Author Topic: What's the lowest pick you ​would accept for IT  (Read 17703 times)

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Re: What's the lowest pick you ​would accept for IT
« Reply #30 on: May 26, 2017, 01:43:00 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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#1.

Since we already have it, I see no need to trade IT. Looking into my crystal ball (which I have named "Common Sense"), I can pretty much guarantee nobody in this draft outside of Fultz ever reaches 2nd team All-NBA.

Because the goal of team building is to put guys on the All-NBA teams.

I don't care what the All-NBA team voters decided - these are the same people that put DeRozan on the third team and David Lee on the third team a few years back.

IT is not a top 10 guy. He's barely a top 10 PG. He plays the same position of our incoming franchise player.

We should move him.
Sorry what?
Despite all the ridiculousness and irrational things said on this forum recently (Brad is a bad coach, we should move the #1 for worse players etc. etc.), this one absolutely takes the cake.

Most moronic thing I've read in quite some time.

You can make the argument that he is barely top 10:

Harden
Westbrook
Curry
Paul
Kyrie
Lowry
Wall
Giannis(really stretching now)
Thomas
I'll bite. The top 4 you mentioned are pretty easily above IT in terms of ranking. However Kyrie, Lowry etc. are definitely on his level. Taking into account age and ability to continue to develop you'd probably have Wall round out the top 5, yet I'd still put (pre-March hip injury) Thomas above Kyrie and co.

But if Giannis is a point guard then that changes the conversation again. However, I feel as though that top ten, plus Lillard are well above the guys on the tier below.

This guy talked about moronic, ridiculous and irrational about other user.
Statistically, Isaiah is easily the better player. All NBA-votes also vault Thomas over Irving
Quote from: George W. Bush
Too often, we judge other groups by their worst examples while judging ourselves by our best intentions.

Re: What's the lowest pick you ​would accept for IT
« Reply #31 on: May 26, 2017, 01:43:04 PM »

Offline gouki88

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#1.

Since we already have it, I see no need to trade IT. Looking into my crystal ball (which I have named "Common Sense"), I can pretty much guarantee nobody in this draft outside of Fultz ever reaches 2nd team All-NBA.

Because the goal of team building is to put guys on the All-NBA teams.

I don't care what the All-NBA team voters decided - these are the same people that put DeRozan on the third team and David Lee on the third team a few years back.

IT is not a top 10 guy. He's barely a top 10 PG. He plays the same position of our incoming franchise player.

We should move him.
Sorry what?
Despite all the ridiculousness and irrational things said on this forum recently (Brad is a bad coach, we should move the #1 for worse players etc. etc.), this one absolutely takes the cake.

Most moronic thing I've read in quite some time.

You can make the argument that he is barely top 10:

Harden
Westbrook
Curry
Paul
Kyrie
Lowry
Wall
Giannis(really stretching now)
Thomas
I'll bite. The top 4 you mentioned are pretty easily above IT in terms of ranking. However Kyrie, Lowry etc. are definitely on his level. Taking into account age and ability to continue to develop you'd probably have Wall round out the top 5, yet I'd still put (pre-March hip injury) Thomas above Kyrie and co.

But if Giannis is a point guard then that changes the conversation again. However, I feel as though that top ten, plus Lillard are well above the guys on the tier below.

This guy talked about moronic, ridiculous and irrational about other user.
They're both awful defenders, but offensively how big is the gap between them? Boston IT vs Kyrie is basically a dead heat - Kyrie just has a pretty nice benefit of playing with LeBron "I turned Mo Williams into an All-Star" James. Not saying Kyrie isn't a good point guard - he is definitely one of the best in the league. But to call saying IT and Kyrie are on the same tier moronic baffles me.
'23 Historical Draft: Orlando Magic.

PG: Terry Porter (90-91) / Steve Francis (00-01)
SG: Joe Dumars (92-93) / Jeff Hornacek (91-92) / Jerry Stackhouse (00-01)
SF: Brandon Roy (08-09) / Walter Davis (78-79)
PF: Terry Cummings (84-85) / Paul Millsap (15-16)
C: Chris Webber (00-01) / Ralph Sampson (83-84) / Andrew Bogut (09-10)

Re: What's the lowest pick you ​would accept for IT
« Reply #32 on: May 26, 2017, 01:43:37 PM »

Offline gouki88

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#1.

Since we already have it, I see no need to trade IT. Looking into my crystal ball (which I have named "Common Sense"), I can pretty much guarantee nobody in this draft outside of Fultz ever reaches 2nd team All-NBA.

Because the goal of team building is to put guys on the All-NBA teams.

I don't care what the All-NBA team voters decided - these are the same people that put DeRozan on the third team and David Lee on the third team a few years back.

IT is not a top 10 guy. He's barely a top 10 PG. He plays the same position of our incoming franchise player.

We should move him.
Sorry what?
Despite all the ridiculousness and irrational things said on this forum recently (Brad is a bad coach, we should move the #1 for worse players etc. etc.), this one absolutely takes the cake.

Most moronic thing I've read in quite some time.

You can make the argument that he is barely top 10:

Harden
Westbrook
Curry
Paul
Kyrie
Lowry
Wall
Giannis(really stretching now)
Thomas
I'll bite. The top 4 you mentioned are pretty easily above IT in terms of ranking. However Kyrie, Lowry etc. are definitely on his level. Taking into account age and ability to continue to develop you'd probably have Wall round out the top 5, yet I'd still put (pre-March hip injury) Thomas above Kyrie and co.

But if Giannis is a point guard then that changes the conversation again. However, I feel as though that top ten, plus Lillard are well above the guys on the tier below.

This guy talked about moronic, ridiculous and irrational about other user.
Statistically, Isaiah is easily the better player. All NBA-votes also vault Thomas over Irving
Cheers, TP.
'23 Historical Draft: Orlando Magic.

PG: Terry Porter (90-91) / Steve Francis (00-01)
SG: Joe Dumars (92-93) / Jeff Hornacek (91-92) / Jerry Stackhouse (00-01)
SF: Brandon Roy (08-09) / Walter Davis (78-79)
PF: Terry Cummings (84-85) / Paul Millsap (15-16)
C: Chris Webber (00-01) / Ralph Sampson (83-84) / Andrew Bogut (09-10)

Re: What's the lowest pick you ​would accept for IT
« Reply #33 on: May 26, 2017, 01:44:45 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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#1.

Since we already have it, I see no need to trade IT. Looking into my crystal ball (which I have named "Common Sense"), I can pretty much guarantee nobody in this draft outside of Fultz ever reaches 2nd team All-NBA.

Because the goal of team building is to put guys on the All-NBA teams.

I don't care what the All-NBA team voters decided - these are the same people that put DeRozan on the third team and David Lee on the third team a few years back.

IT is not a top 10 guy. He's barely a top 10 PG. He plays the same position of our incoming franchise player.

We should move him.
Sorry what?
Despite all the ridiculousness and irrational things said on this forum recently (Brad is a bad coach, we should move the #1 for worse players etc. etc.), this one absolutely takes the cake.

Most moronic thing I've read in quite some time.

You can make the argument that he is barely top 10:

Harden
Westbrook
Curry
Paul
Kyrie
Lowry
Wall
Giannis(really stretching now)
Thomas
+ Lillard

I guess Hornets/Grizzlies fans could make an argument for Kemba/Conley as well.

The way I see it

Curry
Harden
Westbrook
Paul
Kyrie
Wall
Lillard
Giannis (if we can call him a PG)

are definitely better than IT.
Whoa whoa whoa

Lillard?

You can argue that Thomas is better than every point guard except for Steph and Harden.
Quote from: George W. Bush
Too often, we judge other groups by their worst examples while judging ourselves by our best intentions.

Re: What's the lowest pick you ​would accept for IT
« Reply #34 on: May 26, 2017, 01:54:32 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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#1.

Since we already have it, I see no need to trade IT. Looking into my crystal ball (which I have named "Common Sense"), I can pretty much guarantee nobody in this draft outside of Fultz ever reaches 2nd team All-NBA.

Because the goal of team building is to put guys on the All-NBA teams.

I don't care what the All-NBA team voters decided - these are the same people that put DeRozan on the third team and David Lee on the third team a few years back.

IT is not a top 10 guy. He's barely a top 10 PG. He plays the same position of our incoming franchise player.

We should move him.
Sorry what?
Despite all the ridiculousness and irrational things said on this forum recently (Brad is a bad coach, we should move the #1 for worse players etc. etc.), this one absolutely takes the cake.

Most moronic thing I've read in quite some time.

You can make the argument that he is barely top 10:

Harden
Westbrook
Curry
Paul
Kyrie
Lowry
Wall
Giannis(really stretching now)
Thomas
+ Lillard

I guess Hornets/Grizzlies fans could make an argument for Kemba/Conley as well.

The way I see it

Curry
Harden
Westbrook
Paul
Kyrie
Wall
Lillard
Giannis (if we can call him a PG)

are definitely better than IT.

How is Lillard "definitely better"?

IT (in fewer minutes) scores more points, has the same number of assists and steals, gets to the line more, and has a better FG%, 3PT%, FT%, TS% and eFG%. He runs a better / more efficient offense, and has both a better ORtg and DRtg. He's got a better PER, more win shares (both offensive and defensive) and has a higher VORP.

As for Kyrie and Thomas, it's remarkable how close their stats have been.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.fcgi?request=1&sum=1&y1=2017&player_id1=irvinky01&idx=players&y2=2017&player_id2=thomais02&idx=players

So similar, in fact, that Kyrie is IT's #1 "similarity score" on basketball-reference.


I'M THE SILVERBACK GORILLA IN THIS MOTHER——— AND DON'T NONE OF YA'LL EVER FORGET IT!@ 34 minutes

Re: What's the lowest pick you ​would accept for IT
« Reply #35 on: May 26, 2017, 02:00:55 PM »

Offline apc

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Thomas already took his team further than CP3

Re: What's the lowest pick you ​would accept for IT
« Reply #36 on: May 26, 2017, 02:02:08 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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#1.

Since we already have it, I see no need to trade IT. Looking into my crystal ball (which I have named "Common Sense"), I can pretty much guarantee nobody in this draft outside of Fultz ever reaches 2nd team All-NBA.

Because the goal of team building is to put guys on the All-NBA teams.

I don't care what the All-NBA team voters decided - these are the same people that put DeRozan on the third team and David Lee on the third team a few years back.

IT is not a top 10 guy. He's barely a top 10 PG. He plays the same position of our incoming franchise player.

We should move him.
Sorry what?
Despite all the ridiculousness and irrational things said on this forum recently (Brad is a bad coach, we should move the #1 for worse players etc. etc.), this one absolutely takes the cake.

Most moronic thing I've read in quite some time.

You can make the argument that he is barely top 10:

Harden
Westbrook
Curry
Paul
Kyrie
Lowry
Wall
Giannis(really stretching now)
Thomas
+ Lillard

I guess Hornets/Grizzlies fans could make an argument for Kemba/Conley as well.

The way I see it

Curry
Harden
Westbrook
Paul
Kyrie
Wall
Lillard
Giannis (if we can call him a PG)

are definitely better than IT.

How is Lillard "definitely better"?

IT (in fewer minutes) scores more points, has the same number of assists and steals, gets to the line more, and has a better FG%, 3PT%, FT%, TS% and eFG%. He runs a better / more efficient offense, and has both a better ORtg and DRtg. He's got a better PER, more win shares (both offensive and defensive) and has a higher VORP.

As for Kyrie and Thomas, it's remarkable how close their stats have been.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.fcgi?request=1&sum=1&y1=2017&player_id1=irvinky01&idx=players&y2=2017&player_id2=thomais02&idx=players

So similar, in fact, that Kyrie is IT's #1 "similarity score" on basketball-reference.
Not to mention Thomas has led his team to more success than Lillard.
Quote from: George W. Bush
Too often, we judge other groups by their worst examples while judging ourselves by our best intentions.

Re: What's the lowest pick you ​would accept for IT
« Reply #37 on: May 26, 2017, 04:04:06 PM »

Offline Jvalin

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#1.

Since we already have it, I see no need to trade IT. Looking into my crystal ball (which I have named "Common Sense"), I can pretty much guarantee nobody in this draft outside of Fultz ever reaches 2nd team All-NBA.

Because the goal of team building is to put guys on the All-NBA teams.

I don't care what the All-NBA team voters decided - these are the same people that put DeRozan on the third team and David Lee on the third team a few years back.

IT is not a top 10 guy. He's barely a top 10 PG. He plays the same position of our incoming franchise player.

We should move him.
Sorry what?
Despite all the ridiculousness and irrational things said on this forum recently (Brad is a bad coach, we should move the #1 for worse players etc. etc.), this one absolutely takes the cake.

Most moronic thing I've read in quite some time.

You can make the argument that he is barely top 10:

Harden
Westbrook
Curry
Paul
Kyrie
Lowry
Wall
Giannis(really stretching now)
Thomas
+ Lillard

I guess Hornets/Grizzlies fans could make an argument for Kemba/Conley as well.

The way I see it

Curry
Harden
Westbrook
Paul
Kyrie
Wall
Lillard
Giannis (if we can call him a PG)

are definitely better than IT.

How is Lillard "definitely better"?

IT (in fewer minutes) scores more points, has the same number of assists and steals, gets to the line more, and has a better FG%, 3PT%, FT%, TS% and eFG%. He runs a better / more efficient offense, and has both a better ORtg and DRtg. He's got a better PER, more win shares (both offensive and defensive) and has a higher VORP.

As for Kyrie and Thomas, it's remarkable how close their stats have been.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.fcgi?request=1&sum=1&y1=2017&player_id1=irvinky01&idx=players&y2=2017&player_id2=thomais02&idx=players

So similar, in fact, that Kyrie is IT's #1 "similarity score" on basketball-reference.
Not to mention Thomas has led his team to more success than Lillard.

Sure, all valid points.

On the other hand, IT is one of the worst (if not the worst) defenders in the league. It's not that he is hiding on D. No matter how hard he tries, he can do pretty much nothing simply because he is 5'9.

Lillard is a below average defender as well, but at least he is 6'3 with a 6'7 ¾" wingspan. When the game is on the line he has the tools to get the job done on D. You can't say the same thing about IT. In fact, CBS subs him in and out of games in the clutch (possession by possession) whenever possible. That's how bad IT is on D.

Re: What's the lowest pick you ​would accept for IT
« Reply #38 on: May 26, 2017, 04:11:07 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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#1.

Since we already have it, I see no need to trade IT. Looking into my crystal ball (which I have named "Common Sense"), I can pretty much guarantee nobody in this draft outside of Fultz ever reaches 2nd team All-NBA.

Because the goal of team building is to put guys on the All-NBA teams.

I don't care what the All-NBA team voters decided - these are the same people that put DeRozan on the third team and David Lee on the third team a few years back.

IT is not a top 10 guy. He's barely a top 10 PG. He plays the same position of our incoming franchise player.

We should move him.
Sorry what?
Despite all the ridiculousness and irrational things said on this forum recently (Brad is a bad coach, we should move the #1 for worse players etc. etc.), this one absolutely takes the cake.

Most moronic thing I've read in quite some time.

You can make the argument that he is barely top 10:

Harden
Westbrook
Curry
Paul
Kyrie
Lowry
Wall
Giannis(really stretching now)
Thomas
+ Lillard

I guess Hornets/Grizzlies fans could make an argument for Kemba/Conley as well.

The way I see it

Curry
Harden
Westbrook
Paul
Kyrie
Wall
Lillard
Giannis (if we can call him a PG)

are definitely better than IT.

How is Lillard "definitely better"?

IT (in fewer minutes) scores more points, has the same number of assists and steals, gets to the line more, and has a better FG%, 3PT%, FT%, TS% and eFG%. He runs a better / more efficient offense, and has both a better ORtg and DRtg. He's got a better PER, more win shares (both offensive and defensive) and has a higher VORP.

As for Kyrie and Thomas, it's remarkable how close their stats have been.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.fcgi?request=1&sum=1&y1=2017&player_id1=irvinky01&idx=players&y2=2017&player_id2=thomais02&idx=players

So similar, in fact, that Kyrie is IT's #1 "similarity score" on basketball-reference.
Not to mention Thomas has led his team to more success than Lillard.

Sure, all valid points.

On the other hand, IT is one of the worst (if not the worst) defenders in the league. It's not that he is hiding on D. No matter how hard he tries, he can do pretty much nothing simply because he is 5'9.

Lillard is a below average defender as well, but at least he is 6'3 with a 6'7 ¾" wingspan. When the game is on the line he has the tools to get the job done on D. You can't say the same thing about IT. In fact, CBS subs him in and out of games in the clutch (possession by possession) whenever possible. That's how bad IT is on D.

So Lillard is better because he's taller, even though he's worse on offense and hasn't shown to be Amy better on defense?


I'M THE SILVERBACK GORILLA IN THIS MOTHER——— AND DON'T NONE OF YA'LL EVER FORGET IT!@ 34 minutes

Re: What's the lowest pick you ​would accept for IT
« Reply #39 on: May 26, 2017, 04:14:24 PM »

Offline Csfan1984

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The Knicks pick

Re: What's the lowest pick you ​would accept for IT
« Reply #40 on: May 26, 2017, 04:16:47 PM »

Offline Chris22

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Got me thinking...

Would Miami trade Justise Winslow + Whiteside for the #1 pick?  (Their combined salaries is a few million less than a Gordon Hayward max contract)

PG:  IT/Rozier
SG:  Bradley/Smart
SF:  Winslow/Crowder
PF:  Horford/Yabusele
C:  Whiteside/Zizic

with Jaylen Brown getting some minutes in there somewhere as well... maybe as the result of an eventual Jae Crowder trade.

That is a team I'd be pretty happy going in to battle against Cleveland.
Not sure whether Winslow would start over Jae immediately, but it'd be interesting. Also not sure if Whiteside would fit too well into Brad's offence considering he is, frankly, a shocking passer. But his interior presence and amazing rebounding would be incredibly refreshing.

If I wasn't such a Fultz fanboy this would probably be more intriguing.

Fultz is a generational talent at PG.
So I think Danny will keep IT for the next season, and let him walk after that.

Re: What's the lowest pick you ​would accept for IT
« Reply #41 on: May 26, 2017, 04:18:52 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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#1.

Since we already have it, I see no need to trade IT. Looking into my crystal ball (which I have named "Common Sense"), I can pretty much guarantee nobody in this draft outside of Fultz ever reaches 2nd team All-NBA.

Because the goal of team building is to put guys on the All-NBA teams.

I don't care what the All-NBA team voters decided - these are the same people that put DeRozan on the third team and David Lee on the third team a few years back.

IT is not a top 10 guy. He's barely a top 10 PG. He plays the same position of our incoming franchise player.

We should move him.
Sorry what?
Despite all the ridiculousness and irrational things said on this forum recently (Brad is a bad coach, we should move the #1 for worse players etc. etc.), this one absolutely takes the cake.

Most moronic thing I've read in quite some time.

You can make the argument that he is barely top 10:

Harden
Westbrook
Curry
Paul
Kyrie
Lowry
Wall
Giannis(really stretching now)
Thomas
+ Lillard

I guess Hornets/Grizzlies fans could make an argument for Kemba/Conley as well.

The way I see it

Curry
Harden
Westbrook
Paul
Kyrie
Wall
Lillard
Giannis (if we can call him a PG)

are definitely better than IT.

How is Lillard "definitely better"?

IT (in fewer minutes) scores more points, has the same number of assists and steals, gets to the line more, and has a better FG%, 3PT%, FT%, TS% and eFG%. He runs a better / more efficient offense, and has both a better ORtg and DRtg. He's got a better PER, more win shares (both offensive and defensive) and has a higher VORP.

As for Kyrie and Thomas, it's remarkable how close their stats have been.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.fcgi?request=1&sum=1&y1=2017&player_id1=irvinky01&idx=players&y2=2017&player_id2=thomais02&idx=players

So similar, in fact, that Kyrie is IT's #1 "similarity score" on basketball-reference.
Not to mention Thomas has led his team to more success than Lillard.

Sure, all valid points.

On the other hand, IT is one of the worst (if not the worst) defenders in the league. It's not that he is hiding on D. No matter how hard he tries, he can do pretty much nothing simply because he is 5'9.

Lillard is a below average defender as well, but at least he is 6'3 with a 6'7 ¾" wingspan. When the game is on the line he has the tools to get the job done on D. You can't say the same thing about IT. In fact, CBS subs him in and out of games in the clutch (possession by possession) whenever possible. That's how bad IT is on D.
That's the difference between Kyrie and Lillard.

Both are just as bad on d in the regular season as Isaiah. Both have the length to rise to the occasion when it matters. Kyrie has done this. Lillard has not.

You can argue that Lillard is better (is strongly disagree, but you could do it) but you can not say he is "definitely" better because it sure as hell isn't obvious
Quote from: George W. Bush
Too often, we judge other groups by their worst examples while judging ourselves by our best intentions.

Re: What's the lowest pick you ​would accept for IT
« Reply #42 on: May 26, 2017, 04:21:39 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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Notable guards were worse than IT, as measured by Shooting Percentage Against vs. Average Shooting Percentage:

Kyrie Irving
Tony Parker
Eric Bledsoe
D'Angelo Russell
Russell Westbrook
J.J. Redick
Terry Rozier
Victor Oladipo
Rajon Rondo
C.J. McCollum
Damian Lillard
Patrick Beverly
Chris Paul

http://stats.nba.com/players/defense-dash-overall/#!?Season=2016-17&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&sort=PCT_PLUSMINUS&dir=1&CF=G*GE*60&PlayerPosition=G







I'M THE SILVERBACK GORILLA IN THIS MOTHER——— AND DON'T NONE OF YA'LL EVER FORGET IT!@ 34 minutes

Re: What's the lowest pick you ​would accept for IT
« Reply #43 on: May 26, 2017, 04:31:21 PM »

Offline Dino Pitino

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Call me crazy, but I have no interest in resigning him.  I'd rather trade him now (and create enough cap space to go after Hayward) than let him walk in a year's time.

imo

Best case scenario (kind of a pipe dream) : #7 (Wolves)
Most realistic scenario : #9 (Dallas)
Worst case scenario : Well, I don't really know... Let's say #17 (Milwaukee)

If you're crazy, so am I. I like that #9 pick, too, good chance to snag a big man like Isaac or Collins.
"Young man, you have the question backwards." - Bill Russell

"My guess is that an aggregator of expert opinions would be close in terms of results to that of Danny." - Roy H.

Re: What's the lowest pick you ​would accept for IT
« Reply #44 on: May 26, 2017, 04:32:33 PM »

Offline Dino Pitino

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#1.

Since we already have it, I see no need to trade IT. Looking into my crystal ball (which I have named "Common Sense"), I can pretty much guarantee nobody in this draft outside of Fultz ever reaches 2nd team All-NBA.

Because the goal of team building is to put guys on the All-NBA teams.

I don't care what the All-NBA team voters decided - these are the same people that put DeRozan on the third team and David Lee on the third team a few years back.

IT is not a top 10 guy. He's barely a top 10 PG. He plays the same position of our incoming franchise player.

We should move him.

Stark reality, guys. ^^^^
"Young man, you have the question backwards." - Bill Russell

"My guess is that an aggregator of expert opinions would be close in terms of results to that of Danny." - Roy H.