Ainge Responds To The "Trade Isaiah" Nonsense

[mef730]

Sorry, dupe.

Mike

[Roy H.]

When talking about the draft recently, Danny remarked "the hardest thing to find is guys who can score at the end of games".

It seems like Danny highly values the specific skill set that IT is elite at.

http://www.csnne.com/video/danny-ainge-1-1-impact-getting-1-overall-pick

It's not a smokescreen. Danny is smart enough to value top-end talent.

[Ilikesports17]

And I call it nonsense because that's how Danny sees it:

“[W]e want to keep Isaiah.

“All I know is that he’s had an amazing year, and who doesn’t want Isaiah Thomas on their team? Like, you’ve got to be kidding me.”

Ainge laughed at public concern that Thomas will be too expensive.

“Why do the fans need to worry about how much money he makes?” he said. “I can understand if Isaiah and his wife and his agent are worried about that, but I don’t understand why that’s a conversation that needs to be had in the media.”

Listen, Isaiah has had one of the most impressive seasons in Celtics history in so many ways with what he was able to accomplish,” Ainge said. “I don’t know why people can’t see that.

He's not leaving.  Or, as Steve Bulpett puts it,

I’m sure if New Orleans calls and offers Anthony Davis, draft picks and Mardi Gras beads for life, the Celtics will likely be willing to part with Isaiah Thomas.

But Danny Ainge doesn’t believe the Little Guy is going anywhere — not now nor when his contract expires after next season.

Okay, so I'm going to take the opposite point of view. To me, everything in the above reads that he is looking to trade Isaiah, or at least isn't ruling it out.

I'm not saying that I want to trade Isaiah. I'm just saying that the quotes from Danny indicates that he would do so.

Everything in his statement says, "This guy has value and we're willing to trade him for value." Nowhere does Ainge say, "We're not going to trade him." Ainge doesn't even say that he doesn't want to trade him. He does say "We want to keep him," which is very different from "We won't trade himl" Instead, Ainge deflects every argument, rather than addressing it directly. He praises IT's play and asks who wouldn't want him. Of course everyone would want him, but that's not a denial. Rather, that's a "You should want him because I want him and should be ready to give me huge value for him."

When asked about money, he deflects the question again. Obviously, the crowd is concerned about the salary cap implications, not the dollar amount itself. Ainge doesn't address that, instead concentrating on the absolute salary. He knows that we're not concerned about the depth of management's pockets, but creates the red herring, anyway.

When talking about IT's season, he says what a great season IT had and how we don't see that. Another red herring. Of course we all know that IT had a great season. That isn't at issue. What is at issue is where he'll be having his next great season.

I've had just enough training in language cues to be dangerous, and these answers stuck out like a sore hip.

IT's on the market. DA is as cold as a Belichick when it comes to stocking his team.

Mike

For whatever it's worth, the guy doing the interview thought that Ainge wants to keep IT now and in the future.

Totally understood. And I consider Bulpett to be one of the better reporters. I just think Ainge was playing awfully cagey.

I've had just enough training in language cues to be dangerous

this quote is an all-timer

Great. Feel free to put it in your sig and you can refer back to it any time I say something you find outrageous. Being able to interpret language cues in written form is not the pseudoscience that trying to interpret body language is.

Mike

I found the use of the word "dangerous" hilarious, thats all.

[No Nickname]

And I call it nonsense because that's how Danny sees it:

“[W]e want to keep Isaiah.

“All I know is that he’s had an amazing year, and who doesn’t want Isaiah Thomas on their team? Like, you’ve got to be kidding me.”

Ainge laughed at public concern that Thomas will be too expensive.

“Why do the fans need to worry about how much money he makes?” he said. “I can understand if Isaiah and his wife and his agent are worried about that, but I don’t understand why that’s a conversation that needs to be had in the media.”

Listen, Isaiah has had one of the most impressive seasons in Celtics history in so many ways with what he was able to accomplish,” Ainge said. “I don’t know why people can’t see that.

He's not leaving.  Or, as Steve Bulpett puts it,

I’m sure if New Orleans calls and offers Anthony Davis, draft picks and Mardi Gras beads for life, the Celtics will likely be willing to part with Isaiah Thomas.

But Danny Ainge doesn’t believe the Little Guy is going anywhere — not now nor when his contract expires after next season.

Okay, so I'm going to take the opposite point of view. To me, everything in the above reads that he is looking to trade Isaiah, or at least isn't ruling it out.

I'm not saying that I want to trade Isaiah. I'm just saying that the quotes from Danny indicates that he would do so.

Everything in his statement says, "This guy has value and we're willing to trade him for value." Nowhere does Ainge say, "We're not going to trade him." Ainge doesn't even say that he doesn't want to trade him. He does say "We want to keep him," which is very different from "We won't trade himl" Instead, Ainge deflects every argument, rather than addressing it directly. He praises IT's play and asks who wouldn't want him. Of course everyone would want him, but that's not a denial. Rather, that's a "You should want him because I want him and should be ready to give me huge value for him."

When asked about money, he deflects the question again. Obviously, the crowd is concerned about the salary cap implications, not the dollar amount itself. Ainge doesn't address that, instead concentrating on the absolute salary. He knows that we're not concerned about the depth of management's pockets, but creates the red herring, anyway.

When talking about IT's season, he says what a great season IT had and how we don't see that. Another red herring. Of course we all know that IT had a great season. That isn't at issue. What is at issue is where he'll be having his next great season.

I've had just enough training in language cues to be dangerous, and these answers stuck out like a sore hip.

IT's on the market. DA is as cold as a Belichick when it comes to stocking his team.

Mike

I'm not agreeing that Danny is looking to trade him soon, but you say many accurate things.

A good GM speaks to the media like that to pump up the perceived value of his players. Fans think that somehow will be an impediment when it comes to negotiating his next contract. Like the agent can somehow use it as leverage in the talks. That's nonsense.

The only thing that matters in a negotiation is what number is written on a piece of paper slid across the desk and who blinks first.

If Danny tried to talk about IT in the press to somehow influence the negotiations it would be stupid. It would p--- off the player and similarly the GM couldn't use it as leverage in the talks. Maybe it would show that the GM truly won't play much for the player, but with a UFA that just means he'll sign with the highest bidder.

Everything Danny said is strategic. He keeps IT happy, he builds up his perceived value, and he still can offer him a less-than-max contract and maybe he can convince him to sign it.

[Jvalin]

When it comes down to trades, Danny has always had a pragmatic approach. He traded PP and KG to the Nets at a time when most fans wanted to see PP play out his career with the Celtics. This is the guy who was telling Red he should trade away Larry Legend for crying out loud...

Jackie Mac said a week ago that the C's were trying to trade IT for a lotto pick in last year's draft. I know Danny denied the whole story, but what did you expect him to say? ''Yep, we were open to trade talks, but we couldn't get a deal done''?? At the end of the day, no matter what he says it's impossible for us to know what he is actually thinking about. The way I see it, if he believes IT isn't worth the max he is gonna trade him. All it takes is one desperate GM to offer IT crazy money and we 'll lose him for nothing.

edit

Just saw freshinthehouse has written pretty much the same thing

But really, what's he going to say?  "Yeah, we really want to get rid of Thomas."  He has to say that he's not going anywhere.

TP!

[mef730]

And I call it nonsense because that's how Danny sees it:

“[W]e want to keep Isaiah.

“All I know is that he’s had an amazing year, and who doesn’t want Isaiah Thomas on their team? Like, you’ve got to be kidding me.”

Ainge laughed at public concern that Thomas will be too expensive.

“Why do the fans need to worry about how much money he makes?” he said. “I can understand if Isaiah and his wife and his agent are worried about that, but I don’t understand why that’s a conversation that needs to be had in the media.”

Listen, Isaiah has had one of the most impressive seasons in Celtics history in so many ways with what he was able to accomplish,” Ainge said. “I don’t know why people can’t see that.

He's not leaving.  Or, as Steve Bulpett puts it,

I’m sure if New Orleans calls and offers Anthony Davis, draft picks and Mardi Gras beads for life, the Celtics will likely be willing to part with Isaiah Thomas.

But Danny Ainge doesn’t believe the Little Guy is going anywhere — not now nor when his contract expires after next season.

Okay, so I'm going to take the opposite point of view. To me, everything in the above reads that he is looking to trade Isaiah, or at least isn't ruling it out.

I'm not saying that I want to trade Isaiah. I'm just saying that the quotes from Danny indicates that he would do so.

Everything in his statement says, "This guy has value and we're willing to trade him for value." Nowhere does Ainge say, "We're not going to trade him." Ainge doesn't even say that he doesn't want to trade him. He does say "We want to keep him," which is very different from "We won't trade himl" Instead, Ainge deflects every argument, rather than addressing it directly. He praises IT's play and asks who wouldn't want him. Of course everyone would want him, but that's not a denial. Rather, that's a "You should want him because I want him and should be ready to give me huge value for him."

When asked about money, he deflects the question again. Obviously, the crowd is concerned about the salary cap implications, not the dollar amount itself. Ainge doesn't address that, instead concentrating on the absolute salary. He knows that we're not concerned about the depth of management's pockets, but creates the red herring, anyway.

When talking about IT's season, he says what a great season IT had and how we don't see that. Another red herring. Of course we all know that IT had a great season. That isn't at issue. What is at issue is where he'll be having his next great season.

I've had just enough training in language cues to be dangerous, and these answers stuck out like a sore hip.

IT's on the market. DA is as cold as a Belichick when it comes to stocking his team.

Mike

For whatever it's worth, the guy doing the interview thought that Ainge wants to keep IT now and in the future.

Totally understood. And I consider Bulpett to be one of the better reporters. I just think Ainge was playing awfully cagey.

I've had just enough training in language cues to be dangerous

this quote is an all-timer

Great. Feel free to put it in your sig and you can refer back to it any time I say something you find outrageous. Being able to interpret language cues in written form is not the pseudoscience that trying to interpret body language is.

Mike

I found the use of the word "dangerous" hilarious, thats all.

Oops, my bad, sorry about that. TP.

Mike

[No Nickname]

I think a lot of people think of IT as only being able to play one way, as the first option on offense. I think he plays based on the needs of his team.

In one game against the Wizards when they chose to double-team him he had 12 assists. I think if you complement him with scorers like Hayward and Fultz (once he develops, unless he's like Kyrie as a rookie) and maybe a big with a post game you'll see a different player but one that can still get his shot at the end of the clock or end of the game.

[rondohondo]

I don't believe any NBA team will give IT a 5 yr max.

I think Danny's plan is to sign him to a 3 yr max, and have IT tutor Fultz, while also being a draw to Hayward and other free agents. His age lines up well with Horford and Hayward, Butler George too (if they can make a deal using brk 18).

[tarheelsxxiii]

When it comes down to trades, Danny has always had a pragmatic approach. He traded PP and KG to the Nets at a time when most fans wanted to see PP play out his career with the Celtics. This is the guy who was telling Red he should trade away Larry Legend for crying out loud...

Jackie Mac said a week ago that the C's were trying to trade IT for a lotto pick in last year's draft. I know Danny denied the whole story, but what did you expect him to say? ''Yep, we were open to trade talks, but we couldn't get a deal done''?? At the end of the day, no matter what he says it's impossible for us to know what he is actually thinking about. The way I see it, if he believes IT isn't worth the max he is gonna trade him. All it takes is one desperate GM to offer IT crazy money and we 'll lose him for nothing.

edit

Just saw freshinthehouse has written pretty much the same thing

But really, what's he going to say?  "Yeah, we really want to get rid of Thomas."  He has to say that he's not going anywhere.

TP!

Sup bro.  What about IT for Isaiah Canaan and a pick?

[Jvalin]

I don't believe any NBA team will give IT a 5 yr max.

I think Danny's plan is to sign him to a 3 yr max, and have IT tutor Fultz, while also being a draw to Hayward and other free agents. His age lines up well with Horford and Hayward, Butler George too (if they can make a deal using brk 18).

Only the C's are allowed to offer him a 5-year max (with 8% annual raises). Other teams can offer him up to 4 years (with 5% annual raises).

[PhoSita]

When talking about the draft recently, Danny remarked "the hardest thing to find is guys who can score at the end of games".

It seems like Danny highly values the specific skill set that IT is elite at.

http://www.csnne.com/video/danny-ainge-1-1-impact-getting-1-overall-pick

It's not a smokescreen. Danny is smart enough to value top-end talent.

What is remarkable to me is that, after we traded away Pierce, it seemed to me that one of the biggest questions for the rebuild was how long we would have to wait before the team would have that guy again who is the unquestioned bucket-getter, both in terms of "scoring 20+ night-in / night-out" but also who takes the mantle / burden of being the guy to score in crunch time.  I worried that we would spend a long time, as many teams do (see: Orlando) without a scorer to serve as the "premise" for the team's offensive strategy.

Then, we get that guy, almost by accident it seems, in a trade-deadline deal just a year and a half later.  We got our guy!  We barely had to watch this team for a season and a half without anybody who was "the guy," and we got the replacement for basically an expiring contract and an okay 1st rounder.

Now all people want to do is trade that guy away and hand-wring about paying him the market rate for exactly the role he performs.

And yet, if the Celts did move on from Thomas, all we'd hear about is how the team needs a go-to scorer, somebody who causes matchup problems for opposing teams, somebody who can go for for 30-40 on any given night, until Ainge finds somebody else who does that.

Yes, maybe Fultz will show himself to be that kind of player almost from day one.  He might be that kind of talent.

But why are we so eager to give up the possibility of having TWO guys like that?  Isn't that what makes teams like Cleveland and Golden State so deadly -- having multiple players who can break a defense with their transcendent scoring ability?

[SHAQATTACK]

When talking about the draft recently, Danny remarked "the hardest thing to find is guys who can score at the end of games".

It seems like Danny highly values the specific skill set that IT is elite at.

http://www.csnne.com/video/danny-ainge-1-1-impact-getting-1-overall-pick

It's not a smokescreen. Danny is smart enough to value top-end talent.

this qoute .....guys who can score at end of game .....I remember him say n that .   This is WHY I think Fultz is the certain draft pick.   With IT or without IT .....Fultz gives the Celtics a type of player to win a game or get his shot .   Drafting Fultz is backup to losing IT , either way he is covered.

[Phantom255x]

"Rondo can't shoot. TRADE HIM. WE NEED A PG WHO CAN SCORE!"

Now we have a PG who can score (29 PPG!), and yet we want to trade him... 

Tell me this, was Rondo elite on defense?

[Ilikesports17]

Tell me this, was Rondo elite on defense?

when he wanted to be, which cannot be said of Isaiah Thomas.

[nickagneta]

Tell me this, was Rondo elite on defense?

when he wanted to be, which cannot be said of Isaiah Thomas.

But then again Rondo couldn't score or shoot anything like what IT can. If Rondo is unique in Celtic history for his assists and triple doubles then IT is unique in his ability to score and do it so efficiently.