Author Topic: For all the Josh Jackson supporters....  (Read 20937 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Re: For all the Josh Jackson supporters....
« Reply #105 on: June 21, 2017, 04:31:41 PM »

Offline PickNRoll

  • Don Chaney
  • *
  • Posts: 1691
  • Tommy Points: 199
The free throws don't concern me. I doubt it's something he's put a lot of time and effort into practicing thusfar. If he's a hard worker he'll fix that.

What concerns me are his short arms and the hitch in his jumpshot.
It's overstated.  He shot 37% from 3 for the year and 44% over the second half of the year, better than Fultz, Tatum, Fox... all of them.  He basically shot it on par with Luke Kennard over the 2nd half, one of the best shooters in the draft.

Re: For all the Josh Jackson supporters....
« Reply #106 on: June 21, 2017, 04:36:48 PM »

Offline CelticsElite

  • NCE
  • Danny Ainge
  • **********
  • Posts: 10774
  • Tommy Points: 789
The free throws don't concern me. I doubt it's something he's put a lot of time and effort into practicing thusfar. If he's a hard worker he'll fix that.

What concerns me are his short arms and the hitch in his jumpshot.
It's overstated.  He shot 37% from 3 for the year and 44% over the second half of the year, better than Fultz, Tatum, Fox... all of them.  He basically shot it on par with Luke Kennard over the 2nd half, one of the best shooters in the draft.
that's cuz he only shot like 90 attempts.

Didn't LaMelo Ball attempt 90 in a single game or something

Re: For all the Josh Jackson supporters....
« Reply #107 on: June 21, 2017, 04:39:22 PM »

Offline PickNRoll

  • Don Chaney
  • *
  • Posts: 1691
  • Tommy Points: 199
The free throws don't concern me. I doubt it's something he's put a lot of time and effort into practicing thusfar. If he's a hard worker he'll fix that.

What concerns me are his short arms and the hitch in his jumpshot.
It's overstated.  He shot 37% from 3 for the year and 44% over the second half of the year, better than Fultz, Tatum, Fox... all of them.  He basically shot it on par with Luke Kennard over the 2nd half, one of the best shooters in the draft.
that's cuz he only shot like 90 attempts.

Didn't LaMelo Ball attempt 90 in a single game or something
We can only use the data we have.  If the guy makes 44%, how can we conclude he's a bad shooter, even given a small sample?

Re: For all the Josh Jackson supporters....
« Reply #108 on: June 21, 2017, 04:40:22 PM »

Offline Tr1boy

  • Paul Pierce
  • ***************************
  • Posts: 27260
  • Tommy Points: 867
The free throws don't concern me. I doubt it's something he's put a lot of time and effort into practicing thusfar. If he's a hard worker he'll fix that.

What concerns me are his short arms and the hitch in his jumpshot.
It's overstated.  He shot 37% from 3 for the year and 44% over the second half of the year, better than Fultz, Tatum, Fox... all of them.  He basically shot it on par with Luke Kennard over the 2nd half, one of the best shooters in the draft.
that's cuz he only shot like 90 attempts.

Didn't LaMelo Ball attempt 90 in a single game or something

Fultz only attempted about the same...

Ball, kennard, monk attempted and made more 3s

Re: For all the Josh Jackson supporters....
« Reply #109 on: June 21, 2017, 04:44:22 PM »

Offline number_n9ne

  • Jayson Tatum
  • Posts: 937
  • Tommy Points: 126
The free throws don't concern me. I doubt it's something he's put a lot of time and effort into practicing thusfar. If he's a hard worker he'll fix that.

What concerns me are his short arms and the hitch in his jumpshot.
It's overstated.  He shot 37% from 3 for the year and 44% over the second half of the year, better than Fultz, Tatum, Fox... all of them.  He basically shot it on par with Luke Kennard over the 2nd half, one of the best shooters in the draft.
that's cuz he only shot like 90 attempts.

Didn't LaMelo Ball attempt 90 in a single game or something
We can only use the data we have.  If the guy makes 44%, how can we conclude he's a bad shooter, even given a small sample?

Moot point. You can't conclude that he's a good shooter due to the small sample size.

Re: For all the Josh Jackson supporters....
« Reply #110 on: June 21, 2017, 05:30:59 PM »

Offline loco_91

  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2087
  • Tommy Points: 145
The free throws don't concern me. I doubt it's something he's put a lot of time and effort into practicing thusfar. If he's a hard worker he'll fix that.

What concerns me are his short arms and the hitch in his jumpshot.
It's overstated.  He shot 37% from 3 for the year and 44% over the second half of the year, better than Fultz, Tatum, Fox... all of them.  He basically shot it on par with Luke Kennard over the 2nd half, one of the best shooters in the draft.
that's cuz he only shot like 90 attempts.

Didn't LaMelo Ball attempt 90 in a single game or something
We can only use the data we have.  If the guy makes 44%, how can we conclude he's a bad shooter, even given a small sample?

We can only use the data we have, indeed, but we should use ALL the data we have, not the tiny fraction of it that makes him look best.

3p: 34/90 (.378 - decent % on low volume)
FT: 98/173 (.566 - extremely bad on twice the volume)

If Jackson were truly a long-term 38% 3pt shooter, or even a long-term 33% 3pt shooter, we would expect him to attempt more than 90 3's and to be much, much, much better from the FT line.

For contrast, Tatum's stats:
3p: 40/117 (.342)
FT: 118/139 (.849!)

Re: For all the Josh Jackson supporters....
« Reply #111 on: June 21, 2017, 05:33:10 PM »

Offline hwangjini_1

  • Kevin Garnett
  • *****************
  • Posts: 17837
  • Tommy Points: 2661
  • bammokja
i just posted this in another thread, but they work here as well. sorry for duplicating posts.

two articles comparing top players in the draft. pretty good stuff.


http://fansided.com/2017/03/02/jayson-tatum-jonathan-isaac-matchup-breakdown/

http://www.draftexpress.com/article/comparing-and-contrasting-the-prospects-of-tatum-jackson-and-isaac-6062/

I believe Gandhi is the only person who knew about real democracy — not democracy as the right to go and buy what you want, but democracy as the responsibility to be accountable to everyone around you. Democracy begins with freedom from hunger, freedom from unemployment, freedom from fear, and freedom from hatred.
- Vandana Shiva

Re: For all the Josh Jackson supporters....
« Reply #112 on: June 21, 2017, 05:40:45 PM »

Offline PickNRoll

  • Don Chaney
  • *
  • Posts: 1691
  • Tommy Points: 199
The free throws don't concern me. I doubt it's something he's put a lot of time and effort into practicing thusfar. If he's a hard worker he'll fix that.

What concerns me are his short arms and the hitch in his jumpshot.
It's overstated.  He shot 37% from 3 for the year and 44% over the second half of the year, better than Fultz, Tatum, Fox... all of them.  He basically shot it on par with Luke Kennard over the 2nd half, one of the best shooters in the draft.
that's cuz he only shot like 90 attempts.

Didn't LaMelo Ball attempt 90 in a single game or something
We can only use the data we have.  If the guy makes 44%, how can we conclude he's a bad shooter, even given a small sample?

We can only use the data we have, indeed, but we should use ALL the data we have, not the tiny fraction of it that makes him look best.

3p: 34/90 (.378 - decent % on low volume)
FT: 98/173 (.566 - extremely bad on twice the volume)

If Jackson were truly a long-term 38% 3pt shooter, or even a long-term 33% 3pt shooter, we would expect him to attempt more than 90 3's and to be much, much, much better from the FT line.

For contrast, Tatum's stats:
3p: 40/117 (.342)
FT: 118/139 (.849!)
I don't think he's a "good" shooter.  I just don't think we can put too much stock in his college numbers.  He didn't have a ton of attempts.  His form is OK, and improved from the start of the season.  I think he'll be a passable shooter, in time.  People are knocking him like he's MKG.  He's not.

Re: For all the Josh Jackson supporters....
« Reply #113 on: June 21, 2017, 05:41:08 PM »

Offline Mempitt18

  • Xavier Tillman
  • Posts: 40
  • Tommy Points: 5

Re: For all the Josh Jackson supporters....
« Reply #114 on: June 21, 2017, 06:05:52 PM »

Offline OldSchoolDude

  • Jaylen Brown
  • Posts: 599
  • Tommy Points: 79
The more I think of Josh Jackson the more he reminds me of Josh Smith and the more I don't want him.

I see no similarity between the two. So relax.

Everything any the two is similar...

Same strengths,  same weaknesses.   Similar size, though Smith was taller and longer.   Similar shooting troubles.   Both good passers.  Both have limited offensive ability and rely heavily on athleticism fo t  that.   Both are similar calibre rebounders.  Both have questionable attitudes.

Yeah, very similar players. But Josh Smith was more talented then Jackson.   He had the body to pay PF quite effectively in both ends,  while Jackson does not.

I'll add both think they can shoot the 3.    Jackson will develop and should be able to play the 4 in time. 
I think he's probably going to be like Josh Smith.   But many people really wanted us to trade for Smith.  Remember the dream duo of Rondo and Smith?  I'm not surprised there is a lot of Jackson love on the boards.  Of course like Smith if could get a decent shot he'd bed great.

Re: For all the Josh Jackson supporters....
« Reply #115 on: June 21, 2017, 06:24:25 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

  • NCE
  • Johnny Most
  • ********************
  • Posts: 20000
  • Tommy Points: 1323
Quote
What concerns me are his short arms and the hitch in his jumpshot.

He has what a 6-9 or 6-10 wingspan which is normal not elite length.   Some call these T rex arms but that is having shorter arms than your body height.


Quote
I don't think he's a "good" shooter.  I just don't think we can put too much stock in his college numbers.  He didn't have a ton of attempts.  His form is OK, and improved from the start of the season.  I think he'll be a passable shooter, in time.  People are knocking him like he's MKG.  He's not.

One thing I learned in all these drafts threads is the people on this board will lie like a rug to get people swayed or what they think will sway people.   I 've been here a while and know the folks who say anything even stuff unsupported by facts and I pretty much ignore them. 

I think he is a cocking his wrist back in stead of  the angle he has now away from being able to shoot decent.  The fact that we requested his medical records and got them today ought to scare Tatum guys, two workouts and they still are not convinced.

I 've gone on record stating I hope we trade the pick for Porzingas. 

Re: For all the Josh Jackson supporters....
« Reply #116 on: June 22, 2017, 06:26:41 PM »

Offline PickNRoll

  • Don Chaney
  • *
  • Posts: 1691
  • Tommy Points: 199
Quote
What concerns me are his short arms and the hitch in his jumpshot.

He has what a 6-9 or 6-10 wingspan which is normal not elite length.   Some call these T rex arms but that is having shorter arms than your body height.


Quote
I don't think he's a "good" shooter.  I just don't think we can put too much stock in his college numbers.  He didn't have a ton of attempts.  His form is OK, and improved from the start of the season.  I think he'll be a passable shooter, in time.  People are knocking him like he's MKG.  He's not.

One thing I learned in all these drafts threads is the people on this board will lie like a rug to get people swayed or what they think will sway people.   I 've been here a while and know the folks who say anything even stuff unsupported by facts and I pretty much ignore them. 

I think he is a cocking his wrist back in stead of  the angle he has now away from being able to shoot decent.  The fact that we requested his medical records and got them today ought to scare Tatum guys, two workouts and they still are not convinced.

I 've gone on record stating I hope we trade the pick for Porzingas.
The main problem with his shot was all the motion before the release.  He would swing it up rapidly and late from his waist to his face, too much inertia to start his forward motion consistently.  It's gotten better already, but still a problem.

Re: For all the Josh Jackson supporters....
« Reply #117 on: June 22, 2017, 10:01:46 PM »

Offline vjcsmoke

  • Ray Allen
  • ***
  • Posts: 3173
  • Tommy Points: 182
Jackson has elite defender upside... but his offense is going to be limited until he fixes that jumpshot.  Well it's going to be Phoenix' problem now to fix the hitch in his shot.

Re: For all the Josh Jackson supporters....
« Reply #118 on: June 22, 2017, 10:36:36 PM »

Offline Bobshot

  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2050
  • Tommy Points: 141
On Jackson vs Tatum, it still boiled down to defense vs offense. Plus a lot of people felt Jackson was more trade bait than Tatum.

Ainge/Stevens apparently felt they needed offense more than defense with this pick. Couldn't pass up Tatum's natural scoring talent. Plus he's 4 material, a little bigger than Jackson, and probably 6-9 next year. They have him targeted for the 4 if they sign Hayward. And they are going after George as well, from what the rumors say.

So they'll be loaded up pretty well for their small ball. I don't know if it will be enough to beat the Cavs or Warriors, but they'll be closer.