Author Topic: Fultz will not start next year  (Read 12729 times)

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Re: Fultz will not start next year
« Reply #30 on: May 23, 2017, 03:39:35 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Here are the last 9 #1 picks. Fultz better be more KAT than Bennett if we take him.

   
2008   Chicago Bulls   Derrick Rose^    USA   Guard   Memphis   16.8   3.9   6.3   [93]
2009   Los Angeles Clippers   Blake Griffin^[y]    USA   Forward   Oklahoma   22.5   12.1   3.8   [95]
2010   Washington Wizards   John Wall^    USA   Guard   Kentucky   16.4   4.6   8.3   [96]
2011   Cleveland Cavaliers   Kyrie Irving^    USA[z]   Guard   Duke   18.5   3.7   5.4   [99]
2012   New Orleans Hornets   Anthony Davis^    USA   Forward/Center   Kentucky   13.5   8.2   1.0   [100]
2013   Cleveland Cavaliers   Anthony Bennett    CAN   Forward   UNLV   4.2   3.0   0.3   [101]
2014   Cleveland Cavaliers   Andrew Wiggins    CAN   Forward/Guard   Kansas   16.9   4.6   2.1   [102]
2015   Minnesota Timberwolves   Karl-Anthony Towns    USA[aa]   Center   Kentucky   18.3   10.4   2.0   [103]
2016   Philadelphia 76ers   Ben Simmons    AUS[ab]   Forward   LSU   —   —   —   [104]
2017   Boston Celtics   TBA            —   —   —
All those numbers those #1 picks put up were done on crap teams. Fultz will be on an ECF team.  None of those players had the best defensive guard in the league who could put up 16/6/2 and an MVP,  All-Star, All NBA guard who could give you 29/2/6 playing in front of them. My guess is Fultz's numbers will be much lower than the players on this list.

Re: Fultz will not start next year
« Reply #31 on: May 23, 2017, 04:15:19 PM »

Offline bknova

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If you're starting a rookie that isn't named Magic Johnson, you're not a contender.  History bears this out.  We're trying to win now.

Fultz has never seen an NBA defender like Avery Bradley or Patrick Beverly.  It's going to be a rude awakening.  He could have a nice rookie season, but I'd be shocked if he's as good as Devin Booker, e.g.  He's not the savior.  He's not taking Marcus Smart's minutes.  He's not starting unless Stevens is desperate for playmaking while IT is hurt.

Good. And do you know how good he's gonna be because of it. Going agains Marcus and Avery in practice everyday, and not being spoonfed minutes is going to make him earn them and he's gonna end up being a beast, fast.  Look at Jaylen.  You don't think having to earn his minutes didn't make him better, faster.  This is the best possible situation for any kid of elite skill.  Learn how to play hard and win right out of the gate.

Re: Fultz will not start next year
« Reply #32 on: May 23, 2017, 04:27:53 PM »

Offline Donoghus

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Does it really matter if he starts or not in his rookie season?

He'll be coming into one helluva situation (veteran laden, franchise stable, well coached, winning team) not some 20-62 downtrodden franchise.   Plus the C's will have him cost controlled for the foreseeable future.  As long as there is development, there is a very little pressure right off the bat.


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Re: Fultz will not start next year
« Reply #33 on: May 23, 2017, 04:34:11 PM »

Offline KG Living Legend

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Does it really matter if he starts or not in his rookie season?

He'll be coming into one helluva situation (veteran laden, franchise stable, well coached, winning team) not some 20-62 downtrodden franchise.   Plus the C's will have him cost controlled for the foreseeable future.  As long as there is development, there is a very little pressure right off the bat.



 I mean he went start the first game, but he will start at some point next year. Care to wager on it?

Re: Fultz will not start next year
« Reply #34 on: May 23, 2017, 04:39:31 PM »

Offline PAOBoston

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Does it really matter if he starts or not? I would assume getting playing time would be more important.

Re: Fultz will not start next year
« Reply #35 on: May 23, 2017, 04:44:47 PM »

Offline Future Celtics Owner

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If you're starting a rookie that isn't named Magic Johnson, you're not a contender.  History bears this out.  We're trying to win now.

Fultz has never seen an NBA defender like Avery Bradley or Patrick Beverly.  It's going to be a rude awakening.  He could have a nice rookie season, but I'd be shocked if he's as good as Devin Booker, e.g.  He's not the savior.  He's not taking Marcus Smart's minutes.  He's not starting unless Stevens is desperate for playmaking while IT is hurt.

Good. And do you know how good he's gonna be because of it. Going agains Marcus and Avery in practice everyday, and not being spoonfed minutes is going to make him earn them and he's gonna end up being a beast, fast.  Look at Jaylen.  You don't think having to earn his minutes didn't make him better, faster.  This is the best possible situation for any kid of elite skill.  Learn how to play hard and win right out of the gate.
Fultz is at a different offensive level than Jaylen was when we drafted him....that's why he is going #1 overall in a good draft. Having guys competing for spots will be very good for player development, but it may also ruffle some feathers. A returning player may take it hard if he loses his starting spot/role with the team/minutes from either the rookie (Fultz) and Jaylen. It also could hurt a player like Smart's trade value if he started losing all his minutes.

No one can rule Jaylen and Fultz out.

Re: Fultz will not start next year
« Reply #36 on: May 23, 2017, 04:51:45 PM »

Offline mahcus smaht

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Here are the last 9 #1 picks. Fultz better be more KAT than Bennett if we take him.

   
2008   Chicago Bulls   Derrick Rose^    USA   Guard   Memphis   16.8   3.9   6.3   [93]
2009   Los Angeles Clippers   Blake Griffin^[y]    USA   Forward   Oklahoma   22.5   12.1   3.8   [95]
2010   Washington Wizards   John Wall^    USA   Guard   Kentucky   16.4   4.6   8.3   [96]
2011   Cleveland Cavaliers   Kyrie Irving^    USA[z]   Guard   Duke   18.5   3.7   5.4   [99]
2012   New Orleans Hornets   Anthony Davis^    USA   Forward/Center   Kentucky   13.5   8.2   1.0   [100]
2013   Cleveland Cavaliers   Anthony Bennett    CAN   Forward   UNLV   4.2   3.0   0.3   [101]
2014   Cleveland Cavaliers   Andrew Wiggins    CAN   Forward/Guard   Kansas   16.9   4.6   2.1   [102]
2015   Minnesota Timberwolves   Karl-Anthony Towns    USA[aa]   Center   Kentucky   18.3   10.4   2.0   [103]
2016   Philadelphia 76ers   Ben Simmons    AUS[ab]   Forward   LSU   —   —   —   [104]
2017   Boston Celtics   TBA            —   —   —
All those numbers those #1 picks put up were done on crap teams. Fultz will be on an ECF team.  None of those players had the best defensive guard in the league who could put up 16/6/2 and an MVP,  All-Star, All NBA guard who could give you 29/2/6 playing in front of them. My guess is Fultz's numbers will be much lower than the players on this list.
Simmons and Griffin did not play their rookie years. They are irrelevant. Towns, Davis and Bennet are bigs, cross them out.

I think Wiggins is a wing, while Fultz is a gaurd, so I will also cross him off the list.

This leaves Rose, Wall and Irving. All three are comparable level prospects to Fultz. Irving and wall went to garbage teams. Rule them out.

Derrick Rose is the only guy you can draw anything from. The team was coming off a 33 win season and went on to win 41 games and make the playoffs. In the playoffs, Derrick Rose averaged 20/6/6 in 45 minutes a game.

Still you cant really draw anything from this. How many elite prospects have gone to playoff ready teams?

3 years ago, Marcus Smart started over Isaiah Thomas for the 40 win Celtics.
In 2010 James Harden played 23 minutes a game logging 0 starts for the 50 win Thunder
In 2012 Evan Turner played 23 minutes a game logging 14 starts for the 41 win 76ers
In 2006 Deron Williams played 29 minutes a game logging 47 starts for the 41 win Jazz
In 2005 Devin Harris played like 10 minutes a game with 19 starts for the 54 win Mavs
In 2005 Ben Gordon played 24 mninutes a game with just 3 starts for the 47 win Bulls. He started 1 playoff game.
In 2004 Wade started 56/61 games for the 42 win Miami Heat.

Problem here is that Fultz is a much better prospect than Smart Harden and Harris, and the Celtics are  much better team than the others.

There is virtually no precedent for a elite prospect to go to a 50+ win team save Magic Johnson.

Re: Fultz will not start next year
« Reply #37 on: May 23, 2017, 04:53:53 PM »

Offline mahcus smaht

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If you're starting a rookie that isn't named Magic Johnson, you're not a contender.  History bears this out.  We're trying to win now.

Fultz has never seen an NBA defender like Avery Bradley or Patrick Beverly.  It's going to be a rude awakening.  He could have a nice rookie season, but I'd be shocked if he's as good as Devin Booker, e.g.  He's not the savior.  He's not taking Marcus Smart's minutes.  He's not starting unless Stevens is desperate for playmaking while IT is hurt.
Hes a much better prospect than Booker was.

Re: Fultz will not start next year
« Reply #38 on: May 23, 2017, 04:57:29 PM »

Offline Donoghus

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Does it really matter if he starts or not in his rookie season?

He'll be coming into one helluva situation (veteran laden, franchise stable, well coached, winning team) not some 20-62 downtrodden franchise.   Plus the C's will have him cost controlled for the foreseeable future.  As long as there is development, there is a very little pressure right off the bat.



 I mean he went start the first game, but he will start at some point next year. Care to wager on it?

Wager on what?  I don't care if he starts or not.  I'm not advocating either way.  I'm just saying that he doesn't need to start right of the bat. 


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Re: Fultz will not start next year
« Reply #39 on: May 23, 2017, 05:09:29 PM »

Offline Denis998

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Yep, Brad isn't going to change his coaching philosophy just because Fultz is a number 1 pick. Fultz is going to have to earn playing time in practice in order to get on the floor, and furthermore outplay the starters if he wants an opportunity to start.

Re: Fultz will not start next year
« Reply #40 on: May 23, 2017, 05:38:19 PM »

Offline PickNRoll

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Fultz will eventually be better than Booker, he's just not going to play 28 minutes/game in his rookie year if he's a Celtic.

Re: Fultz will not start next year
« Reply #41 on: May 23, 2017, 06:18:40 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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I'm concerned with his defense and intensity. Offense like Lillard, defense like Harden.

Yeah, I'm with you, here.  I worry about his motor, as too many times he just gave up on plays, yet he has also made a number of chase down blocks, so which guy is he?  That's not a question that you should be asking of a potential first overall pick, imo, and I'm also concerned about that knee.  I guess it comes down to personal preference, but unless your name is Joel Embiid or the talent is just undeniable, I'd rather not take someone in the top 10 with medical/injury concerns. 

Re: Fultz will not start next year
« Reply #42 on: May 23, 2017, 06:21:38 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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I'm concerned with his defense and intensity. Offense like Lillard, defense like Harden.

Yeah, I'm with you, here.  I worry about his motor, as too many times he just gave up on plays, yet he has also made a number of chase down blocks, so which guy is he?  That's not a question that you should be asking of a potential first overall pick, imo, and I'm also concerned about that knee.  I guess it comes down to personal preference, but unless your name is Joel Embiid or the talent is just undeniable, I'd rather not take someone in the top 10 with medical/injury concerns.
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Re: Fultz will not start next year
« Reply #43 on: May 23, 2017, 06:34:21 PM »

Offline Beat LA

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I'm concerned with his defense and intensity. Offense like Lillard, defense like Harden.

Yeah, I'm with you, here.  I worry about his motor, as too many times he just gave up on plays, yet he has also made a number of chase down blocks, so which guy is he?  That's not a question that you should be asking of a potential first overall pick, imo, and I'm also concerned about that knee.  I guess it comes down to personal preference, but unless your name is Joel Embiid or the talent is just undeniable, I'd rather not take someone in the top 10 with medical/injury concerns.
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Re: Fultz will not start next year
« Reply #44 on: May 23, 2017, 07:07:31 PM »

Offline OldSchoolDude

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Huh, I have a problem with a guy who only won 9 games in college and didn't play in the NCAA tourney. Is he that much better than any other rookie? I just keep thinking back to watching other rookies who were highly touted and they looked ok their rookie year but not world beaters.

I want to see or hear how these workouts go.

Well every point guard taken #1 that was highly touted actually were world beaters, so if the pattern holds he'll probably be starting by seasons end, even if its at the 2 next to IT.