Author Topic: Four Ainge assumptions to make this trade happen  (Read 1530 times)

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Four Ainge assumptions to make this trade happen
« on: August 23, 2017, 03:22:53 AM »

Offline Darío SpanishFan

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1. He must have spoken to Irving to extend him beyond these two years remaining in his contract.
2. He wouldn't have given IT max money considering age, maybe injury and (lack) of defense due to size. But he thinks some team will give 30 million per year to him, so he had to check in.
3. An injury in a player who plays this way (much contact, getting into the basket among people a foot bigger than him) may be more dangerous than we think.
4. There will be at least five tanking teams this year, while the Nets have no incentive to do so. Maybe their 2018 pick may not be as good as expected.
5. The fact of having to give up more than one player might open up spots for necessary players (Tony Allen as a lockdown swing defender) and solves the logjam at the 3 spot with Crowder's departure, no matter how good his contract was.
BONUS: Let's keep an eye on the Noel situation. It's difficult, but the trade happening as soon as he changed agents makes me wonder.

Taking all these into account, the trade seems more palatable and easier to understand from our perspective. Because, at first sight, you just want to shouuuut.

Re: Four Ainge assumptions to make this trade happen
« Reply #1 on: August 23, 2017, 03:29:22 AM »

Offline Androslav

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Expanding;
6. You can get more Team USA players more easily when you already have two on your team (AD and such).
7. Brooklyn pick would have snatched the lower value than the Tatum pick. otherwise, we would include him instead, as there were reports that Cavs were interested in Tatum.
"The joy of the balling under the rims."

Re: Four Ainge assumptions to make this trade happen
« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2017, 03:51:22 AM »

Online Neurotic Guy

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I wonder if Ainge also was not as high on Zizic as he had been prior to SL.  Maybe he thought him more of a 3-5 year project with bust potential.  I don't see why Z needed to be the salary filler (which I assume was needed) when Semi, Yabu, Nader, maybe even Theis would have been enough.  Maybe it speaks to Danny's opinion on Yabu (who I would have thought was more of a project than Zizic).

Every way I try to rationalize I end up glad to have KI but sick in the belly about how well Cavs did in this trade. 

Re: Four Ainge assumptions to make this trade happen
« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2017, 04:10:49 AM »

Offline Darío SpanishFan

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7. Brooklyn pick would have snatched the lower value than the Tatum pick. otherwise, we would include him instead, as there were reports that Cavs were interested in Tatum.

TP. I think it's important for people to know that Tatum is a "sure" thing (well, he's a rookie, but everybody understands) while the Nets pick could end up being Bagley/Porter...or number 8.

Re: Four Ainge assumptions to make this trade happen
« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2017, 04:34:37 AM »

Offline iadera

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I still cannot believe that Ainge made this move, considering all prior ''easier'' moves and his hesitations to make them.

Re: Four Ainge assumptions to make this trade happen
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2017, 05:56:31 AM »

Offline playdream

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I still cannot believe that Ainge made this move, considering all prior ''easier'' moves and his hesitations to make them.
He made the right choice though, It's much better than PG/JB rumor

Re: Four Ainge assumptions to make this trade happen
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2017, 05:57:40 AM »

Offline playdream

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I wonder if Ainge also was not as high on Zizic as he had been prior to SL.  Maybe he thought him more of a 3-5 year project with bust potential.  I don't see why Z needed to be the salary filler (which I assume was needed) when Semi, Yabu, Nader, maybe even Theis would have been enough.  Maybe it speaks to Danny's opinion on Yabu (who I would have thought was more of a project than Zizic).

Every way I try to rationalize I end up glad to have KI but sick in the belly about how well Cavs did in this trade.
This , says a ton about how he sees Zizic and Yabu/Semi

Re: Four Ainge assumptions to make this trade happen
« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2017, 06:08:09 AM »

Offline tazzmaniac

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I just don't see #2 happening.  5'9" PGs are not greatly valued.  With a bad hip, even less so.  Next offseason, there are going to be even fewer teams with significant cap space and fewer teams that need a starting PG. 


Re: Four Ainge assumptions to make this trade happen
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2017, 06:16:06 AM »

Offline Darío SpanishFan

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I just don't see #2 happening.  5'9" PGs are not greatly valued.  With a bad hip, even less so.  Next offseason, there are going to be even fewer teams with significant cap space and fewer teams that need a starting PG.

It will depend on how he plays this year and other facts (for example, LeBron leaving or not).
 
Anyway, it can be said the same about 22-25 million per year and not the maximum. Ainge didn't want to commit a lot of salary about Thomas and will do it to Irving (which, in terms of age and performance, is much better).

Re: Four Ainge assumptions to make this trade happen
« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2017, 06:25:14 AM »

Online BitterJim

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Irving is not going to extend his contract. Doing so would leave ~$8-10 million per year on the table. If we had/were going to have the cap space to renegotiate his contract that could happen, but we aren't going to
I'm bitter.

Re: Four Ainge assumptions to make this trade happen
« Reply #10 on: August 23, 2017, 06:54:22 AM »

Offline Androslav

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Irving is not going to extend his contract. Doing so would leave ~$8-10 million per year on the table. If we had/were going to have the cap space to renegotiate his contract that could happen, but we aren't going to
8. If Horford declines his player option for the 2019/20 season, the same year Kyrie deal ends, we could have significant cap space.
"The joy of the balling under the rims."

Re: Four Ainge assumptions to make this trade happen
« Reply #11 on: August 23, 2017, 07:08:59 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Quote
1. He must have spoken to Irving to extend him beyond these two years remaining in his contract.
2. He wouldn't have given IT max money considering age, maybe injury and (lack) of defense due to size. But he thinks some team will give 30 million per year to him, so he had to check in.
3. An injury in a player who plays this way (much contact, getting into the basket among people a foot bigger than him) may be more dangerous than we think.
4. There will be at least five tanking teams this year, while the Nets have no incentive to do so. Maybe their 2018 pick may not be as good as expected.
5. The fact of having to give up more than one player might open up spots for necessary players (Tony Allen as a lockdown swing defender) and solves the logjam at the 3 spot with Crowder's departure, no matter how good his contract was.
BONUS: Let's keep an eye on the Noel situation. It's difficult, but the trade happening as soon as he changed agents makes me wonder


Solid analysis.  TP.  But I don't think Ainge wants Noel.

Re: Four Ainge assumptions to make this trade happen
« Reply #12 on: August 23, 2017, 07:21:34 AM »

Offline chambers

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I heard on ESPN or CNS that the Cavs said they would do the deal if ONE of:

Tatum
Brown
2018 Nets pick
Lakers pick

was included.

So Danny valued the Nets pick the least.
Makes sense. Even though Nets suck, the East sucks really bad. and the Lakers are in a BRUTAL Western Conference.

I guess he figures he's replaced the Nets pick with a better lottery pick in the Lakers pick.

"We are lucky we have a very patient GM that isn't willing to settle for being good and coming close. He wants to win a championship and we have the potential to get there still with our roster and assets."

quoting 'Greg B' on RealGM after 2017 trade deadline.
Read that last line again. One more time.

Re: Four Ainge assumptions to make this trade happen
« Reply #13 on: August 23, 2017, 10:54:12 AM »

Offline Darío SpanishFan

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Quote
1. He must have spoken to Irving to extend him beyond these two years remaining in his contract.
2. He wouldn't have given IT max money considering age, maybe injury and (lack) of defense due to size. But he thinks some team will give 30 million per year to him, so he had to check in.
3. An injury in a player who plays this way (much contact, getting into the basket among people a foot bigger than him) may be more dangerous than we think.
4. There will be at least five tanking teams this year, while the Nets have no incentive to do so. Maybe their 2018 pick may not be as good as expected.
5. The fact of having to give up more than one player might open up spots for necessary players (Tony Allen as a lockdown swing defender) and solves the logjam at the 3 spot with Crowder's departure, no matter how good his contract was.
BONUS: Let's keep an eye on the Noel situation. It's difficult, but the trade happening as soon as he changed agents makes me wonder


Solid analysis.  TP.  But I don't think Ainge wants Noel.

His style doesn't seem to fit us...but neither Baynes' seemed. I think there is another last ace in the hole for Ainge to get a big man unless we go stretch four full-time (which I wouldn't like).

It's being a funny summer, even if some people don't like the moves.