Help quantify this draft. How much separation is there between players?

[Eja117]

I'm not seeing tons and tons of separation between the top 11 guys in this draft. It seems to me like the difference between 1 and 11 is tremendous but the difference between 1 and 2 and 2 and 3 and 3 and 4 and 4 and 5 etc is not that much.

But I think other people are seeing a ton of difference. Maybe you want to use a scale of ten to explain.

Maybe you want to use names of player comparisons. Maybe all star appearances.

I mean if you see Fultz as Jordan and J Jackson as James Worthy....I mean Worthy was considered a top 50 NBA player but there is still a huge difference there.

I didn't envision Fultz as leading a team to a ring but that's just me. Maybe some of you do.

[vgulab]

I agree. I wasn't sold on Fultz being franchise player, probably all star but not top 5 player in the league. And this is a deep draft and i would say there are 6 or 7 players in that tier 1 that are close in terms of what they can became.

If we trade down to 3 that probably means Tatum or maybe Isaac. Because Jackson will go 2 and we won't take Ball or Fox, there is no chance of that, so Tatum and Isaac probably. And i would be very satisfied with any of those guys. I like Isaac a lot, but he is not nba ready and teams need to be patient with him, but he reminds me of young KG, just ton of potential. And Tatum, he is an athlete and scoring wing, he might end up being Tobias Harris or Carmelo Anthony.

So to answer your question, Fultz, Jackson, Ball, Fox, Tatum, Isaac. All these guys with all star potential, really deep draft. And also you got guys like Smith and Monk which you can get somewhere in 8-10 range, players who might not have the same potential, but very very quality players.

[coco]

IMHO there is a big drop after Faultz, and a bigger drop passed 3rd pick.

[coco]

Maybe you want to use names of player comparisons. Maybe all star appearances.

I mean if you see Fultz as Jordan and J Jackson as James Worthy....I mean Worthy was considered a top 50 NBA player but there is still a huge difference there.

I didn't envision Fultz as leading a team to a ring but that's just me. Maybe some of you do.

I think Josh  Jackson is still quite raw offensively.   Worthy was way more polished offensively coming out of college.

Heck, I would probably take Ball before Josh.  At least we know what Ball is really good at.  The kid has excellent court vision.

As for me, I'd keep the No.1 pick and take Faultz.  It is very simple and Ainge is over analyzing this - if you ask me.

We are in dire need of players who can create their own shot and/or create for others.  Faultz check both of those boxes.

[Who]

I think there is good deal of separation between #1 (Fultz) and the rest of the draft but little separation between #2 and #7 (Jackson, Isaac, Fox, Patton, Tatum). Then a couple of others (DSJ, Ball, Ntlinika). Then a big drop off again.

[Tr1boy]

Blue chip prospects (no order)

Jackson
Tatum
Ball
Fultz
Smith Jr.
Fox

Starters (no order)

Isaac
Monk
Ntilikina
Markkanen

[Who]

I think there is good deal of separation between #1 (Fultz) and the rest of the draft but little separation between #2 and #7 (Jackson, Isaac, Fox, Patton, Tatum). Then a couple of others (DSJ, Ball, Ntlinika). Then a big drop off again.

I like Fultz the most at the top because he is the most well rounded and certain prospect in the draft. I liken him to a combo guard version of Paul Pierce. Not a physical freak like LeBron or McGrady but still a plus athlete and with a terrific skill-level.

The next group of players has a wider range of possibilities between their floors and ceilings which is why I view there being a big separation between #1 and #2.

Josh Jackson is the most gifted of the bunch. Elite athleticism. Top defense. Plus rebounding. But only a basic offensive game. How that offensive game develops could be the difference between him being anywhere from a starter level SF to the best player in this draft. He has a higher ceiling than Fultz but that is a best case scenario.

Fox is my next best prospect. I love his explosive quickness. Best PG in the draft. He'll be able to get into the paint at will in the NBA. Plays strong defense. Can pass. Can score a big. Dodgy jump-shot. How dodgy that jump-shot is will define his future. Anywhere from Elfrid Payton level PG to a John Wall level PG.

Isaac is next on my list. I likened him to Cliff Robinson. That is who Isaac reminds me of. It's his defensive game. The versatility to defend 3 (SF, SG, PF) or maybe even 4 or 5 positions. Elite defensive potential with elite versatility. His athleticism with that size and length makes him a tough matchup at combo forward. Bigger than most SFs. Quicker than most PFs. Capable of creating mismatches against most teams in the league. Average shot-creation and limited playmaking limit his offensive potential which is why he is not higher on my list.

I like Patton a lot. He is still growing into his body. Learning how to be a big man. His size and athleticism are rare. He has a good skill-level for a young big. A comfort on the ball in both the low post and high post. Two way potential. A few years away from contributing. But high potential and looks like he has his head glued on straight (unlike JaVale McGee) and works hard. He is a guy I'd bet on.

Then there is Tatum. I like his game more if this was 15-20 years ago. He'd be a top 3 pick no doubt. In today's league, I think Tatum is more in the 4-7 range. I'd have him at the back end of this second tier because I like how the other candidates fit into today's league more than I do Tatum. Super mid-post and mid-range scorer. Good size and athleticism. Capable of defending and rebounding his position. Okay passing and handles. Better version of Jabari Parker.

3rd tier ....

Dennis Smith Jr similar to Brandon Jennings. Lots of raw talent. Lots of flaws. Career could end up going in lots of ways. Highest potential left on the board.

Lonzo Ball. Cannot drive well enough to play PG in the NBA. He will be a two guard. Should be a solid offensive player due to his passing and shooting. Lacks explosive quickness. Dodgy defense. Good rebounding. Typical great college player okay NBA player.

Ntilinka is a lot like Smart. A tough defensive minded combo guard. Great size, good athleticism. Lacks explosiveness. Hurts his PG value. More of a two guard or setup PG than a playmaking PG. Cannot get into the paint frequently enough. Has a better jump-shot than Smart.

[Casperian]

I think there is good deal of separation between #1 (Fultz) and the rest of the draft but little separation between #2 and #7 (Jackson, Isaac, Fox, Patton, Tatum). Then a couple of others (DSJ, Ball, Ntlinika). Then a big drop off again.

I like Fultz the most at the top because he is the most well rounded and certain prospect in the draft. I liken him to a combo guard version of Paul Pierce. Not a physical freak like LeBron or McGrady but still a plus athlete and with a terrific skill-level.

TP for the post, Who.

The real question, however, is do you believe Fultz has "transcendent" talent? I'm aware that transcendent is a rather vague term, but do you believe he could become a player on the Lebron/Durant/Davis level in a best-case scenario, or do you just think he is the safest pick right now?

[Who]

I think there is good deal of separation between #1 (Fultz) and the rest of the draft but little separation between #2 and #7 (Jackson, Isaac, Fox, Patton, Tatum). Then a couple of others (DSJ, Ball, Ntlinika). Then a big drop off again.

I like Fultz the most at the top because he is the most well rounded and certain prospect in the draft. I liken him to a combo guard version of Paul Pierce. Not a physical freak like LeBron or McGrady but still a plus athlete and with a terrific skill-level.

TP for the post, Who.

The real question, however, is do you believe Fultz has "transcendental" talent? I'm aware that transcendental is a rather vague term, but do you believe he could become a player on the Lebron/Durant/Davis level, or do you just think he is the safest pick right now?

No, I don't think Fultz is a transcendent talent.

I consider a transcendent talent to be someone who is an MVP caliber player. You can see that at 18-20 years and fully expect that player to be an MVP candidate for 5-10 years in his prime. Like Durant or LeBron or an Anthony Davis.

I don't put Fultz up on that level. More on that Paul Pierce level. A level below MVP.

[Tr1boy]

I think there is good deal of separation between #1 (Fultz) and the rest of the draft but little separation between #2 and #7 (Jackson, Isaac, Fox, Patton, Tatum). Then a couple of others (DSJ, Ball, Ntlinika). Then a big drop off again.

I like Fultz the most at the top because he is the most well rounded and certain prospect in the draft. I liken him to a combo guard version of Paul Pierce. Not a physical freak like LeBron or McGrady but still a plus athlete and with a terrific skill-level.

The next group of players has a wider range of possibilities between their floors and ceilings which is why I view there being a big separation between #1 and #2.

Josh Jackson is the most gifted of the bunch. Elite athleticism. Top defense. Plus rebounding. But only a basic offensive game. How that offensive game develops could be the difference between him being anywhere from a starter level SF to the best player in this draft. He has a higher ceiling than Fultz but that is a best case scenario.

Fox is my next best prospect. I love his explosive quickness. Best PG in the draft. He'll be able to get into the paint at will in the NBA. Plays strong defense. Can pass. Can score a big. Dodgy jump-shot. How dodgy that jump-shot is will define his future. Anywhere from Elfrid Payton level PG to a John Wall level PG.

Isaac is next on my list. I likened him to Cliff Robinson. That is who Isaac reminds me of. It's his defensive game. The versatility to defend 3 (SF, SG, PF) or maybe even 4 or 5 positions. Elite defensive potential with elite versatility. His athleticism with that size and length makes him a tough matchup at combo forward. Bigger than most SFs. Quicker than most PFs. Capable of creating mismatches against most teams in the league. Average shot-creation and limited playmaking limit his offensive potential which is why he is not higher on my list.

I like Patton a lot. He is still growing into his body. Learning how to be a big man. His size and athleticism are rare. He has a good skill-level for a young big. A comfort on the ball in both the low post and high post. Two way potential. A few years away from contributing. But high potential and looks like he has his head glued on straight (unlike JaVale McGee) and works hard. He is a guy I'd bet on.

Then there is Tatum. I like his game more if this was 15-20 years ago. He'd be a top 3 pick no doubt. In today's league, I think Tatum is more in the 4-7 range. I'd have him at the back end of this second tier because I like how the other candidates fit into today's league more than I do Tatum. Super mid-post and mid-range scorer. Good size and athleticism. Capable of defending and rebounding his position. Okay passing and handles. Better version of Jabari Parker.

3rd tier ....

Dennis Smith Jr similar to Brandon Jennings. Lots of raw talent. Lots of flaws. Career could end up going in lots of ways. Highest potential left on the board.

Lonzo Ball. Cannot drive well enough to play PG in the NBA. He will be a two guard. Should be a solid offensive player due to his passing and shooting. Lacks explosive quickness. Dodgy defense. Good rebounding. Typical great college player okay NBA player.

Ntilinka is a lot like Smart. A tough defensive minded combo guard. Great size, good athleticism. Lacks explosiveness. Hurts his PG value. More of a two guard or setup PG than a playmaking PG. Cannot get into the paint frequently enough. Has a better jump-shot than Smart.

I disagree with you

Fultz the most well rounded?  Where was his defense last season? In hibernation?   He looked like Jamal Crawford playing college ball.  Showtime moves.  But no consistent effort on the defensive end.   From the 3 games i saw him play, he didn't set picks for others on the offensive end, didn't dive for a loose ball, didn't take a charge

Dennis Smith Jr and Jennings have little in common.  Smith Jr. explosiveness/strength alone makes him a better prospect.  Steve Francis comparisons are pretty good

[Casperian]

I think there is good deal of separation between #1 (Fultz) and the rest of the draft but little separation between #2 and #7 (Jackson, Isaac, Fox, Patton, Tatum). Then a couple of others (DSJ, Ball, Ntlinika). Then a big drop off again.

I like Fultz the most at the top because he is the most well rounded and certain prospect in the draft. I liken him to a combo guard version of Paul Pierce. Not a physical freak like LeBron or McGrady but still a plus athlete and with a terrific skill-level.

TP for the post, Who.

The real question, however, is do you believe Fultz has "transcendental" talent? I'm aware that transcendental is a rather vague term, but do you believe he could become a player on the Lebron/Durant/Davis level, or do you just think he is the safest pick right now?

No, I don't think Fultz is a transcendent talent.

I consider a transcendent talent to be someone who is an MVP caliber player. You can see that at 18-20 years and fully expect that player to be an MVP candidate for 5-10 years in his prime. Like Durant or LeBron or an Anthony Davis.

I don't put Fultz up on that level. More on that Paul Pierce level. A level below MVP.

Thank you for the answer, and I agree.

Not that there's anything wrong with a Paul Pierce level player, I'd be over the moon with drafting the next Pierce, but if the goal is to win a championship, then I'm not worried over trading down and picking up additional assets, either.

[Who]

I think there is good deal of separation between #1 (Fultz) and the rest of the draft but little separation between #2 and #7 (Jackson, Isaac, Fox, Patton, Tatum). Then a couple of others (DSJ, Ball, Ntlinika). Then a big drop off again.

I like Fultz the most at the top because he is the most well rounded and certain prospect in the draft. I liken him to a combo guard version of Paul Pierce. Not a physical freak like LeBron or McGrady but still a plus athlete and with a terrific skill-level.

The next group of players has a wider range of possibilities between their floors and ceilings which is why I view there being a big separation between #1 and #2.

Josh Jackson is the most gifted of the bunch. Elite athleticism. Top defense. Plus rebounding. But only a basic offensive game. How that offensive game develops could be the difference between him being anywhere from a starter level SF to the best player in this draft. He has a higher ceiling than Fultz but that is a best case scenario.

Fox is my next best prospect. I love his explosive quickness. Best PG in the draft. He'll be able to get into the paint at will in the NBA. Plays strong defense. Can pass. Can score a big. Dodgy jump-shot. How dodgy that jump-shot is will define his future. Anywhere from Elfrid Payton level PG to a John Wall level PG.

Isaac is next on my list. I likened him to Cliff Robinson. That is who Isaac reminds me of. It's his defensive game. The versatility to defend 3 (SF, SG, PF) or maybe even 4 or 5 positions. Elite defensive potential with elite versatility. His athleticism with that size and length makes him a tough matchup at combo forward. Bigger than most SFs. Quicker than most PFs. Capable of creating mismatches against most teams in the league. Average shot-creation and limited playmaking limit his offensive potential which is why he is not higher on my list.

I like Patton a lot. He is still growing into his body. Learning how to be a big man. His size and athleticism are rare. He has a good skill-level for a young big. A comfort on the ball in both the low post and high post. Two way potential. A few years away from contributing. But high potential and looks like he has his head glued on straight (unlike JaVale McGee) and works hard. He is a guy I'd bet on.

Then there is Tatum. I like his game more if this was 15-20 years ago. He'd be a top 3 pick no doubt. In today's league, I think Tatum is more in the 4-7 range. I'd have him at the back end of this second tier because I like how the other candidates fit into today's league more than I do Tatum. Super mid-post and mid-range scorer. Good size and athleticism. Capable of defending and rebounding his position. Okay passing and handles. Better version of Jabari Parker.

3rd tier ....

Dennis Smith Jr similar to Brandon Jennings. Lots of raw talent. Lots of flaws. Career could end up going in lots of ways. Highest potential left on the board.

Lonzo Ball. Cannot drive well enough to play PG in the NBA. He will be a two guard. Should be a solid offensive player due to his passing and shooting. Lacks explosive quickness. Dodgy defense. Good rebounding. Typical great college player okay NBA player.

Ntilinka is a lot like Smart. A tough defensive minded combo guard. Great size, good athleticism. Lacks explosiveness. Hurts his PG value. More of a two guard or setup PG than a playmaking PG. Cannot get into the paint frequently enough. Has a better jump-shot than Smart.

I disagree with you

Fultz the most well rounded?  Where was his defense last season? In hibernation?   He looked like Jamal Crawford playing college ball.  Showtime moves.  But no consistent effort on the defensive end.   From the 3 games i saw him play, he didn't set picks for others on the offensive end, didn't dive for a loose ball, didn't take a charge

Dennis Smith Jr and Jennings have little in common.  Smith Jr. explosiveness/strength alone makes him a better prospect.  Steve Francis comparisons are pretty good

Yeah, Jennings is a different sort of athlete. I see some similarities in their skill levels though. Guys who are / were good at several things but great at nothing. Questionable IQ / mentality on the floor. Guys with high ceilings if they put the work in but could end up being quite ordinary if they do not (as Jennings did).

Different athletes though. DSJ more powerful and a better leaper. Jennings with more explosive quickness. Better burst / first step.

[Tr1boy]

I think there is good deal of separation between #1 (Fultz) and the rest of the draft but little separation between #2 and #7 (Jackson, Isaac, Fox, Patton, Tatum). Then a couple of others (DSJ, Ball, Ntlinika). Then a big drop off again.

I like Fultz the most at the top because he is the most well rounded and certain prospect in the draft. I liken him to a combo guard version of Paul Pierce. Not a physical freak like LeBron or McGrady but still a plus athlete and with a terrific skill-level.

The next group of players has a wider range of possibilities between their floors and ceilings which is why I view there being a big separation between #1 and #2.

Josh Jackson is the most gifted of the bunch. Elite athleticism. Top defense. Plus rebounding. But only a basic offensive game. How that offensive game develops could be the difference between him being anywhere from a starter level SF to the best player in this draft. He has a higher ceiling than Fultz but that is a best case scenario.

Fox is my next best prospect. I love his explosive quickness. Best PG in the draft. He'll be able to get into the paint at will in the NBA. Plays strong defense. Can pass. Can score a big. Dodgy jump-shot. How dodgy that jump-shot is will define his future. Anywhere from Elfrid Payton level PG to a John Wall level PG.

Isaac is next on my list. I likened him to Cliff Robinson. That is who Isaac reminds me of. It's his defensive game. The versatility to defend 3 (SF, SG, PF) or maybe even 4 or 5 positions. Elite defensive potential with elite versatility. His athleticism with that size and length makes him a tough matchup at combo forward. Bigger than most SFs. Quicker than most PFs. Capable of creating mismatches against most teams in the league. Average shot-creation and limited playmaking limit his offensive potential which is why he is not higher on my list.

I like Patton a lot. He is still growing into his body. Learning how to be a big man. His size and athleticism are rare. He has a good skill-level for a young big. A comfort on the ball in both the low post and high post. Two way potential. A few years away from contributing. But high potential and looks like he has his head glued on straight (unlike JaVale McGee) and works hard. He is a guy I'd bet on.

Then there is Tatum. I like his game more if this was 15-20 years ago. He'd be a top 3 pick no doubt. In today's league, I think Tatum is more in the 4-7 range. I'd have him at the back end of this second tier because I like how the other candidates fit into today's league more than I do Tatum. Super mid-post and mid-range scorer. Good size and athleticism. Capable of defending and rebounding his position. Okay passing and handles. Better version of Jabari Parker.

3rd tier ....

Dennis Smith Jr similar to Brandon Jennings. Lots of raw talent. Lots of flaws. Career could end up going in lots of ways. Highest potential left on the board.

Lonzo Ball. Cannot drive well enough to play PG in the NBA. He will be a two guard. Should be a solid offensive player due to his passing and shooting. Lacks explosive quickness. Dodgy defense. Good rebounding. Typical great college player okay NBA player.

Ntilinka is a lot like Smart. A tough defensive minded combo guard. Great size, good athleticism. Lacks explosiveness. Hurts his PG value. More of a two guard or setup PG than a playmaking PG. Cannot get into the paint frequently enough. Has a better jump-shot than Smart.

I disagree with you

Fultz the most well rounded?  Where was his defense last season? In hibernation?   He looked like Jamal Crawford playing college ball.  Showtime moves.  But no consistent effort on the defensive end.   From the 3 games i saw him play, he didn't set picks for others on the offensive end, didn't dive for a loose ball, didn't take a charge

Dennis Smith Jr and Jennings have little in common.  Smith Jr. explosiveness/strength alone makes him a better prospect.  Steve Francis comparisons are pretty good

Yeah, Jennings is a different sort of athlete. I see some similarities in their skill levels though. Guys who are / were good at several things but great at nothing. Questionable IQ / mentality on the floor. Guys with high ceilings if they put the work in but could end up being quite ordinary if they do not (as Jennings did).

Different athletes though. DSJ more powerful and a better leaper. Jennings with more explosive quickness. Better burst / first step.

Jennings is quicker with a better 1st step...but it has been underutilised because he cant do nothing near the basket....

Smith Jr. is definitely a better prospect

[td450]

I think there is good deal of separation between #1 (Fultz) and the rest of the draft but little separation between #2 and #7 (Jackson, Isaac, Fox, Patton, Tatum). Then a couple of others (DSJ, Ball, Ntlinika). Then a big drop off again.

I like Fultz the most at the top because he is the most well rounded and certain prospect in the draft. I liken him to a combo guard version of Paul Pierce. Not a physical freak like LeBron or McGrady but still a plus athlete and with a terrific skill-level.

TP for the post, Who.

The real question, however, is do you believe Fultz has "transcendental" talent? I'm aware that transcendental is a rather vague term, but do you believe he could become a player on the Lebron/Durant/Davis level, or do you just think he is the safest pick right now?

No, I don't think Fultz is a transcendent talent.

I consider a transcendent talent to be someone who is an MVP caliber player. You can see that at 18-20 years and fully expect that player to be an MVP candidate for 5-10 years in his prime. Like Durant or LeBron or an Anthony Davis.

I don't put Fultz up on that level. More on that Paul Pierce level. A level below MVP.

Fultz emerged as an elite talent a little later than usual, but he did post a pretty impressive freshman season.

I think he's shown the tools he would need to become better than Pierce. He's a little bit more explosive than Paul was, and has a few more shots in his arsenal. The most important thing is he can get into the lane whenever he wants and he always looks like he is under control. He has that feel for making decisions and making the easiest play that only the very best players have. He can finish shots now as well as Pierce could when he was 3-4 years older, and he can already pass better than Pierce ever could.

However, a Paul Pierce level career is a pretty high bar. If that is what he becomes, that's pretty great.

I'd be pretty surprised if Ainge trades this pick and doesn't get something pretty great in return.How he fits this move, a free agent signing, and resulting roster balancing moves together so it all works is going to be complicated. We can't sign Hayward, keep Crowder and Brown and draft Jackson or Tatum.

I think its a safe bet that we are finally going to see a fireworks show.