Author Topic: Why are so many asking about trading IT?  (Read 4930 times)

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Re: Why are so many asking about trading IT?
« Reply #30 on: May 20, 2017, 09:21:46 PM »

Offline CelticSooner

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Resigning IT is dependent on who the C's get beside him in FA.

Re: Why are so many asking about trading IT?
« Reply #31 on: May 20, 2017, 09:31:56 PM »

Offline Tr1boy

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IT4 will ultimately not be a celtic after next season I predict

He will be offered a 4 year 100 million dollar contract...and will scoff at it

Danny will either try to trade IT4 on draft night

Or

Play him the rest of the year until contract is completed

Re: Why are so many asking about trading IT?
« Reply #32 on: May 20, 2017, 09:32:11 PM »

Offline tazzmaniac

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I do not like undersized score first no defense PGs.

I have never warmed up to IT. I would be happy to see him gone.

Yep, same here. Appreciate all he's done for us as a Celtic, but I still view him as best fit for a sixth man scoring spark plug off the bench.

Fultz and IT's injury just cemented this sentiment for me. I'd rather keep AB for less money long-term than max out IT coming off of a major injury like this.
IT is around a 16 million dollar player making 7 million but at age 29, he will get worse midway through his next contract. If the goal is to win a championship, Ainge should not investing big money into an undersized, defensively deficient IT heading into his 30s. It was always pure lunacy to do that. It is now more obvious given his injury situation.
With the injury, I'd be surprised if he gets any offers near MAX.  It may put him around his actual value as a 6th man scorer off the bench.  This gives Fultz a chance to take the starting PG job.  If he can't beat out Smart and Rozier, I'd be rather disappointed. 

Re: Why are so many asking about trading IT?
« Reply #33 on: May 20, 2017, 09:49:05 PM »

Offline GRADYCOLNON

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The entire trade IT narrative is built on comments that respectable Boston reporters said during a podcast.  The conversation was about getting the assets to make the Butler trade.  Overall, I think the narrative of trading IT should only be in the presence of getting a two-way star like Butler.

The trade IT movement makes fair points about the imbalance in his game and his upcoming contract.  One thing I'd like to add is if you take away the quality of role players that support IT, the team will fall back to late lottery team.

It was no coincidence he has succeeded in Boston. But back in Sacramento, he only contributed in putting up individual numbers.  After signing with the Suns, there haven't been improvements in his game beyond taking on larger offensive responsibility. 

This only goes to show he isn't the reason why the team is winning.  In actuality, the strong defense has given Isaiah a platform to say he is responsible for the wins.  You let him sign big for another team, he will be on a perennial late-lottery team and that team will regret overpaying.

This is why IT doesn't deserve a max deal.  Until Isaiah realizes leaving the Celtics to chase money will guarantee life in basketball purgatory for the remainder of his prime, I think trading him or letting him go are the best options.  Things will turn 180 if he realizes he needs to take less money because the winning has been because of the team's success. 


Re: Why are so many asking about trading IT?
« Reply #34 on: May 20, 2017, 09:55:17 PM »

Offline Dchuck

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 For me, the ultimate and ONLY question is ....will having Isaiah, Horford and (fill in the blank max player) be enough to raise banner 18?

If the answer is yes, sign him!  If the answer is no, then move on. 

My hope is, we draft Fultz and build around him, Brown and next year's pick.  Everything else is secondary.

Re: Why are so many asking about trading IT?
« Reply #35 on: May 20, 2017, 10:06:57 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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I can understand trading IT if you're getting back an upgrade. Like trading IT and a Brooklyn pick for Westbrook or Davis or with other picks for a Towns or Porzingas. But some of the trades I have seen have just dumped him for nothing, which can't happen.

I would offer IT the same deal everyone else can offer him, a 4 year max deal, and see if he takes it. If he does and take it, let him play with Fultz until Fultz is a star, then trade him.

Re: Why are so many asking about trading IT?
« Reply #36 on: May 20, 2017, 10:08:01 PM »

Offline jpotter33

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I do not like undersized score first no defense PGs.

I have never warmed up to IT. I would be happy to see him gone.

Yep, same here. Appreciate all he's done for us as a Celtic, but I still view him as best fit for a sixth man scoring spark plug off the bench.

Fultz and IT's injury just cemented this sentiment for me. I'd rather keep AB for less money long-term than max out IT coming off of a major injury like this.
IT is around a 16 million dollar player making 7 million but at age 29, he will get worse midway through his next contract. If the goal is to win a championship, Ainge should not investing big money into an undersized, defensively deficient IT heading into his 30s. It was always pure lunacy to do that. It is now more obvious given his injury situation.
With the injury, I'd be surprised if he gets any offers near MAX.  It may put him around his actual value as a 6th man scorer off the bench.  This gives Fultz a chance to take the starting PG job.  If he can't beat out Smart and Rozier, I'd be rather disappointed.

You don't think LA will offer IT big money next summer, even if it's just a Horford type move to try and lure PG? Granted, that might depend upon who they take in the draft. Hard to see them signing IT after picking Ball and having Russell and Clarkson.

Re: Why are so many asking about trading IT?
« Reply #37 on: May 20, 2017, 10:14:48 PM »

Offline mctyson

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I'm not sure that trading IT makes any sense, because I doubt that he can even get back a lottery pick with his weaknesses and contract status.

But that's a completely different argument than not wanting to max him out. I'm not sure that you can make a reasonable argument to max IT out anymore after what we've seen this playoffs plus the probable addition of Fultz, barring some very specific circumstances and signings.

Cousins delivered a top-10 pick and Buddy Heild, and Cousins never came close to Isaiah's success this year.

Re: Why are so many asking about trading IT?
« Reply #38 on: May 20, 2017, 10:20:33 PM »

Offline mctyson

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I do not like undersized score first no defense PGs.

I have never warmed up to IT. I would be happy to see him gone.

2nd team All NBA. You are crazy.

Re: Why are so many asking about trading IT?
« Reply #39 on: May 20, 2017, 11:10:45 PM »

Offline Future Celtics Owner

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I can understand trading IT if you're getting back an upgrade. Like trading IT and a Brooklyn pick for Westbrook or Davis or with other picks for a Towns or Porzingas. But some of the trades I have seen have just dumped him for nothing, which can't happen.

I would offer IT the same deal everyone else can offer him, a 4 year max deal, and see if he takes it. If he does and take it, let him play with Fultz until Fultz is a star, then trade him.
But what happens in your scenario when he does not take the deal and ends up walking as an UFA.....we get left with NOTHING and all we had to do was draft Fultz at #1 to be our superstar PG of the future and trade IT.

IT has always been an enigma to me. I understand why people love him but you can only max out a very select few per team and his game is just too unbalanced. Paul Pierce or KG played both ends of the floor and competed 100% of the game against guys like Kobe/Lebron and Duncan/Dirk.

Re: Why are so many asking about trading IT?
« Reply #40 on: May 20, 2017, 11:12:45 PM »

Offline Future Celtics Owner

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I'm not sure that trading IT makes any sense, because I doubt that he can even get back a lottery pick with his weaknesses and contract status.

But that's a completely different argument than not wanting to max him out. I'm not sure that you can make a reasonable argument to max IT out anymore after what we've seen this playoffs plus the probable addition of Fultz, barring some very specific circumstances and signings.

Cousins delivered a top-10 pick and Buddy Heild, and Cousins never came close to Isaiah's success this year.
Really?

Re: Why are so many asking about trading IT?
« Reply #41 on: May 21, 2017, 09:08:08 AM »

Offline nickagneta

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I can understand trading IT if you're getting back an upgrade. Like trading IT and a Brooklyn pick for Westbrook or Davis or with other picks for a Towns or Porzingas. But some of the trades I have seen have just dumped him for nothing, which can't happen.

I would offer IT the same deal everyone else can offer him, a 4 year max deal, and see if he takes it. If he does and take it, let him play with Fultz until Fultz is a star, then trade him.
But what happens in your scenario when he does not take the deal and ends up walking as an UFA.....we get left with NOTHING and all we had to do was draft Fultz at #1 to be our superstar PG of the future and trade IT.

IT has always been an enigma to me. I understand why people love him but you can only max out a very select few per team and his game is just too unbalanced. Paul Pierce or KG played both ends of the floor and competed 100% of the game against guys like Kobe/Lebron and Duncan/Dirk.
Then if he doesn't sign, but he will, then just don't sign Bradley or Smart either and sign another free agent who will be an impact. You dont dump IT for nothing now for fear of him walking later. Thats management by fear which is the wrong way to approach things.

Re: Why are so many asking about trading IT?
« Reply #42 on: May 21, 2017, 09:20:27 AM »

Offline ThaPreacher

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It's only a small but loud contingent, fortunately.

Oh, I don't know. Let's poll this one. I think half of Celticsblog wants to trade him. And another group wants to banish him back to the bench.

Fultz hasn't even gone through a pre-draft work-out in Boston yet.
"Just do what you do best."  -Red Auerbach-

Re: Why are so many asking about trading IT?
« Reply #43 on: May 21, 2017, 09:22:19 AM »

Offline LilRip

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What is the "max money" in signing IT anyway?
- LilRip

Re: Why are so many asking about trading IT?
« Reply #44 on: May 21, 2017, 09:35:36 AM »

Offline spikelovetheCelts

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I can understand trading IT if you're getting back an upgrade. Like trading IT and a Brooklyn pick for Westbrook or Davis or with other picks for a Towns or Porzingas. But some of the trades I have seen have just dumped him for nothing, which can't happen.

I would offer IT the same deal everyone else can offer him, a 4 year max deal, and see if he takes it. If he does and take it, let him play with Fultz until Fultz is a star, then trade him.
I think the same path is the way to go. I would ask for just under the 4 year max and see if he will puts me money to win. If Tiny Archibald can win as a point guard in Boston why not IT4. If you DA gets value for any player they will be traded as well.
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