Author Topic: James Comey fired  (Read 9443 times)

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Re: James Comey fired
« Reply #15 on: May 09, 2017, 09:48:19 PM »

Offline Vermont Green

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surprised but not undeserved.  my take on it is this has more to do with sabotaging/damaging the Russia investigation than his questionable leadership

Ya think?

Comey did botch the whole Hillary thing but I believe he was going to right his legacy by doing a fair investigation of the Russia connection.  Raise your hand if you think Trump wants a fair investigation.

Re: James Comey fired
« Reply #16 on: May 09, 2017, 09:53:39 PM »

Offline Emmette Bryant

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One of the lessons of Watergate is that it's not the illegal act that gets you in trouble but the coverup.

Re: James Comey fired
« Reply #17 on: May 09, 2017, 11:15:40 PM »

Online FatKidsDad

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Gone is democracy from the US. The start of fascism. A goon can remove anyone who investigates his possible wrong doing. the media rolls over. The ruling party puts party over nation.

Once the idiot-in-chief realizes he can do anything without consequences, he will. And who will stand up and oppose him?

What separates the US from a banana republic, wherein the ruler installs his family, profits off government policy, and collides with the rich to become richer? Opposition is squelched and the media marches in step.

Investigation of possible crimes by the ruler?  Off with their heads.

Basically, the legitimacy of the US as a semi-functional democratic entity is now dependent on the Democratic Party turning out voters in a mid-term election.

Christ save us all.

Latest in a string of ugly moves by POTUS but I won't go dowm the fascism road.  I think he is less evil or ideological zealot than he is an immature, thin-skinned and impulsive man with far more power than he should have.  There are still some level heads in the administration - other than Bannon there is no Geobals in the WH. 

 Dems and Independents need to unify to give congress back to the democrats in 2018.   Dems need to take a deep breath amd locate an articulate moderate who can lead the party. And someone like John Kasich should start his 2020 campaign for the republican nomination ASAP.    Democracy is alive -- in 18 months this turns around

 
As is often the case, the voice of reason.

TP
"If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking." - George S. Patton
   
"Live so that when your children think of fairness and integrity,they think of you." -   H. Jackson Brown, Jr.

Re: James Comey fired
« Reply #18 on: May 10, 2017, 11:52:55 AM »

Offline kraidstar

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Gone is democracy from the US. The start of fascism. A goon can remove anyone who investigates his possible wrong doing. the media rolls over. The ruling party puts party over nation.

Once the idiot-in-chief realizes he can do anything without consequences, he will. And who will stand up and oppose him?

What separates the US from a banana republic, wherein the ruler installs his family, profits off government policy, and collides with the rich to become richer? Opposition is squelched and the media marches in step.

Investigation of possible crimes by the ruler?  Off with their heads.

Basically, the legitimacy of the US as a semi-functional democratic entity is now dependent on the Democratic Party turning out voters in a mid-term election.

Christ save us all.

Latest in a string of ugly moves by POTUS but I won't go dowm the fascism road.  I think he is less evil or ideological zealot than he is an immature, thin-skinned and impulsive man with far more power than he should have.  There are still some level heads in the administration - other than Bannon there is no Geobals in the WH. 

 Dems and Independents need to unify to give congress back to the democrats in 2018.   Dems need to take a deep breath amd locate an articulate moderate who can lead the party. And someone like John Kasich should start his 2020 campaign for the republican nomination ASAP.    Democracy is alive -- in 18 months this turns around

 
As is often the case, the voice of reason.

TP

I don't know about that. We have a system of checks and balances in place to prevent power from swinging too far in any given direction, but I would argue that those checks and balances are failing.

The Republicans stole a Supreme Court seat, manipulating obscure procedures to push through their candidate after denying Obama his Constitutional right to appoint his own nominee.

They've gerrymandered and disenfranchised their way to a disproportionate number of state and national congressional seats. Conservative-packed courts have failed to overturn these injustices.

Political spin has turned into outright propaganda and "alternate facts" pushed by various corporate-backed outlets.

Many congressmen seem unperturbed that our supposed enemy, Russia, interfered in our election, and is backing Trump and many other far right-wing politicians world-wide.

The conservatives are supporting a a President who got a huge assist from the FBI at the most critical moment in the Presidential election - and then the same President fires the FBI director because he's investigating the administration for ties to Russia. I doubt congress will organize a proper investigation. And I doubt even more that Trump will investigate himself.

And, perhaps worst of all, the Republicans are fighting to give even greater tax cuts and deregulation to the oligarchs and industries which are burying the middle class, a middle class which is theoretically the backbone of a strong economy.

These same oligarchs are contributing vast amounts of dark money to the campaigns of same said politicians, in large part to decisions like Citizens United. Good luck overturning that one with a rigged Supreme Court.

Good luck prosecuting possible Russian sympathizers with a rigged FBI.

Good luck winning elections when the failsafes to protect our democracy are failing one by one, and corruption and partisanship have supplanted common sense.

I don't see how anyone can view the current situation as anything other than a blatant third-world-style power grab.

IMO to call it anything else is apologism or naivete. This is NOT business as usual. This is serious.

Re: James Comey fired
« Reply #19 on: May 10, 2017, 11:57:28 AM »

Offline liam

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Gone is democracy from the US. The start of fascism. A goon can remove anyone who investigates his possible wrong doing. the media rolls over. The ruling party puts party over nation.

Once the idiot-in-chief realizes he can do anything without consequences, he will. And who will stand up and oppose him?

What separates the US from a banana republic, wherein the ruler installs his family, profits off government policy, and collides with the rich to become richer? Opposition is squelched and the media marches in step.

Investigation of possible crimes by the ruler?  Off with their heads.

Basically, the legitimacy of the US as a semi-functional democratic entity is now dependent on the Democratic Party turning out voters in a mid-term election.

Christ save us all.

Latest in a string of ugly moves by POTUS but I won't go dowm the fascism road.  I think he is less evil or ideological zealot than he is an immature, thin-skinned and impulsive man with far more power than he should have.  There are still some level heads in the administration - other than Bannon there is no Geobals in the WH. 

 Dems and Independents need to unify to give congress back to the democrats in 2018.   Dems need to take a deep breath amd locate an articulate moderate who can lead the party. And someone like John Kasich should start his 2020 campaign for the republican nomination ASAP.    Democracy is alive -- in 18 months this turns around

 
As is often the case, the voice of reason.

TP

I don't know about that. We have a system of checks and balances in place to prevent power from swinging too far in any given direction, but I would argue that those checks and balances are failing.

The Republicans stole a Supreme Court seat, manipulating obscure procedures to push through their candidate after denying Obama his Constitutional right to appoint his own nominee.

They've gerrymandered and disenfranchised their way to a disproportionate number of state and national congressional seats. Conservative-packed courts have failed to overturn these injustices.

Political spin has turned into outright propaganda and "alternate facts" pushed by various corporate-backed outlets.

Many congressmen seem unperturbed that our supposed enemy, Russia, interfered in our election, and is backing Trump and many other far right-wing politicians world-wide.

The conservatives are supporting a a President who got a huge assist from the FBI at the most critical moment in the Presidential election - and then the same President fires the FBI director because he's investigating the administration for ties to Russia. I doubt congress will organize a proper investigation. And I doubt even more that Trump will investigate himself.

And, perhaps worst of all, the Republicans are fighting to give even greater tax cuts and deregulation to the oligarchs and industries which are burying the middle class, a middle class which is theoretically the backbone of a strong economy.

These same oligarchs are contributing vast amounts of dark money to the campaigns of same said politicians, in large part to decisions like Citizens United. Good luck overturning that one with a rigged Supreme Court.

Good luck prosecuting possible Russian sympathizers with a rigged FBI.

Good luck winning elections when the failsafes to protect our democracy are failing one by one, and corruption and partisanship have supplanted common sense.

I don't see how anyone can view the current situation as anything other than a blatant third-world-style power grab.

IMO to call it anything else is apologism or naivete. This is NOT business as usual. This is serious.

Sadly, this all too true. The only hope is that a backlash of political action will take place and sweep away this power and money grab.

Re: James Comey fired
« Reply #20 on: May 10, 2017, 12:19:08 PM »

Offline Jon

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I hope conservatives are enjoying the last time they'll have power for a very long time, because only a fool would be oblivious to the fact that Trump is going to run the entire Party and brand into the ground.

Re: James Comey fired
« Reply #21 on: May 10, 2017, 12:52:09 PM »

Online Roy H.

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I hope conservatives are enjoying the last time they'll have power for a very long time, because only a fool would be oblivious to the fact that Trump is going to run the entire Party and brand into the ground.

I don't think that's really true.  Look at Nixon's resignation. The Republicans held the White House for 16 of the next 20 years.

Look at those members of Congress that have been forced out of Congress due to scandal and corruption. In almost all instances, the political parties themselves haven't suffered.

As amateurish as Trump has been, 40% of voters still support him. That's hardly a death knell for Republicans, and they'll never run a worse nominee.


Once a CrotoNat, always a CrotoNat.  CelticsBlog Draft Champions, 2009 & 2012;
DKC Draft 2015 Champions and beyond...

Re: James Comey fired
« Reply #22 on: May 10, 2017, 12:57:21 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Gone is democracy from the US. The start of fascism. A goon can remove anyone who investigates his possible wrong doing. the media rolls over. The ruling party puts party over nation.

Once the idiot-in-chief realizes he can do anything without consequences, he will. And who will stand up and oppose him?

What separates the US from a banana republic, wherein the ruler installs his family, profits off government policy, and collides with the rich to become richer? Opposition is squelched and the media marches in step.

Investigation of possible crimes by the ruler?  Off with their heads.

Basically, the legitimacy of the US as a semi-functional democratic entity is now dependent on the Democratic Party turning out voters in a mid-term election.

Christ save us all.

Latest in a string of ugly moves by POTUS but I won't go dowm the fascism road.  I think he is less evil or ideological zealot than he is an immature, thin-skinned and impulsive man with far more power than he should have.  There are still some level heads in the administration - other than Bannon there is no Geobals in the WH. 

 Dems and Independents need to unify to give congress back to the democrats in 2018.   Dems need to take a deep breath amd locate an articulate moderate who can lead the party. And someone like John Kasich should start his 2020 campaign for the republican nomination ASAP.    Democracy is alive -- in 18 months this turns around

 
As is often the case, the voice of reason.

TP

I don't know about that. We have a system of checks and balances in place to prevent power from swinging too far in any given direction, but I would argue that those checks and balances are failing.

The Republicans stole a Supreme Court seat, manipulating obscure procedures to push through their candidate after denying Obama his Constitutional right to appoint his own nominee.

They've gerrymandered and disenfranchised their way to a disproportionate number of state and national congressional seats. Conservative-packed courts have failed to overturn these injustices.

Political spin has turned into outright propaganda and "alternate facts" pushed by various corporate-backed outlets.

Many congressmen seem unperturbed that our supposed enemy, Russia, interfered in our election, and is backing Trump and many other far right-wing politicians world-wide.

The conservatives are supporting a a President who got a huge assist from the FBI at the most critical moment in the Presidential election - and then the same President fires the FBI director because he's investigating the administration for ties to Russia. I doubt congress will organize a proper investigation. And I doubt even more that Trump will investigate himself.

And, perhaps worst of all, the Republicans are fighting to give even greater tax cuts and deregulation to the oligarchs and industries which are burying the middle class, a middle class which is theoretically the backbone of a strong economy.

These same oligarchs are contributing vast amounts of dark money to the campaigns of same said politicians, in large part to decisions like Citizens United. Good luck overturning that one with a rigged Supreme Court.

Good luck prosecuting possible Russian sympathizers with a rigged FBI.

Good luck winning elections when the failsafes to protect our democracy are failing one by one, and corruption and partisanship have supplanted common sense.

I don't see how anyone can view the current situation as anything other than a blatant third-world-style power grab.

IMO to call it anything else is apologism or naivete. This is NOT business as usual. This is serious.

Isn't the biggest check the voters? No offense, but by buying into the "my side is better than your side" nonsense, you're part of the problem. You truly believe Democrats aren't bought and paid for? That Democrats don't gerrymander? That Democrats have clean hands with judicial nominations?

Both parties are about money and power. Their primary goal is to make voters false promises in an effort to get elected.


Once a CrotoNat, always a CrotoNat.  CelticsBlog Draft Champions, 2009 & 2012;
DKC Draft 2015 Champions and beyond...

Re: James Comey fired
« Reply #23 on: May 10, 2017, 01:06:21 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

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The most obvious reason for Trump to do this is to appoint an FBI director who won't investigate him seriously.
The FBI director and his agency serve at the pleasure of the President. Any serious investigation on this will come from the Congress or the Senate.
(Formerly) managing Rilski Sportist to glory at http://www.buzzerbeater.com

Re: James Comey fired
« Reply #24 on: May 10, 2017, 01:41:23 PM »

Offline slamtheking

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The most obvious reason for Trump to do this is to appoint an FBI director who won't investigate him seriously.
The FBI director and his agency serve at the pleasure of the President. Any serious investigation on this will come from the Congress or the Senate.
that may be the first time the word 'serious' was used in the same sentence as Congress/Senate.

that said, with both houses in the hands of the Reps, no real investigation will be conducted

Re: James Comey fired
« Reply #25 on: May 10, 2017, 01:44:33 PM »

Offline slamtheking

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I hope conservatives are enjoying the last time they'll have power for a very long time, because only a fool would be oblivious to the fact that Trump is going to run the entire Party and brand into the ground.

I don't think that's really true.  Look at Nixon's resignation. The Republicans held the White House for 16 of the next 20 years.

Look at those members of Congress that have been forced out of Congress due to scandal and corruption. In almost all instances, the political parties themselves haven't suffered.

As amateurish as Trump has been, 40% of voters still support him. That's hardly a death knell for Republicans, and they'll never run a worse nominee.
sadly this is truer than it should be.  Trump could make good on his comment about shooting someone in the streets of NY and not taking a hit in popularity thanks to his core voting block that doesn't give a rat's ass about the rest of the country/world and will support him no matter what. 

Re: James Comey fired
« Reply #26 on: May 10, 2017, 03:00:05 PM »

Offline More Banners

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I hope conservatives are enjoying the last time they'll have power for a very long time, because only a fool would be oblivious to the fact that Trump is going to run the entire Party and brand into the ground.

Well, one would think.

The overwhelming unpopularity of GWB and the slaughter of the 2008 election, followed immediately by the slaughter the other way in 2010, however, give me pause to believe either can be out for long in a dichotomous political environment. The electorate doesn't have the attention span to hold a grudge, the 24 hour news cycle will put something else on to attend to/distract, and opposition media and party will find enough fault with the solution to the last  brouhaha to warrant their return.

2-party politics don't provide much protection for the republic.  But I like a multiparty parliamentary system where new coalitions form all the time more than our standard collections (e.g. I don't understand how religious social conservatives and libertarians vote for the same dude, right? Wouldn't they be naturally opposed?)

Re: James Comey fired
« Reply #27 on: May 10, 2017, 04:02:48 PM »

Offline mef730

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I hope conservatives are enjoying the last time they'll have power for a very long time, because only a fool would be oblivious to the fact that Trump is going to run the entire Party and brand into the ground.

Sadly, I believed that before the election, as well.

Mike
Tickets for the 2017-18 season for sale at face value! Thread here: http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=93612.0

Re: James Comey fired
« Reply #28 on: May 10, 2017, 04:55:09 PM »

Offline Jon

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I hope conservatives are enjoying the last time they'll have power for a very long time, because only a fool would be oblivious to the fact that Trump is going to run the entire Party and brand into the ground.

I don't think that's really true.  Look at Nixon's resignation. The Republicans held the White House for 16 of the next 20 years.

Look at those members of Congress that have been forced out of Congress due to scandal and corruption. In almost all instances, the political parties themselves haven't suffered.

As amateurish as Trump has been, 40% of voters still support him. That's hardly a death knell for Republicans, and they'll never run a worse nominee.
sadly this is truer than it should be.  Trump could make good on his comment about shooting someone in the streets of NY and not taking a hit in popularity thanks to his core voting block that doesn't give a rat's ass about the rest of the country/world and will support him no matter what.

But all of you (including some others on this thread) aren't taking into account the shifting demographics of America. Republicans have been able to dodge scandals like Nixon and ineptness like GW Bush because they could still rely on white male voters to support them. With the percentage of white males in the country shrinking by the day, the Republicans are going to have a very hard time convincing anyone else to vote for them. As inept as W. was, he at least did not outwardly spew scorn against minorities or women. Under Trump, they have become the party synonymous with that.

Don't believe me? Ask Pat Buchanan, who essentially was a less unhinged Trump before Trump who also loves Trump now. On This American Life recently he was asked about Trump and in the midst of his praise he said the following:


"North Carolina is shifting. Georgia is shifting demographically. The American Southwest is shifting. The Hispanic vote is growing. It's going to be almost impossible to win. Trump won, but he lost by 3 million votes. And 80,000 votes the other way and we'd still be talking about the eternal lock the Democratic Party's got on the presidency. In other words, they have a problem, the Republican Party. It's far harder for me to solve than the one I saw after Barry Goldwater. You could see the path-- the path up the mountainside there. I don't see it now."


And that's a guy who loves Trump and wants to see him succeed. To paraphrase an earlier part of the interview, he basically said if Trump passes the legislation he wants to keep immigrants out, Republicans will fail with minorities in future election cycles, but if he doesn't the country will continue to get more and more diverse and Republicans will also fail in future election cycles. The whole transcript can be seen below.


https://m.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/615/transcript

Re: James Comey fired
« Reply #29 on: May 10, 2017, 05:08:42 PM »

Offline MBunge

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I hope conservatives are enjoying the last time they'll have power for a very long time, because only a fool would be oblivious to the fact that Trump is going to run the entire Party and brand into the ground.

I don't think that's really true.  Look at Nixon's resignation. The Republicans held the White House for 16 of the next 20 years.

Look at those members of Congress that have been forced out of Congress due to scandal and corruption. In almost all instances, the political parties themselves haven't suffered.

As amateurish as Trump has been, 40% of voters still support him. That's hardly a death knell for Republicans, and they'll never run a worse nominee.
sadly this is truer than it should be.  Trump could make good on his comment about shooting someone in the streets of NY and not taking a hit in popularity thanks to his core voting block that doesn't give a rat's ass about the rest of the country/world and will support him no matter what.

But all of you (including some others on this thread) aren't taking into account the shifting demographics of America.

The demographic delusion is one of the things that got Trump elected in the first place.  Democrats and liberals can't just sit back and expect sometehing to deliver them to power.  They need to run good candidates who have compelling answers to the problems facing the country today.

Republicans led the country into a pointless war and set off a massive foreign policy fiasco we will be dealing with for decades, presided over the start of the worst economic crisis since the Great Depression, nearly blew another hole in the global economy by voting to not raise the debt ceiling AND are on the wrong side of one social issue after another.

Republicans also currently hold the White House, the Senate, the House, a majority of governorships and a majority of state legislatures.

Democrats need to start thinking HARD about how both of those things can be possible and give up this adolescent fantasy that they're perfect and they just need the rest of the world to catch up to them.

Mike