Author Topic: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick  (Read 4577 times)

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Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #45 on: December 05, 2017, 06:15:47 PM »

Offline mctyson

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Considering that Kyrie demanded a trade, I thought the Cavs got a terrific deal.  They got a rotation player/starter in Crowder on a bargain contract, an allstar guard (albeit an injured one) in Isaiah, a young big who many on this board thought would have been a lotto pick in this past draft with Zizic, and what will be a top 1-8 lottery pick.  Oh, and they got a decent 2nd rounder tossed in too. 

Usually in the NBA when you trade a disgruntled player that has demanded a trade you get crap in return.  Or certainly, you get 50 to 75 cents on the dollar.  I think the Cavs did very well.  Key will be what Isaiah looks like when he comes back.   If he's himself, he's going to really make that team tough to handle.

I think the Cavs did very well too considering their situation.  But didn't the Celtics did well also?  We have Kyrie playing better than anyone expected and appearing to be the anchor of our team for years to come.  I think both teams did well.

When IT gets up to speed for CLE, they may be the best team in the league.  They have won 12 in a row without him and they will add an elite player to the mix at a position of real need.  They have been starting Jose Calderon at PG.  Plus they can trade the BKN pick if they want to for more reinforcements.

CLE is set but I would not reverse the trade.  I like where the Celtics are with Kyrie and we still get to add in Hayward.  CLE may win the title and then blow up with IT and LeBron leaving.

I said shortly after the deal that Kyrie did Cleveland a solid. He quietly went about the trade request not being disgruntled (ie. hurting his trade value) and even increasing his value by eventually waving his trade kicker.

CLE did very well in this trade if IT comes back strong and CLE surpasses Boston in the East, and/or if that BK '18 pick is top-5.  Lebron will do as much as he possibly can to make sure the former part of those conditions becomes true, so even if IT doesn't add much I think CLE fans will be fine in the end.

The CLE fans are whining because Boston looks really good (like maybe they could win the East good) and that BK '18 pick is looking more like a 7-through-12 pick and not a top-5.  More importantly, Kyrie is playing like an MVP candidate and at 25 years old, if all CLE walks away with is a mid-lottery pick and a couple projects (IT and Lebron can leave), then this is a huge L for the Cavs




Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #46 on: December 05, 2017, 06:43:43 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Quote
I think CLE fans will be fine in the end

Only until the next time the Browns play.

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #47 on: December 06, 2017, 01:05:55 AM »

Offline rondofan1255

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not you per se, but everyone in this thread makes it seem like they were always on board with the trade, which just wasn't the case.  Most of this board was very upset when the trade was made, calling for Danny's head, saying we traded a top 3 pick for a lesser player and giving up a starter, etc.

Very revisionist history. Most of this board was absolutely on board with it.

I, on the other hand, was not though I never once called for Danny's head (and I don't remember anyone doing so). I said we swapped IT for a younger version of IT and threw in a likely top 5 pick, Zizic and one of the better contracts in the NBA to boot.

Of course, we had no idea that IT wouldn't be playing in November or even December. The Nets are exceeding expectation and I doubt anyone expected that Demarre Carroll would be averaging a career high in points. No one expected Jae Crowder to TS% to drop 80 points and his scoring to go down 5ppg. Few anticipated that Kyrie would be playing defense (though he's slipped considerably in recent games). Zizic, who many experts around the nation predicted would have been a later lottery pick, has a whopping 32 total minutes played.

On this trade, everything is coming up Millhouse for Danny. Even he couldn't have predicted this. I expect the pendulum to swing back the other way at some point. But at this stage there's nothing for me to say but I was wrong. The trade looks brilliant because of all of these unforeseen (or highly unlikely) events.

Granath I looked this up and you are correct. Moranis' memory on this is not accurate from the poll I could find.

66% of the board gave it an A or a B as an initial reaction. Only 11% gave it a D or an F.

As mentioned earlier I was very against the trade initially myself. However, I have basically 180'd.

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=93180.0

TP for finding this!!

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #48 on: December 06, 2017, 10:22:19 AM »

Offline Moranis

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not you per se, but everyone in this thread makes it seem like they were always on board with the trade, which just wasn't the case.  Most of this board was very upset when the trade was made, calling for Danny's head, saying we traded a top 3 pick for a lesser player and giving up a starter, etc.

Very revisionist history. Most of this board was absolutely on board with it.

I, on the other hand, was not though I never once called for Danny's head (and I don't remember anyone doing so). I said we swapped IT for a younger version of IT and threw in a likely top 5 pick, Zizic and one of the better contracts in the NBA to boot.

Of course, we had no idea that IT wouldn't be playing in November or even December. The Nets are exceeding expectation and I doubt anyone expected that Demarre Carroll would be averaging a career high in points. No one expected Jae Crowder to TS% to drop 80 points and his scoring to go down 5ppg. Few anticipated that Kyrie would be playing defense (though he's slipped considerably in recent games). Zizic, who many experts around the nation predicted would have been a later lottery pick, has a whopping 32 total minutes played.

On this trade, everything is coming up Millhouse for Danny. Even he couldn't have predicted this. I expect the pendulum to swing back the other way at some point. But at this stage there's nothing for me to say but I was wrong. The trade looks brilliant because of all of these unforeseen (or highly unlikely) events.

Granath I looked this up and you are correct. Moranis' memory on this is not accurate from the poll I could find.

66% of the board gave it an A or a B as an initial reaction. Only 11% gave it a D or an F.

As mentioned earlier I was very against the trade initially myself. However, I have basically 180'd.

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=93180.0

TP for finding this!!
that thread was open for voting for a long time after the trade and well into the season, so it is hard to definitively say what it was right after the trade.  The comments though have a lot of negatives right after and at a much larger percentage then the positives.  There were countless threads about how the Cavs won the trade initially as well.  Obviously once the extent of Thomas' injury became more known the tide shifted heavily back towards Boston.
Ohio State 2014/15 National Champions.

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #49 on: December 06, 2017, 10:31:14 AM »

Offline rondofan1255

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not you per se, but everyone in this thread makes it seem like they were always on board with the trade, which just wasn't the case.  Most of this board was very upset when the trade was made, calling for Danny's head, saying we traded a top 3 pick for a lesser player and giving up a starter, etc.

Very revisionist history. Most of this board was absolutely on board with it.

I, on the other hand, was not though I never once called for Danny's head (and I don't remember anyone doing so). I said we swapped IT for a younger version of IT and threw in a likely top 5 pick, Zizic and one of the better contracts in the NBA to boot.

Of course, we had no idea that IT wouldn't be playing in November or even December. The Nets are exceeding expectation and I doubt anyone expected that Demarre Carroll would be averaging a career high in points. No one expected Jae Crowder to TS% to drop 80 points and his scoring to go down 5ppg. Few anticipated that Kyrie would be playing defense (though he's slipped considerably in recent games). Zizic, who many experts around the nation predicted would have been a later lottery pick, has a whopping 32 total minutes played.

On this trade, everything is coming up Millhouse for Danny. Even he couldn't have predicted this. I expect the pendulum to swing back the other way at some point. But at this stage there's nothing for me to say but I was wrong. The trade looks brilliant because of all of these unforeseen (or highly unlikely) events.

Granath I looked this up and you are correct. Moranis' memory on this is not accurate from the poll I could find.

66% of the board gave it an A or a B as an initial reaction. Only 11% gave it a D or an F.

As mentioned earlier I was very against the trade initially myself. However, I have basically 180'd.

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=93180.0

TP for finding this!!
that thread was open for voting for a long time after the trade and well into the season, so it is hard to definitively say what it was right after the trade.  The comments though have a lot of negatives right after and at a much larger percentage then the positives.  There were countless threads about how the Cavs won the trade initially as well.  Obviously once the extent of Thomas' injury became more known the tide shifted heavily back towards Boston.

No, I kept up with it right when it started (and I'm sure others did, as Granath alluded to), and it was always majority for the C's. I remember being surprised as the numbers mounted during the first week of the poll. The people against it were the most vocal, but the majority were good or at least okay with the trade.

tl;dr the people not happy with the trade were the loudest and made the most threads, but that wasn't the opinion of most posters

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #50 on: December 06, 2017, 10:56:34 AM »

Offline Granath

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not you per se, but everyone in this thread makes it seem like they were always on board with the trade, which just wasn't the case.  Most of this board was very upset when the trade was made, calling for Danny's head, saying we traded a top 3 pick for a lesser player and giving up a starter, etc.

Very revisionist history. Most of this board was absolutely on board with it.

I, on the other hand, was not though I never once called for Danny's head (and I don't remember anyone doing so). I said we swapped IT for a younger version of IT and threw in a likely top 5 pick, Zizic and one of the better contracts in the NBA to boot.

Of course, we had no idea that IT wouldn't be playing in November or even December. The Nets are exceeding expectation and I doubt anyone expected that Demarre Carroll would be averaging a career high in points. No one expected Jae Crowder to TS% to drop 80 points and his scoring to go down 5ppg. Few anticipated that Kyrie would be playing defense (though he's slipped considerably in recent games). Zizic, who many experts around the nation predicted would have been a later lottery pick, has a whopping 32 total minutes played.

On this trade, everything is coming up Millhouse for Danny. Even he couldn't have predicted this. I expect the pendulum to swing back the other way at some point. But at this stage there's nothing for me to say but I was wrong. The trade looks brilliant because of all of these unforeseen (or highly unlikely) events.

Granath I looked this up and you are correct. Moranis' memory on this is not accurate from the poll I could find.

66% of the board gave it an A or a B as an initial reaction. Only 11% gave it a D or an F.

As mentioned earlier I was very against the trade initially myself. However, I have basically 180'd.

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=93180.0

TP for finding this!!
that thread was open for voting for a long time after the trade and well into the season, so it is hard to definitively say what it was right after the trade.  The comments though have a lot of negatives right after and at a much larger percentage then the positives.  There were countless threads about how the Cavs won the trade initially as well.  Obviously once the extent of Thomas' injury became more known the tide shifted heavily back towards Boston.

With all due respect, you're objectively wrong. Let it go.
Jaylen Brown will be an All Star in the next 5 years.

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #51 on: December 06, 2017, 11:17:49 AM »

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not you per se, but everyone in this thread makes it seem like they were always on board with the trade, which just wasn't the case.  Most of this board was very upset when the trade was made, calling for Danny's head, saying we traded a top 3 pick for a lesser player and giving up a starter, etc.

Very revisionist history. Most of this board was absolutely on board with it.

I, on the other hand, was not though I never once called for Danny's head (and I don't remember anyone doing so). I said we swapped IT for a younger version of IT and threw in a likely top 5 pick, Zizic and one of the better contracts in the NBA to boot.

Of course, we had no idea that IT wouldn't be playing in November or even December. The Nets are exceeding expectation and I doubt anyone expected that Demarre Carroll would be averaging a career high in points. No one expected Jae Crowder to TS% to drop 80 points and his scoring to go down 5ppg. Few anticipated that Kyrie would be playing defense (though he's slipped considerably in recent games). Zizic, who many experts around the nation predicted would have been a later lottery pick, has a whopping 32 total minutes played.

On this trade, everything is coming up Millhouse for Danny. Even he couldn't have predicted this. I expect the pendulum to swing back the other way at some point. But at this stage there's nothing for me to say but I was wrong. The trade looks brilliant because of all of these unforeseen (or highly unlikely) events.

Granath I looked this up and you are correct. Moranis' memory on this is not accurate from the poll I could find.

66% of the board gave it an A or a B as an initial reaction. Only 11% gave it a D or an F.

As mentioned earlier I was very against the trade initially myself. However, I have basically 180'd.

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=93180.0

TP for finding this!!
that thread was open for voting for a long time after the trade and well into the season, so it is hard to definitively say what it was right after the trade.  The comments though have a lot of negatives right after and at a much larger percentage then the positives.  There were countless threads about how the Cavs won the trade initially as well.  Obviously once the extent of Thomas' injury became more known the tide shifted heavily back towards Boston.

No, I kept up with it right when it started (and I'm sure others did, as Granath alluded to), and it was always majority for the C's. I remember being surprised as the numbers mounted during the first week of the poll. The people against it were the most vocal, but the majority were good or at least okay with the trade.

tl;dr the people not happy with the trade were the loudest and made the most threads, but that wasn't the opinion of most posters

This is correct.  As one of the most vocal posters on the board in favor of the trade at the time, I can say that the poll was always at least a 50/50 split or slightly in favor of the trade, and that there seemed to be more posts slamming the trade than defending it... but it was tons of repeat posters commenting similar things again and again. 
Give us this pick, Almighty Red
And forgive us our tanking
As we forgive those who tanked against us
And lead us not into the lottery
But deliver us from losing

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Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #52 on: December 06, 2017, 11:37:17 AM »

Offline GreenShooter

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Did they expect Brooklyn to be the worst team in the league? Not sure everyone here thought that was the case, even before the pick was traded. I figured them for a bottom 5 team. That could still happen. Only Atlanta, Chicago and Sacramento are pretty much guaranteed for one of bottom 5 spots.
The Cavs fans need to stop crying like 'bron does. They'll still get a decent pick out of the deal. Even if the pick falls between 7-10 there will be talent there. Can't have everything go your way like when you got 'bron and Kyrie and f'd-up the other no.1 overall pick.

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #53 on: December 06, 2017, 01:57:05 PM »

Offline celticsclay

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not you per se, but everyone in this thread makes it seem like they were always on board with the trade, which just wasn't the case.  Most of this board was very upset when the trade was made, calling for Danny's head, saying we traded a top 3 pick for a lesser player and giving up a starter, etc.

Very revisionist history. Most of this board was absolutely on board with it.

I, on the other hand, was not though I never once called for Danny's head (and I don't remember anyone doing so). I said we swapped IT for a younger version of IT and threw in a likely top 5 pick, Zizic and one of the better contracts in the NBA to boot.

Of course, we had no idea that IT wouldn't be playing in November or even December. The Nets are exceeding expectation and I doubt anyone expected that Demarre Carroll would be averaging a career high in points. No one expected Jae Crowder to TS% to drop 80 points and his scoring to go down 5ppg. Few anticipated that Kyrie would be playing defense (though he's slipped considerably in recent games). Zizic, who many experts around the nation predicted would have been a later lottery pick, has a whopping 32 total minutes played.

On this trade, everything is coming up Millhouse for Danny. Even he couldn't have predicted this. I expect the pendulum to swing back the other way at some point. But at this stage there's nothing for me to say but I was wrong. The trade looks brilliant because of all of these unforeseen (or highly unlikely) events.

Granath I looked this up and you are correct. Moranis' memory on this is not accurate from the poll I could find.

66% of the board gave it an A or a B as an initial reaction. Only 11% gave it a D or an F.

As mentioned earlier I was very against the trade initially myself. However, I have basically 180'd.

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=93180.0

TP for finding this!!
that thread was open for voting for a long time after the trade and well into the season, so it is hard to definitively say what it was right after the trade.  The comments though have a lot of negatives right after and at a much larger percentage then the positives.  There were countless threads about how the Cavs won the trade initially as well.  Obviously once the extent of Thomas' injury became more known the tide shifted heavily back towards Boston.

With all due respect, you're objectively wrong. Let it go.

Yea unless everyone on the board is a Chad Ford type that wanted to go back and change their vote retroactively or something this makes no sense. I agree with others that the most vocal posted a lot making it seem like more people were against it (and i started a thread against it), but to say the majority were against the trade is definitely objectively false.

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #54 on: December 06, 2017, 02:13:10 PM »

Offline saltlover

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not you per se, but everyone in this thread makes it seem like they were always on board with the trade, which just wasn't the case.  Most of this board was very upset when the trade was made, calling for Danny's head, saying we traded a top 3 pick for a lesser player and giving up a starter, etc.

Very revisionist history. Most of this board was absolutely on board with it.

I, on the other hand, was not though I never once called for Danny's head (and I don't remember anyone doing so). I said we swapped IT for a younger version of IT and threw in a likely top 5 pick, Zizic and one of the better contracts in the NBA to boot.

Of course, we had no idea that IT wouldn't be playing in November or even December. The Nets are exceeding expectation and I doubt anyone expected that Demarre Carroll would be averaging a career high in points. No one expected Jae Crowder to TS% to drop 80 points and his scoring to go down 5ppg. Few anticipated that Kyrie would be playing defense (though he's slipped considerably in recent games). Zizic, who many experts around the nation predicted would have been a later lottery pick, has a whopping 32 total minutes played.

On this trade, everything is coming up Millhouse for Danny. Even he couldn't have predicted this. I expect the pendulum to swing back the other way at some point. But at this stage there's nothing for me to say but I was wrong. The trade looks brilliant because of all of these unforeseen (or highly unlikely) events.

Granath I looked this up and you are correct. Moranis' memory on this is not accurate from the poll I could find.

66% of the board gave it an A or a B as an initial reaction. Only 11% gave it a D or an F.

As mentioned earlier I was very against the trade initially myself. However, I have basically 180'd.

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=93180.0

TP for finding this!!
that thread was open for voting for a long time after the trade and well into the season, so it is hard to definitively say what it was right after the trade.  The comments though have a lot of negatives right after and at a much larger percentage then the positives.  There were countless threads about how the Cavs won the trade initially as well.  Obviously once the extent of Thomas' injury became more known the tide shifted heavily back towards Boston.

With all due respect, you're objectively wrong. Let it go.

Yea unless everyone on the board is a Chad Ford type that wanted to go back and change their vote retroactively or something this makes no sense. I agree with others that the most vocal posted a lot making it seem like more people were against it (and i started a thread against it), but to say the majority were against the trade is definitely objectively false.

Yeah, as someone who was (and still is) not a supporter of the trade, I can safely say I was in the minority from Day 1.

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #55 on: December 06, 2017, 02:29:54 PM »

Offline konkmv

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The cavs as organisation should leave top picks for others... their history with the picks is bad... irving and Wiggins are out of there and bennet was a comical pick... keep Bron till 40...

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #56 on: December 06, 2017, 09:33:25 PM »

Offline CelticsElite

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Some of them said they wanted the Memphis pick too or Tatum lol

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #57 on: December 06, 2017, 09:38:58 PM »

Offline PAOBoston

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The cavs as organisation should leave top picks for others... their history with the picks is bad... irving and Wiggins are out of there and bennet was a comical pick... keep Bron till 40...
Don't forget Dion Waiters

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #58 on: December 06, 2017, 10:05:58 PM »

Offline trickybilly

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not you per se, but everyone in this thread makes it seem like they were always on board with the trade, which just wasn't the case.  Most of this board was very upset when the trade was made, calling for Danny's head, saying we traded a top 3 pick for a lesser player and giving up a starter, etc.

Very revisionist history. Most of this board was absolutely on board with it.

I, on the other hand, was not though I never once called for Danny's head (and I don't remember anyone doing so). I said we swapped IT for a younger version of IT and threw in a likely top 5 pick, Zizic and one of the better contracts in the NBA to boot.

Of course, we had no idea that IT wouldn't be playing in November or even December. The Nets are exceeding expectation and I doubt anyone expected that Demarre Carroll would be averaging a career high in points. No one expected Jae Crowder to TS% to drop 80 points and his scoring to go down 5ppg. Few anticipated that Kyrie would be playing defense (though he's slipped considerably in recent games). Zizic, who many experts around the nation predicted would have been a later lottery pick, has a whopping 32 total minutes played.

On this trade, everything is coming up Millhouse for Danny. Even he couldn't have predicted this. I expect the pendulum to swing back the other way at some point. But at this stage there's nothing for me to say but I was wrong. The trade looks brilliant because of all of these unforeseen (or highly unlikely) events.

Granath I looked this up and you are correct. Moranis' memory on this is not accurate from the poll I could find.

66% of the board gave it an A or a B as an initial reaction. Only 11% gave it a D or an F.

As mentioned earlier I was very against the trade initially myself. However, I have basically 180'd.

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=93180.0

TP for finding this!!
that thread was open for voting for a long time after the trade and well into the season, so it is hard to definitively say what it was right after the trade.  The comments though have a lot of negatives right after and at a much larger percentage then the positives.  There were countless threads about how the Cavs won the trade initially as well.  Obviously once the extent of Thomas' injury became more known the tide shifted heavily back towards Boston.

With all due respect, you're objectively wrong. Let it go.

Yea unless everyone on the board is a Chad Ford type that wanted to go back and change their vote retroactively or something this makes no sense. I agree with others that the most vocal posted a lot making it seem like more people were against it (and i started a thread against it), but to say the majority were against the trade is definitely objectively false.

Yeah, as someone who was (and still is) not a supporter of the trade, I can safely say I was in the minority from Day 1.

What needs to happen for you to change your mind? A ring? The pick to be in the 20's? Or is it a principled position?
"Gimme the ball, gimme the ball". Freddy Quimby, 1994.

Re: Guilty Pleasure: Cavs fans crying over Nets pick
« Reply #59 on: December 06, 2017, 10:06:54 PM »

Offline hwangjini_1

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The cavs as organisation should leave top picks for others... their history with the picks is bad... irving and Wiggins are out of there and bennet was a comical pick... keep Bron till 40...
Don't forget Dion Waiters
And that Lebron guy. What. A wasted pick he was. ::)
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