of Savage and Yates. The games against the Rams was against all backups.  Would like to see how he performs over the course of the next year before I call him a top ten qb etc as others have started to say.
TP, agree completely. People have jumped the gun entirely - probably out of spite towards the Pats

You guys have got to be kidding me. If Brady was traded to the 49ers instead and went 5-0, you guys would say that is why Brady is the GOAT. The fact of the matter is Jimmy G did go 5-0 on a 1-10 team. He did have end of games drives to put his team in a position to win multiple times. During Brady's four game suspension, the talk around here was the Pats could go 0-4. Amazingly enough, the Pats went 3-1 with apparently two scrubs. To me, that says either Brady's backups were good, or Brady might be the most overrated player in history because anyone could win on the Pats team.

Obviously fans are going to get more excited than they should. It is part of what being a fan is. So yes I agree we would go nuts if Brady came in and went 5-0. (Heck can you imagine what would happen if he came in and led the Patriots to a super bowl in his first season over a team so good it has the nickname greatest show on turf? I can't imagine what it would be like if that had happened.
All that being said, we can also be realistic when talking about other teams and point out that three of the wins came against seth mannion, tj yates and beating trubinskey on only field goals. It calls for a longer view of him to determine he is going to be a great one.

Re: Just found this on 98.5 Twitter page...
« Reply #36 on: January 05, 2018, 04:08:42 PM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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I think both sides can be right about Jimmy G.  He looks extremely promising as a future starter and possible top 10 QB in the league.  A guy who is worth a top 15 1st round pick.

That said, the sample size is small and he may turn out to be no better than a Joe Flacco or Drew Bledsoe level QB (very good, but not great). But I really doubt he bombs.  The stats of the final 5 games of a team with nothing to lose is a little like 4th quarter stats in a game you trail by 3 touchdowns.  You play a little more loose and freewheeling.  Lots of yards and basically a 1:1 TD:int ratio and a very good completion %.  Promising but not overwhelming.

Re: Just found this on 98.5 Twitter page...
« Reply #37 on: January 05, 2018, 04:11:22 PM »

Offline johnnygreen

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I'm really curious as to Bill's contract. Is it up at the end of the season? If not, how many years are remaining? Does he have an opt out clause that he can exercise?

If Jon Gruden is apparently going back to the Raiders on a 10 year, nearly $100 million contract, then what is Belichick worth on the open market? If Bill retired or changed franchises this offseason, then that would be one of the biggest moves in the history of the league.

Re: Just found this on 98.5 Twitter page...
« Reply #38 on: January 05, 2018, 04:21:10 PM »

Offline wayupnorth

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What was weird about the timing of the trade?

They didn't trade him in that off season, because they needed to see if Brady could still actually make it happen in games.

Once they got up to the deadline, and Brady still clearly has 'it's, they faced the choice of keeping Jimmy and losing him for nothing at the end of the season for nothing, or getting something for him now.

I am not saying the Kraft-Brady deal didn't occur, and it seems certainly possible,  but the timing of this trade was not in any way "weird".

Get a high second, or a late third comp pick.

Or trade Brady.

But something had to be done. Keeping both was not an option.
But why trade Brisset if you are thinking you might trade Jimmy G later in the year?  And they absolutely could have franchised Jimmy G this offseason and either kept both or traded one of them after the franchise tag.  To do that, the Patriots would have just needed the cap space to apply the franchise tag. 

It just feels like a rushed trade out of nowhere, which tends to lend a lot of credence to the fact that it came from ownership and not someone like Bill, who is always so calculated and plans for everything.

Because you feel Jacoby brings nothing they can't find out of a FA and had the opportunity to get something for him.

And franchising Jimmy was not an option, realistically.

Jimmy would have made noise about that.

There is no chance they would pay 24 million or so for a a backup QB.

One had to go, that is the truth and the bottom line. Maybe Kraft stepped in to make that decision, I don't know, but I do know that the timing of the trade was not unusual. They had to see if Tom still had it, so they didn't trade him in the off season, and Tom showed he had it so they had to trade one of them, or end up losing one for nothing.

Re: Just found this on 98.5 Twitter page...
« Reply #39 on: January 05, 2018, 04:27:59 PM »

Offline johnnygreen

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What was weird about the timing of the trade?

They didn't trade him in that off season, because they needed to see if Brady could still actually make it happen in games.

Once they got up to the deadline, and Brady still clearly has 'it's, they faced the choice of keeping Jimmy and losing him for nothing at the end of the season for nothing, or getting something for him now.

I am not saying the Kraft-Brady deal didn't occur, and it seems certainly possible,  but the timing of this trade was not in any way "weird".

Get a high second, or a late third comp pick.

Or trade Brady.

But something had to be done. Keeping both was not an option.

Yea I agree that it could definitely be this, or any number of other reasons (or the story could be mostly true too). It could be that the staff didn't like the way Garrapolo was looking in practice. It could be that Graapolo's agent made it clear in September (but not May) that was he would never sign here this offseason. It could be that the team thought Brady looked better than he would at age 40 and became more comfortable. The timing of the article also seems like it has an agenda of trying to disrupt the playoffs right before the playoffs start.
If anyone on the Patriots staff didn't like how Jimmy G was looking, they should be fired immediately because Jimmy G clearly has that special factor.  Look at what he did for San Fran.

Ok so I listed 3 reasons and you disagree with 1. Are the other two not believable?

Also interesting to think about this comparison:

Colin Kaepernick last five full games in 2016:

64.6 completion percentage on 164 attempts
1,093 passing yards for 9 TD, 2 INT and passer rating of 96.9
27 rushes for 188 yards and 1 TD

Jimmy Garoppolo last five full games in 2017:

67.1 completion percentage on 176 attempts
1,542 passing yards for 6 TD, 5 INT and passer rating of 94.0
14 rushes for 7 yards and 1 TD

I think Garoppolo could be an excellent player, but he is definitely getting a ton of extra hype from the fact that the 49ers got a streak going with 2 impressive wins and 3 games they may have won anyways (in the final week the Rams start Mannion at qb and Brown at RB).

I think he could very well have a great year next year, but lets not assume he is all-time great just yet.

I saw that garbage stat/argument today. Funny how the article never mentioned that the 49ers got worse every year Kaepernick played. And in those final 6 games, I believe his record was 1-5. Jimmy G started the last 5 games for a 1-10 team and still went 5-0, while taking two snaps or so as a sub in that first game (to come up with their 6 game argument). Also, lost in the argument, is the fact that Kaepernick was already a 5 year starter, while Jimmy G had only started 2 or 3 games previously in his career. Talk about cherry picking stats to try to make an argument.

I wasn't trying to say Jimmy G won't be better than Kapernick, but point out how much of the hype is tied to the record. He definitely deserves lots of credit for a great start, but it would be about half the hype if he was 2-3 or 1-4 and their defense certainly played well at the end of the season. In their win over the bears they won without even getting a touchdown. Against the  Texans they went up against a turd sandwich of Savage and Yates. The games against the Rams was against all backups.  Would like to see how he performs over the course of the next year before I call him a top ten qb etc as others have started to say.
TP, agree completely. People have jumped the gun entirely - probably out of spite towards the Pats

You guys have got to be kidding me. If Brady was traded to the 49ers instead and went 5-0, you guys would say that is why Brady is the GOAT. The fact of the matter is Jimmy G did go 5-0 on a 1-10 team. He did have end of games drives to put his team in a position to win multiple times. During Brady's four game suspension, the talk around here was the Pats could go 0-4. Amazingly enough, the Pats went 3-1 with apparently two scrubs. To me, that says either Brady's backups were good, or Brady might be the most overrated player in history because anyone could win on the Pats team.

Obviously fans are going to get more excited than they should. It is part of what being a fan is. So yes I agree we would go nuts if Brady came in and went 5-0. (Heck can you imagine what would happen if he came in and led the Patriots to a super bowl in his first season over a team so good it has the nickname greatest show on turf? I can't imagine what it would be like if that had happened.
All that being said, we can also be realistic when talking about other teams and point out that three of the wins came against seth mannion, tj yates and beating trubinskey on only field goals. It calls for a longer view of him to determine he is going to be a great one.

The QB's you listed sound like the AFC East QB's the Pats have faced for the past 10 years or so. BTW, I do like how you conveniently left out the two playoff teams Jimmy G beat, that were still trying to win.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to make the argument that he is a great quarterback. He looks like a difference maker, and I'm not sure how many QB's could have went 5-0 on that 49ers team.

Re: Just found this on 98.5 Twitter page...
« Reply #40 on: January 05, 2018, 05:12:32 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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What was weird about the timing of the trade?

They didn't trade him in that off season, because they needed to see if Brady could still actually make it happen in games.

Once they got up to the deadline, and Brady still clearly has 'it's, they faced the choice of keeping Jimmy and losing him for nothing at the end of the season for nothing, or getting something for him now.

I am not saying the Kraft-Brady deal didn't occur, and it seems certainly possible,  but the timing of this trade was not in any way "weird".

Get a high second, or a late third comp pick.

Or trade Brady.

But something had to be done. Keeping both was not an option.

Yea I agree that it could definitely be this, or any number of other reasons (or the story could be mostly true too). It could be that the staff didn't like the way Garrapolo was looking in practice. It could be that Graapolo's agent made it clear in September (but not May) that was he would never sign here this offseason. It could be that the team thought Brady looked better than he would at age 40 and became more comfortable. The timing of the article also seems like it has an agenda of trying to disrupt the playoffs right before the playoffs start.
If anyone on the Patriots staff didn't like how Jimmy G was looking, they should be fired immediately because Jimmy G clearly has that special factor.  Look at what he did for San Fran.

Ok so I listed 3 reasons and you disagree with 1. Are the other two not believable?

Also interesting to think about this comparison:

Colin Kaepernick last five full games in 2016:

64.6 completion percentage on 164 attempts
1,093 passing yards for 9 TD, 2 INT and passer rating of 96.9
27 rushes for 188 yards and 1 TD

Jimmy Garoppolo last five full games in 2017:

67.1 completion percentage on 176 attempts
1,542 passing yards for 6 TD, 5 INT and passer rating of 94.0
14 rushes for 7 yards and 1 TD

I think Garoppolo could be an excellent player, but he is definitely getting a ton of extra hype from the fact that the 49ers got a streak going with 2 impressive wins and 3 games they may have won anyways (in the final week the Rams start Mannion at qb and Brown at RB).

I think he could very well have a great year next year, but lets not assume he is all-time great just yet.

I saw that garbage stat/argument today. Funny how the article never mentioned that the 49ers got worse every year Kaepernick played. And in those final 6 games, I believe his record was 1-5. Jimmy G started the last 5 games for a 1-10 team and still went 5-0, while taking two snaps or so as a sub in that first game (to come up with their 6 game argument). Also, lost in the argument, is the fact that Kaepernick was already a 5 year starter, while Jimmy G had only started 2 or 3 games previously in his career. Talk about cherry picking stats to try to make an argument.

I wasn't trying to say Jimmy G won't be better than Kapernick, but point out how much of the hype is tied to the record. He definitely deserves lots of credit for a great start, but it would be about half the hype if he was 2-3 or 1-4 and their defense certainly played well at the end of the season. In their win over the bears they won without even getting a touchdown. Against the  Texans they went up against a turd sandwich of Savage and Yates. The games against the Rams was against all backups.  Would like to see how he performs over the course of the next year before I call him a top ten qb etc as others have started to say.
TP, agree completely. People have jumped the gun entirely - probably out of spite towards the Pats

You guys have got to be kidding me. If Brady was traded to the 49ers instead and went 5-0, you guys would say that is why Brady is the GOAT. The fact of the matter is Jimmy G did go 5-0 on a 1-10 team. He did have end of games drives to put his team in a position to win multiple times. During Brady's four game suspension, the talk around here was the Pats could go 0-4. Amazingly enough, the Pats went 3-1 with apparently two scrubs. To me, that says either Brady's backups were good, or Brady might be the most overrated player in history because anyone could win on the Pats team.

Obviously fans are going to get more excited than they should. It is part of what being a fan is. So yes I agree we would go nuts if Brady came in and went 5-0. (Heck can you imagine what would happen if he came in and led the Patriots to a super bowl in his first season over a team so good it has the nickname greatest show on turf? I can't imagine what it would be like if that had happened.
All that being said, we can also be realistic when talking about other teams and point out that three of the wins came against seth mannion, tj yates and beating trubinskey on only field goals. It calls for a longer view of him to determine he is going to be a great one.

The QB's you listed sound like the AFC East QB's the Pats have faced for the past 10 years or so. BTW, I do like how you conveniently left out the two playoff teams Jimmy G beat, that were still trying to win.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to make the argument that he is a great quarterback. He looks like a difference maker, and I'm not sure how many QB's could have went 5-0 on that 49ers team.

Umm no. Yates was the 3rd string qb. Mannion has never thrown a career touchdown in 3 seasons and has 235 yards across 3 seasons. Trubinsky (who i think could eventually be good) has as many career tds and ints and a qbr of 28.

By comparison the maligned Tyrrod Taylor has 14 tds and 4 interceptions and more than twice the QBR. McNown had 18 tds and 9 interceptions and also twice the QBR. Even walking joke Jay Cutler crushes those guys. So your comment is not accurate.

Regarding the two playoff wins they certainly were impressive. The defense probably did win that jags game for them with a pick 6 and two other interception that set them up for two different 20 yard touchdown drives. Jimmy G actually only had 238 yards and an interception (that was a pick 6) in that game.

I do live in the Bay Area, and regrettably the last few years at least, they are sometimes the only game on at 1 pm without NFL Sunday Ticket. So I watched most of these games and can tell you pretty realistically that the reason they went 5-0 was part jimmy g playing well, part defense playing very well, and partly games against terrible teams with backup or third string qbs. I don't really get how that is controversial. 
« Last Edit: January 05, 2018, 05:22:08 PM by celticsclay »

Re: Just found this on 98.5 Twitter page...
« Reply #41 on: January 05, 2018, 07:00:39 PM »

Offline Big333223

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I laughed pretty hard at this part of the piece:

Quote
Guerrero says he received a degree in traditional Chinese medicine from the now-closed Samra University of Oriental Medicine in Los Angeles

Sounds legit.
1957, 1959, 1960, 1961, 1962, 1963, 1964, 1965, 1966, 1968, 1969, 1974, 1976, 1981, 1984, 1986, 2008, 2019

Re: Just found this on 98.5 Twitter page...
« Reply #42 on: January 05, 2018, 07:29:53 PM »

Offline Fan from VT

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I think this was a tough situation for the pats, in a win-win but no-win kind of a way. I think they knew jimmy was good. Of course. Thats why they kept him number 2 on the depth chart. I think belichek wants to win a superbowl every year he coaches, so they kept jimmy as a very good backup as long as they could. I think they also kept him as long as they could in case brady just broke down, then jimmy just slides in. But Brady might win the mvp and wants to play 3 more years. There is no way to keep both beyond this year. So, do you trade jimmy and go all in the next 3 years or do you keep them until the end of the season and cut the GOAT/league mvp/all-franchise player?

Re: Just found this on 98.5 Twitter page...
« Reply #43 on: January 08, 2018, 09:44:20 AM »

Offline Moranis

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So adding another strange wrinkle is the fact that it appears the Patriots only spoke to the Niners and no other team before trading Jimmy G.  The Browns were apparently willing to offer the Houston 1st (and maybe more) and would work with the Pats on finding a back-up QB, but were continually and consistently told Jimmy G wasn't available (one of those calls was 2 days before he was traded).

http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/index.ssf/2018/01/how_cleveland_browns_were_froz.html#incart_2box

Re: Just found this on 98.5 Twitter page...
« Reply #44 on: January 08, 2018, 10:01:21 AM »

Offline JBcat

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So adding another strange wrinkle is the fact that it appears the Patriots only spoke to the Niners and no other team before trading Jimmy G.  The Browns were apparently willing to offer the Houston 1st (and maybe more) and would work with the Pats on finding a back-up QB, but were continually and consistently told Jimmy G wasn't available (one of those calls was 2 days before he was traded).

http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/index.ssf/2018/01/how_cleveland_browns_were_froz.html#incart_2box

I’d rather him go to the NFC anyway.