Author Topic: Ainge on cancelled Jackson workout: "I was mad" was cancelled mid-flight Bos-Sac  (Read 12446 times)

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Offline Chief Macho

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Ainge passed on his top rated player because of hurt feelings and a grudge with the agent?   Is that what I'm reading?   great.

Offline Snakehead

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Ainge passed on his top rated player because of hurt feelings and a grudge with the agent?   Is that what I'm reading?

No?  They've already said multiple times they would have taken Tatum first overall, what are you talking about?
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Offline ChillyWilly

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I think BJ Armstrong is bold and will do what it takes to get what he wants. There was serious concern Danny was taking Jackson so he made sure that didn't happen.

I'm pretty sure flying DA cross country just to sit in a hotel room was the nail in the coffin.

Not sure how I feel about someone not wanting to compete on a playoff team however if stat padding is his goal than PHO is a great place to drop 70 and still get blown out :)
ok fine

Offline Snakehead

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I should have known people on Celticsblog would try to conspiracy all of this.
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Offline footey

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We'll never know for sure but I feel it did influence Ainge's decision. He's human.

Re: Ainge on Jackson: "he didn't want to be a Celtic for some reason"
« Reply #50 on: June 23, 2017, 09:38:07 AM »

Offline mef730

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What adults does this kid have around him?  How did they let him get away with that?

Mike

He didn't make the decision.
How do you know?

Common sense, plus his agent's history of being difficult.

Jackson indicated that he wish he'd worked out for the Celts in hindsight. I think he just got bad advice.

It doesn't matter if it was at the behest of the agent or not.  The agent is representing Josh Jackson, not the other way around.

While that's true, it also somewhat ignores reality. I work in a field where I give advice, and people rely on me. That includes a lot of 19 year olds. Many of these kids - and many who are much older - completely rely on me. I've heard "I'll do whatever you recommend" too many times to count. If I had an agenda (like Armstrong) it would be incredibly easy to steer these clients in an unwise direction.

Now, in my field, I repeatedly remind my clients that I'm just giving advice, that they have various options, etc. Legal clients repeatedly  get reminded that they're the ultimate decision maker, because if that's fuzzy for a client, their can be ethics violations, etc. Why? Because the opportunity for undue influence is high. I get the sense that some agents might be a bit less scrupulous in protecting their clients' interests.

In short, athletes are no more immune than being taken advantage of by people in power than anybody else.

I have to agree. I'm also in a field where I provide advice to people and have grown pretty good at it. People pay me for my advice with the intention of taking it.

The Josh Jackson situation is the ultimate in, "In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king." His agent has been doing this for a while. He hasn't. I don't blame him for taking his agent's advice, even if it didn't make sense to him.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not happy with the kid, but I think that the majority of the blame belongs elsewhere.

Mike

Offline Ogaju

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Seeing as we're all hopeless Celtics homers, everyone is bashing Jackson for cancelling the work out, and rightfully so. He shouldn't have agreed to anything he wasn't willing to go through, and even if he changed his mind he should have at least honored his original commitment.

I don't really want to talk about the cancellation though. What a lot of fans don't really want to admit is that as good an organization as the Celtics are, there are a lot of reasons this isn't the best place for a young player to come to now.

First off, the Celtics already have Jaylen Brown, Jae Crowder, and are planning to go all out to sign Hayward. That's way too many SFs eating up minutes. This is a team that wants to at least half "go for it" right now and honestly, that means young players are not going to get as many minutes as they would on a typical lottery team. The less a player plays early on, the less experience and exposure they get.

With such a logjam at certain positions and a requirement to maximize their ability to win now, eventually some of the players will either be allowed to walk or be dealt for a superstar. It's unrealistic to expect the Celtics to keep all these young players because we won't be able to afford them. Eventually the team will need to decide which ones are best and deserving of a big contract. The ones that aren't will either be dealt, let go, or asked to sign less for a bench role. The most likely result is that they are traded.

Why would a young player want to go somewhere where there is that uncertainty? You are totally under the team's control and could be dealt anywhere. Why not go to a place where you will at least get playing time?

The Celtics are trying to have their cake and eat it too. They want to compete now but due to the unlikely situation where they have all these good first round picks from the Nets deal, they are trying to use the kids as assets while keeping them as bench players. What's going to happen next year when they potentially have two more lottery picks? Are they going to have a bench full of lottery picks? How happy are they going to be in such a situation?

We already are at risk of keeping Yabusele and Zizic abroad another year, delaying their rookie deal activating and limiting the amount of NBA money they can make overall in their careers. Do you think that is making their agents very happy? With so many forwards, what is Yabusele thinking? Is he ever going to get a chance here anyway?

Undoubtedly the Celtics are going to be making trades to help alleviate the roster jam, so they'll be fine eventually. The players? That is debatable. Yes, when it comes down to it every player in this league is an asset, because after all it's a business. But when you're 19 years old, it's still important for you to believe that the team that drafts you truly believes you will be with them for 10-12 years.

I agree with everything you said, but wouldn't the mature and professional thing to do in this setting be to have the interview and ask the team what their long term plans are if they select the him? He can then tell them if he is on board, or if the team should look elsewhere.

Offline Tr1boy

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Josh Jackson came off to be too much like Rondo imo
A rascal, know it all and rubbed ainge and cbs the wrong way

I was a fan but after hearing he cancelled the 1st workout midflight ... Then didnt make it up... Pretty low move. I hope Jaylen torches him

Offline Bobshot

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That story raises a flag about Jackson's character.

Offline BlackCeltic

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I usually give kids benefit of the doubt but there's no way you waste someone's time like that.

Offline obnoxiousmime

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Seeing as we're all hopeless Celtics homers, everyone is bashing Jackson for cancelling the work out, and rightfully so. He shouldn't have agreed to anything he wasn't willing to go through, and even if he changed his mind he should have at least honored his original commitment.

I don't really want to talk about the cancellation though. What a lot of fans don't really want to admit is that as good an organization as the Celtics are, there are a lot of reasons this isn't the best place for a young player to come to now.

First off, the Celtics already have Jaylen Brown, Jae Crowder, and are planning to go all out to sign Hayward. That's way too many SFs eating up minutes. This is a team that wants to at least half "go for it" right now and honestly, that means young players are not going to get as many minutes as they would on a typical lottery team. The less a player plays early on, the less experience and exposure they get.

With such a logjam at certain positions and a requirement to maximize their ability to win now, eventually some of the players will either be allowed to walk or be dealt for a superstar. It's unrealistic to expect the Celtics to keep all these young players because we won't be able to afford them. Eventually the team will need to decide which ones are best and deserving of a big contract. The ones that aren't will either be dealt, let go, or asked to sign less for a bench role. The most likely result is that they are traded.

Why would a young player want to go somewhere where there is that uncertainty? You are totally under the team's control and could be dealt anywhere. Why not go to a place where you will at least get playing time?

The Celtics are trying to have their cake and eat it too. They want to compete now but due to the unlikely situation where they have all these good first round picks from the Nets deal, they are trying to use the kids as assets while keeping them as bench players. What's going to happen next year when they potentially have two more lottery picks? Are they going to have a bench full of lottery picks? How happy are they going to be in such a situation?

We already are at risk of keeping Yabusele and Zizic abroad another year, delaying their rookie deal activating and limiting the amount of NBA money they can make overall in their careers. Do you think that is making their agents very happy? With so many forwards, what is Yabusele thinking? Is he ever going to get a chance here anyway?

Undoubtedly the Celtics are going to be making trades to help alleviate the roster jam, so they'll be fine eventually. The players? That is debatable. Yes, when it comes down to it every player in this league is an asset, because after all it's a business. But when you're 19 years old, it's still important for you to believe that the team that drafts you truly believes you will be with them for 10-12 years.

I agree with everything you said, but wouldn't the mature and professional thing to do in this setting be to have the interview and ask the team what their long term plans are if they select the him? He can then tell them if he is on board, or if the team should look elsewhere.

As I said before, I'm not excusing the cancellation. I don't know what the mix-up there was, he shouldn't have agreed to it if he wasn't going to follow through.

Regarding his team's overall policy of avoiding the Celtics, however, can you argue with the results? He wasn't drafted by the Celtics, after all. He will probably get a lot of minutes on a PHX team that has a strong future. Take the cancellation out of the equation - do you think Ainge would have been really upset at a player for trying to control his future? He's a former player himself.

I mean, Ainge has been called "Trader Danny" for ****. When's the last time a star Celtic actually retired with the team? Kevin McHale? You could say that that doesn't happen anymore but I could point you to the Spurs Ginobili and Duncan, Bryant in LA, and Nowitzki in Dallas. All I'm saying is that you can understand why an agent would instruct their client to do whatever possible to go somewhere else. We shouldn't take it so personally.


Offline droopdog7

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Ainge passed on his top rated player because of hurt feelings and a grudge with the agent?   Is that what I'm reading?

No?  They've already said multiple times they would have taken Tatum first overall, what are you talking about?
Link?  I know they said they could still get their top rated player, but there is certainly no guarantee that Tatum was that guy.  Indeed, this situation leaves the possibility that Jackson was the guy.

Offline Tr1boy

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Ainge passed on his top rated player because of hurt feelings and a grudge with the agent?   Is that what I'm reading?

No?  They've already said multiple times they would have taken Tatum first overall, what are you talking about?
Link?  I know they said they could still get their top rated player, but there is certainly no guarantee that Tatum was that guy.  Indeed, this situation leaves the possibility that Jackson was the guy.

Nobody knows...but it was either going to be Jackson or Tatum

Both guys are similar level prospects ...just that one has adv on the defensive end and the other on the offensive end

One played mind games the other worked out twice and co operated during the process....so Tatum got picked

Jackson might of had a better chance(slim)  if he just didnt workout for the Celtics at all...instead of cancelling mid flight the 1st time and making Danny mad

Offline hwangjini_1

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Ainge passed on his top rated player because of hurt feelings and a grudge with the agent?   Is that what I'm reading?   great.
no. that is what you are reading into it. that ainge walks around with grudges or hurt feelings guiding his leadership of the celtics is not borne out so far by his actions.

the point here is either jackson or his agent or both acted very unprofessionally. perhaps it was intentional to drive ainge off from choosing him. in which case, ainge did the right thing in not picking jackson.

besides, tatum was ainge's first choice anyway.
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Offline Fan from VT

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Ainge passed on his top rated player because of hurt feelings and a grudge with the agent?   Is that what I'm reading?

No?  They've already said multiple times they would have taken Tatum first overall, what are you talking about?
Link?  I know they said they could still get their top rated player, but there is certainly no guarantee that Tatum was that guy.  Indeed, this situation leaves the possibility that Jackson was the guy.

Nobody knows...but it was either going to be Jackson or Tatum

Both guys are similar level prospects ...just that one has adv on the defensive end and the other on the offensive end

One played mind games the other worked out twice and co operated during the process....so Tatum got picked

Jackson might of had a better chance(slim)  if he just didnt workout for the Celtics at all...instead of cancelling mid flight the 1st time and making Danny mad

I kept going back and forth too, still don't know; the age and size measurables would favor Tatum though.