If no PG-13, can we get BOTH Hayward AND Griffin, one via sign and trade?

[csfansince60s]

I know that S&Ts have become more difficult, with the new CBA, so I am not conversant as to their restrictions.

If we miss out on PG, can we sign one of Hayward/Griffin via FA and get one via S&T similar as to how CP3 was just acquired by the Rox?

Anybody have an idea as to what that could look like?

Also, is it easier, numbers-wise to get a 3rd team involved. e.g, Celts/Pacers/Clips?...so George to Clips, Griffin here and whatever we need to send to the Pacers?

[Moranis]

Yes but you have to get to a pretty high salary going out, which is very difficult without including Horford or Thomas.  It is possible, but isn't all that likely.

[Tr1boy]

My bold prediction is... If both pg13, hayward dont sign

Griffin is going to be a Celtic

[Future Celtics Owner]

Yes but you have to get to a pretty high salary going out, which is very difficult without including Horford or Thomas.  It is possible, but isn't all that likely.

Horford for Blake?

[csfansince60s]

Yes but you have to get to a pretty high salary going out, which is very difficult without including Horford or Thomas.  It is possible, but isn't all that likely.

Would either the Jazz or Clips be interested in a S&T Olynyk?

That should be a big chunk of change.

Can you S&T one player for another S&T'd player?

[Dino Pitino]

Yes but you have to get to a pretty high salary going out, which is very difficult without including Horford or Thomas.  It is possible, but isn't all that likely.

Would either the Jazz or Clips be interested in a S&T Olynyk?

That should be a big chunk of change.

Can you S&T one player for another S&T'd player?

Olynyk's new salary would only count as half of itself in the trade because of BYC. That's what CBA people say.

[pearljammer10]

CP3 wasn't a sign and trade

[csfansince60s]

Yes but you have to get to a pretty high salary going out, which is very difficult without including Horford or Thomas.  It is possible, but isn't all that likely.

Would either the Jazz or Clips be interested in a S&T Olynyk?

That should be a big chunk of change.

Can you S&T one player for another S&T'd player?

Olynyk's new salary would only count as half of itself in the trade because of BYC. That's what CBA people say.

TP, thanks.

So, if KO got $18m, 9 would count....would KO, Bradley and Crowder with a pick or two do it?

[JBcat]

Yes but you have to get to a pretty high salary going out, which is very difficult without including Horford or Thomas.  It is possible, but isn't all that likely.

Would either the Jazz or Clips be interested in a S&T Olynyk?

That should be a big chunk of change.

Can you S&T one player for another S&T'd player?

Olynyk's new salary would only count as half of itself in the trade because of BYC. That's what CBA people say.

Shouldn't it even out though if the returning player is also via S&T?  I don't think I've ever seen it done before.

For the other player coming in maybe could also be done via S&T with Bradley and Crowder going out?

[saltlover]

Yes but you have to get to a pretty high salary going out, which is very difficult without including Horford or Thomas.  It is possible, but isn't all that likely.

Would either the Jazz or Clips be interested in a S&T Olynyk?

That should be a big chunk of change.

Can you S&T one player for another S&T'd player?

Olynyk's new salary would only count as half of itself in the trade because of BYC. That's what CBA people say.

Shouldn't it even out though if the returning player is also via S&T?  I don't think I've ever seen it done before.

For the other player coming in maybe could also be done via S&T with Bradley and Crowder going out?

No, it makes it worse.  Olynyk counts fully to the team receiving him, but half for us in terms of how much we can take back.  The same would be true coming the other way too.  Say we are getting Hayward.  We'd have to send out roughly $24 million to get him.  For the Jazz, Hayward would count as his current salary of $16 million (you pick either the current salary or half the new one, whichever is greater), meaning they could only take back $21 million if they wound up going over the cap.  Say Olynyk gets $16 million.  He'd only count as $8 million for the Celtics, meaning they'd need to send an additional $16 million to get to $24 million, for a total of $32 million.  This far exceeds the $21 million Hayward can bring back.

As for double sign-and-trades -- we sent Sasha Pavlovic to Portland (along with second-round picks for helping out) in a S&T as part of the three team deal that brought us Courtney Lee from Houston.

[crimson_stallion]

Yes but you have to get to a pretty high salary going out, which is very difficult without including Horford or Thomas.  It is possible, but isn't all that likely.

Would either the Jazz or Clips be interested in a S&T Olynyk?

That should be a big chunk of change.

Can you S&T one player for another S&T'd player?

Olynyk's new salary would only count as half of itself in the trade because of BYC. That's what CBA people say.

TP, thanks.

So, if KO got $18m, 9 would count....would KO, Bradley and Crowder with a pick or two do it?

You'd need to make up $30m.

$9m for Olynyk
$8m for Bradley
$6m for Crowder

That's still only $23m, so you need to somehow make up another $7m on top of that - most likely would have to involve either Tatum, Smart or Jaylen going out as well - and by this point you've stripped so much of the team that it hardly seams worth it.

The key reason why the Paul George / Jimmy Butler ideas were so good was the fact that both players are on bargain contracts - $17m for Butler and $19m for George.  They were figures that Boston could match salary with relatively easily.   Matching for $30M is much harder.

This is where all of Boston's cost efficient contracts actually becomes a liability, and where the value of contracts like Amir (@ $12M) and Zeller (@ $8M) were valuable.  They were great for making up salary in potential trades.

[csfansince60s]

TPs to all for the clarifications.

This thing is a morass to me.

Sounds like Hayward (my preference) OR Griffin and try to pry a star (PG13, Zinger, someone who hasn't shaken out yet) who is on a good contract. Shake those trees, Danny!