Author Topic: How long are we expecting Hayward and Horford to remain with the Celtics  (Read 2739 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline GRADYCOLNON

  • Marcus Smart
  • Posts: 204
  • Tommy Points: 21
Where do people see Horford after his contract is over? What do we see Hayward doing after year three when he has a player option? 

I could flip a coin with Horford on a cheaper contract.  Hayward, I have no clue.  Brown and Tatum, if they have become young stars would be in year 5 and 4, respectively, where do they fit?And Hayward will be looking for another big pay raise, so will the Celtics pay him or trade him?

Also, if the team wins a title in three years, how does that impact the scenarios?

I'd love to hear opinions.  All opinions are welcome, but please be respectful :)

Re: How long are we expecting Hayward and Horford to remain with the Celtics
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2017, 11:26:48 PM »

Offline crimson_stallion

  • Rajon Rondo
  • *****
  • Posts: 5899
  • Tommy Points: 863
Where do people see Horford after his contract is over? What do we see Hayward doing after year three when he has a player option? 

I could flip a coin with Horford on a cheaper contract.  Hayward, I have no clue.  Brown and Tatum, if they have become young stars would be in year 5 and 4, respectively, where do they fit?And Hayward will be looking for another big pay raise, so will the Celtics pay him or trade him?

Also, if the team wins a title in three years, how does that impact the scenarios?

I'd love to hear opinions.  All opinions are welcome, but please be respectful :)

I see Horford retired.

I can't see him remaining very effective by age 33-34 given how much he;s already declined the past 2-3 seasons. 

Hayward I feel will probably stick around. 

Re: How long are we expecting Hayward and Horford to remain with the Celtics
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2017, 11:52:53 PM »

Offline Bucketgetter

  • Kyrie Irving
  • Posts: 887
  • Tommy Points: 160
Where do people see Horford after his contract is over? What do we see Hayward doing after year three when he has a player option? 

I could flip a coin with Horford on a cheaper contract.  Hayward, I have no clue.  Brown and Tatum, if they have become young stars would be in year 5 and 4, respectively, where do they fit?And Hayward will be looking for another big pay raise, so will the Celtics pay him or trade him?

Also, if the team wins a title in three years, how does that impact the scenarios?

I'd love to hear opinions.  All opinions are welcome, but please be respectful :)

I see Horford retired.

I can't see him remaining very effective by age 33-34 given how much he;s already declined the past 2-3 seasons. 

Hayward I feel will probably stick around.
You see Horford retired at age 33? ???

With guys like Udonis Halsem, Pau Gasol, David West, Nick Collison, and Zach Randolph all still playing? Who are all 35-37 years old.
CB Draft
Sacramento Kings
Coach: Dave Joerger
Roster: Kawhi Leonard, Damian Lillard, Marvin Williams, Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, John Henson, Boban Marjanovic, Rodney Stuckey, Wade Baldwin IV, Taurean Prince, Andrew Nicholson, D.J. Augustin, Jeff Withey, James Jones, Charlie Villanueva, Jordan Adams

Re: How long are we expecting Hayward and Horford to remain with the Celtics
« Reply #3 on: September 20, 2017, 11:55:11 PM »

Offline tarheelsxxiii

  • Rajon Rondo
  • *****
  • Posts: 5899
  • Tommy Points: 1240
Where do people see Horford after his contract is over? What do we see Hayward doing after year three when he has a player option? 

I could flip a coin with Horford on a cheaper contract.  Hayward, I have no clue.  Brown and Tatum, if they have become young stars would be in year 5 and 4, respectively, where do they fit?And Hayward will be looking for another big pay raise, so will the Celtics pay him or trade him?

Also, if the team wins a title in three years, how does that impact the scenarios?

I'd love to hear opinions.  All opinions are welcome, but please be respectful :)

I see Horford retired.

I can't see him remaining very effective by age 33-34 given how much he;s already declined the past 2-3 seasons. 

Hayward I feel will probably stick around.
You see Horford retired at age 33? ???

With guys like Udonis Halsem, Pau Gasol, David West, Nick Collison, and Zach Randolph all still playing? Who are all 35-37 years old.

Health permitting, I could see his game age well, too.  Skilled, high bball IQ big that is hardly at all reliant on his athleticism.

I think Hayward will stick around.  Boston fans are going to love him. 
"As far as playing, I didn't care who guarded me - red, yellow, black. I just didn't want a white guy guarding me, because it's disrespect to my game."
-Larry Bird

Re: How long are we expecting Hayward and Horford to remain with the Celtics
« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2017, 11:57:40 PM »

Offline Bucketgetter

  • Kyrie Irving
  • Posts: 887
  • Tommy Points: 160
Where do people see Horford after his contract is over? What do we see Hayward doing after year three when he has a player option? 

I could flip a coin with Horford on a cheaper contract.  Hayward, I have no clue.  Brown and Tatum, if they have become young stars would be in year 5 and 4, respectively, where do they fit?And Hayward will be looking for another big pay raise, so will the Celtics pay him or trade him?

Also, if the team wins a title in three years, how does that impact the scenarios?

I'd love to hear opinions.  All opinions are welcome, but please be respectful :)

I see Horford retired.

I can't see him remaining very effective by age 33-34 given how much he;s already declined the past 2-3 seasons. 

Hayward I feel will probably stick around.
You see Horford retired at age 33? ???

With guys like Udonis Halsem, Pau Gasol, David West, Nick Collison, and Zach Randolph all still playing? Who are all 35-37 years old.

Health permitting, I could see his game age well, too.  Skilled, high bball IQ big that is hardly at all reliant on his athleticism.

I think Hayward will stick around.  Boston fans are going to love him.
Exactly. And while he has declined, he is still a very valuable player and clearly our best big.
CB Draft
Sacramento Kings
Coach: Dave Joerger
Roster: Kawhi Leonard, Damian Lillard, Marvin Williams, Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, John Henson, Boban Marjanovic, Rodney Stuckey, Wade Baldwin IV, Taurean Prince, Andrew Nicholson, D.J. Augustin, Jeff Withey, James Jones, Charlie Villanueva, Jordan Adams

Re: How long are we expecting Hayward and Horford to remain with the Celtics
« Reply #5 on: September 21, 2017, 12:02:50 AM »

Offline coffee425

  • Kyrie Irving
  • Posts: 871
  • Tommy Points: 105


I see Horford retired.

I can't see him remaining very effective by age 33-34 given how much he;s already declined the past 2-3 seasons. 


Hayward I feel will probably stick around.

How can a guy that hasn't jumped for a rebound in 5 years retire at 34? His knees are probably in better shape than Smart's.

https://vine.co/v/5taveZXU5Bt/embed/simple
Quote
Even at the end of the game, we lined up in different formation that he hadn't seen and he called out our play before I got the ball. I heard him calling it out. -John Wall on Brad Stevens

Re: How long are we expecting Hayward and Horford to remain with the Celtics
« Reply #6 on: September 21, 2017, 12:35:47 AM »

Offline Beat LA

  • Paul Silas
  • ******
  • Posts: 6637
  • Tommy Points: 689
  • Mr. Emoji
As far as Horford, I think he'll be here until Ainge finds a way to package him and other pieces for Davis, just because ::). I hope that Al hasn't bought a house, lol :laugh:.

Re: How long are we expecting Hayward and Horford to remain with the Celtics
« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2017, 12:37:44 AM »

Offline gouki88

  • Bill Walton
  • *
  • Posts: 1229
  • Tommy Points: 88
I think Hayward will spend the remainder of his career with us.

Horford, I'm not too sure. I wouldn't be surprised if he stayed with us for cheap (hopefully) as a big off the bench, but if some other team throws him some considerable money I wouldn't be surprised if he left
Quote from: PhoSita
It's not rational, but sports fandom isn't supposed to be.

Re: How long are we expecting Hayward and Horford to remain with the Celtics
« Reply #8 on: September 21, 2017, 12:46:31 AM »

Offline tarheelsxxiii

  • Rajon Rondo
  • *****
  • Posts: 5899
  • Tommy Points: 1240
As far as Horford, I think he'll be here until Ainge finds a way to package him and other pieces for Davis, just because ::). I hope that Al hasn't bought a house, lol :laugh:.

Fully expect Tatum and Brown to be shopped for A. Davis, if the Pelicans choose to move him anytime soon. 

The time is so ripe for the Celtics... if Brown and Tatum show flashes this year, their stock will rise; if neither overwhelm, it hardly matters -- both extremely young, high draft picks, that "lacked opportunity on a top team."
"As far as playing, I didn't care who guarded me - red, yellow, black. I just didn't want a white guy guarding me, because it's disrespect to my game."
-Larry Bird

Re: How long are we expecting Hayward and Horford to remain with the Celtics
« Reply #9 on: September 21, 2017, 03:29:53 AM »

Offline crimson_stallion

  • Rajon Rondo
  • *****
  • Posts: 5899
  • Tommy Points: 863
Where do people see Horford after his contract is over? What do we see Hayward doing after year three when he has a player option? 

I could flip a coin with Horford on a cheaper contract.  Hayward, I have no clue.  Brown and Tatum, if they have become young stars would be in year 5 and 4, respectively, where do they fit?And Hayward will be looking for another big pay raise, so will the Celtics pay him or trade him?

Also, if the team wins a title in three years, how does that impact the scenarios?

I'd love to hear opinions.  All opinions are welcome, but please be respectful :)

I see Horford retired.

I can't see him remaining very effective by age 33-34 given how much he;s already declined the past 2-3 seasons. 

Hayward I feel will probably stick around.
You see Horford retired at age 33? ???

With guys like Udonis Halsem, Pau Gasol, David West, Nick Collison, and Zach Randolph all still playing? Who are all 35-37 years old.

Paul Gasol doesn't belong on that list because he was an elite two-way big and perennial all-star who also happens to also have elite size (7'0" / 250 lbs / 7'5 wingspan) that allows him to remain effective in the league for longer, since that size allows him to shoot right over guys, grab rebounds right over guys and affect shots on defence without having to get much elevation or movement.  Hence why a guy with elite size (like Gasol  or Howard) is more likely to last in the league.  Hence why he put up arguably better numbers last year at 36 then Horford did at 31..lol

Pau Gasol and Zach Randolph also happen to be the only guys on that list currently who aren't on the fringe of "completely useless". 

* Haslem averaged less than 2 pts, 2.5 reb and 10 mins over the past two seasons
* Collison averaged as above last season
* West was comparatively beastly, putting up 4.6 pts and 3 rebounds in his 12.6 mins year

Those guys may not be retired, but all three of them may as well have done so 3 seasons ago, because they aren't doing anything to help anybody on the court right now.

Zach Randolph is the only one on that list who has remained effective, and that has a lot to do with the fact that he has freakish length (allowing him to play bigger than he is) plus the fact that his game based mostly around power rather than finesse.  Unlike Hoford he stills bangs down low, and he still gets after rebounds - he doesn't try to be something he isn't and go chasing people around on the perimeter and popping up four threes a game.

Likewise Randolph didn't see a drop off in production starting at the age of 28 like Horford has.  The last time Horford saw a rise in statistical production was in 2013/14 when he was 27 years old.   Since then it's been a steady decline both statistically and physically - you can clearly see he's not as mobile/athletic as he was 2-3 years ago, and that mobility was a big part of what made him such a special player. 

Last season was:
* The first time in Horford's career that he shot below 50% from the field (I'm not counting the 49.9% in his rookie year)

* The first time in Horford's career that he averaged below 7 rebounds per game

* His lowest scoring average (14.0 PPG) since his second year (2008/08 season at age 22)

 * The equal second lowest eFG% of his career after his rookie year (tied with his 2nd year)

* The second lowest TS% of his career after his rookie year

And he had just turned 30...it's not looking good.

Re: How long are we expecting Hayward and Horford to remain with the Celtics
« Reply #10 on: September 21, 2017, 05:51:44 AM »

Offline Greyman

  • Gordon Hayward
  • Posts: 695
  • Tommy Points: 137
Hayward is a big part of the future, he should be in Boston for a long time. Horford is more dependant on: form, DA's ability to package him and how well he works with Hayward and Irving. His salary can be an obstacle to improving the team, he needs to produce or look for DA to find a way to move him. My guess is he goes prior to the 2019 season in a move for Davis, that is just a guess though.

Re: How long are we expecting Hayward and Horford to remain with the Celtics
« Reply #11 on: September 21, 2017, 06:21:25 AM »

Online JBcat

  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2494
  • Tommy Points: 442
Horford still does many things well.  I believe last year he averaged the most assists for his career.  With him now taking 3 pointers it will help him age.

The overall long term outlook for our bigs is shaky though.  Maybe if Tatum develops into a 4 or someone like Yabu surprises us all and becomes a star at the 4, maybe then we'll have our own version of the Warriors with stars 1-4, and we rotate in and out journeymen centers.

For Hayward maybe we could keep him on a cheaper or at least short contract going into his 30s.

Re: How long are we expecting Hayward and Horford to remain with the Celtics
« Reply #12 on: September 21, 2017, 07:37:10 AM »

Offline Big333223

  • NCE
  • Ray Allen
  • ***
  • Posts: 3468
  • Tommy Points: 305
More than 70% of the roster changed in the last 3 months. Trying to look ahead 3 years is almost impossible. There are just so many factors including how Brown and Tatum develop, if the C's get a chance to draft a big in '18, injuries and age (which is always hard to predict).

My hope is that both guys are able to play out there contracts and then slide into bench roles on smaller deals once their current ones are up. And that they both win multiple championships in the process.  8)

Re: How long are we expecting Hayward and Horford to remain with the Celtics
« Reply #13 on: September 21, 2017, 11:05:01 AM »

Offline GRADYCOLNON

  • Marcus Smart
  • Posts: 204
  • Tommy Points: 21
Horford still does many things well.  I believe last year he averaged the most assists for his career.  With him now taking 3 pointers it will help him age.

The overall long term outlook for our bigs is shaky though.  Maybe if Tatum develops into a 4 or someone like Yabu surprises us all and becomes a star at the 4, maybe then we'll have our own version of the Warriors with stars 1-4, and we rotate in and out journeymen centers.

For Hayward maybe we could keep him on a cheaper or at least short contract going into his 30s.

I'd love to keep Hayward on a cheaper deal going into his thirties, but his player option is up when he is 30.  There are numerous examples around the league where stars still receive top dollar well into their thirties.  Do you think we should pay him even if Brown and Tatum are the real deal?

Re: How long are we expecting Hayward and Horford to remain with the Celtics
« Reply #14 on: September 21, 2017, 11:08:19 AM »

Offline GRADYCOLNON

  • Marcus Smart
  • Posts: 204
  • Tommy Points: 21
I think Hayward will spend the remainder of his career with us.

Horford, I'm not too sure. I wouldn't be surprised if he stayed with us for cheap (hopefully) as a big off the bench, but if some other team throws him some considerable money I wouldn't be surprised if he left

What happens if Brown and Tatum become superstars? Do the Celtics still keep Hayward? Mind you that he will be getting another max deal after 3 seasons with the Celtics