Gordon Hayward + Jimmy Butler - What does everyone think?

[Green-18]

First things first, it feels great to no longer deal with this first round playoff talk!  Regardless of trade deadline thoughts, Rondo's injury, no fireworks at the draft etc., the direction of this team is very difficult to criticize after a 3rd straight season with legitimate improvement.  I have always maintained the position that I will trust the process as long as we continue to improve each season while maintaining flexibility with our roster and draft picks.

Anyways, my friend and I were talking about the idea of pairing Jimmy Butler and Gordon Hayward after last nights game.  For arguments sake let's assume Hayward comes to Boston.  How much is everyone willing to part with in order to bring in Jimmy Butler?  I will start by commenting on the players that I  believe are guaranteed to be involved.

Avery Bradley -  Is it not awesome to see a healthy Avery Bradley playing at his best in the playoffs?  He has truly become a great player that I think can be a starting 2 on a legitimate East contender.  I think we are all impressed with his defensive effort on Butler throughout the series.  Even more impressive was his ability to score at high level deep into the series without any drop-off on the defensive end.  The major downside for AB will always be durability.  I would hate to see him leave but I would pull the trigger on the right Butler deal.

Jae Crowder - Jae has been one of the more confusing players throughout this season.  He spent all summer working on his shooting range and it looked like he had become an excellent spot up shooter.  Unfortunately it's not translating into the playoffs and his shooting in general has slipped throughout the season.  His ability to attack the basket is also severely limited against playoff caliber defense.  We all know what Jae can bring on the defensive end but let's face the facts.  Jimmy can do everything Jae does and a lot more.  This upcoming series with Washington is a big one for Crowder.  It's his turn to leave a lasting imprint on a series.  We are going to need his best to get by Washington.

Jimmy Butler - I honestly like the idea of bringing in Jimmy more after watching this series.   He is in a toxic situation in Chicago and for the most part I thought he gave 110% every night.  It's also clear that he was laboring from knee pain as the series went deeper.  Jimmy is clearly willing to do whatever it takes to win and I believe his scoring efficiency would be through the roof if he was paired with IT and Hayward.  There's no reason to think that he wouldn't thrive under Brad's system and our culture.  Ultimately, Jimmy's biggest value would ultimately be in a playoff series against the Cavs.  I love the idea of him defending LeBron for 7 games while only being the 3rd scoring option.

What does everyone think about the remaining pieces that would be needed to make a trade for Butler?  Marcus, Jaylen, Terry, BK17 and BK18, would all be discussed for sure.  Also, does anyone want us to take back anything else from Chicago?

As for my final thoughts, Jimmy becomes way more valuable to me if we can bring in a guy like Hayward.  Jimmy alone doesn't move the needle enough for me to part with too many assets.

[Darío SpanishFan]

Without a good big man to pair with Horford (which we couldn't afford if we get Hayward + Butler), it's no use to have so many quality wings. Also, Olynyk, Amir, Jerebko and Zeller are FAs and we wouldn't be able to retain more than one of them with this new hypothetical situation).

We need some balance and depth. I don't think it's a good idea to get Hayward AND Butler.

[NHCelticsFan]

Ideally I think the best scenario is to add Hayward in free agency.  Adding Butler would cost us assets where as Hayward would cost us cap space (I know we would need to let guys go to free up the space, but nothing we would lose would be as valuable as what we would have to throw in to a Butler trade.)

Jae has been a mixed bag so far, and while I love his fit on this team, I wouldn't hesitate to add Hayward, who I view as a major upgrade. 

I'm honestly all set on Jimmy.  Beggars can't be choosers though, and if he is the best option then I trust DA to make the right move.

Really hoping LA can finish off Utah and Hayward comes to Boston!

[Celtics4ever]

 I would not give up assets for Butler and try to sign Hayward.  But I don't think we need them both.

Rather see Hayward and a legit four.

[Green-18]

Without a good big man to pair with Horford (which we couldn't afford if we get Hayward + Butler), it's no use to have so many quality wings. Also, Olynyk, Amir, Jerebko and Zeller are FAs and we wouldn't be able to retain more than one of them with this new hypothetical situation).

We need some balance and depth. I don't think it's a good idea to get Hayward AND Butler.

No doubt this is the biggest concern.  The latest projection puts the cap at $101 million next year.  Also, what is the latest rule on the mid-level exception?  I believe we would only have one if we are already over the cap right?  Essentially we couldn't add depth with the mid-level until after next season.

Butler - $18.6 Million
Horford - $28 Million
Hayward - $30.6 Million
Isaiah - $6.3 Million
Jaylen/Marcus - Avaerage $4.5 Million(Assuming one of them would be gone)
Terry Rozier - $1.2 Million
Bobby Portis - $1.5 Million ( an idea for a trade)
Yabusele - $1.8 Million(used rookie scale from last year.  correct me if I am wrong)
Zizic - $1.2 Million

This all adds up to $93.7 Million.  We would still have some cap room leftover and we could fit a our 2017 BKN draft pick if we somehow kept it in the deal.  I honestly think there is a way to make this work.  We also need to factor in the idea of proven veterans that will take minimum money to play for a potential winner.  I haven't looked up names but I'm sure Danny could convince someone to sign.

[playdream]

AB has proved himself(and my worries wrong)that he can perform at this big stage, if he keeps it into second round i say we just keep him instead of JB

JB's knee already worn out at this age thanks to Thib/Hoiberg

[Green-18]

I would not give up assets for Butler and try to sign Hayward.  But I don't think we need them both.

Rather see Hayward and a legit four.

I definitely like the idea of adding a proven 4 as well,especially if we can keep our depth and maintain some cap flexibility.  I figured it would be an interesting conversation to see what people thought of IT, Hayward, Butler, and Horford together on the front line.  Depth would definitely be the biggest concern for sure.

[Irish Stew]

Without a good big man to pair with Horford (which we couldn't afford if we get Hayward + Butler), it's no use to have so many quality wings. Also, Olynyk, Amir, Jerebko and Zeller are FAs and we wouldn't be able to retain more than one of them with this new hypothetical situation).

We need some balance and depth. I don't think it's a good idea to get Hayward AND Butler.

No doubt this is the biggest concern.  The latest projection puts the cap at $101 million next year.  Also, what is the latest rule on the mid-level exception?  I believe we would only have one if we are already over the cap right?  Essentially we couldn't add depth with the mid-level until after next season.

Butler - $18.6 Million
Horford - $28 Million
Hayward - $30.6 Million
Isaiah - $6.3 Million
Jaylen/Marcus - Avaerage $4.5 Million(Assuming one of them would be gone)
Terry Rozier - $1.2 Million
Bobby Portis - $1.5 Million ( an idea for a trade)
Yabusele - $1.8 Million(used rookie scale from last year.  correct me if I am wrong)
Zizic - $1.2 Million

This all adds up to $93.7 Million.  We would still have some cap room leftover and we could fit a our 2017 BKN draft pick if we somehow kept it in the deal.  I honestly think there is a way to make this work.  We also need to factor in the idea of proven veterans that will take minimum money to play for a potential winner.  I haven't looked up names but I'm sure Danny could convince someone to sign.

  I prefer George and Hayward but certainly would settle for something like this. I'm not sure it's feasible to keep the pick and account for 3 empty roster spots at $800,000+ each. It would be a tight fit. It would be nice if we could.

[td450]

I like the idea of bringing in Hayward as as free agent. But that means we need to clear space out at small forward, not cause a traffic jam.

Count me as someone who sees Jaylen Brown needing 20+ minutes next year and 30+ for the next decade after that. Getting Hayward probably means moving Crowder and other assets for a quality big. We don't need another wing that needs starters minutes.

After the series we just saw, can anyone still think Butler is more valuable than Avery Bradley AND a couple of other extremely valuable assets? I don't think so.

[Rosco917]

IMO Hayward is the way to go. You'd give up no assets. He healthy, still has upside remaining, young, and a big improvement at the 3.

Replace Amir at the 4/5 with a real 5. Not a huge name, but a solid 5 that understands the C's go small often, and he'll be expected to grow his game.

Draft Fultz if at all possible.

Trading for George or Buller will be costly, it should be plan B.

[Green-18]

I like the idea of bringing in Hayward as as free agent. But that means we need to clear space out at small forward, not cause a traffic jam.

Count me as someone who sees Jaylen Brown needing 20+ minutes next year and 30+ for the next decade after that. Getting Hayward probably means moving Crowder and other assets for a quality big. We don't need another wing that needs starters minutes.

After the series we just saw, can anyone still think Butler is more valuable than Avery Bradley AND a couple of other extremely valuable assets? I don't think so.

I am with you on the upside of Jaylen!  I think we will see a nice bump in production from him next year.   

As for Butler, he alone isn't worth Avery + additional assets.  However, I think his value to us would increase significantly if he was surrounded by Hayward and IT.  The three of them together in crunch time would be very problematic to defend for the entire Eastern Conference.  As I mentioned earlier, I am only on pro-Butler if it means we are adding another All-Star caliber player to go along with him.  Jimmy was able to prove that he could score efficiently at a high level on one of the worst offensive teams in the NBA.  I think he would be excellent in a role that didin't require him to carry the scoring load every single night.

[SHAQATTACK]

For me ,  not speaking for anybody else ......I want to wait and see where our draft number 1-4 first lands   The #1 pick is worth more to me than either of Butler or Gordon.  Dude is so talented , he maybe  a franchise player at some point.

Also , the player they draft 1-4 .....might influence the STAR I would want to sign and  Trades of other Celtic talent . 

No matter what .....it's gonna put pressure on LeBron like he has never had in the East.

[rochrist]

No Butler plz.

[Quetzalcoatl]

Hayward > Butler.  If we get Fultz, then I'd rather have him at that salary at the 2.  If both of those happen, then we packahe Crowder, Bradley and some picks for DeAndre.

[LilRip]

I wouldn't want Butler AND Hayward. I'll be happy with either one and a quality big. Hayward via FA + big via trade or Butler via trade + big via FA would probably have to include Crowder and/or Bradley though. I like both players a lot but I think it'll be for the best.