As Most Of Us Believed/Hoped, Ainge Is Staying The Patient Course...

[Bobshot]

The longer we wait to get a star and compete ......the cost of keeping the team is going to sky rocket .......we will wind up with a huge payroll .     

If DA waits for the perfect storm to use the assets .....will th eowners buy into paying the luxury tax to keep the players we need to win a title ...... a la Cavs .

I don't see how to put together a team to beat these guys without going into luxury tax.   Everybody is getting max money.

A TP for mentioning payroll!

Ainge is mindful of Butler and George's favorable contracts compared to what it will cost for FAs this summer. A savings of about $10M per yr for each. About $5M per yr less for Drummond, who is younger and has a longer contract. That's a huge savings. You have to balance that against the value of those draft picks. Dice thrown twice--first, the lottery; second, did I pick the right 19yo? And how much does a no.1 pick cost? Risky business. 

[iadera]

I actually don't see a course which we are going. If we'll pull back yet at another deadline, I can't figure out what do we do with all these good (not great) players and tons of picks. OK, we take Ball or Fultz, but then what do we do with Thomas?! We have to choose something. Now is the time.

Unless we have a path to a championship THIS year, I would argue now is definitely not the time. Deadlines make people do crazy things. See Thornton for IT a couple of years ago or Hield for Cousins this year. Unless we are winning the trade, I am all set with what we have (barring a small trade using a couple of 2nds to shore up our rebounding)

I totaly agree with you, but I'm reffering to talks that Danny doesn't want to include Nets pick in any trade, or Jaylen, or Crowder. If we talk about players like you mentioned Thornton, or Hield, then I'm all Danny's. But if we are talking about acquiring Butler or George, I must disagree. We have such assets exactly in order to get this star-players, isn't this all sense of having assets - to bring these big names??? 

[JHTruth]

I actually don't see a course which we are going. If we'll pull back yet at another deadline, I can't figure out what do we do with all these good (not great) players and tons of picks. OK, we take Ball or Fultz, but then what do we do with Thomas?! We have to choose something. Now is the time.

Unless we have a path to a championship THIS year, I would argue now is definitely not the time. Deadlines make people do crazy things. See Thornton for IT a couple of years ago or Hield for Cousins this year. Unless we are winning the trade, I am all set with what we have (barring a small trade using a couple of 2nds to shore up our rebounding)

I totaly agree with you, but I'm reffering to talks that Danny doesn't want to include Nets pick in any trade, or Jaylen, or Crowder. If we talk about players like you mentioned Thornton, or Hield, then I'm all Danny's. But if we are talking about acquiring Butler or George, I must disagree. We have such assets exactly in order to get this star-players, isn't this all sense of having assets - to bring these big names??? 

Starting to think we should start calling them "The Assets" as in Philly's "Process"..

[iadera]

I actually don't see a course which we are going. If we'll pull back yet at another deadline, I can't figure out what do we do with all these good (not great) players and tons of picks. OK, we take Ball or Fultz, but then what do we do with Thomas?! We have to choose something. Now is the time.

Unless we have a path to a championship THIS year, I would argue now is definitely not the time. Deadlines make people do crazy things. See Thornton for IT a couple of years ago or Hield for Cousins this year. Unless we are winning the trade, I am all set with what we have (barring a small trade using a couple of 2nds to shore up our rebounding)

I totaly agree with you, but I'm reffering to talks that Danny doesn't want to include Nets pick in any trade, or Jaylen, or Crowder. If we talk about players like you mentioned Thornton, or Hield, then I'm all Danny's. But if we are talking about acquiring Butler or George, I must disagree. We have such assets exactly in order to get this star-players, isn't this all sense of having assets - to bring these big names??? 

Starting to think we should start calling them "The Assets" as in Philly's "Process"..

But if we turn them into a star, we will avoid Philly's sindrom.

[hwangjini_1]

I actually don't see a course which we are going. If we'll pull back yet at another deadline, I can't figure out what do we do with all these good (not great) players and tons of picks. OK, we take Ball or Fultz, but then what do we do with Thomas?! We have to choose something. Now is the time.

Unless we have a path to a championship THIS year, I would argue now is definitely not the time. Deadlines make people do crazy things. See Thornton for IT a couple of years ago or Hield for Cousins this year. Unless we are winning the trade, I am all set with what we have (barring a small trade using a couple of 2nds to shore up our rebounding)

I totaly agree with you, but I'm reffering to talks that Danny doesn't want to include Nets pick in any trade, or Jaylen, or Crowder. If we talk about players like you mentioned Thornton, or Hield, then I'm all Danny's. But if we are talking about acquiring Butler or George, I must disagree. We have such assets exactly in order to get this star-players, isn't this all sense of having assets - to bring these big names??? 

Starting to think we should start calling them "The Assets" as in Philly's "Process"..

But if we turn them into a star, we will avoid Philly's sindrom.

not sure whether the spelling in the bolded was intentional, but in any case at tp for that spelling. very nice. 

[Moranis]

The poll result doesn't seem to agree with the topic title. 

Most posters want something to happen--because they sense the team has weaknesses to address or the season might well be wasted. Especially that rebounder up front. I think at least something along those lines will happen. I doubt Butler or George are available, but you never know. Drummond looms as a sleeper. Bogut looks like the safest bet.

Yeah. The goal posts are on the move. Again.

Fascinating, inaccurate and convenient how a minor move has suddenly become "stay the course," isn't it?

Those poll results are clear - the vast majority want something to happen. That isn't "staying the patient course" the OP advocates - in thread after thread after thread he starts.

of course the opening post talks about making minor moves so that is clearly the intent of the thread.

[CelticGuardian]

With Amir at 12 million and Zeller at 8 million when they are a clear step behind the rest of the starting lineup, those guys might just end up being dead money if they are not moved. No one will take them without picks attached or good young players, both of which we have an embarrassment of. So this is not complacency as many of you think, it is Ainge looking to fleece somebody and the teams are already turned off, too many GMs have already been embarrassed by this man. This team is still unproven in the playoffs and Ainge will be a fool to stand pat based on results that aren't there, if he stands pat is because draft day is when he will actually know what to do.

RJ Hunter was cut because the team simply took on way too many rookies in 2015. Jackson or Mickey might be next if Ainge keeps playing both sides. IT, Bradley, Smart, or Rozier might be next if he drafts another guard and they are really good. Tough choices, but I honestly don't see what the clear option is for the C's that will allow them to overthrow Cleveland this year or the next. I know we can win a regular season game against the Cavs with Butler on the team, I'm just not so sure about a playoff series. Butler's is as unproven in the playoffs as this C's team. They say draft picks are gamble but so is cashing out everything that's been built to this point on the chance that Butler + C's Core = "Transcendent Player" and he'll all of a sudden become a player that is not inferior to LeBron.

[boscel33]

Celtics = Patriots!


Stay the course Danny.......

The Celtics are not the Patriots.

The Patriots win Super Bowls every other year--almost.

The Celtics haven't won a Championship in almost 10 years.

C's were pretty good in the Bird ERA, no? 

"Today's situation is very reminiscent of the Bird era. Red hoarded alot of draft picks and used them as both trading chips and assets. Detroit's 1st was held by the Celtics and was traded to Golden State for a young talented center in Robert Parish and their 3rd pick which landed Kevin McHale.

Parish was 27 when we acquired him, but we got him for a 2 for 1 deal that also landed us McHale. Danny could use the BKN 2017 to draft Fultz and trade him for the highest bidder on the draft and could possibly settle for Jackson and one more additional solid young talent. I don't think sending it for Butler is the best value for it."

Red advised the owners to go with Ainge and he learned from him.

Seems to me, he's on the right course.

[oldtype]

I keep saying this, but it's really simple:

(1) The only way we field a viable "win now" team is to sign an FA AND make a trade.  Making a trade now caps us out and locks us in as the 2nd best team in the East (which we already are.)

(2) If we can't do (1), the best option is to enjoy the team as is and wait for Smart, Brown, 2017, and 2018 to develop.  The next great Celtics team will come sometime in the next 4~5 years with some carryovers from the current team + young players.

[JHTruth]

I keep saying this, but it's really simple:

(1) The only way we field a viable "win now" team is to sign an FA AND make a trade.  Making a trade now caps us out and locks us in as the 2nd best team in the East (which we already are.)

(2) If we can't do (1), the best option is to enjoy the team as is and wait for Smart, Brown, 2017, and 2018 to develop.  The next great Celtics team will come sometime in the next 4~5 years with some carryovers from the current team + young players.

If we were doing option 2, then why in the heck did we put Horford on the books?

[BitterJim]

With Amir at 12 million and Zeller at 8 million when they are a clear step behind the rest of the starting lineup, those guys might just end up being dead money if they are not moved. No one will take them without picks attached or good young players, both of which we have an embarrassment of. So this is not complacency as many of you think, it is Ainge looking to fleece somebody and the teams are already turned off, too many GMs have already been embarrassed by this man. This team is still unproven in the playoffs and Ainge will be a fool to stand pat based on results that aren't there, if he stands pat is because draft day is when he will actually know what to do.

RJ Hunter was cut because the team simply took on way too many rookies in 2015. Jackson or Mickey might be next if Ainge keeps playing both sides. IT, Bradley, Smart, or Rozier might be next if he drafts another guard and they are really good. Tough choices, but I honestly don't see what the clear option is for the C's that will allow them to overthrow Cleveland this year or the next. I know we can win a regular season game against the Cavs with Butler on the team, I'm just not so sure about a playoff series. Butler's is as unproven in the playoffs as this C's team. They say draft picks are gamble but so is cashing out everything that's been built to this point on the chance that Butler + C's Core = "Transcendent Player" and he'll all of a sudden become a player that is not inferior to LeBron.

Amir is expiring and Zeller is non guaranteed for next year, so they aren't negative assets, they're just kind of there.  They're great for salary matching purposes (as there's no long term money to necessitate including a pick), and there's no long term loss from keeping them, so they're just kind of there.

Hunter probably wouldn't have been cut if we had an extra roster spot, but let's not pretend like he was an actual asset.  There's a reason that the Bulls decided they'd rather have an empty roster spot (which they still haven't filled!) than Hunter.  The number of rookies didn't help his chances, but if we're honest, he didn't have great chances of making it in the NBA anyway.

And Butler has 29 playoff games under his belt (I'm ignoring the 4 total minutes over 3 games he played in 2011-12), so he's a bit more playoff seasoned than the Celtics (only Horford has played more playoff games - Bradley is 2nd on the team with only 21).  He did well over 12 games in 2014-15, so I wouldn't say that he's unproven.  He's not gonna take down Lebron on his own (which is just another reason to wait until the offseason if we want to get him), but don't sell him short.

[BitterJim]

I keep saying this, but it's really simple:

(1) The only way we field a viable "win now" team is to sign an FA AND make a trade.  Making a trade now caps us out and locks us in as the 2nd best team in the East (which we already are.)

(2) If we can't do (1), the best option is to enjoy the team as is and wait for Smart, Brown, 2017, and 2018 to develop.  The next great Celtics team will come sometime in the next 4~5 years with some carryovers from the current team + young players.

If we were doing option 2, then why in the heck did we put Horford on the books?

Why wouldn't we? He makes the team better now (and gave us a real shot at KD), and we gave up zero assets (except for cap room) to get him.  It's not like we traded a bunch of young assets for him, we gave up nothing and got a 4x All Star that fits our system perfectly.

[Surferdad]

What percentage of teams that build patiently with draft picks win titles?

What are the chances that any of our picks become all-stars, let alone HOF superstars (the type of draft picks that lift teams to titles).

I wanted Cousins lol but it's difficult now.

He literally would have filled most of our remaining needs alone.

Oh well..

Difficult, but not impossible.  He is a FA after this season or next (?)

Yes, he fills ALL of our needs, but Ainge doesn't want the headache.

[CelticGuardian]

With Amir at 12 million and Zeller at 8 million when they are a clear step behind the rest of the starting lineup, those guys might just end up being dead money if they are not moved. No one will take them without picks attached or good young players, both of which we have an embarrassment of. So this is not complacency as many of you think, it is Ainge looking to fleece somebody and the teams are already turned off, too many GMs have already been embarrassed by this man. This team is still unproven in the playoffs and Ainge will be a fool to stand pat based on results that aren't there, if he stands pat is because draft day is when he will actually know what to do.

RJ Hunter was cut because the team simply took on way too many rookies in 2015. Jackson or Mickey might be next if Ainge keeps playing both sides. IT, Bradley, Smart, or Rozier might be next if he drafts another guard and they are really good. Tough choices, but I honestly don't see what the clear option is for the C's that will allow them to overthrow Cleveland this year or the next. I know we can win a regular season game against the Cavs with Butler on the team, I'm just not so sure about a playoff series. Butler's is as unproven in the playoffs as this C's team. They say draft picks are gamble but so is cashing out everything that's been built to this point on the chance that Butler + C's Core = "Transcendent Player" and he'll all of a sudden become a player that is not inferior to LeBron.

Amir is expiring and Zeller is non guaranteed for next year, so they aren't negative assets, they're just kind of there.  They're great for salary matching purposes (as there's no long term money to necessitate including a pick), and there's no long term loss from keeping them, so they're just kind of there.

Hunter probably wouldn't have been cut if we had an extra roster spot, but let's not pretend like he was an actual asset.  There's a reason that the Bulls decided they'd rather have an empty roster spot (which they still haven't filled!) than Hunter.  The number of rookies didn't help his chances, but if we're honest, he didn't have great chances of making it in the NBA anyway.

And Butler has 29 playoff games under his belt (I'm ignoring the 4 total minutes over 3 games he played in 2011-12), so he's a bit more playoff seasoned than the Celtics (only Horford has played more playoff games - Bradley is 2nd on the team with only 21).  He did well over 12 games in 2014-15, so I wouldn't say that he's unproven.  He's not gonna take down Lebron on his own (which is just another reason to wait until the offseason if we want to get him), but don't sell him short.

I understand both those guys are not guaranteed next year, but the point is why sign them to so much expiring money to just let them walk?... just seems like that goes against whatever Danny intended to do with those contracts. That's why I believe a trade will happen, whether big or small.

[Surferdad]

With Amir at 12 million and Zeller at 8 million when they are a clear step behind the rest of the starting lineup, those guys might just end up being dead money if they are not moved. No one will take them without picks attached or good young players, both of which we have an embarrassment of. So this is not complacency as many of you think, it is Ainge looking to fleece somebody and the teams are already turned off, too many GMs have already been embarrassed by this man. This team is still unproven in the playoffs and Ainge will be a fool to stand pat based on results that aren't there, if he stands pat is because draft day is when he will actually know what to do.

RJ Hunter was cut because the team simply took on way too many rookies in 2015. Jackson or Mickey might be next if Ainge keeps playing both sides. IT, Bradley, Smart, or Rozier might be next if he drafts another guard and they are really good. Tough choices, but I honestly don't see what the clear option is for the C's that will allow them to overthrow Cleveland this year or the next. I know we can win a regular season game against the Cavs with Butler on the team, I'm just not so sure about a playoff series. Butler's is as unproven in the playoffs as this C's team. They say draft picks are gamble but so is cashing out everything that's been built to this point on the chance that Butler + C's Core = "Transcendent Player" and he'll all of a sudden become a player that is not inferior to LeBron.

Amir is expiring and Zeller is non guaranteed for next year, so they aren't negative assets, they're just kind of there.  They're great for salary matching purposes (as there's no long term money to necessitate including a pick), and there's no long term loss from keeping them, so they're just kind of there.

Hunter probably wouldn't have been cut if we had an extra roster spot, but let's not pretend like he was an actual asset.  There's a reason that the Bulls decided they'd rather have an empty roster spot (which they still haven't filled!) than Hunter.  The number of rookies didn't help his chances, but if we're honest, he didn't have great chances of making it in the NBA anyway.

And Butler has 29 playoff games under his belt (I'm ignoring the 4 total minutes over 3 games he played in 2011-12), so he's a bit more playoff seasoned than the Celtics (only Horford has played more playoff games - Bradley is 2nd on the team with only 21).  He did well over 12 games in 2014-15, so I wouldn't say that he's unproven.  He's not gonna take down Lebron on his own (which is just another reason to wait until the offseason if we want to get him), but don't sell him short.

I understand both those guys are not guaranteed next year, but the point is why sign them to so much expiring money to just let them walk?... just seems like that goes against whatever Danny intended to do with those contracts. That's why I believe a trade will happen, whether big or small.

Why?  For cap space to sign 2 max FA's over the summer.  I would not say it was pointless to sign them.  They did help the team this year.