Author Topic: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick  (Read 4081 times)

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Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #60 on: December 06, 2017, 10:15:01 PM »

Offline jambr380

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Yeah, as someone who was (and still is) not a supporter of the trade, I can safely say I was in the minority from Day 1.

What needs to happen for you to change your mind? A ring? The pick to be in the 20's? Or is it a principled position?

I am actually surprised to see SL take this position.

I imagine he isn't this extreme, but for some people, it's not even about where the pick lands, but how the player taken with the pick (or within range of the pick) turns out. Regardless of how great (and young) Kyrie is and continues to be, it could be 5-7 years before those against the trade finally accept (or reject) it.

What they aren't taking into consideration is IT's age, health, and contract situation and the fact that we are now set to compete for the present and the future with Kyrie at the helm. As I recall, SL was also a huge fan of Crowder's contract (me, too, btw).

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #61 on: December 06, 2017, 10:45:15 PM »

Online slamtheking

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no sympathy for Cleveland regarding the pick.  predicted Nets with top 8 pick before the season started.  still well within the probably range for the pick.

still think we overpaid.  Kyrie's been amazing and better for this team than IT IMO which is what I expected but there should have been protections on that Brooklyn pick.  if nothing else but a top-1 protection like the one Philly put on the Laker/Sac pick

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #62 on: December 08, 2017, 12:15:19 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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This thread keeps giving. Following the Nets upset win over the Thunder:

"I know I'm quite far from the only one but I've said it a few times starting with opening night that this pick wasn't going to be the uber premier pick we all hoped it would be, and every time got funny's and disagrees. Well now none of us are laughing, d&*%s."

and my personal favorite: "Hope we can avoid Brooklyn in the playoffs."
« Last Edit: December 08, 2017, 12:23:56 PM by celticsclay »

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #63 on: December 08, 2017, 12:49:37 PM »

Offline Granath

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Yeah, as someone who was (and still is) not a supporter of the trade, I can safely say I was in the minority from Day 1.

What needs to happen for you to change your mind? A ring? The pick to be in the 20's? Or is it a principled position?

I am actually surprised to see SL take this position.

I imagine he isn't this extreme, but for some people, it's not even about where the pick lands, but how the player taken with the pick (or within range of the pick) turns out. Regardless of how great (and young) Kyrie is and continues to be, it could be 5-7 years before those against the trade finally accept (or reject) it.

What they aren't taking into consideration is IT's age, health, and contract situation and the fact that we are now set to compete for the present and the future with Kyrie at the helm. As I recall, SL was also a huge fan of Crowder's contract (me, too, btw).

I can't speak for SL but I'm also still cautious about this trade (which is a couple of steps up from where I started).

The current situation far improves my opinion of the trade. After all, everything that could go right for the Celtics in this deal has gone right (or wrong from Cleveland's standpoint):

- IT is still hurt
- Crowder isn't playing particularly well
- Zizic isn't seeing the floor.
- The Nets have 10 wins before January
- Kyrie is playing defense (although that's slipped lately), has been relatively healthy and hasn't fallen off the (flat) Earth
- The Cs are winning

Much of that could not be reasonably predicted when this deal was done. As I've said before, it's all coming up Millhouse for Ainge. But there's a lot that could still reasonably happen to make this deal go south again.

- Irving could choose not to re-sign in two years
- Irving could go back to playing no defense (this is more of a concern lately) or get hurt and start playing 50 games again (as he's been prone to do)
- IT could get perfectly healthy and with that injury may resign for less than the max
- Brooklyn could go on a losing streak and the pick ends up being Bagley who looks more and more like a generational talent

Is any of that likely to happen? Probably not but any single one of those really colors the deal. Then there's the normal stuff - IT coming back and playing well, Crowder's shooting has been improving, Zizic will improve, etc.

So I'm not sure that there will be a verdict on this for a while yet. If the Cs win the title then that's the definitive answer. Let's hope for that outcome.
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Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #64 on: December 08, 2017, 01:10:47 PM »

Offline triboy16f

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Time for Okafor and Nik to have breakout seasons...go Nets!!

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #65 on: December 08, 2017, 01:12:36 PM »

Offline CelticsElite

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They're panicking big time after that win over okc. There's 5 to 10 pages of posts since last night

"Also, I know it's crying over spilt milk because there really wasn't a better deal out there, but if IT doesn't come back as IT from last year, the trade for Kyrie will go down as one of the biggest trade thefts ever."

"Eh it's more just the frustration seeping out over Danny Ainge cackling to the bank after dumping this asset right when it peaked. Anyone who watched them coached by Atkinson last season knew they were poised to make a leap. It's getting to that time when people on this forum stop deluding themselves about this being the most valuable asset in the league."

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #66 on: December 08, 2017, 01:24:25 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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They're panicking big time after that win over okc. There's 5 to 10 pages of posts since last night

"Also, I know it's crying over spilt milk because there really wasn't a better deal out there, but if IT doesn't come back as IT from last year, the trade for Kyrie will go down as one of the biggest trade thefts ever."

"Eh it's more just the frustration seeping out over Danny Ainge cackling to the bank after dumping this asset right when it peaked. Anyone who watched them coached by Atkinson last season knew they were poised to make a leap. It's getting to that time when people on this forum stop deluding themselves about this being the most valuable asset in the league."

great ones. I know we would be losing our mind over that game last night if we still had the pick.

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #67 on: December 08, 2017, 02:13:23 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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Lebron might be sensing the pic won't be high enough to get a top STAR to join him.   He knew they could get Love with that pick when he fled Heat.

If Lebron thinks the FO won't spend the pic on getting him another star or the pick looks to be out of top 5-6 ......Lebron sees the writing on the wall.   I thinking he is skeptical Cavs would resign IT for a max no matter how his hip plays out .   

Leaving Bron with midget with a bad hip and no top 5 draft pick is gonna push him out the door.

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #68 on: December 08, 2017, 04:04:07 PM »

Offline rondofan1255

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They're panicking big time after that win over okc. There's 5 to 10 pages of posts since last night

"Also, I know it's crying over spilt milk because there really wasn't a better deal out there, but if IT doesn't come back as IT from last year, the trade for Kyrie will go down as one of the biggest trade thefts ever."

"Eh it's more just the frustration seeping out over Danny Ainge cackling to the bank after dumping this asset right when it peaked. Anyone who watched them coached by Atkinson last season knew they were poised to make a leap. It's getting to that time when people on this forum stop deluding themselves about this being the most valuable asset in the league."

great ones. I know we would be losing our mind over that game last night if we still had the pick.

We would be arguing over whether they’re going to make the playoffs.   :P

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #69 on: December 08, 2017, 04:13:05 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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They're panicking big time after that win over okc. There's 5 to 10 pages of posts since last night

"Also, I know it's crying over spilt milk because there really wasn't a better deal out there, but if IT doesn't come back as IT from last year, the trade for Kyrie will go down as one of the biggest trade thefts ever."

"Eh it's more just the frustration seeping out over Danny Ainge cackling to the bank after dumping this asset right when it peaked. Anyone who watched them coached by Atkinson last season knew they were poised to make a leap. It's getting to that time when people on this forum stop deluding themselves about this being the most valuable asset in the league."

great ones. I know we would be losing our mind over that game last night if we still had the pick.

We would be arguing over whether they’re going to make the playoffs.   :P

i hope the cavs play them in the first round of the playoffs somehow...

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #70 on: December 08, 2017, 04:43:16 PM »

Online footey

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They're panicking big time after that win over okc. There's 5 to 10 pages of posts since last night

"Also, I know it's crying over spilt milk because there really wasn't a better deal out there, but if IT doesn't come back as IT from last year, the trade for Kyrie will go down as one of the biggest trade thefts ever."

"Eh it's more just the frustration seeping out over Danny Ainge cackling to the bank after dumping this asset right when it peaked. Anyone who watched them coached by Atkinson last season knew they were poised to make a leap. It's getting to that time when people on this forum stop deluding themselves about this being the most valuable asset in the league."

great ones. I know we would be losing our mind over that game last night if we still had the pick.

We would be arguing over whether they’re going to make the playoffs.   :P

i hope the cavs play them in the first round of the playoffs somehow...

and lose.

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #71 on: December 08, 2017, 04:47:14 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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Time for Okafor and Nik to have breakout seasons...go Nets!!
I really didnt like the Jah trade for us. Liked it for both Philly and Brooklyn.

Okafor is talented, but Booker was such a grinder. Really good defensive player who competes. Have to imagine he contributes more to winning than Jah does for the rest of the year.
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Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #72 on: December 08, 2017, 05:02:38 PM »

Offline Jvalin

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They're panicking big time after that win over okc. There's 5 to 10 pages of posts since last night

"Also, I know it's crying over spilt milk because there really wasn't a better deal out there, but if IT doesn't come back as IT from last year, the trade for Kyrie will go down as one of the biggest trade thefts ever."

"Eh it's more just the frustration seeping out over Danny Ainge cackling to the bank after dumping this asset right when it peaked. Anyone who watched them coached by Atkinson last season knew they were poised to make a leap. It's getting to that time when people on this forum stop deluding themselves about this being the most valuable asset in the league."
Funny thing is, the most valuable asset in the league right now might be the Kings pick and it seems likely that we own that pick! ;D

Imo

Nets pick : mid/late lottery
Lakers pick : mid/late lottery
Kings pick : mid/early lottery

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #73 on: December 08, 2017, 05:12:48 PM »

Offline wayupnorth

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Yeah, as someone who was (and still is) not a supporter of the trade, I can safely say I was in the minority from Day 1.

What needs to happen for you to change your mind? A ring? The pick to be in the 20's? Or is it a principled position?

I am actually surprised to see SL take this position.

I imagine he isn't this extreme, but for some people, it's not even about where the pick lands, but how the player taken with the pick (or within range of the pick) turns out. Regardless of how great (and young) Kyrie is and continues to be, it could be 5-7 years before those against the trade finally accept (or reject) it.

What they aren't taking into consideration is IT's age, health, and contract situation and the fact that we are now set to compete for the present and the future with Kyrie at the helm. As I recall, SL was also a huge fan of Crowder's contract (me, too, btw).

I can't speak for SL but I'm also still cautious about this trade (which is a couple of steps up from where I started).

The current situation far improves my opinion of the trade. After all, everything that could go right for the Celtics in this deal has gone right (or wrong from Cleveland's standpoint):

- IT is still hurt
- Crowder isn't playing particularly well
- Zizic isn't seeing the floor.
- The Nets have 10 wins before January
- Kyrie is playing defense (although that's slipped lately), has been relatively healthy and hasn't fallen off the (flat) Earth
- The Cs are winning

Much of that could not be reasonably predicted when this deal was done. As I've said before, it's all coming up Millhouse for Ainge. But there's a lot that could still reasonably happen to make this deal go south again.

- Irving could choose not to re-sign in two years
- Irving could go back to playing no defense (this is more of a concern lately) or get hurt and start playing 50 games again (as he's been prone to do)
- IT could get perfectly healthy and with that injury may resign for less than the max
- Brooklyn could go on a losing streak and the pick ends up being Bagley who looks more and more like a generational talent

Is any of that likely to happen? Probably not but any single one of those really colors the deal. Then there's the normal stuff - IT coming back and playing well, Crowder's shooting has been improving, Zizic will improve, etc.

So I'm not sure that there will be a verdict on this for a while yet. If the Cs win the title then that's the definitive answer. Let's hope for that outcome.

Major TP's for the "coming up Millhouse" line.

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #74 on: December 08, 2017, 05:29:25 PM »

Offline RIPRED

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not you per se, but everyone in this thread makes it seem like they were always on board with the trade, which just wasn't the case.  Most of this board was very upset when the trade was made, calling for Danny's head, saying we traded a top 3 pick for a lesser player and giving up a starter, etc.

I was always on board with the trade from a talent standpoint, but I was, and still am, sad to see Isaiah go. Kyrie is better than him (it hurts to say that even though I'm basically a Kyrie fanboy at this point), and the team appears to be a lot better with Kyrie--I always assumed that would be the case but it still stung to lose Isaiah who truly embraced playing for this team and seemed to love the city and fans.