Author Topic: Rumor: Josh Jackson has a top-3 promise  (Read 40076 times)

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Re: Rumor: Josh Jackson has a top-3 promise
« Reply #120 on: June 13, 2017, 08:49:56 PM »

Offline max215

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If Jackson has a promise at 2 or 3, what is the logic behind skipping the workout with #1?

Could be any number of things. It could be something personal, like a desire to live in LA, or maybe he wants to go somewhere where he can play a big role.

Ball, Jackson no diff

How could they not want to play for the Celtics... Foolish

As I said, they could value stepping right into a big role over winning in a bench role. This is not a new concept. Kris Dunn did the same exact thing last year.


Well, that didn't work out well for him at all. Also, the Celtics never had any interest in Dunn, Ainge knew he was going to be a bust and was quoted saying he didn't want to get stuck with him if he drafted him and teams didn't offer a good enough trade for him.

How did it not work out for him? Sure, he didn't start last year, but it's not like Rubio is entrenched as the starter long-term. Minnesota was probably the best opportunity for him. And it doesn't matter if Ainge wanted him or not (which I agree, he clearly didn't), he refused to work out for the Celtics, as Ball and Jackson are choosing to do this year.
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Re: Rumor: Josh Jackson has a top-3 promise
« Reply #121 on: June 13, 2017, 09:32:13 PM »

Offline hpantazo

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If Jackson has a promise at 2 or 3, what is the logic behind skipping the workout with #1?

Could be any number of things. It could be something personal, like a desire to live in LA, or maybe he wants to go somewhere where he can play a big role.

Ball, Jackson no diff

How could they not want to play for the Celtics... Foolish

As I said, they could value stepping right into a big role over winning in a bench role. This is not a new concept. Kris Dunn did the same exact thing last year.


Well, that didn't work out well for him at all. Also, the Celtics never had any interest in Dunn, Ainge knew he was going to be a bust and was quoted saying he didn't want to get stuck with him if he drafted him and teams didn't offer a good enough trade for him.

How did it not work out for him? Sure, he didn't start last year, but it's not like Rubio is entrenched as the starter long-term. Minnesota was probably the best opportunity for him. And it doesn't matter if Ainge wanted him or not (which I agree, he clearly didn't), he refused to work out for the Celtics, as Ball and Jackson are choosing to do this year.


It didn't work out for him because he sucked and is already considered a bust, despite the fact that the TWolves tried to spoonfeed him the starting PG role. He's also much older than the other lottery picks so he has little room to grow. If he had been on the Celtics, at least teams would think he didn't play much because they are a contender and have great starters. They would still have some illusion of hope for him, but the Twolves ran him out there more than enough for him to prove his unworth.

Re: Rumor: Josh Jackson has a top-3 promise
« Reply #122 on: June 13, 2017, 09:54:54 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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Under the influence of alcohol or not, I have absolutely zero interest in anyone who threatens a woman, period, let alone by telling her that he was going to, “beat her ass,” not to mention his failure to leave his contact information after backing into another vehicle, iirc, and to top it all off, he has to attend anger management classes as well as, "refrain from alcohol and recreational drugs for 12 months and write an apology letter," per his diversion agreement stemming from the first "incident," so put me down for ABSOLUTELY NOT.  How many red flags do you need?

Do you know why Jackson wasn't charged with criminal threatening?

Because two of the victim's friends - including her roommate - gave statements, and neither reported any threats. The only person who did is the victim, who moments earlier had assaulted Jackson's friend.  Even the victim's own witnesses don't corroborate her story.

Quote
Calvert said Jackson “was yelling for her to get out of the car and that he would beat her ass.” According to the Lawrence Journal-World, “That allegation is not made by two other witnesses that are included in the affidavit, although it isn't clear whether they were specifically asked about that part of the incident.”

http://kansas.247sports.com/Bolt/Released-affidavit-lends-clarity-to-Josh-Jackson-incident-51806711

That's some friend that Jackson's got there, btw (sarcasm), "Vick was found by a University of Kansas investigation in January 2016 to have more than likely hit Calvert several times in the arm and kicked her in the face in December 2015."

http://www.kansascity.com/sports/college/big-12/university-of-kansas/ku-basketball-news/article138906253.html

http://www.kansascity.com/sports/college/big-12/university-of-kansas/article129703974.html

Does it at least bother you that Jackson, Vick, and Frank Mason III were listed as witnesses in the police report regarding the "alleged rape of a 16 year old at McCarthy Hall?" :o

http://www.kansascity.com/sports/college/big-12/university-of-kansas/article128646254.html

Oh yeah, these guys are the kind of high character individuals that Ainge is looking for (sarcasm). ::)

There was a police investigation. There was proof of one crime: vandalism. There was no threat, there was no assault. Neutral witnesses never mentioned this.

Why the rush to convict somebody without actual credible evidence?

Why, then, has Jackson been ordered to attend anger management classes, write a letter of apology, and, "refrain from using alcohol or recreational drugs for a year," per his diversion agreement, if none of what you described actually happened?  Plus, we don't even know if the "neutral witnesses" were asked about the threat and assault specifically in regards to the affidavit, and I'm not rushing to convict the guy at all - his record speaks for itself. 

Sorry, I just can't sign off on Jackson, ethically, and I hope that Ainge feels the same way.

Is it fair to say that you don't know much about the legal process?

Counseling, restitution, no use or possession of illegal drugs or alcohol, etc. are all pretty standard conditions for a diversion / deferred disposition  / "filing".  Those aren't added because Jackson made a threat of violence. Rather, it's because he was drinking underage and damaged somebody's car.

It's also fair to say that you don't know much about police reports / affidavits filed in support of probable cause? The police were looking to press charges. The victim reported being threatened. The police almost definitely asked witnesses about that. Even if the LEOs didn't specifically inquire, the witness statements seem very detailed. Yet, both leave out perhaps the single most sensational allegation.

As for his "record", he's got a traffic ticket and misdemeanor vandalism. My goodness. Fellow thug Jaylen Brown was arrested for operating after suspension and running a stop sign. Danny would never draft somebody with such poor character!

While I'm sorry that I'm not a lawyer ::), the bottom line, for me, is that I don't want any individuals who are even brought in for questioning about such behavior and/or participating in said possible incidents, if that's okay with you ::).

And yes, I do realize that the police were looking to press charges and that the alleged threat was not mentioned by any of the witnesses in their respective statements, but I don't care if attending counseling/staying off of recreational drugs is standard operating procedure in these kinds of proceedings or not, because it doesn't change the fact that this is starting to look like a pattern with him, and I just don't think that that is the kind of individual who should be an ambassador for this franchise, no matter how talented.  Sorry ::).

Re: Rumor: Josh Jackson has a top-3 promise
« Reply #123 on: June 13, 2017, 10:02:37 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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So you're just not a fan of players who beat women or do stupid things under the influence of alcohol.  I can understand that.  With such a vehement opposition to such behavior, I assume you also don't care for:
- Robert Parish, who beat his wife over the course of a many years
- Larry Bird, who got into a bar fight during the '85 playoffs


As long as you're consistent, that's cool.  If not...you may want to consider ratcheting down your righteous indignation over Jackson's behavior.

I do not.  I will say, though, that in terms of what happened in '85, since I wasn't around then but love reading about Celtic history, etc., do we actually know what happened, because I thought that those records were sealed and Bird settled out of court or something, but I'm probably wrong.  I also don't believe that Larry was drunk at the time, but, again, I'm probably wrong, as I thought that what went down was the result of his "friend" hitting on someone else's girlfriend, or whatever, right?  Am I doing okay so far, lol? ;D
« Last Edit: June 13, 2017, 10:32:15 PM by Beat LA »

Re: Rumor: Josh Jackson has a top-3 promise
« Reply #124 on: June 13, 2017, 10:07:58 PM »

Offline max215

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If Jackson has a promise at 2 or 3, what is the logic behind skipping the workout with #1?

Could be any number of things. It could be something personal, like a desire to live in LA, or maybe he wants to go somewhere where he can play a big role.

Ball, Jackson no diff

How could they not want to play for the Celtics... Foolish

As I said, they could value stepping right into a big role over winning in a bench role. This is not a new concept. Kris Dunn did the same exact thing last year.


Well, that didn't work out well for him at all. Also, the Celtics never had any interest in Dunn, Ainge knew he was going to be a bust and was quoted saying he didn't want to get stuck with him if he drafted him and teams didn't offer a good enough trade for him.

How did it not work out for him? Sure, he didn't start last year, but it's not like Rubio is entrenched as the starter long-term. Minnesota was probably the best opportunity for him. And it doesn't matter if Ainge wanted him or not (which I agree, he clearly didn't), he refused to work out for the Celtics, as Ball and Jackson are choosing to do this year.


It didn't work out for him because he sucked and is already considered a bust, despite the fact that the TWolves tried to spoonfeed him the starting PG role. He's also much older than the other lottery picks so he has little room to grow. If he had been on the Celtics, at least teams would think he didn't play much because they are a contender and have great starters. They would still have some illusion of hope for him, but the Twolves ran him out there more than enough for him to prove his unworth.

I think you're missing the point. Dunn landed in the situation he wanted. He accomplished his goal. Being an overrated prospect and then bad NBA player has nothing to do with this.
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Re: Rumor: Josh Jackson has a top-3 promise
« Reply #125 on: June 13, 2017, 10:24:17 PM »

Offline CelticsElite

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Thread made me think- imagine if we had gotten stuck with Dunn. What a wasted pick that would  have been

Re: Rumor: Josh Jackson has a top-3 promise
« Reply #126 on: June 13, 2017, 10:27:17 PM »

Offline Tr1boy

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Thread made me think- imagine if we had gotten stuck with Dunn. What a wasted pick that would  have been

Dunn is not dunn yet..

Re: Rumor: Josh Jackson has a top-3 promise
« Reply #127 on: June 13, 2017, 10:27:22 PM »

Offline max215

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Thread made me think- imagine if we had gotten stuck with Dunn. What a wasted pick that would  have been

Yet how many wanted to crucify Danny for not selecting Dunn? Dunn's perceived rise was always peculiar to me. He was part of the 3-8 morass for the entire pre-Draft process, then all of a sudden in the last 2-3 days before the draft he was the "consensus" #3. Whatever, I was glad we didn't take him at the time, and I'm thrilled we don't have him now.
Isaiah, you were lightning in a bottle.

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Re: Rumor: Josh Jackson has a top-3 promise
« Reply #128 on: June 13, 2017, 10:30:27 PM »

Offline 86MaxwellSmart

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Do you guys have Jax #2 on your big boards? I do and I really like him, but the spacing with he, Ingram, Russell, Randle and Zubac would be really bad. Ingram and Jax might turn into better outside shooters, but you're really taking a risk there.

Yes, I really like Jackson.  He would be a good addition for the Lakers. Although I still think they are going to draft Ball.

I don't... Lakers are going to pick Jackson
Ball to the 76ers

Some Lakers fans think they will trade D.Russell to Philly for that 3rd pick...and draft BOTH Ball and Jackson---where this Promise comes into play.
Larry Bird was Greater than you think.

Re: Rumor: Josh Jackson has a top-3 promise
« Reply #129 on: June 13, 2017, 10:32:11 PM »

Offline CelticsElite

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Thread made me think- imagine if we had gotten stuck with Dunn. What a wasted pick that would  have been

Yet how many wanted to crucify Danny for not selecting Dunn? Dunn's perceived rise was always peculiar to me. He was part of the 3-8 morass for the entire pre-Draft process, then all of a sudden in the last 2-3 days before the draft he was the "consensus" #3. Whatever, I was glad we didn't take him at the time, and I'm thrilled we don't have him now.I a
I was  mad about the brown pick cuz he was projected to go 8, but honestly the other guys were jokes. That one euro I forget his name hasn't amounted to much. Dunn is a joke. Hield is a chucker

Re: Rumor: Josh Jackson has a top-3 promise
« Reply #130 on: June 13, 2017, 10:35:34 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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Thread made me think- imagine if we had gotten stuck with Dunn. What a wasted pick that would  have been

Yet how many wanted to crucify Danny for not selecting Dunn? Dunn's perceived rise was always peculiar to me. He was part of the 3-8 morass for the entire pre-Draft process, then all of a sudden in the last 2-3 days before the draft he was the "consensus" #3. Whatever, I was glad we didn't take him at the time, and I'm thrilled we don't have him now.

Since I was very clearly wrong about Dunn, is it okay if I ask you what made him an overrated prospect, in your eyes?  Was it his age?  Scoring output?  Medical concerns?  Some combination?  Just curious :).

Re: Rumor: Josh Jackson has a top-3 promise
« Reply #131 on: June 13, 2017, 10:36:54 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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Thread made me think- imagine if we had gotten stuck with Dunn. What a wasted pick that would  have been

Yet how many wanted to crucify Danny for not selecting Dunn? Dunn's perceived rise was always peculiar to me. He was part of the 3-8 morass for the entire pre-Draft process, then all of a sudden in the last 2-3 days before the draft he was the "consensus" #3. Whatever, I was glad we didn't take him at the time, and I'm thrilled we don't have him now.I a
I was  mad about the brown pick cuz he was projected to go 8, but honestly the other guys were jokes. That one euro I forget his name hasn't amounted to much. Dunn is a joke. Hield is a chucker

Who is Dragan Bender, for 100, Alex? ;D In fairness to him, didn't he get hurt during the year?

Re: Rumor: Josh Jackson has a top-3 promise
« Reply #132 on: June 13, 2017, 10:39:51 PM »

Offline max215

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Thread made me think- imagine if we had gotten stuck with Dunn. What a wasted pick that would  have been

Yet how many wanted to crucify Danny for not selecting Dunn? Dunn's perceived rise was always peculiar to me. He was part of the 3-8 morass for the entire pre-Draft process, then all of a sudden in the last 2-3 days before the draft he was the "consensus" #3. Whatever, I was glad we didn't take him at the time, and I'm thrilled we don't have him now.

Since I was very clearly wrong about Dunn, is it okay if I ask you what made him an overrated prospect, in your eyes?  Was it his age?  Scoring output?  Medical concerns?  Some combination?  Just curious :).

To be clear, I didn't think a Dunn was bad. In hindsight, I was too high on him, but I thought the clear #3 stuff was ridiculous and a ploy to boost the value of the pick. What made me lower than some was probably a combination of age, lack of production until late in his career, and a lack of belief in his entire offensive skillset. I loved his physical profile, though.
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Re: Rumor: Josh Jackson has a top-3 promise
« Reply #133 on: June 13, 2017, 10:40:43 PM »

Offline max215

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Thread made me think- imagine if we had gotten stuck with Dunn. What a wasted pick that would  have been

Yet how many wanted to crucify Danny for not selecting Dunn? Dunn's perceived rise was always peculiar to me. He was part of the 3-8 morass for the entire pre-Draft process, then all of a sudden in the last 2-3 days before the draft he was the "consensus" #3. Whatever, I was glad we didn't take him at the time, and I'm thrilled we don't have him now.I a
I was  mad about the brown pick cuz he was projected to go 8, but honestly the other guys were jokes. That one euro I forget his name hasn't amounted to much. Dunn is a joke. Hield is a chucker

Who is Dragan Bender, for 100, Alex? ;D In fairness to him, didn't he get hurt during the year?

Yes, he missed a good chunk of the season. I still like him a lot. He's like a not-as-good Jonathan Isaac.
Isaiah, you were lightning in a bottle.

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Re: Rumor: Josh Jackson has a top-3 promise
« Reply #134 on: June 13, 2017, 10:56:48 PM »

Offline Section301

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So you're just not a fan of players who beat women or do stupid things under the influence of alcohol.  I can understand that.  With such a vehement opposition to such behavior, I assume you also don't care for:
- Robert Parish, who beat his wife over the course of a many years
- Larry Bird, who got into a bar fight during the '85 playoffs


As long as you're consistent, that's cool.  If not...you may want to consider ratcheting down your righteous indignation over Jackson's behavior.

I do not.  I will say, though, that in terms of what happened in '85, since I wasn't around then but love reading about Celtic history, etc., do we actually know what happened, because I thought that those records were sealed and Bird settled out of court or something, but I'm probably wrong.  I also don't believe that Larry was drunk at the time, but, again, I'm probably wrong, as I thought that what went down was the result of his "friend" hitting on someone else's girlfriend, or whatever, right?  Am I doing okay so far, lol? ;D

OK, cool, as long as you're consistent, have fun with the righteous indignation.  Must be tough being a C's fan and having such an intense dislike for Larry Bird.  The way he shut his daughter out must really p--- you off. 

And as far as the bar fight...he was in a bar, so I'm assuming he was drinking, since he readily admitted that he liked to drink and have a good time. And he did have a fight, because he later admitted that it was his fault.  So yeah, we do know what happened, at least enough to know that bad decision making can happen to anyone, and that sometime a lapse of judgement is just a lapse of judgement, and not a sign of pathological problem
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