We got the best player in the deal. And he hasn't reached his prime yet

[KGBirdBias]

The only way we lose this trade is if the Cavs beat the Warrriors, they get the #1 pick and Irving is hurt and the Celtics don't get the Lakers pick next year.

25 years old, cheaper and the Celtics will get the Lakers pick because the West is going to strangle the Lakers. Ainge weighed the Nets vs Lakers pick. A weak East makes the Nets pick expendable.

I will say it again...25 years old. 4x All Star, All Star MVP, clutch in Finals and won a chip.

[PaulAllen]

Wait wait wait. I mean we obviously got a young superstar but if that pick turns top 2 we would've lost this trade, we gave a PG that's arguably better than him right now to a win now team and a potential franchise cornerstone to build around. Lakers fans are going crazy laughing at us rn, let's hold our optimism in for a while.

I said in another thread that I heard on ESPN or CNS that the Cavs said they would do the deal if ONE of:

Tatum
Brown
2018 Nets pick
Lakers pick

was included.

So Danny valued the Nets pick the least.
Makes sense. Even though Nets suck, the East sucks really bad. and the Lakers are in a BRUTAL Western Conference.

I guess he figures he's replaced the Nets pick with a better lottery pick in the Lakers pick.

We'd have to hope that if that Nets pick is a top 2 or 3 pick that the player we draft is better than Kyrie Irving in his prime.

Because that's who we just got. A 25 year old that has won a championship as a top 2 player and averaged 28 ppg and 5 assists over 2 finals series and 12 finals games.
He's arguably still 2-3 years away from his prime, coming to play for a better coach and our team that has gotten younger, bigger, stronger and better.

We have every reason to be smiling from ear to ear mate

Also worth noting a tank may be in the future of the Lakers. Since Lopez and Pope are at the end of their contracts Magic might try to trade them to gain assets for further trades... If Lebron and PG decide to go west ..

[Vermont Green]

I think the age thing is being overstated some.  Irving is 25 years 5 months, Thomas is 28 years 6 months.  3 years isn't nothing but it also isn't huge.

Irving way well get better, Thomas certainly did in his 25-28 years but Irving is probably fairly close to his ceiling as he is pretty good right now.  And that is OK.  If he can be consistent at that level that is great.

Thomas had a generational season last season.  I am not sure that Irving can top that although I don't know if Thomas will ever top that either.  We gave up a lot for him.  I am OK with the trade but don't view it as a huge upgrade.  We should be better at least for two years.

[IDreamCeltics]

Per 36 numbers
                          FG%   3%    2%    FT%  FTA   REB   AST  STL  To   Pts      PER  WS
Thomas Career   .443   .367  .491   .876    6.6    3.1   6.2   1.2  2.9  23.0   21.0  45.0
Kyrie's  Career    .457   .383  .505   .873    4.7    3.3   5.8   1.4  2.8  22.8   21.3  40.0

Thomas 2016     .463   .379   .528  .909    9.1    2.9   6.3   1.0  2.8  30.8    26.5 12.5
Kyrie     2016     .473   .401   .486  .905    4.7    3.6   6.0   1.2  2.6  25.9    23.0  8.9

Age:
Thomas:27
Kyrie: 24

Seriously... Terrible trade. 
 

[jpotter33]

I think the age thing is being overstated some.  Irving is 25 years 5 months, Thomas is 28 years 6 months.  3 years isn't nothing but it also isn't huge.

Irving way well get better, Thomas certainly did in his 25-28 years but Irving is probably fairly close to his ceiling as he is pretty good right now.  And that is OK.  If he can be consistent at that level that is great.

Thomas had a generational season last season.  I am not sure that Irving can top that although I don't know if Thomas will ever top that either.  We gave up a lot for him.  I am OK with the trade but don't view it as a huge upgrade.  We should be better at least for two years.

Given the context of this situation it is huge. IT is approaching thirty, coming off a major injury, criminally undersized, and very reliant on his athleticism/quickness to be an effective NBA player. I think in this situation given IT's injury, size, and reliance on quickness, that three years is a major difference to consider.

Further, Kyrie has an old-man's game that should keep him playing at a really high level for several years into his thirties. He relies on his athleticism very little due to his extremely high skill set.

[jpotter33]

Per 36 numbers
                          FG%   3%    2%    FT%  FTA   REB   AST  STL  To   Pts      PER  WS
Thomas Career   .443   .367  .491   .876    6.6    3.1   6.2   1.2  2.9  23.0   21.0  45.0
Kyrie's  Career    .457   .383  .505   .873    4.7    3.3   5.8   1.4  2.8  22.8   21.3  40.0

Thomas 2016     .463   .379   .528  .909    9.1    2.9   6.3   1.0  2.8  30.8    26.5 12.5
Kyrie     2016     .473   .401   .486  .905    4.7    3.6   6.0   1.2  2.6  25.9    23.0  8.9

Age:
Thomas:27
Kyrie: 24

Seriously... Terrible trade. 
 

This thing called context matters. IT was the sole true scoring threat on our team with no other 20 ppg scorers; Kyrie had two other true scoring threats on his team that were 20+ ppg scorers.

[Fan from VT]

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-cavs-thread-the-needle-with-kyrie-megadeal/

[Fan from VT]

I think the age thing is being overstated some.  Irving is 25 years 5 months, Thomas is 28 years 6 months.  3 years isn't nothing but it also isn't huge.

Irving way well get better, Thomas certainly did in his 25-28 years but Irving is probably fairly close to his ceiling as he is pretty good right now.  And that is OK.  If he can be consistent at that level that is great.

Thomas had a generational season last season.  I am not sure that Irving can top that although I don't know if Thomas will ever top that either.  We gave up a lot for him.  I am OK with the trade but don't view it as a huge upgrade.  We should be better at least for two years.

Given the context of this situation it is huge. IT is approaching thirty, coming off a major injury, criminally undersized, and very reliant on his athleticism/quickness to be an effective NBA player. I think in this situation given IT's injury, size, and reliance on quickness, that three years is a major difference to consider.

Further, Kyrie has an old-man's game that should keep him playing at a really high level for several years into his thirties. He relies on his athleticism very little due to his extremely high skill set.

Yeah, I think the age matters especially in terms of timing of the NEXT max contract. Looking at IT, his size and hip looking for max money at age 29 vs Kyrie looking for a max deal at 27, is a big difference.

[Roy H.]

Per 36 numbers
                          FG%   3%    2%    FT%  FTA   REB   AST  STL  To   Pts      PER  WS
Thomas Career   .443   .367  .491   .876    6.6    3.1   6.2   1.2  2.9  23.0   21.0  45.0
Kyrie's  Career    .457   .383  .505   .873    4.7    3.3   5.8   1.4  2.8  22.8   21.3  40.0

Thomas 2016     .463   .379   .528  .909    9.1    2.9   6.3   1.0  2.8  30.8    26.5 12.5
Kyrie     2016     .473   .401   .486  .905    4.7    3.6   6.0   1.2  2.6  25.9    23.0  8.9

Age:
Thomas:27
Kyrie: 24

Seriously... Terrible trade. 
 

This thing called context matters. IT was the sole true scoring threat on our team with no other 20 ppg scorers; Kyrie had two other true scoring threats on his team that were 20+ ppg scorers.

Kyrie played more minutes, had more shot attempts, and often avoided double teams due to being set up by the best player in the world.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.fcgi?request=1&sum=0&player_id1_hint=Isaiah+Thomas&player_id1_select=Isaiah+Thomas&y1=2017&player_id1=thomais02&idx=players&player_id2_hint=Kyrie+Irving&player_id2_select=Kyrie+Irving&y2=2017&player_id2=irvinky01&idx=players

Kyrie is a heck of a talent, but he's not clearly better than IT. In fact, the stats say the opposite.

[Chris22]

IT could not even make it through the playoffs, and people here are saying that he and Kyrie have the same value.
LOL

[SHAQATTACK]

Irving is still young enough to be coached the right way .   LeBron is no coach , he is money hungry fend.

CBS can bring him back from the dark side.



Cavs only wanted that pick to buy a player like George off OKC .....to entice James to stay .  IT is just a short term gig , so Cavs won't be embrassed this year.....the goal is still PG3 .....just as Irving said it was.

No,way Cavs max IT.

His gimpy leg and small body won'r take 4-5 more years of the thumping he gave it.

IT can discuss his brinks truck with his new owner LeWhine ......LeWhine decides tue future of the Cavs ....not the GM.

[BitterJim]

IT could not even make it through the playoffs, and people here are saying that he and Kyrie have the same value.
LOL

Kyrie couldn't make it through the 2015 playoffs, and has played 60 fewer regular season games than Thomas (including missing 29 games in 2015-16). Does that mean that he can't possibly be considered valuable, either?

[jdz101]

Here is a fairly shallow look at the cumulative numbers on Kyrie, Isaiah, and a couple of their other similar peers for 16-17.

Honestly its not pretty reading.

I'm not sure how you could justify saying we got the best player in the deal based off last season's raw data. Entire body of work might be a bit different, but not much in all honesty.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/44b1east67eanf5/Kyrie%20Player%20Comparison.xlsx?dl=0

[jpotter33]

Per 36 numbers
                          FG%   3%    2%    FT%  FTA   REB   AST  STL  To   Pts      PER  WS
Thomas Career   .443   .367  .491   .876    6.6    3.1   6.2   1.2  2.9  23.0   21.0  45.0
Kyrie's  Career    .457   .383  .505   .873    4.7    3.3   5.8   1.4  2.8  22.8   21.3  40.0

Thomas 2016     .463   .379   .528  .909    9.1    2.9   6.3   1.0  2.8  30.8    26.5 12.5
Kyrie     2016     .473   .401   .486  .905    4.7    3.6   6.0   1.2  2.6  25.9    23.0  8.9

Age:
Thomas:27
Kyrie: 24

Seriously... Terrible trade. 
 

This thing called context matters. IT was the sole true scoring threat on our team with no other 20 ppg scorers; Kyrie had two other true scoring threats on his team that were 20+ ppg scorers.

Kyrie played more minutes, had more shot attempts, and often avoided double teams due to being set up by the best player in the world.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.fcgi?request=1&sum=0&player_id1_hint=Isaiah+Thomas&player_id1_select=Isaiah+Thomas&y1=2017&player_id1=thomais02&idx=players&player_id2_hint=Kyrie+Irving&player_id2_select=Kyrie+Irving&y2=2017&player_id2=irvinky01&idx=players

Kyrie is a heck of a talent, but he's not clearly better than IT. In fact, the stats say the opposite.

These were per-36 numbers he posted, so Kyrie playing more minutes isn't a factor here. And "more" shot attempts is reaching - they were virtually identical at 19.7 vs 19.4. And actually that's misleading, because IT averaged four more free throw attempts than Kyrie, meaning IT actually shot the ball more times per game when fouled fga are counted. This is evidenced by his higher usage rate of 34.0 vs Kyrie at 30.8.

Look, while you can make the case that they're similarly elite offensive players, which is fair, when both sides of the ball are considered Kyrie is clearly better. Even if Kyrie is no defensive worldbeater himself, at the very least he doesn't provide a perpetual mismatch against every single team in the league like IT. That's a significant difference. Also, while IT is pretty clearly maxed out and only going to get worse from here on out (he'll never top or come close to last year's production again, especially playing with more ball-dominant players now), Kyrie has yet to hit his prime.

Essentially, I think Kyrie definitely could've put up IT's offensive production last year in our context, while also not being the major defensive mismatch that IT was.

[incoherent]

Hey all that matters is that it is undeniable that Kyrie is better in the playoffs.

Thats all that matters, end of discussion. We have a clutch champion who has beaten Golden State on our team. 

End of discussion.