Woj: Boston has interest in Irving, no formal offer made yet. Cavs like Tatum

[Granath]

I've been saying since his demand broke that Thomas, Crowder, Rozier, and Boston's 1st for Irving makes a lot of sense for both teams.  I doubt it happens but would be reasonable

That's because you're Moranis. Others would prefer to not have a brain dead, locker room cancer loser on the team.

It's hard to take some you seriously when you make comments like this. Irving is a lot things, but he's a 4-time All-Star who's still just 25 years old. Is it questionable he wants to leave a winner? Possibly, but we don't know all of the behind the scenes machinations at work in Cleveland. Or maybe - just maybe - he's tired of being at the mercy of Lebron's whims. Right now, Cleveland is a winner but Lebron can torpedo that in a year. He's done it before.

In all fairness, this is the same guy that said the earth is flat and didn't talk to teammates for two straight practices during the playoffs. It may be harsh and hyperbole, but it's not far off.

.

1. Irving was trolling with that earth is flat thing. The fact that people still don't see that is hysterical. Alternative facts, indeed.
2. Again, that's one side of the story. Interesting that him not speaking to teammates only came to light after his trade request became public.

1.Was he trolling by saying we didn't land on the moon, Jamaican assassins killed JFK and aliens live among us? Either he's constantly trolling or he's an utter moron. Neither is a good thing.

2. Have you heard any of his teammates sticking up for him? No? That silence says everything you need to know. Sometimes there is only one story.

3. He'd rather be "the man" than win, hence the trade demand. Have you heard of another guy who wants to leave Lebron, who is known as one of the best teammates in the league?

I never said he wasn't talented. But he's lazy on defense and that attitude carries both on and off the court. I've never been impressed with Irving's demeanor or his drive to win. If a guy like that isn't committed now, what happens when he gets $150m?

He's just someone who should only ever see the visitor's side of a locker room in the Garden...to be candid, I'd rather have Cousins than Irving. At least Cousins generally gives his all on the floor.

[gouki88]

Unless we flip Irving for someone like AD, it doesn't make any sense. Ainge would never do IT and Tatum for Irving.

There's no way Kyrie and Isaiah could play together.

Unless it was a three-team trade, I don't see it. And I don't believe Cleveland would help facilitate us getting supreme talent in any way.

I'm not completely convinced this is true.  And that's why I'd be very intrigued in Tatum, Smart, and Morris for Kyrie.  I haven't sold myself on it yet, mostly because I don't want to play against Smart in the playoffs.  But that's what I'd look at.

Good back-courts would abuse us on the defensive end, but on the other end of the court what back-court can match the offensive dynamism of IT and Kyrie.

I still don't see any deal that benefits us.

Are Kyrie and IT that much worse defensively than Steph+Klay?
They're worse, but not by much.

Quite easily worse. Klay is a plus defender, whereas nobody else in that group is. That tips the scales heavily.

[csfansince60s]

I've been saying since his demand broke that Thomas, Crowder, Rozier, and Boston's 1st for Irving makes a lot of sense for both teams.  I doubt it happens but would be reasonable

I'd do that, even though it might hurt this year.

Not me...not only would it hurt us a lot this year, it helps Cleveland a lot and balances that team.

Cleveland becomes a lot stronger/deeper this year and IT AND Crowder and Rozier could make LeBaby stay.

On top of that, trading the guy H and H came here to play with in IT?

Bad, Bad juju.

No thanks.

[Moranis]

I suspect any Celtics interest in Irving would be connected with their ability to sign IT long term to a max. Or their inability, I should say. They will have a tough time adding a 3rd star to a max contract. Irving has a friendlier contract. What is it? $18-20M per for the next 2 or 3 years.They would have an easier time fitting Irving under or near the cap than IT.

Let's be clear, even if we give IT an absolute max-value, full 5-year contract, Irving will cost more over the next 6 years.

In fact, he will cost more in 5 of the 6 years.   And he will cost more in total just to cover the next two years.

Irving would be only be cheaper in year 2 from now (the year IT would be in the first year of his new contract).   Because after that, then Irving would jump back up above him in cost with his _own_ new max contract.

So can we please stop with the "friendlier contract" mythology?   Irving's contract doesn't present any real-world advantage over Thomas'.   In either case, we will be over the cap from now on.  In either case we will go over the tax in year 2.   The only difference is that we'd be over by a lesser amount in year 2 but then over by a lot more in subsequent years.

I think people see Irving as a more legitimate max-level player than IT due to his age and height advantage. The team-friendly terminology also refers to next year when we are going to plow through the tax penalty by a wide margin. Having Irving instead of a $30M+ IT would allow an extra year to work through the logistics. Heck, even Horford will be eligible to opt out of his contract after that year. It also may allow us to keep Smart.

Are you sure about that? We have to match salaries, and since we don't have any bad contracts, we are giving away good players on good deals. Unless we are gonna fill the roster with even more rookies, we aren't saving all that much. Lose Crowder in the deal, who replaces him? Vet min has-been? Two-way player?

Also, Brad is big on character and sometimes personalities just matter. IT is a perfect fit for this team and Irving is a questionable teammate, at best.

I will not endorse a trade for Kyrie unless it's part of a three-team deal in which we get someone to play alongside IT. You guys can harp on years and inches and dollars all you want, but when it comes to wins and losses, IT is right there with Kyrie (and some stats would suggest he is better). Many like to irgnore the LBJ factor and how much pressure he takes off Irving. When LeBron DNP's, the Cavs are terrible.

A lot of the Cavs terribleness without James is their general lack of a game plan and a roster constructed around James. 

Swapping Irving for Thomas, Crowder, Rozier, and Boston's 1st (say around pick 25) would save Boston in the neighborhood of 25 million next year, which would allow Boston to keep Smart (who is most definitely gone next year if Thomas is brought back).  It also most likely keeps Boston out of the luxury tax next year.  In addition, Irving is a much better fit with the timeline of Brown, Tatum, BKN, LAL picks as he is a good deal younger than Thomas and most would project him to have a longer prime than Thomas (on account of Thomas' small size).  Irving is also the best player in that trade.  I mean the poll on this blog shows a heavy tilt to Irving and this is the one place that would lean towards Thomas.

How are you replacing Crowder? Our biggest asset this year is depth and how we can play big/small depending on what Brad wants to do. Anyone who thinks he is a significant upgrade over IT is wrong. Yes he's younger, but we don't need younger. We needs rookies to learn from quality vets, what team other than GSW grew their young guys together into a dynasty? Every other template mixes all-star vets with talented youth. That's what Ainge is presumably going for.

If Kyrie will be making roughly $23M next year, how much are we paying Smart and who are we replacing Crowder/Rozier with to stay below the tax while staying amongst the elite? We take a giant step back to maybe stay under the tax threshold for another season? Or do you think Kyrie for IT/Crowder/Rozier/pick makes us better?

I'm here to win now. I like our horses. I don't care what the polls say on a site with the most negative fan base there probably is. For every green-glassed fan on here, we have a Debbie Downer who just likes to play devils advocate believing the grass is always greener. IT is too small. Horford's the worst contract in NBA. Hayward can't play D/he's no George. Lakers are gonna win 50. Brad uses too many lineups. Ainge is too gunshy. Wyc & co are too cheap. This site is hardly that biased FOR the Celtics.

Boston isn't winning a title this year, so what does any extra depth this year actually matter for?  As for who is going to replace a bench SF, my guess is Tatum.  Morris and Brown will fill some of those minutes as well.  Essentially you'd be looking at a playoff rotation this year of Irving, Brown, Hayward, Morris, Horford, Smart, Tatum, and Baynes.  Next year Boston will add at least 1 top level rookie and maybe 2 and would likely be able to keep Smart with having Irving at 8 million or so less than Thomas, plus no Crowder, Rozier, or the late 1st salaries on the books. 

The way to win a title is to either build around the young players/assets or trade those players/assets for guys that can actually make Boston a legit contender.  It isn't just do nothing and hope it all works out as the team is already starting to lose players for salary reasons, and that is only going to continue with the current status quo because the Celtics aren't going to pay the luxury tax for a non-contender, especially for 3 straight seasons to hit the repeater tax level just in time for the young guys to maybe be ready.

[Moranis]

I've been saying since his demand broke that Thomas, Crowder, Rozier, and Boston's 1st for Irving makes a lot of sense for both teams.  I doubt it happens but would be reasonable

That's because you're Moranis. Others would prefer to not have a brain dead, locker room cancer loser on the team.

It's hard to take some you seriously when you make comments like this. Irving is a lot things, but he's a 4-time All-Star who's still just 25 years old. Is it questionable he wants to leave a winner? Possibly, but we don't know all of the behind the scenes machinations at work in Cleveland. Or maybe - just maybe - he's tired of being at the mercy of Lebron's whims. Right now, Cleveland is a winner but Lebron can torpedo that in a year. He's done it before.

In all fairness, this is the same guy that said the earth is flat and didn't talk to teammates for two straight practices during the playoffs. It may be harsh and hyperbole, but it's not far off.

.

1. Irving was trolling with that earth is flat thing. The fact that people still don't see that is hysterical. Alternative facts, indeed.
2. Again, that's one side of the story. Interesting that him not speaking to teammates only came to light after his trade request became public.

1.Was he trolling by saying we didn't land on the moon, Jamaican assassins killed JFK and aliens live among us? Either he's constantly trolling or he's an utter moron. Neither is a good thing.

2. Have you heard any of his teammates sticking up for him? No? That silence says everything you need to know. Sometimes there is only one story.

3. He'd rather be "the man" than win, hence the trade demand. Have you heard of another guy who wants to leave Lebron, who is known as one of the best teammates in the league?

I never said he wasn't talented. But he's lazy on defense and that attitude carries both on and off the court. I've never been impressed with Irving's demeanor or his drive to win. If a guy like that isn't committed now, what happens when he gets $150m?

He's just someone who should only ever see the visitor's side of a locker room in the Garden...to be candid, I'd rather have Cousins than Irving. At least Cousins generally gives his all on the floor.

1. Yes.  He is always trolling because morons on the internet keep falling for it.

2. His teammates know he is gone and don't want to alienate James.  They know who butters the goose in Cleveland.

3.  He doesn't want to be the man.  He wants to be away from James and out of Cleveland.  That is obvious by looking at the 4 teams he put on his list i.e. Minnesota (clearly behind Butler and probably Towns this year let alone going forward and that is a team with solid management and a well respected coach), San Antonio (clearly behind Leonard and the most stable organization in the NBA), Miami (clearly the man, but aside from San An is the most stable organization in the sport), and New York (his home town so a bit different than the other 3).  Irving just doesn't want to play with James and can't stand the dysfunction that is the Cavs management.  Remember he wasn't the one who leaked his trade request to the press and thus he wasn't the one controlling that narrative.  After winning the title, James was apparently pushing the Cavs to trade Irving for Chris Paul (a title the Cavs don't win without Irving).  Maybe just maybe that soured the relationship, which worsened over the entirety of last season culminating with Irving asking out at the end of the season maybe even after Griffin was let go (a GM that was genuinely liked and well respected by everyone on the Cavs and around the NBA).  If he really wanted to be the man, he wouldn't have put San Antonio and Minnesota on his list.  That tells you that wasn't why Irving asked out. 

[moiso]

Maybe the morons are the ones who think Irving is trolling.  In the context it certainly didn't look as though Irving wasn't 100% serious when he said that stuff.  There was no humor in it.  I don't see the point of saying that stuff without some kind of humor.  I think the stuff he said is just so ridiculous that some people have to file it the "he can't be serious" category.  To me it seemed like he was serious.  The second coming of Carl Everett.

[RJ87]

I've been saying since his demand broke that Thomas, Crowder, Rozier, and Boston's 1st for Irving makes a lot of sense for both teams.  I doubt it happens but would be reasonable

That's because you're Moranis. Others would prefer to not have a brain dead, locker room cancer loser on the team.

It's hard to take some you seriously when you make comments like this. Irving is a lot things, but he's a 4-time All-Star who's still just 25 years old. Is it questionable he wants to leave a winner? Possibly, but we don't know all of the behind the scenes machinations at work in Cleveland. Or maybe - just maybe - he's tired of being at the mercy of Lebron's whims. Right now, Cleveland is a winner but Lebron can torpedo that in a year. He's done it before.

In all fairness, this is the same guy that said the earth is flat and didn't talk to teammates for two straight practices during the playoffs. It may be harsh and hyperbole, but it's not far off.

.

1. Irving was trolling with that earth is flat thing. The fact that people still don't see that is hysterical. Alternative facts, indeed.
2. Again, that's one side of the story. Interesting that him not speaking to teammates only came to light after his trade request became public.

1.Was he trolling by saying we didn't land on the moon, Jamaican assassins killed JFK and aliens live among us? Either he's constantly trolling or he's an utter moron. Neither is a good thing.

2. Have you heard any of his teammates sticking up for him? No? That silence says everything you need to know. Sometimes there is only one story.

3. He'd rather be "the man" than win, hence the trade demand. Have you heard of another guy who wants to leave Lebron, who is known as one of the best teammates in the league?

I never said he wasn't talented. But he's lazy on defense and that attitude carries both on and off the court. I've never been impressed with Irving's demeanor or his drive to win. If a guy like that isn't committed now, what happens when he gets $150m?

He's just someone who should only ever see the visitor's side of a locker room in the Garden...to be candid, I'd rather have Cousins than Irving. At least Cousins generally gives his all on the floor.

1. Yes.  He is always trolling because morons on the internet keep falling for it.

2. His teammates know he is gone and don't want to alienate James.  They know who butters the goose in Cleveland.

3.  He doesn't want to be the man.  He wants to be away from James and out of Cleveland.  That is obvious by looking at the 4 teams he put on his list i.e. Minnesota (clearly behind Butler and probably Towns this year let alone going forward and that is a team with solid management and a well respected coach), San Antonio (clearly behind Leonard and the most stable organization in the NBA), Miami (clearly the man, but aside from San An is the most stable organization in the sport), and New York (his home town so a bit different than the other 3).  Irving just doesn't want to play with James and can't stand the dysfunction that is the Cavs management.  Remember he wasn't the one who leaked his trade request to the press and thus he wasn't the one controlling that narrative.  After winning the title, James was apparently pushing the Cavs to trade Irving for Chris Paul (a title the Cavs don't win without Irving).  Maybe just maybe that soured the relationship, which worsened over the entirety of last season culminating with Irving asking out at the end of the season maybe even after Griffin was let go (a GM that was genuinely liked and well respected by everyone on the Cavs and around the NBA).  If he really wanted to be the man, he wouldn't have put San Antonio and Minnesota on his list.  That tells you that wasn't why Irving asked out.

TP. Couldn't have said it better myself.

And GreenEnvy, I'm not worried about "what happens after he gets $150m". He's already making bank with his endorsements (he's got the best selling signature sneaker in Nike's basketball line 2 years running), if it was about the money he would've checked out awhile ago.

[Moranis]

Maybe the morons are the ones who think Irving is trolling.  In the context it certainly didn't look as though Irving wasn't 100% serious when he said that stuff.  There was no humor in it.  I don't see the point of saying that stuff without some kind of humor.  I think the stuff he said is just so ridiculous that some people have to file it the "he can't be serious" category.  To me it seemed like he was serious.  The second coming of Carl Everett.

The thing is, Irving has actually all but said he was trolling everyone.

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2017/02/kyrie_irving_admits_science_su.html#incart_river_index

"It would be scientifically impossible, which I'm totally aware of that," Irving said after the East's All-Star practice on Saturday.

"I just feel like the fact that it's even a conversation is hilarious," he said. "That that could actually be news. It's hilarious."

[moiso]

Maybe the morons are the ones who think Irving is trolling.  In the context it certainly didn't look as though Irving wasn't 100% serious when he said that stuff.  There was no humor in it.  I don't see the point of saying that stuff without some kind of humor.  I think the stuff he said is just so ridiculous that some people have to file it the "he can't be serious" category.  To me it seemed like he was serious.  The second coming of Carl Everett.

The thing is, Irving has actually all but said he was trolling everyone.

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2017/02/kyrie_irving_admits_science_su.html#incart_river_index

"It would be scientifically impossible, which I'm totally aware of that," Irving said after the East's All-Star practice on Saturday.

"I just feel like the fact that it's even a conversation is hilarious," he said. "That that could actually be news. It's hilarious."

I never saw the stuff from that day.  So he wasn't serious.  He thinks it's hilarious but it's not funny.

[GreenFaith1819]

No thanks, please don't mess with our chemistry.

IT4 is our heart and soul.

[KGs Knee]

I really just cannot fathom Ainge trading Thomas for Irving.  I suspect that would cause major issues in the lockeroom, as IT is a rather beloved guy.  Ainge (hopefully) learned his lesson about this after the Perkins trade.

[byennie]

Has to be Boston sniffing out a 3 way trade. We're always hunting for good intel.

Let's just blow up the league.

Love, Davis to Boston
Cousins, Crowder, Morris to Cleveland
Horford, Irving, Brown to New Orleans

IT/ Smart/ Hayward/ Love/ Davis

wooooooooo

[colincb]

KI is leaving now or next year. Cavs are in a mess and have a strong incentive to try to trade him.

If we clearly win such a trade, you do it. Otherwise, don't.

IT and Tatum for Irving is a don't.

[Moranis]

Maybe the morons are the ones who think Irving is trolling.  In the context it certainly didn't look as though Irving wasn't 100% serious when he said that stuff.  There was no humor in it.  I don't see the point of saying that stuff without some kind of humor.  I think the stuff he said is just so ridiculous that some people have to file it the "he can't be serious" category.  To me it seemed like he was serious.  The second coming of Carl Everett.

The thing is, Irving has actually all but said he was trolling everyone.

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2017/02/kyrie_irving_admits_science_su.html#incart_river_index

"It would be scientifically impossible, which I'm totally aware of that," Irving said after the East's All-Star practice on Saturday.

"I just feel like the fact that it's even a conversation is hilarious," he said. "That that could actually be news. It's hilarious."

I never saw the stuff from that day.  So he wasn't serious.  He thinks it's hilarious but it's not funny.

you've missed his point entirely.

[gouki88]

Maybe the morons are the ones who think Irving is trolling.  In the context it certainly didn't look as though Irving wasn't 100% serious when he said that stuff.  There was no humor in it.  I don't see the point of saying that stuff without some kind of humor.  I think the stuff he said is just so ridiculous that some people have to file it the "he can't be serious" category.  To me it seemed like he was serious.  The second coming of Carl Everett.

The thing is, Irving has actually all but said he was trolling everyone.

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2017/02/kyrie_irving_admits_science_su.html#incart_river_index

"It would be scientifically impossible, which I'm totally aware of that," Irving said after the East's All-Star practice on Saturday.

"I just feel like the fact that it's even a conversation is hilarious," he said. "That that could actually be news. It's hilarious."

I never saw the stuff from that day.  So he wasn't serious.  He thinks it's hilarious but it's not funny.

you've missed his point entirely.

It's definitely funny. It actually is hilarious.