Author Topic: Tatum says he was Ainge's pick all along  (Read 10504 times)

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Re: Tatum says he was Ainge's pick all along
« Reply #45 on: August 05, 2017, 10:57:44 PM »

Offline footey

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I just wish Danny had learned to be more daring in the draft a couple years earlier when he took Olynyk rather Giannis.

I'm convinced that KO was a Stevens' pick.

KO fit CBS' system and prototype player.....a big who can shoot and handle the ball.

Giannis was an incredible athlete who couldn't shoot and was unpolished.

DA gets blamed on this all the time (and he is the GM, and I realize the buck stops with him), but the KO pick had "accommodate the new head coach" all over it. To me that was on Stevens.

Athleticism isn't high on CBS priority list of player attributes desired. Nor is rebounding nor shot blocking. He likes skilled, versatile players who can shoot.  In my opinion that's why we do not have the Greek freak and we had KO.
I don't buy it but if that were the case Stevens should have no input on the draft selections.

Stevens wasn't hired until a week or so after the draft.  There's no way Olynyk was his pick.  None.

I remember reading where Stevens told Danny that Butler hated playing him. Don't know the timing of that conversation.

Re: Tatum says he was Ainge's pick all along
« Reply #46 on: August 05, 2017, 11:05:54 PM »

Offline saltlover

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I just wish Danny had learned to be more daring in the draft a couple years earlier when he took Olynyk rather Giannis.

I'm convinced that KO was a Stevens' pick.

KO fit CBS' system and prototype player.....a big who can shoot and handle the ball.

Giannis was an incredible athlete who couldn't shoot and was unpolished.

DA gets blamed on this all the time (and he is the GM, and I realize the buck stops with him), but the KO pick had "accommodate the new head coach" all over it. To me that was on Stevens.

Athleticism isn't high on CBS priority list of player attributes desired. Nor is rebounding nor shot blocking. He likes skilled, versatile players who can shoot.  In my opinion that's why we do not have the Greek freak and we had KO.
I don't buy it but if that were the case Stevens should have no input on the draft selections.

Stevens wasn't hired until a week or so after the draft.  There's no way Olynyk was his pick.  None.

I remember reading where Stevens told Danny that Butler hated playing him. Don't know the timing of that conversation.

Doc left for the Clippers on the 25th.  The draft was on the 27th.  During that time they also made one of the most epic trades in NBA history -- I don't think they were picking Stevens' brain about Olynyk that week.

But anyway, Olynyk was a fine pick who lived up to exoectations.  The error in evaluation was about Giannis, not Olynyk.  From Day 1 Ainge called him a role player, and that's what he turned into.  So if Stevens liked Olynyk, and somehow had any influence in whom the Celtics selected a week before he was hired, he wasn't wrong. 

Re: Tatum says he was Ainge's pick all along
« Reply #47 on: August 05, 2017, 11:09:14 PM »

Offline CelticsElite

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Plus its hardly all Dannys fault about Greek freak being passed up. Half the league passed on him

Re: Tatum says he was Ainge's pick all along
« Reply #48 on: August 05, 2017, 11:14:21 PM »

Offline Bobshot

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Ainge said he thought the top 4 or 5 picks were about equal. He may have had a preference for Tatum--one factor being a preference for a forward--but a big factor may also have been the $2 million price savings for the #3 vs #1 pick. They were cutting it close with the $2million cap reduction signing Hayward.

Tatum looks like the best pick right now, but the Celtics didn't get much respect in the Summer League out west. I don't know how Josh Jackson was picked over him on the all-star team. Maybe because Tatum sat on the bench a lot the last 2-3 games. Ball was the obvious big market media pick out there, though that kid's funny shot release with a delay could be a problem for him.

The rookies that will dominate will be the ones that play big minutes for bad teams. Hard to see that happening with Tatum, though he could surprise with his offense.

Re: Tatum says he was Ainge's pick all along
« Reply #49 on: August 06, 2017, 12:13:47 PM »

Offline ThePaintedArea

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When Vlade traded Boogie at the all-star weekend, people were all over him cause he decided not to wait till the trade deadline.

Different situation, I think - they traded him to get him out of their locker room, so taking action immediately may have been a priority.  Then, too, it may have occurred to them that trading him sooner meant fewer wins, and therefore a better chance at a top pick.

Re: Tatum says he was Ainge's pick all along
« Reply #50 on: August 06, 2017, 02:21:17 PM »

Offline Jvalin

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When Vlade traded Boogie at the all-star weekend, people were all over him cause he decided not to wait till the trade deadline.

Different situation, I think - they traded him to get him out of their locker room, so taking action immediately may have been a priority.  Then, too, it may have occurred to them that trading him sooner meant fewer wins, and therefore a better chance at a top pick.
They traded him 4 days prior to the deadline. The NBA had no games scheduled for those 4 days.

Re: Tatum says he was Ainge's pick all along
« Reply #51 on: August 06, 2017, 03:41:49 PM »

Offline ManUp

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I absolutely believe he was Danny's guy.

Fultz seemed to have had a poor showing with the Celtics in his workouts and probably didn't impress with his interview. There was a pre-draft video of him shooting around shirtless looking pudgy and talk of him not looking as explosive in workouts. Those are red flags that suggest he was relaxing instead of working out and preparing for the draft. Danny seems to be learning from past draft mistakes when it comes to talented guys with questionable motors and work ethic (Gerald Green, Jeff Green, Sullinger, and Young).

Fultz acting as if the Celtics picking him was a forgone conclusion also wasn't a good look on his part. It rubbed me the wrong way and I'm assuming it rubbed people in the Celtics organization the wrong way. Fultz was counting his chickens before they hatched and it kind of made him look a bit entitled. Look at this way he went into workouts out of shape, didn't impress, and was still acting as if his number one selection by the Celtics was a forgone conclusion on social media and tv specials.

From what I've read, seen, and my own intuition. Danny trading down was simply about him not being impressed by Fultz and liking Tatum(the person and player) more. Trading down with Philly was simply a smart move. The Lakers weren't going to take Tatum because they already have Ingram. Philly was in serious need of a point guard and perimeter scoring they were taking Ball or Fultz. So why take the guy at 1 when you can have him at 3 and pick up another serious asset? Agree or disagree with his decision Danny got the guy he was going to pick.

Re: Tatum says he was Ainge's pick all along
« Reply #52 on: August 06, 2017, 03:43:36 PM »

Offline FreddieJ

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When Vlade traded Boogie at the all-star weekend, people were all over him cause he decided not to wait till the trade deadline.

Different situation, I think - they traded him to get him out of their locker room, so taking action immediately may have been a priority.  Then, too, it may have occurred to them that trading him sooner meant fewer wins, and therefore a better chance at a top pick.
They traded him 4 days prior to the deadline. The NBA had no games scheduled for those 4 days.

Cousins agent was making the deals worse by threatening teams interested that he wouldn't re-sign, and New Orleans dropped another first from the deal because of that. The Kings aren't managed by dunces

Re: Tatum says he was Ainge's pick all along
« Reply #53 on: August 06, 2017, 04:47:43 PM »

Offline Jvalin

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When Vlade traded Boogie at the all-star weekend, people were all over him cause he decided not to wait till the trade deadline.

Different situation, I think - they traded him to get him out of their locker room, so taking action immediately may have been a priority.  Then, too, it may have occurred to them that trading him sooner meant fewer wins, and therefore a better chance at a top pick.
They traded him 4 days prior to the deadline. The NBA had no games scheduled for those 4 days.

Cousins agent was making the deals worse by threatening teams interested that he wouldn't re-sign, and New Orleans dropped another first from the deal because of that. The Kings aren't managed by dunces
What about when they traded Isaiah Thomas to the Suns for a traded player exception and the rights to Alex Oriakhi? Were they managed by dunces back then or not?

What about when they traded Nik Stauskas + Carl Landry + Jason Thompson + 2019 unprotected first round pick + two pick swap options for the rights to Arturas Gudaitis + Luka Mitrovic + future second round pick?

What about when they traded Omri Casspi and a protected first to the Cavs for JJ Hickson?

What about when they traded the 7th pick in the 2011 draft (Bismack Biyombo) + Beno Udrih for the 10th pick (Jimmer Fredette) + John Salmons?

I could go on and on and on....

Anyway, there were teams willing to trade for Boogie regardless of his contract situation. Off the top of my head : the Pelicans, the Magic and the Lakers.


case for the Pelicans :
- Dell Demps (their GM) had nothing to lose cause according to rumors he was in danger of getting fired.
- They already had AD.
- Boogie is from Mobile, Alabama, just a two-hour drive from New Orleans.
- Both Boogie and AD played college basketball for the University of Kentucky.


case for the Magic :
Same GM situation with the Pelicans. Rob Hennigan was about to get fired and he was trying to save his job (for what it's worth, he got fired on April 13)


case for the Lakers :
They are the Lakers. No fear of losing Boogie in free agency.

Re: Tatum says he was Ainge's pick all along
« Reply #54 on: August 06, 2017, 05:16:27 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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When Vlade traded Boogie at the all-star weekend, people were all over him cause he decided not to wait till the trade deadline.

Different situation, I think - they traded him to get him out of their locker room, so taking action immediately may have been a priority.  Then, too, it may have occurred to them that trading him sooner meant fewer wins, and therefore a better chance at a top pick.
They traded him 4 days prior to the deadline. The NBA had no games scheduled for those 4 days.

Cousins agent was making the deals worse by threatening teams interested that he wouldn't re-sign, and New Orleans dropped another first from the deal because of that. The Kings aren't managed by dunces
What about when they traded Isaiah Thomas to the Suns for a traded player exception and the rights to Alex Oriakhi? Were they managed by dunces back then or not?

What about when they traded Nik Stauskas + Carl Landry + Jason Thompson + 2019 unprotected first round pick + two pick swap options for the rights to Arturas Gudaitis + Luka Mitrovic + future second round pick?

What about when they traded Omri Casspi and a protected first to the Cavs for JJ Hickson?

What about when they traded the 7th pick in the 2011 draft (Bismack Biyombo) + Beno Udrih for the 10th pick (Jimmer Fredette) + John Salmons?

I could go on and on and on....

Anyway, there were teams willing to trade for Boogie regardless of his contract situation. Off the top of my head : the Pelicans, the Magic and the Lakers.


case for the Pelicans :
- Dell Demps (their GM) had nothing to lose cause according to rumors he was in danger of getting fired.
- They already had AD.
- Boogie is from Mobile, Alabama, just a two-hour drive from New Orleans.
- Both Boogie and AD played college basketball for the University of Kentucky.


case for the Magic :
Same GM situation with the Pelicans. Rob Hennigan was about to get fired and he was trying to save his job (for what it's worth, he got fired on April 13)


case for the Lakers :
They are the Lakers. No fear of losing Boogie in free agency.
to be fair, the IT trade, was a sign and trade. The stupidity was not in their inability to get better assets. The stupidity lies in the decision not to resign Isaiah.
Quote from: George W. Bush
Too often, we judge other groups by their worst examples while judging ourselves by our best intentions.

Re: Tatum says he was Ainge's pick all along
« Reply #55 on: August 06, 2017, 05:20:29 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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I just wish Danny had learned to be more daring in the draft a couple years earlier when he took Olynyk rather Giannis.

I'm convinced that KO was a Stevens' pick.

KO fit CBS' system and prototype player.....a big who can shoot and handle the ball.

Giannis was an incredible athlete who couldn't shoot and was unpolished.

DA gets blamed on this all the time (and he is the GM, and I realize the buck stops with him), but the KO pick had "accommodate the new head coach" all over it. To me that was on Stevens.

Athleticism isn't high on CBS priority list of player attributes desired. Nor is rebounding nor shot blocking. He likes skilled, versatile players who can shoot.  In my opinion that's why we do not have the Greek freak and we had KO.
I don't buy it but if that were the case Stevens should have no input on the draft selections.

Stevens wasn't hired until a week or so after the draft.  There's no way Olynyk was his pick.  None.

I remember reading where Stevens told Danny that Butler hated playing him. Don't know the timing of that conversation.
I can promise you it was after the draft.
Quote from: George W. Bush
Too often, we judge other groups by their worst examples while judging ourselves by our best intentions.

Re: Tatum says he was Ainge's pick all along
« Reply #56 on: August 06, 2017, 05:36:48 PM »

Offline Jvalin

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When Vlade traded Boogie at the all-star weekend, people were all over him cause he decided not to wait till the trade deadline.

Different situation, I think - they traded him to get him out of their locker room, so taking action immediately may have been a priority.  Then, too, it may have occurred to them that trading him sooner meant fewer wins, and therefore a better chance at a top pick.
They traded him 4 days prior to the deadline. The NBA had no games scheduled for those 4 days.

Cousins agent was making the deals worse by threatening teams interested that he wouldn't re-sign, and New Orleans dropped another first from the deal because of that. The Kings aren't managed by dunces
What about when they traded Isaiah Thomas to the Suns for a traded player exception and the rights to Alex Oriakhi? Were they managed by dunces back then or not?

What about when they traded Nik Stauskas + Carl Landry + Jason Thompson + 2019 unprotected first round pick + two pick swap options for the rights to Arturas Gudaitis + Luka Mitrovic + future second round pick?

What about when they traded Omri Casspi and a protected first to the Cavs for JJ Hickson?

What about when they traded the 7th pick in the 2011 draft (Bismack Biyombo) + Beno Udrih for the 10th pick (Jimmer Fredette) + John Salmons?

I could go on and on and on....

Anyway, there were teams willing to trade for Boogie regardless of his contract situation. Off the top of my head : the Pelicans, the Magic and the Lakers.


case for the Pelicans :
- Dell Demps (their GM) had nothing to lose cause according to rumors he was in danger of getting fired.
- They already had AD.
- Boogie is from Mobile, Alabama, just a two-hour drive from New Orleans.
- Both Boogie and AD played college basketball for the University of Kentucky.


case for the Magic :
Same GM situation with the Pelicans. Rob Hennigan was about to get fired and he was trying to save his job (for what it's worth, he got fired on April 13)


case for the Lakers :
They are the Lakers. No fear of losing Boogie in free agency.
to be fair, the IT trade, was a sign and trade. The stupidity was not in their inability to get better assets. The stupidity lies in the decision not to resign Isaiah.
Yep, they basically decided to let him walk and they got a trade exception (which went unused) out of it. Obviously, it was a terrible decision, especially since they could have resigned him on a multi-year bargain contract.

No Brinks truck at the time for IT. :P
« Last Edit: August 06, 2017, 07:24:19 PM by Jvalin »

Re: Tatum says he was Ainge's pick all along
« Reply #57 on: August 06, 2017, 09:33:29 PM »

Offline mctyson

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I don't follow all the pre-draft hype and analysis all that closely - I'll look at some mock drafts, watch some videos, but otherwise don't pay attention to all the "experts".  So my questions:

1) Were there any mock drafts at all where Fultz was not #1?

If I remember correctly CBS had Boston picking Tatum.

Re: Tatum says he was Ainge's pick all along
« Reply #58 on: August 06, 2017, 10:46:06 PM »

Offline FreddieJ

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When Vlade traded Boogie at the all-star weekend, people were all over him cause he decided not to wait till the trade deadline.

Different situation, I think - they traded him to get him out of their locker room, so taking action immediately may have been a priority.  Then, too, it may have occurred to them that trading him sooner meant fewer wins, and therefore a better chance at a top pick.
They traded him 4 days prior to the deadline. The NBA had no games scheduled for those 4 days.

Cousins agent was making the deals worse by threatening teams interested that he wouldn't re-sign, and New Orleans dropped another first from the deal because of that. The Kings aren't managed by dunces
What about when they traded Isaiah Thomas to the Suns for a traded player exception and the rights to Alex Oriakhi? Were they managed by dunces back then or not?

What about when they traded Nik Stauskas + Carl Landry + Jason Thompson + 2019 unprotected first round pick + two pick swap options for the rights to Arturas Gudaitis + Luka Mitrovic + future second round pick?

What about when they traded Omri Casspi and a protected first to the Cavs for JJ Hickson?

What about when they traded the 7th pick in the 2011 draft (Bismack Biyombo) + Beno Udrih for the 10th pick (Jimmer Fredette) + John Salmons?

I could go on and on and on....

Anyway, there were teams willing to trade for Boogie regardless of his contract situation. Off the top of my head : the Pelicans, the Magic and the Lakers.


case for the Pelicans :
- Dell Demps (their GM) had nothing to lose cause according to rumors he was in danger of getting fired.
- They already had AD.
- Boogie is from Mobile, Alabama, just a two-hour drive from New Orleans.
- Both Boogie and AD played college basketball for the University of Kentucky.


case for the Magic :
Same GM situation with the Pelicans. Rob Hennigan was about to get fired and he was trying to save his job (for what it's worth, he got fired on April 13)


case for the Lakers :
They are the Lakers. No fear of losing Boogie in free agency.

D'Allessandro was a terrible GM, so yeah. Petrie was at the end of his road too, hence why he wasn't kept. So why bring up moves under their tenure? The Sixers trade was a calculated gamble that didn't pay off in hindsight. The Magic didn't want to trade for him, and reportedly wouldn't even accept a Fournier/Vuc. Lakers wouldn't trade Ingram and couldn't move their pick, they didn't have anything. Nor was it promised that the Pelicans offer would continue to be there, as they were in the mix for Okafor. I'm glad you think you know more than NBA GMs
« Last Edit: August 06, 2017, 10:55:53 PM by FreddieJ »

Re: Tatum says he was Ainge's pick all along
« Reply #59 on: August 07, 2017, 08:26:31 AM »

Offline Moranis

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When Vlade traded Boogie at the all-star weekend, people were all over him cause he decided not to wait till the trade deadline.

Different situation, I think - they traded him to get him out of their locker room, so taking action immediately may have been a priority.  Then, too, it may have occurred to them that trading him sooner meant fewer wins, and therefore a better chance at a top pick.
They traded him 4 days prior to the deadline. The NBA had no games scheduled for those 4 days.

Cousins agent was making the deals worse by threatening teams interested that he wouldn't re-sign, and New Orleans dropped another first from the deal because of that. The Kings aren't managed by dunces
What about when they traded Isaiah Thomas to the Suns for a traded player exception and the rights to Alex Oriakhi? Were they managed by dunces back then or not?

What about when they traded Nik Stauskas + Carl Landry + Jason Thompson + 2019 unprotected first round pick + two pick swap options for the rights to Arturas Gudaitis + Luka Mitrovic + future second round pick?

What about when they traded Omri Casspi and a protected first to the Cavs for JJ Hickson?

What about when they traded the 7th pick in the 2011 draft (Bismack Biyombo) + Beno Udrih for the 10th pick (Jimmer Fredette) + John Salmons?

I could go on and on and on....

Anyway, there were teams willing to trade for Boogie regardless of his contract situation. Off the top of my head : the Pelicans, the Magic and the Lakers.


case for the Pelicans :
- Dell Demps (their GM) had nothing to lose cause according to rumors he was in danger of getting fired.
- They already had AD.
- Boogie is from Mobile, Alabama, just a two-hour drive from New Orleans.
- Both Boogie and AD played college basketball for the University of Kentucky.


case for the Magic :
Same GM situation with the Pelicans. Rob Hennigan was about to get fired and he was trying to save his job (for what it's worth, he got fired on April 13)


case for the Lakers :
They are the Lakers. No fear of losing Boogie in free agency.
Thomas signed a contract with the Suns as a restricted free agent.  Now certainly the Kings could have matched the contract offer, but they preferred Darren Collison at 3 years, 16 million as opposed to Thomas at 4 years, 27 million.  So rather then just lose Thomas for nothing they did the sign and trade to get a trade exception and the rights to a player.  And while Collison didn't blossom like Thomas did, he has been a pretty effective player for the Kings. 
2023 Historical Draft - Brooklyn Nets - 9th pick

Bigs - Pau, Amar'e, Issel, McGinnis, Roundfield
Wings - Dantley, Bowen, J. Jackson
Guards - Cheeks, Petrovic, Buse, Rip