Author Topic: IT coming back early?  (Read 2767 times)

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Re: IT coming back early?
« Reply #30 on: November 13, 2017, 06:21:14 PM »

Offline GreenFaith1819

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Whenever he comes back I wish him the very BEST.

We wouldn't be where we are at NOW if it wasn't for him.

Some will disagree, but I lump him into KG/PP trade as far as the END result making the team overall BETTER.

Thank you, IT, for the memories and hope you continue to get well and come back and tear the league up.
Marcus Smart "Impacts Winning." Boston Celtics Coach Brad Stevens

Re: IT coming back early?
« Reply #31 on: November 13, 2017, 06:21:22 PM »

Offline Phantom255x

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He's probably coming back after Christmas, which is about when he was expected to come back anyways.

I think Isaiah will immensely help Cleveland overall (esp. with scoring) but I doubt he's going to return to that 25+ PPG type scorer he was here in Boston.

But unless Isaiah learned how to play defense, CLE in most games will probably have to score 120+ to win games vs. good teams (and so far their success rate at that is pretty low).

Re: IT coming back early?
« Reply #32 on: November 13, 2017, 08:18:56 PM »

Online azzenfrost

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He doesn't need to play defense. They don't care in Cleveland.
I moved the cheese.

Re: IT coming back early?
« Reply #33 on: November 13, 2017, 09:01:35 PM »

Offline moiso

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Whenever he comes back I wish him the very BEST.

We wouldn't be where we are at NOW if it wasn't for him.

Some will disagree, but I lump him into KG/PP trade as far as the END result making the team overall BETTER.

Thank you, IT, for the memories and hope you continue to get well and come back and tear the league up.
Yeah, if you think about it we might not have Horford, Hayward, or Irving if we never had Isaiah.  He recruited Horford and Hayward, and was traded for Irving.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2017, 09:19:53 PM by moiso »

Re: IT coming back early?
« Reply #34 on: November 13, 2017, 11:25:42 PM »

Offline OldSchoolDude

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I agree with those who said IT played on the injured hip to try and preserve his max contract.   I think he knew that if he said something he wouldn't play and his biggest knock was his playoff play.   He played hurt last year but to me it really didn't look any different than the two previous post seasons when he wasn't hurt and the bigger Atlanta and Cleveland guards shot over him at will.    When the defense trapped him he was useless.  He wasn't tall enough to see an open player for the pass, so all he could do was throw the ball up and hope for a foul or to luck it in, or both.
 
To get the max IT needed to win in the post season.  Regular season stats are great but if IT can't close the deal in the post season then there is no reason to Max him.  I believe he knew deep down that Danny didn't want to give him the money and thats why he talked it up so much to try and get some fan and media pressure on Danny to pay him. 

I think the team doctors were fired because they either knew about the injury and hushed it up, which I doubt, or they didn't know how bad it was.   Remember at first it was a groin injury so it looks like IT lied to them and they didn't catch on right away.  I also think that they wanted him to have surgery right away but he didn't want to.  IT found his own doctor who recommended rest.

There is not a lot of good examples of players coming back the same from that type of surgery.  Look at these examples:



So only Aldridge returned to form, but then I would say that even he may have lost a step.  IT's game is based on speed, he can't afford to loose a step.   If he is just a little bit slower he will be useless against most of guards that he used to blow by.  I think IT was legitimately afraid of surgery because of the bad track record.  I don't know of any examples of people coming back just by rest and rehab alone, so we'll see how it turns out for him, but I personally don't think he'll ever have another season like last years.     

Re: IT coming back early?
« Reply #35 on: November 13, 2017, 11:34:10 PM »

Online tarheelsxxiii

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We won't know for sure how serious the injury was/is until he takes the court.  CLE had every reason to use his health status as a bargaining chip, and of course, it was clear Danny was willing to overpay to get Kyrie.  After the trade, they obviously weren't going to back off their prognosis to the media. 

Hopefully he comes back in solid form, though.  He'll be asked to carry far less of the load when he does.  Heck, LeBron made James Jones and Damon Jones look good.  Hopefully we'll get to see our franchise-changer play in the Finals (finally!) this year. 
« Last Edit: November 13, 2017, 11:45:04 PM by tarheelsxxiii »
"As far as playing, I didn't care who guarded me - red, yellow, black. I just didn't want a white guy guarding me, because it's disrespect to my game."
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Re: IT coming back early?
« Reply #36 on: November 13, 2017, 11:49:09 PM »

Offline wayupnorth

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We won't know for sure how serious the injury was/is until he takes the court.  CLE had every reason to use his health status as a bargaining chip, and of course, it was clear Danny was willing to overpay to get Kyrie.  After the trade, they obviously weren't going to back off their prognosis to the media. 

Hopefully he comes back in solid form, though.  He'll be asked to carry far less of the load when he does.  Heck, LeBron made James Jones and Damon Jones look good.  Hopefully we'll get to see our franchise-changer play in the Finals (finally!) this year.

This statement confuses me.

Do you mean, if the Cavs play in the Finals, you hope to see IT play, or would you legitimately like to see the Cavs make the finals over the Celtics?

This statement sure makes it sound like you would root for th Cavs over the Celtics in the ECF if it came down to it.

And I have to give you the benefit of the doubt you don't actually feel that way.

Re: IT coming back early?
« Reply #37 on: November 13, 2017, 11:54:20 PM »

Online tarheelsxxiii

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We won't know for sure how serious the injury was/is until he takes the court.  CLE had every reason to use his health status as a bargaining chip, and of course, it was clear Danny was willing to overpay to get Kyrie.  After the trade, they obviously weren't going to back off their prognosis to the media. 

Hopefully he comes back in solid form, though.  He'll be asked to carry far less of the load when he does.  Heck, LeBron made James Jones and Damon Jones look good.  Hopefully we'll get to see our franchise-changer play in the Finals (finally!) this year.

This statement confuses me.

Do you mean, if the Cavs play in the Finals, you hope to see IT play, or would you legitimately like to see the Cavs make the finals over the Celtics?

This statement sure makes it sound like you would root for th Cavs over the Celtics in the ECF if it came down to it.

And I have to give you the benefit of the doubt you don't actually feel that way.

I hope for the best this year with our super talented youth.  But realistically, I think they're a year away from reaching the Finals.  It'd be cool to see them make it, but IT has earned it and I'd enjoy seeing him on that stage. 

If I expressly stated that I'd prefer to see CLE make the Finals over BOS (because of IT), though, I don't see why that would require anyone's benefit of the doubt.  The notion is actually extremely odd to me.  I mean, no single player has positive influenced our franchise more than IT the last two years, and his contributions here have been largely understated.

Hope that helps clarify the confusion.  In a nutshell... "The Little Guy!"
"As far as playing, I didn't care who guarded me - red, yellow, black. I just didn't want a white guy guarding me, because it's disrespect to my game."
-Larry Bird

Re: IT coming back early?
« Reply #38 on: November 14, 2017, 12:44:14 AM »

Offline wayupnorth

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We won't know for sure how serious the injury was/is until he takes the court.  CLE had every reason to use his health status as a bargaining chip, and of course, it was clear Danny was willing to overpay to get Kyrie.  After the trade, they obviously weren't going to back off their prognosis to the media. 

Hopefully he comes back in solid form, though.  He'll be asked to carry far less of the load when he does.  Heck, LeBron made James Jones and Damon Jones look good.  Hopefully we'll get to see our franchise-changer play in the Finals (finally!) this year.

This statement confuses me.

Do you mean, if the Cavs play in the Finals, you hope to see IT play, or would you legitimately like to see the Cavs make the finals over the Celtics?

This statement sure makes it sound like you would root for th Cavs over the Celtics in the ECF if it came down to it.

And I have to give you the benefit of the doubt you don't actually feel that way.

I hope for the best this year with our super talented youth.  But realistically, I think they're a year away from reaching the Finals.  It'd be cool to see them make it, but IT has earned it and I'd enjoy seeing him on that stage. 

If I expressly stated that I'd prefer to see CLE make the Finals over BOS (because of IT), though, I don't see why that would require anyone's benefit of the doubt.  The notion is actually extremely odd to me.  I mean, no single player has positive influenced our franchise more than IT the last two years, and his contributions here have been largely understated.

Hope that helps clarify the confusion.  In a nutshell... "The Little Guy!"

Well, if a Celtics fan expressly stated they would rather see a rival team make it to the finals over us, I wouldn't consider that person a huge Celtics fan, or much of a Celtics fan at all.

I guess it just sounds to me like you would rather see the Cavs make it to the finals than the Celtics, and that is something I have literally never heard any other fan say about their team, no matter how much they like a former player.

I personally wish IT the absolute best personally and professionally, unless he is playing against us, in which case he can play as poorly as he likes.

Again though, some of your takes are just something else.

Re: IT coming back early?
« Reply #39 on: November 14, 2017, 12:47:00 AM »

Online tarheelsxxiii

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We won't know for sure how serious the injury was/is until he takes the court.  CLE had every reason to use his health status as a bargaining chip, and of course, it was clear Danny was willing to overpay to get Kyrie.  After the trade, they obviously weren't going to back off their prognosis to the media. 

Hopefully he comes back in solid form, though.  He'll be asked to carry far less of the load when he does.  Heck, LeBron made James Jones and Damon Jones look good.  Hopefully we'll get to see our franchise-changer play in the Finals (finally!) this year.

This statement confuses me.

Do you mean, if the Cavs play in the Finals, you hope to see IT play, or would you legitimately like to see the Cavs make the finals over the Celtics?

This statement sure makes it sound like you would root for th Cavs over the Celtics in the ECF if it came down to it.

And I have to give you the benefit of the doubt you don't actually feel that way.

I hope for the best this year with our super talented youth.  But realistically, I think they're a year away from reaching the Finals.  It'd be cool to see them make it, but IT has earned it and I'd enjoy seeing him on that stage. 

If I expressly stated that I'd prefer to see CLE make the Finals over BOS (because of IT), though, I don't see why that would require anyone's benefit of the doubt.  The notion is actually extremely odd to me.  I mean, no single player has positive influenced our franchise more than IT the last two years, and his contributions here have been largely understated.

Hope that helps clarify the confusion.  In a nutshell... "The Little Guy!"

Well, if a Celtics fan expressly stated they would rather see a rival team make it to the finals over us, I wouldn't consider that person a huge Celtics fan, or much of a Celtics fan at all.

I guess it just sounds to me like you would rather see the Cavs make it to the finals than the Celtics, and that is something I have literally never heard any other fan say about their team, no matter how much they like a former player.

I personally wish IT the absolute best personally and professionally, unless he is playing against us, in which case he can play as poorly as he likes.

Again though, some of your takes are just something else.

You do make an interesting point.  I guess I would liken the scenario you described to an individual overvaluing a new 'star' that recently forced his way to your team from their primary rival.   I'd possibly question the substance behind his/her investment in the team, such as whether he/she watch the games, what aspects are enjoyable to him/her, etc.  Sports fandom is far from rational, as some of our most rational members have pointed out, so I imagine there are a lot of individual preferences out there.  And that's what makes it enjoyable to so many.     
« Last Edit: November 14, 2017, 12:52:53 AM by tarheelsxxiii »
"As far as playing, I didn't care who guarded me - red, yellow, black. I just didn't want a white guy guarding me, because it's disrespect to my game."
-Larry Bird

Re: IT coming back early?
« Reply #40 on: November 14, 2017, 01:03:47 AM »

Offline wayupnorth

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We won't know for sure how serious the injury was/is until he takes the court.  CLE had every reason to use his health status as a bargaining chip, and of course, it was clear Danny was willing to overpay to get Kyrie.  After the trade, they obviously weren't going to back off their prognosis to the media. 

Hopefully he comes back in solid form, though.  He'll be asked to carry far less of the load when he does.  Heck, LeBron made James Jones and Damon Jones look good.  Hopefully we'll get to see our franchise-changer play in the Finals (finally!) this year.

This statement confuses me.

Do you mean, if the Cavs play in the Finals, you hope to see IT play, or would you legitimately like to see the Cavs make the finals over the Celtics?

This statement sure makes it sound like you would root for th Cavs over the Celtics in the ECF if it came down to it.

And I have to give you the benefit of the doubt you don't actually feel that way.

I hope for the best this year with our super talented youth.  But realistically, I think they're a year away from reaching the Finals.  It'd be cool to see them make it, but IT has earned it and I'd enjoy seeing him on that stage. 

If I expressly stated that I'd prefer to see CLE make the Finals over BOS (because of IT), though, I don't see why that would require anyone's benefit of the doubt.  The notion is actually extremely odd to me.  I mean, no single player has positive influenced our franchise more than IT the last two years, and his contributions here have been largely understated.

Hope that helps clarify the confusion.  In a nutshell... "The Little Guy!"

Well, if a Celtics fan expressly stated they would rather see a rival team make it to the finals over us, I wouldn't consider that person a huge Celtics fan, or much of a Celtics fan at all.

I guess it just sounds to me like you would rather see the Cavs make it to the finals than the Celtics, and that is something I have literally never heard any other fan say about their team, no matter how much they like a former player.

I personally wish IT the absolute best personally and professionally, unless he is playing against us, in which case he can play as poorly as he likes.

Again though, some of your takes are just something else.

You do make an interesting point.  I guess I would liken the scenario you described to an individual overvaluing a new 'star' that recently forced his way to your team from their primary rival.   I'd possibly question the substance behind his/her investment in the team, such as whether he/she watch the games, what aspects are enjoyable to him/her, etc.  Sports fandom is far from rational, as some of our most rational members have pointed out, so I imagine there are a lot of individual preferences out there.  And that's what makes it enjoyable to so many.     

Lol I am invested in the Celtics doing well.

Personally, I don't believe someone could call themselves much of a Celtics fan, when they would prefer the Celtics largest rivals to beat them to make the finals.
Y
I can not think of any way in which actively preferring the team one is a fan of, losing, is rational.

Personally, it sounds like you are a larger fan of IT than you are the franchise of the Celtics.

That is totally fine, but be honest about it.

It truly comes across as if you wish to see the Celtics do poorly, solely because you are extremely salty about the best player on the team.

Forgive me, but I have been on many sports forums, for many years, and the only time I saw anything remotely close to this, was when Alex Smith was traded to KC and some Niners 'fans' would have rather seen Alex succeed, than the Niners succeed.

It confused me then, and confuses me now.



Re: IT coming back early?
« Reply #41 on: November 14, 2017, 01:14:53 AM »

Online tarheelsxxiii

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We won't know for sure how serious the injury was/is until he takes the court.  CLE had every reason to use his health status as a bargaining chip, and of course, it was clear Danny was willing to overpay to get Kyrie.  After the trade, they obviously weren't going to back off their prognosis to the media. 

Hopefully he comes back in solid form, though.  He'll be asked to carry far less of the load when he does.  Heck, LeBron made James Jones and Damon Jones look good.  Hopefully we'll get to see our franchise-changer play in the Finals (finally!) this year.

This statement confuses me.

Do you mean, if the Cavs play in the Finals, you hope to see IT play, or would you legitimately like to see the Cavs make the finals over the Celtics?

This statement sure makes it sound like you would root for th Cavs over the Celtics in the ECF if it came down to it.

And I have to give you the benefit of the doubt you don't actually feel that way.

I hope for the best this year with our super talented youth.  But realistically, I think they're a year away from reaching the Finals.  It'd be cool to see them make it, but IT has earned it and I'd enjoy seeing him on that stage. 

If I expressly stated that I'd prefer to see CLE make the Finals over BOS (because of IT), though, I don't see why that would require anyone's benefit of the doubt.  The notion is actually extremely odd to me.  I mean, no single player has positive influenced our franchise more than IT the last two years, and his contributions here have been largely understated.

Hope that helps clarify the confusion.  In a nutshell... "The Little Guy!"

Well, if a Celtics fan expressly stated they would rather see a rival team make it to the finals over us, I wouldn't consider that person a huge Celtics fan, or much of a Celtics fan at all.

I guess it just sounds to me like you would rather see the Cavs make it to the finals than the Celtics, and that is something I have literally never heard any other fan say about their team, no matter how much they like a former player.

I personally wish IT the absolute best personally and professionally, unless he is playing against us, in which case he can play as poorly as he likes.

Again though, some of your takes are just something else.

You do make an interesting point.  I guess I would liken the scenario you described to an individual overvaluing a new 'star' that recently forced his way to your team from their primary rival.   I'd possibly question the substance behind his/her investment in the team, such as whether he/she watch the games, what aspects are enjoyable to him/her, etc.  Sports fandom is far from rational, as some of our most rational members have pointed out, so I imagine there are a lot of individual preferences out there.  And that's what makes it enjoyable to so many.     

Lol I am invested in the Celtics doing well.

Personally, I don't believe someone could call themselves much of a Celtics fan, when they would prefer the Celtics largest rivals to beat them to make the finals.
Y
I can not think of any way in which actively preferring the team one is a fan of, losing, is rational.

Personally, it sounds like you are a larger fan of IT than you are the franchise of the Celtics.

That is totally fine, but be honest about it.

It truly comes across as if you wish to see the Celtics do poorly, solely because you are extremely salty about the best player on the team.

Forgive me, but I have been on many sports forums, for many years, and the only time I saw anything remotely close to this, was when Alex Smith was traded to KC and some Niners 'fans' would have rather seen Alex succeed, than the Niners succeed.

It confused me then, and confuses me now.

Well, your fandar is off -- I like the Celtics considerably more than IT.  But let's make sure IT's imprint on the franchise is respect, while Kyrie's is valued at least somewhat objectively.

My perplexity about fans that have welcomed (and overvalued) Kyrie with open arms seems like it's highly related to yours, we're just talked at a team level vs. an individual player (that forced himself off the same team) level.. 

I personally miss having several of the gritty Boston athletes in our back yard, including Rodney Harrison, Tedy Bruschi, Bobby Orr, Larry Bird, the Perkins/Rondo duo.  Who are you partial to, past or present? Or do individual players not matter? 

I feel like we may be getting somewhere.  If you're interested, hit me up on MySpace: Tarheelsxxiii. 
« Last Edit: November 14, 2017, 01:27:48 AM by tarheelsxxiii »
"As far as playing, I didn't care who guarded me - red, yellow, black. I just didn't want a white guy guarding me, because it's disrespect to my game."
-Larry Bird

Re: IT coming back early?
« Reply #42 on: November 14, 2017, 08:24:44 AM »

Offline iadera

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His expected return is rescheduled officialy for January 2, instead December 25.

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/injuries

Btw. Stephen Curry is questionable for Celtics' game on Thursday (thigh bruise ).
« Last Edit: November 14, 2017, 09:21:37 AM by iadera »

Re: IT coming back early?
« Reply #43 on: November 14, 2017, 12:22:27 PM »

Offline mmmmm

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I agree with those who said IT played on the injured hip to try and preserve his max contract.   I think he knew that if he said something he wouldn't play and his biggest knock was his playoff play. 
But he DID say something.  The team knew he was hurt.
Quote
He played hurt last year but to me it really didn't look any different than the two previous post seasons when he wasn't hurt and the bigger Atlanta and Cleveland guards shot over him at will.    When the defense trapped him he was useless.  He wasn't tall enough to see an open player for the pass, so all he could do was throw the ball up and hope for a foul or to luck it in, or both.
The ATL guards did not "shoot over him at will".  That's just totally made up fantasy.   Both Teague (40% FG%, 23.8% 3PT%) and Shroeder (41.1% FG%, 18.8% 3PT%) shot like crap in that series, including when guarded by Thomas.   

We lost that series because we had no healthy 3PT shooters other than Thomas and Jerebko (which allowed ATL to pack the paint and to double-and-triple Thomas constantly) and we had no answer to stop Horford and Milsap from owning the front-court.   But I suppose you think that Thomas was supposed to guard Milsap?   

Thomas posted the highest GmSc rating by far of any player in that series at 15.1.  The only other Celtic above 9 was Bradley, with an 11.9, but he only played one game.   Meanwhile, Millsap and Horford both posted 13.3 & 13.7 ratings and were supported by 3 other Hawks with ratings over 10.

Quote
 
I think the team doctors were fired because they either knew about the injury and hushed it up, which I doubt, or they didn't know how bad it was.   Remember at first it was a groin injury so it looks like IT lied to them and they didn't catch on right away.  I also think that they wanted him to have surgery right away but he didn't want to.  IT found his own doctor who recommended rest.
Tin-foil hat fit well?
Quote

There is not a lot of good examples of players coming back the same from that type of surgery.  Look at these examples:



So only Aldridge returned to form, but then I would say that even he may have lost a step.  IT's game is based on speed, he can't afford to loose a step.   If he is just a little bit slower he will be useless against most of guards that he used to blow by.  I think IT was legitimately afraid of surgery because of the bad track record.  I don't know of any examples of people coming back just by rest and rehab alone, so we'll see how it turns out for him, but I personally don't think he'll ever have another season like last years.   
So much wrong with this. 

That chart only includes players with hip labrum tears who were serious enough to require surgery.   It is believed that there are several times that number of cases that did not require surgery (it is not in the player's interest to broadcast this to the world).   Thomas did not require surgery.   Until he does, those are not good comps.

Also, the reason why there are not a lot of examples of hip labrum repairs in the NBA, period, is because it isn't that common of a serious injury in the NBA.  Compare it to how often _shoulder_ labrum repairs occur, for example.   The reason the hip labrum injury is less common is because the activity of basketball doesn't normally put extreme range-of-motion stress on the hips.  Again, for comparison, the two types of injury are reversed in frequency in hockey.  Hip labrum issues are very common in the NHL while shoulder issues are not.   In hockey, normal activity often puts extreme range-of-motion stress on the hips. Some teams now routinely scan young hockey players for signs of future hip issues.   In basketball, hip labrum issues tend to only occur when there is either a chronic impingement issue or a freak accident event.    Thomas played a ton for his first 6 years (plus 3 years of college) with very little missed time, so this strongly suggests that the problem here was a freak event.

Having Karl Anthony Towns land on top of you probably qualifies as an 'unusual event'.

That's not a guarantee that Thomas won't be permanently diminished by this injury.     I don't have access to his scans and have not been privy to his rehab workouts.   His recovery will be a success or it won't regardless of our silly attempts to diagnose things through the internet.   We'll just have to wait and watch.   And it totally makes sense for Danny Ainge to not want to have to sit on that gamble -- especially when the opportunity arose to replace him with a younger, healthy replacement.

There are plenty of ways to look at the trade in a positive light using real facts.  There is no need to make up a bunch of revisionist history and twisted conspiracy theory narratives.
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Re: IT coming back early?
« Reply #44 on: November 14, 2017, 12:36:12 PM »

Offline green_bballers13

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We won't know for sure how serious the injury was/is until he takes the court.  CLE had every reason to use his health status as a bargaining chip, and of course, it was clear Danny was willing to overpay to get Kyrie.  After the trade, they obviously weren't going to back off their prognosis to the media. 

Hopefully he comes back in solid form, though.  He'll be asked to carry far less of the load when he does.  Heck, LeBron made James Jones and Damon Jones look good.  Hopefully we'll get to see our franchise-changer play in the Finals (finally!) this year.

This statement confuses me.

Do you mean, if the Cavs play in the Finals, you hope to see IT play, or would you legitimately like to see the Cavs make the finals over the Celtics?

This statement sure makes it sound like you would root for th Cavs over the Celtics in the ECF if it came down to it.

And I have to give you the benefit of the doubt you don't actually feel that way.

I hope for the best this year with our super talented youth.  But realistically, I think they're a year away from reaching the Finals.  It'd be cool to see them make it, but IT has earned it and I'd enjoy seeing him on that stage. 

If I expressly stated that I'd prefer to see CLE make the Finals over BOS (because of IT), though, I don't see why that would require anyone's benefit of the doubt.  The notion is actually extremely odd to me.  I mean, no single player has positive influenced our franchise more than IT the last two years, and his contributions here have been largely understated.

Hope that helps clarify the confusion.  In a nutshell... "The Little Guy!"

Well, if a Celtics fan expressly stated they would rather see a rival team make it to the finals over us, I wouldn't consider that person a huge Celtics fan, or much of a Celtics fan at all.

I guess it just sounds to me like you would rather see the Cavs make it to the finals than the Celtics, and that is something I have literally never heard any other fan say about their team, no matter how much they like a former player.

I personally wish IT the absolute best personally and professionally, unless he is playing against us, in which case he can play as poorly as he likes.

Again though, some of your takes are just something else.

You do make an interesting point.  I guess I would liken the scenario you described to an individual overvaluing a new 'star' that recently forced his way to your team from their primary rival.   I'd possibly question the substance behind his/her investment in the team, such as whether he/she watch the games, what aspects are enjoyable to him/her, etc.  Sports fandom is far from rational, as some of our most rational members have pointed out, so I imagine there are a lot of individual preferences out there.  And that's what makes it enjoyable to so many.     

Lol I am invested in the Celtics doing well.

Personally, I don't believe someone could call themselves much of a Celtics fan, when they would prefer the Celtics largest rivals to beat them to make the finals.
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I can not think of any way in which actively preferring the team one is a fan of, losing, is rational.

Personally, it sounds like you are a larger fan of IT than you are the franchise of the Celtics.

That is totally fine, but be honest about it.

It truly comes across as if you wish to see the Celtics do poorly, solely because you are extremely salty about the best player on the team.

Forgive me, but I have been on many sports forums, for many years, and the only time I saw anything remotely close to this, was when Alex Smith was traded to KC and some Niners 'fans' would have rather seen Alex succeed, than the Niners succeed.

It confused me then, and confuses me now.

Well, your fandar is off -- I like the Celtics considerably more than IT.  But let's make sure IT's imprint on the franchise is respect, while Kyrie's is valued at least somewhat objectively.

My perplexity about fans that have welcomed (and overvalued) Kyrie with open arms seems like it's highly related to yours, we're just talked at a team level vs. an individual player (that forced himself off the same team) level.. 

I personally miss having several of the gritty Boston athletes in our back yard, including Rodney Harrison, Tedy Bruschi, Bobby Orr, Larry Bird, the Perkins/Rondo duo.  Who are you partial to, past or present? Or do individual players not matter? 

I feel like we may be getting somewhere.  If you're interested, hit me up on MySpace: Tarheelsxxiii.

If any of those players were projected to play the Patriots, Bruins, Celtics, or Red Sox (teams I root for) in the pursuit of a championship, I would 100% root for my team. I would hope that Larry Bird would score 50 pts, but in a losing cause.

It sounds like you are saying that you hope that IT makes it to the finals. Both CLE and BOS cannot make the same NBA finals in the same year. I'm confused too. Are you saying that you would root for IT to make it to the finals more than Jaylen Brown, Tatum, Horford, etc.? I understand that IT is your favorite player, but do you choose players over teams?