Woj + Lowe: Bledsoe to Bucks

[Fafnir]

That year the Suns expected to be bad and won 48 games and missed the playoffs by one game really messed them up pretty badly.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

I am not with the crowd on this one.  I don't think Bledsoe is that great and I don't think the trade is all that bad for Phoenix (depending on how the protections end up).  I am also not worried that this makes Milwaukee a big threat.  I understand the trade for both and like it for both.  Bledsoe seems like he will be good for MIL, just not best in the conference good.

Phoenix may be able to flip Monroe.  It is a lot of salary but they may be able to get something done where Milwaukee couldn't.  And they get a first round pick for a player they had given up on.  I think Phoenix did fine under the circumstances.

Part of this is how I feel about Antetokounmpo.  Sure he is an emerging star but I think a star like Isaiah Thomas.  Fabulous numbers but in the end, not as good as the numbers would make you think in terms of being the best player on a team looking to go deep into the playoffs.  Saying GA is like IT is not a bad thing, he is clearly a very good player like IT.

I thought about posting something like your last paragraph. I'm still not convinced that his style of scoring will work in the playoffs. He has a little fade away within 15 feet, and then he has bullying his way into the paint. His passing has regressed and the rest of the team relies on him way too much.

The Bucks are scary defensively with this trade, if they can play more as a team. Individually, they are really good, though. Offensively this might move the needle a little bit, but I've never been impressed with Bledsoe's scoring ability anyway.

Hard to really take that position when Giannis, as a 22 year old, is coming off a playoff series in which he averaged 24.8 p, 9.5 r, 4.0 a, 2.2 s, 1.7 b, while shooting 40% from three and 55% from two. 

He is the first player since they started tracking all 5 major categories to lead his team in all 5 in the same season, which he did last season (Henson currently is topping him blocks this season, but he has the other 4 right now). 

Giannis is a freak of nature.  The most gifted all around player since James to enter the league.  Obviously him reaching James' level is unlikely, but he is 23 and has already accomplished more than most of the league and most all time greats at a similar age.

I get your point. Its true. And he was young. But his team lost 4 of the 6 games in which he averaged those numbers. Again, maybe that improves.

My point is that I don't think the Bucks team can score enough points to win in the playoffs if the offense is based around his style. Its too inconsistent and frenetic, not to mention how prone he is to offensive fouls.

I would feel no need to pick him apart this way if he was average. He is obviously special. I'm just saying that, based on what I've seen, the Bucks offense is easy to stop if its based around Giannis' scoring ability.

[Moranis]

I am not with the crowd on this one.  I don't think Bledsoe is that great and I don't think the trade is all that bad for Phoenix (depending on how the protections end up).  I am also not worried that this makes Milwaukee a big threat.  I understand the trade for both and like it for both.  Bledsoe seems like he will be good for MIL, just not best in the conference good.

Phoenix may be able to flip Monroe.  It is a lot of salary but they may be able to get something done where Milwaukee couldn't.  And they get a first round pick for a player they had given up on.  I think Phoenix did fine under the circumstances.

Part of this is how I feel about Antetokounmpo.  Sure he is an emerging star but I think a star like Isaiah Thomas.  Fabulous numbers but in the end, not as good as the numbers would make you think in terms of being the best player on a team looking to go deep into the playoffs.  Saying GA is like IT is not a bad thing, he is clearly a very good player like IT.

I thought about posting something like your last paragraph. I'm still not convinced that his style of scoring will work in the playoffs. He has a little fade away within 15 feet, and then he has bullying his way into the paint. His passing has regressed and the rest of the team relies on him way too much.

The Bucks are scary defensively with this trade, if they can play more as a team. Individually, they are really good, though. Offensively this might move the needle a little bit, but I've never been impressed with Bledsoe's scoring ability anyway.

Hard to really take that position when Giannis, as a 22 year old, is coming off a playoff series in which he averaged 24.8 p, 9.5 r, 4.0 a, 2.2 s, 1.7 b, while shooting 40% from three and 55% from two. 

He is the first player since they started tracking all 5 major categories to lead his team in all 5 in the same season, which he did last season (Henson currently is topping him blocks this season, but he has the other 4 right now). 

Giannis is a freak of nature.  The most gifted all around player since James to enter the league.  Obviously him reaching James' level is unlikely, but he is 23 and has already accomplished more than most of the league and most all time greats at a similar age.

I get your point. Its true. And he was young. But his team lost 4 of the 6 games in which he averaged those numbers. Again, maybe that improves.

My point is that I don't think the Bucks team can score enough points to win in the playoffs if the offense is based around his style. Its too inconsistent and frenetic, not to mention how prone he is to offensive fouls.

I would feel no need to pick him apart this way if he was average. He is obviously special. I'm just saying that, based on what I've seen, the Bucks offense is easy to stop if its based around Giannis' scoring ability.

Need to see what they look like with both Parker and Middleton healthy at the same time.  They haven't ever had that trio firing on all cylinders at the same time. 

[DefenseWinsChamps]

I am not with the crowd on this one.  I don't think Bledsoe is that great and I don't think the trade is all that bad for Phoenix (depending on how the protections end up).  I am also not worried that this makes Milwaukee a big threat.  I understand the trade for both and like it for both.  Bledsoe seems like he will be good for MIL, just not best in the conference good.

Phoenix may be able to flip Monroe.  It is a lot of salary but they may be able to get something done where Milwaukee couldn't.  And they get a first round pick for a player they had given up on.  I think Phoenix did fine under the circumstances.

Part of this is how I feel about Antetokounmpo.  Sure he is an emerging star but I think a star like Isaiah Thomas.  Fabulous numbers but in the end, not as good as the numbers would make you think in terms of being the best player on a team looking to go deep into the playoffs.  Saying GA is like IT is not a bad thing, he is clearly a very good player like IT.

I thought about posting something like your last paragraph. I'm still not convinced that his style of scoring will work in the playoffs. He has a little fade away within 15 feet, and then he has bullying his way into the paint. His passing has regressed and the rest of the team relies on him way too much.

The Bucks are scary defensively with this trade, if they can play more as a team. Individually, they are really good, though. Offensively this might move the needle a little bit, but I've never been impressed with Bledsoe's scoring ability anyway.

Hard to really take that position when Giannis, as a 22 year old, is coming off a playoff series in which he averaged 24.8 p, 9.5 r, 4.0 a, 2.2 s, 1.7 b, while shooting 40% from three and 55% from two. 

He is the first player since they started tracking all 5 major categories to lead his team in all 5 in the same season, which he did last season (Henson currently is topping him blocks this season, but he has the other 4 right now). 

Giannis is a freak of nature.  The most gifted all around player since James to enter the league.  Obviously him reaching James' level is unlikely, but he is 23 and has already accomplished more than most of the league and most all time greats at a similar age.

I get your point. Its true. And he was young. But his team lost 4 of the 6 games in which he averaged those numbers. Again, maybe that improves.

My point is that I don't think the Bucks team can score enough points to win in the playoffs if the offense is based around his style. Its too inconsistent and frenetic, not to mention how prone he is to offensive fouls.

I would feel no need to pick him apart this way if he was average. He is obviously special. I'm just saying that, based on what I've seen, the Bucks offense is easy to stop if its based around Giannis' scoring ability.

Need to see what they look like with both Parker and Middleton healthy at the same time.  They haven't ever had that trio firing on all cylinders at the same time.

True. As discussed earlier in this thread, its going to be very difficult for them to keep them all past this year. They'd be well into the luxury tax if they signed Parker in the summer (especially with the changes in ownership and potential move, this seems unlikely). Its unlikely they can trade Dellavadova, Snell, Teletovic, or Henson, because they already gave up a 1st rounder to get Bledsoe and so many other teams will be looking to dump contracts.

That leaves Middleton as a trade possibility, but as has been stated, they might rather keep him over Parker.

If everything breaks perfectly for them, there is definite potential to be a contender, but more than likely they will be a good-not-great team moving forward. Worst-case scenario, they languish in mediocrity so much that Giannis begins looking around at other teams.

[Birdman]

Monroe may get bought out..and Phoenix may get 3 1st round picks for next season if Miami doesn't get top 7

[DefenseWinsChamps]

Monroe may get bought out..and Phoenix may get 3 1st round picks for next season if Miami doesn't get top 7

They already have 9 guys on rookie contracts on their team.

[saltlover]

That year the Suns expected to be bad and won 48 games and missed the playoffs by one game really messed them up pretty badly.

Kind of? They got TJ Warren in the draft that year at pick 14, who’s turned out better than about half of the picks ahead of him.  The next year they got Booker at pick 13 as a near-.500 team, so trying to win that year and failing at it didn’t set them back too much either.

The mistake was how they reacted to that season in free agency.  With Dragic coming off an All-NBA season and Bledsoe in restricted free agency and not getting offers, they signed IT.  While this was a fine signing in its own right based on production and value, it created three point guards on the roster who all needed the ball, thus making it a poor fit on offense and an even worse fit on defense.  This created a rift that resulted in both IT and Dragic being traded for picks 1-5 drafts in the future.

Even that would have been okay, but they also decided to trade the valuable LA pick for Brandon Knight, who again was a poor fit with Bledsoe.  Because they had paid such a highly trade price for him, they then gave him way too much money in free agency.  And to top it off, despite having a relatively young team, they signed a very old Tyson Chandler to a very long deal.  This both wasted money and blocked their former top-5 pick center Alex Len from getting playing time entering his third season.

It wasn’t the winning so much as their reaction to it that messed them up.

[Monkhouse]

That year the Suns expected to be bad and won 48 games and missed the playoffs by one game really messed them up pretty badly.

Kind of? They got TJ Warren in the draft that year at pick 14, who’s turned out better than about half of the picks ahead of him.  The next year they got Booker at pick 13 as a near-.500 team, so trying to win that year and failing at it didn’t set them back too much either.

The mistake was how they reacted to that season in free agency.  With Dragic coming off an All-NBA season and Bledsoe in restricted free agency and not getting offers, they signed IT.  While this was a fine signing in its own right based on production and value, it created three point guards on the roster who all needed the ball, thus making it a poor fit on offense and an even worse fit on defense.  This created a rift that resulted in both IT and Dragic being traded for picks 1-5 drafts in the future.

Even that would have been okay, but they also decided to trade the valuable LA pick for Brandon Knight, who again was a poor fit with Bledsoe.  Because they had paid such a highly trade price for him, they then gave him way too much money in free agency.  And to top it off, despite having a relatively young team, they signed a very old Tyson Chandler to a very long deal.  This both wasted money and blocked their former top-5 pick center Alex Len from getting playing time entering his third season.

It wasn’t the winning so much as their reaction to it that messed them up.

I have absolutely no idea or inkling of what the Suns are trying to accomplish.

Its like Ainge's infatuation with undersized scoring point guards became contagious to Ryan McDonough, lol.

[Birdman]

Phoenix use to be the place to go but now players wants out like Bledsoe and Isaiah Thomas

[Moranis]

That year the Suns expected to be bad and won 48 games and missed the playoffs by one game really messed them up pretty badly.

Kind of? They got TJ Warren in the draft that year at pick 14, who’s turned out better than about half of the picks ahead of him.  The next year they got Booker at pick 13 as a near-.500 team, so trying to win that year and failing at it didn’t set them back too much either.

The mistake was how they reacted to that season in free agency.  With Dragic coming off an All-NBA season and Bledsoe in restricted free agency and not getting offers, they signed IT.  While this was a fine signing in its own right based on production and value, it created three point guards on the roster who all needed the ball, thus making it a poor fit on offense and an even worse fit on defense.  This created a rift that resulted in both IT and Dragic being traded for picks 1-5 drafts in the future.

Even that would have been okay, but they also decided to trade the valuable LA pick for Brandon Knight, who again was a poor fit with Bledsoe.  Because they had paid such a highly trade price for him, they then gave him way too much money in free agency.  And to top it off, despite having a relatively young team, they signed a very old Tyson Chandler to a very long deal.  This both wasted money and blocked their former top-5 pick center Alex Len from getting playing time entering his third season.

It wasn’t the winning so much as their reaction to it that messed them up.

I have absolutely no idea or inkling of what the Suns are trying to accomplish.

Its like Ainge's infatuation with undersized scoring point guards became contagious to Ryan McDonough, lol.

They have an owner that badly wants to win and make a big splash.  Much like the Nets when Pok first took over. 

[byennie]

I am not with the crowd on this one.  I don't think Bledsoe is that great and I don't think the trade is all that bad for Phoenix (depending on how the protections end up).  I am also not worried that this makes Milwaukee a big threat.  I understand the trade for both and like it for both.  Bledsoe seems like he will be good for MIL, just not best in the conference good.

Phoenix may be able to flip Monroe.  It is a lot of salary but they may be able to get something done where Milwaukee couldn't.  And they get a first round pick for a player they had given up on.  I think Phoenix did fine under the circumstances.

Part of this is how I feel about Antetokounmpo.  Sure he is an emerging star but I think a star like Isaiah Thomas.  Fabulous numbers but in the end, not as good as the numbers would make you think in terms of being the best player on a team looking to go deep into the playoffs.  Saying GA is like IT is not a bad thing, he is clearly a very good player like IT.

I thought about posting something like your last paragraph. I'm still not convinced that his style of scoring will work in the playoffs. He has a little fade away within 15 feet, and then he has bullying his way into the paint. His passing has regressed and the rest of the team relies on him way too much.

The Bucks are scary defensively with this trade, if they can play more as a team. Individually, they are really good, though. Offensively this might move the needle a little bit, but I've never been impressed with Bledsoe's scoring ability anyway.

Hard to really take that position when Giannis, as a 22 year old, is coming off a playoff series in which he averaged 24.8 p, 9.5 r, 4.0 a, 2.2 s, 1.7 b, while shooting 40% from three and 55% from two. 

He is the first player since they started tracking all 5 major categories to lead his team in all 5 in the same season, which he did last season (Henson currently is topping him blocks this season, but he has the other 4 right now). 

Giannis is a freak of nature.  The most gifted all around player since James to enter the league.  Obviously him reaching James' level is unlikely, but he is 23 and has already accomplished more than most of the league and most all time greats at a similar age.

He's a career 28% three point shooter with a 4-8 record in the playoffs. Obviously he's an incredible player, but going 4-10 from deep over 240 minutes of losing basketball last postseason doesn't dispel the concern for me. He also had almost as many turnovers as assists for the entire series, shot 54% from the line, and made 1 three pointer in the last 130+ minutes.

Awesome, awesome player, but the playoff flaws as a leading man are real.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

I am not with the crowd on this one.  I don't think Bledsoe is that great and I don't think the trade is all that bad for Phoenix (depending on how the protections end up).  I am also not worried that this makes Milwaukee a big threat.  I understand the trade for both and like it for both.  Bledsoe seems like he will be good for MIL, just not best in the conference good.

Phoenix may be able to flip Monroe.  It is a lot of salary but they may be able to get something done where Milwaukee couldn't.  And they get a first round pick for a player they had given up on.  I think Phoenix did fine under the circumstances.

Part of this is how I feel about Antetokounmpo.  Sure he is an emerging star but I think a star like Isaiah Thomas.  Fabulous numbers but in the end, not as good as the numbers would make you think in terms of being the best player on a team looking to go deep into the playoffs.  Saying GA is like IT is not a bad thing, he is clearly a very good player like IT.

I thought about posting something like your last paragraph. I'm still not convinced that his style of scoring will work in the playoffs. He has a little fade away within 15 feet, and then he has bullying his way into the paint. His passing has regressed and the rest of the team relies on him way too much.

The Bucks are scary defensively with this trade, if they can play more as a team. Individually, they are really good, though. Offensively this might move the needle a little bit, but I've never been impressed with Bledsoe's scoring ability anyway.

Hard to really take that position when Giannis, as a 22 year old, is coming off a playoff series in which he averaged 24.8 p, 9.5 r, 4.0 a, 2.2 s, 1.7 b, while shooting 40% from three and 55% from two. 

He is the first player since they started tracking all 5 major categories to lead his team in all 5 in the same season, which he did last season (Henson currently is topping him blocks this season, but he has the other 4 right now). 

Giannis is a freak of nature.  The most gifted all around player since James to enter the league.  Obviously him reaching James' level is unlikely, but he is 23 and has already accomplished more than most of the league and most all time greats at a similar age.

He's a career 28% three point shooter with a 4-8 record in the playoffs. Obviously he's an incredible player, but going 4-10 from deep over 240 minutes of losing basketball last postseason doesn't dispel the concern for me. He also had almost as many turnovers as assists for the entire series, shot 54% from the line, and made 1 three pointer in the last 130+ minutes.

Awesome, awesome player, but the playoff flaws as a leading man are real.

Great stats. He is still young -- really, really young. These are legit questions though.

[playdream]

That's a desperation move, Bledsoe needs the ball and so do Giannis and they both aren't great shooter, it's not gonna work , plus they lost their only inside offense in monroe, i say they will get worse

[smokeablount]

I didn't know Bledsoe scored 21 a game last year.  I mean, he's still young.  This will fall on Jason Kidd's coaching ability, because getting a flawed but impact player like Bledsoe for only a bench scoring big and a weak pick is a win.

[smokeablount]

I mean, with a year in the right system Jahlil Okafor would have an outside chance at being very similar to Greg Monroe, and look at how much of this board doesn't want Okafor for free.  Monroe and the 23rd pick for a 21 ppg 27 year old scorer (even on a crap team) is a bargain.