Honestly, I Don't Think 'The Offseason Plan' Has Changed Much

[ThePaintedArea]

I don't buy it for a second, it just doesn't make any sense.  Bring in Hayward and George, rely on 31+ year old Horford and other bigs off the scrap heap, have to resign I.T. and George for a ton the next off season pushing the C's well into the tax, have a very young inexperienced bench and the only way to improve is now through internal development of the youngsters and the Brooklyn pick, + lose a ton of your defense if Bradley, Crowder, Smart, K.O., Jerebko, are traded or let go???

It's refreshing to see someone looking at the big picture.

"other bigs off the scrap heap" - plus, apparently, Ante Zizic. The grass is always greener, they say, on the other side of the hill.

I have always said that I trust Danny but if he goes that route I am going to start questioning what they are doing.  I would still bet that the Hayward + George rumors are not true/smokescreen,  Bradley and maybe Crowder are traded, K.O. and Smart stay, and Hayward signs.

I'm doubtful even about them signing Hayward. It's likely that he'd have an immediate impact on shot creation - something that Boston needs badly - but he's an average defender, and getting him neither addresses the urgent defensive rebounding crisis nor makes it easier to add quality bigs because of the salary.  That the Celtics Brass have drafted two guys in two years who have tremendous shot creating potential shows that they're addressing that particular need - granted of course that Hayward is an immediate solution.

Wouldn't it be more effective to sign Blake Griffin? That would address the Celtics' three big issues: shot-creation, defensive rebounding, and big man depth. Unlike with Zizic, with Blake they can continue to run the fluid offense that they've been building toward these past few years.

[Phantom255x]

I don't buy it for a second, it just doesn't make any sense.  Bring in Hayward and George, rely on 31+ year old Horford and other bigs off the scrap heap, have to resign I.T. and George for a ton the next off season pushing the C's well into the tax, have a very young inexperienced bench and the only way to improve is now through internal development of the youngsters and the Brooklyn pick, + lose a ton of your defense if Bradley, Crowder, Smart, K.O., Jerebko, are traded or let go???

It's refreshing to see someone looking at the big picture.

"other bigs off the scrap heap" - plus, apparently, Ante Zizic. The grass is always greener, they say, on the other side of the hill.

I have always said that I trust Danny but if he goes that route I am going to start questioning what they are doing.  I would still bet that the Hayward + George rumors are not true/smokescreen,  Bradley and maybe Crowder are traded, K.O. and Smart stay, and Hayward signs.

I'm doubtful even about them signing Hayward. It's likely that he'd have an immediate impact on shot creation - something that Boston needs badly - but he's an average defender, and getting him neither addresses the urgent defensive rebounding crisis nor makes it easier to add quality bigs because of the salary.  That the Celtics Brass have drafted two guys in two years who have tremendous shot creating potential shows that they're addressing that particular need - granted of course that Hayward is an immediate solution.

Wouldn't it be more effective to sign Blake Griffin? That would address the Celtics' three big issues: shot-creation, defensive rebounding, and big man depth. Unlike with Zizic, with Blake they can continue to run the fluid offense that they've been building toward these past few years.

I think if Hayward stays put or goes MIA.. We have a great shot at Griffin with CP3 now traded.

Hopefully KG has put in some good words about BOS while he was an assistant of sorts for the Clips this season.

[Phantom255x]

Tom Cuddy‏
@TomCuddySports

#Celtics Danny Ainge on possible trading partners.."They are asking for some of our prime real estate."

Probably means the plan is the same, no longer Hayward + George/Griffin.

Some team may actually overpay for a year of George. Hope it's not the C's.

[mctyson]

If the trade for George is just Crowder and Bradley and picks, I don't see how replacing those two Celtics with George and Hayward guts the team. I think it upgrades the starters and leaves Smart, Brown, Rozier, Tatum, possibly Jerebko with the room exception, Zizic, Theis and probably a vet min guy like Lavoy Allen or Marresse Speights

It doesn't gut the team but ask yourself if upgrading Bradley to Hayward is what puts this team past Cleveland or Golden State?

They are the same age and in the same year in the league (7th going to 8th)

I agree that Hayward is superior offensively to Bradley, but that is largely due to his ability to iso and draw fouls.  Look at their per game stats from this year, Hayward's 1st All Star season:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.fcgi?request=1&sum=0&player_id1_hint=Avery+Bradley&player_id1_select=Avery+Bradley&player_id1=bradlav01&y1=2017&player_id2_hint=Gordon+Hayward&player_id2_select=Gordon+Hayward&y2=2017&player_id2=haywago01&idx=players

A lot of these are nearly identical, almost eerily similar.  They play the same amount of minutes, shoot similar % from 2 and 3...Hayward just gets to the line more and makes more FTs.

Now, ask yourself if they are similar defensively.  More importantly, is replacing Bradley with Hayward giving you a better chance of stopping Kyrie Iriving, Steph Curry, James Harden, Chris Paul, etc...?

I am not so sure it does.  I like Hayward to, but what if it is a better idea to use the space for simply George's extension, or for signing Griffin?

So yeah, it is not gutting the team, but it is not really a massive upgrade outside of adding George and all of the ancillary steps required to get both Hayward and George will remove valuable key players from the roster who I think we would all rather keep if possible.

[nickagneta]

If the trade for George is just Crowder and Bradley and picks, I don't see how replacing those two Celtics with George and Hayward guts the team. I think it upgrades the starters and leaves Smart, Brown, Rozier, Tatum, possibly Jerebko with the room exception, Zizic, Theis and probably a vet min guy like Lavoy Allen or Marresse Speights

It doesn't gut the team but ask yourself if upgrading Bradley to Hayward is what puts this team past Cleveland or Golden State?

They are the same age and in the same year in the league (7th going to 8th)

I agree that Hayward is superior offensively to Bradley, but that is largely due to his ability to iso and draw fouls.  Look at their per game stats from this year, Hayward's 1st All Star season:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.fcgi?request=1&sum=0&player_id1_hint=Avery+Bradley&player_id1_select=Avery+Bradley&player_id1=bradlav01&y1=2017&player_id2_hint=Gordon+Hayward&player_id2_select=Gordon+Hayward&y2=2017&player_id2=haywago01&idx=players

A lot of these are nearly identical, almost eerily similar.  They play the same amount of minutes, shoot similar % from 2 and 3...Hayward just gets to the line more and makes more FTs.

Now, ask yourself if they are similar defensively.  More importantly, is replacing Bradley with Hayward giving you a better chance of stopping Kyrie Iriving, Steph Curry, James Harden, Chris Paul, etc...?

I am not so sure it does.  I like Hayward to, but what if it is a better idea to use the space for simply George's extension, or for signing Griffin?

So yeah, it is not gutting the team, but it is not really a massive upgrade outside of adding George and all of the ancillary steps required to get both Hayward and George will remove valuable key players from the roster who I think we would all rather keep if possible.

You take the role players. I will take the All-Stars.

[Phantom255x]

If the trade for George is just Crowder and Bradley and picks, I don't see how replacing those two Celtics with George and Hayward guts the team. I think it upgrades the starters and leaves Smart, Brown, Rozier, Tatum, possibly Jerebko with the room exception, Zizic, Theis and probably a vet min guy like Lavoy Allen or Marresse Speights

It doesn't gut the team but ask yourself if upgrading Bradley to Hayward is what puts this team past Cleveland or Golden State?

They are the same age and in the same year in the league (7th going to 8th)

I agree that Hayward is superior offensively to Bradley, but that is largely due to his ability to iso and draw fouls.  Look at their per game stats from this year, Hayward's 1st All Star season:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.fcgi?request=1&sum=0&player_id1_hint=Avery+Bradley&player_id1_select=Avery+Bradley&player_id1=bradlav01&y1=2017&player_id2_hint=Gordon+Hayward&player_id2_select=Gordon+Hayward&y2=2017&player_id2=haywago01&idx=players

A lot of these are nearly identical, almost eerily similar.  They play the same amount of minutes, shoot similar % from 2 and 3...Hayward just gets to the line more and makes more FTs.

Now, ask yourself if they are similar defensively.  More importantly, is replacing Bradley with Hayward giving you a better chance of stopping Kyrie Iriving, Steph Curry, James Harden, Chris Paul, etc...?

I am not so sure it does.  I like Hayward to, but what if it is a better idea to use the space for simply George's extension, or for signing Griffin?

So yeah, it is not gutting the team, but it is not really a massive upgrade outside of adding George and all of the ancillary steps required to get both Hayward and George will remove valuable key players from the roster who I think we would all rather keep if possible.

You take the role players. I will take the All-Stars.

I agree Hayward > Bradley, and George > Bradley

But did you really just call Bradley a "role player"??

[Phantom255x]

JUST STAY THE COURSE. FORGET GEORGE. (In response to Lowe Article On Front Page Of The Blog)

Sign one of Hayward/Griffin, fill out the remaining roles with Zizic, exception signings and what not (maybe small trades for a moderate PF/C upgrade)? And ROLL. Keep developing.

George is HELL BENT on being a Laker in 2018. And just hoping the "winning culture" will convinced George to stay is a VERY RISKY MOVE.

Most of you would call for Danny’s head if he traded for George with a valuable asset or two, then watched him bolt for the Lakers for "free" next year.

And screw Indiana if they really want back Nets Pick + Lakers Pick + STARTERS for a dang rental.

They can just enjoy the second rounders and the Shumperts that all the other teams, Lakers included, will likely offer then for PG13.

[Phantom255x]

Looks like it will stay like this.

Now if Hayward stays in Utah or signs with Miami, that will be depressing...

[CelticsElite]

Let's see how much of this actually occurs lol