Author Topic: Patriots 2017 season  (Read 23223 times)

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Re: Patriots 2017 season
« Reply #510 on: January 23, 2018, 04:47:30 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

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With the first quote it doesn't address the fact he didn't lose the ball till on the ground. Ball moving doesn't matter. We have seen it how many replays on would be fumbles? It has to be out of his hands before he hits the ground.
That's not how it works. The moment the ball gets dislodged, he's lost it and it's a fumble. That happens when Jack initially pokes at it out and way before Lewis has even started to go down.
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Re: Patriots 2017 season
« Reply #511 on: January 23, 2018, 04:48:36 PM »

Offline Donoghus

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Something about this play that I haven't seen addressed anywhere: Lewis had three blockers in front of him, so why was he shifting toward the outside of the right-most blocker, instead of staying basically centered behind the three of them? The fumble might not even happen if he'd done that.
I said the same thing when watching. Wondered why he didn't speed up and head down the sideline where blockers had it sealed. He instead slowed down and ran more towards the center of the field(not completely just more right than left towards the sidelines behind the bevy of blockers).

He slowed down and started moving back to the outside,  he was shifting back outside because he was anticipating Solder sealing #50 back inside towards the hashes.  What I'm not entirely sure of is whether or not Lewis knew Jack was pursuing him until the last very second.  Lewis was already starting to shift back left right when Jack took him down.   He had to slow up because he had caught up to his other two lead blockers.


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Re: Patriots 2017 season
« Reply #512 on: January 23, 2018, 05:13:55 PM »

Online Csfan1984

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With the first quote it doesn't address the fact he didn't lose the ball till on the ground. Ball moving doesn't matter. We have seen it how many replays on would be fumbles? It has to be out of his hands before he hits the ground.
That's not how it works. The moment the ball gets dislodged, he's lost it and it's a fumble. That happens when Jack initially pokes at it out and way before Lewis has even started to go down.
That is how it works. It's been long established the ball has to be out. It's not a catch it's a runner
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Re: Patriots 2017 season
« Reply #513 on: January 23, 2018, 06:23:35 PM »

Offline green_bballers13

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With the first quote it doesn't address the fact he didn't lose the ball till on the ground. Ball moving doesn't matter. We have seen it how many replays on would be fumbles? It has to be out of his hands before he hits the ground.
That's not how it works. The moment the ball gets dislodged, he's lost it and it's a fumble. That happens when Jack initially pokes at it out and way before Lewis has even started to go down.
That is how it works. It's been long established the ball has to be out. It's not a catch it's a runner

I guess I don't get what your point is. Dion Lewis didn't control the ball at the point that his body hit the ground. Do you think he had possession of the ball?

Re: Patriots 2017 season
« Reply #514 on: January 23, 2018, 06:55:18 PM »

Online Csfan1984

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With the first quote it doesn't address the fact he didn't lose the ball till on the ground. Ball moving doesn't matter. We have seen it how many replays on would be fumbles? It has to be out of his hands before he hits the ground.
That's not how it works. The moment the ball gets dislodged, he's lost it and it's a fumble. That happens when Jack initially pokes at it out and way before Lewis has even started to go down.
That is how it works. It's been long established the ball has to be out. It's not a catch it's a runner

I guess I don't get what your point is. Dion Lewis didn't control the ball at the point that his body hit the ground. Do you think he had possession of the ball?
If he doesn't have possession how does he turn and slide on his back and still have the ball in his hands? If he didn't have it or control, no way it survives all that .. and the guy still has to rip at it further on the ground. Or were the Pats cheating with some new kind of stickum?
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Re: Patriots 2017 season
« Reply #515 on: January 23, 2018, 07:10:17 PM »

Offline rocknrollforyoursoul

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Something about this play that I haven't seen addressed anywhere: Lewis had three blockers in front of him, so why was he shifting toward the outside of the right-most blocker, instead of staying basically centered behind the three of them? The fumble might not even happen if he'd done that.
I said the same thing when watching. Wondered why he didn't speed up and head down the sideline where blockers had it sealed. He instead slowed down and ran more towards the center of the field(not completely just more right than left towards the sidelines behind the bevy of blockers).

I'm wondering if he might've been getting a little antsy, thinking that his blockers were going too slow, and was thinking of darting past them and maybe surprising the defense?
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Re: Patriots 2017 season
« Reply #516 on: January 23, 2018, 07:14:27 PM »

Offline Phantom255x

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Something about this play that I haven't seen addressed anywhere: Lewis had three blockers in front of him, so why was he shifting toward the outside of the right-most blocker, instead of staying basically centered behind the three of them? The fumble might not even happen if he'd done that.
I said the same thing when watching. Wondered why he didn't speed up and head down the sideline where blockers had it sealed. He instead slowed down and ran more towards the center of the field(not completely just more right than left towards the sidelines behind the bevy of blockers).

I'm wondering if he might've been getting a little antsy, thinking that his blockers were going too slow, and was thinking of darting past them and maybe surprising the defense?

I thought the same thing, but my guess is that Lewis didn't realize Jack was right behind him. He probably knew that someone was sort of trailing him, but he didn't realize the guy was literally RIGHT BEHIND him. As a result, Lewis thought of bouncing out while the defenders in front of him merged towards the sideline, and then got strip-tackled by Jack.

That's a credit to that JAX defense. They are a fast, speedy group, and Jack caught up to Lewis there. Myles Jack definitely caused a lot of problems for the Pats on Sunday, that's for sure.
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Re: Patriots 2017 season
« Reply #517 on: January 23, 2018, 07:15:32 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

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With the first quote it doesn't address the fact he didn't lose the ball till on the ground. Ball moving doesn't matter. We have seen it how many replays on would be fumbles? It has to be out of his hands before he hits the ground.
That's not how it works. The moment the ball gets dislodged, he's lost it and it's a fumble. That happens when Jack initially pokes at it out and way before Lewis has even started to go down.
That is how it works. It's been long established the ball has to be out. It's not a catch it's a runner
Well, the ball was "out" the moment Jack poked at it and it got dislodged. The moment you start bobbling the ball is when you fumble. That's been the rule (for reference, see the Sefarian-Jenkins non-TD). To regain control, you are under receiver rules, so you have to survive the ground. That didn't happen.
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Re: Patriots 2017 season
« Reply #518 on: January 23, 2018, 07:27:33 PM »

Online Csfan1984

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With the first quote it doesn't address the fact he didn't lose the ball till on the ground. Ball moving doesn't matter. We have seen it how many replays on would be fumbles? It has to be out of his hands before he hits the ground.
That's not how it works. The moment the ball gets dislodged, he's lost it and it's a fumble. That happens when Jack initially pokes at it out and way before Lewis has even started to go down.
That is how it works. It's been long established the ball has to be out. It's not a catch it's a runner
Well, the ball was "out" the moment Jack poked at it and it got dislodged. The moment you start bobbling the ball is when you fumble. That's been the rule (for reference, see the Sefarian-Jenkins non-TD). To regain control, you are under receiver rules, so you have to survive the ground. That didn't happen.
That ball was literally in the air.
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