How are we going to fix our defense?

[jpotter33]

Terry rozier
Gerald green
Jordan mickey
Jaylen brown

These guys (weak links) need to be replaced in the rotation by competent wing defenders in order for the defense to get better.

Also, one of the bigs - - Horford, KO, Amir, Jerebko - - needs to be replaced with somebody who grabs at least 25% of defensive boards. A real glass eater.

I'm not sure it can be boiled down just to that. They have been terrible defensively, but there have been games where Rozier, Brown, and Green have all hardly played and we still look terrible defensively. The starters have been pretty bad defensively themselves.

Moving Al back to the 5 seems to be the first and most essential move that needs to be made. Getting a better rebounder and someone mobile enough to play next to Al seems to be the next course of action.

Big challenge is finding somebody mobile enough to defend at the four but who can also defend the glass.

Who out there is a four defensively but a five offensively? Faried?

You got me. Milsap probably fits that mold the best. Even if he's not the best rebounder on the market, he provides the best overall balance of the type of player we need.

Faried would certainly help out rebounding, but I thought he was pretty lackluster otherwise defensively?

[Rosco917]

Terry rozier
Gerald green
Jordan mickey
Jaylen brown

These guys (weak links) need to be replaced in the rotation by competent wing defenders in order for the defense to get better.

Also, one of the bigs - - Horford, KO, Amir, Jerebko - - needs to be replaced with somebody who grabs at least 25% of defensive boards. A real glass eater.

I'm not sure it can be boiled down just to that. They have been terrible defensively, but there have been games where Rozier, Brown, and Green have all hardly played and we still look terrible defensively. The starters have been pretty bad defensively themselves.

Moving Al back to the 5 seems to be the first and most essential move that needs to be made. Getting a better rebounder and someone mobile enough to play next to Al seems to be the next course of action.

Big challenge is finding somebody mobile enough to defend at the four but who can also defend the glass.

Who out there is a four defensively but a five offensively? Faried?

The man of few words Chris22 knows the answer. "Get Noel," he would tighten up interior defense and protect the rim. He can defend 4's and 5's. Not a star...but will be a solid defender for years to come.

[mr. dee]

Wait till next season. Yabu and Zizic plus the BKN picks will just upgrade some of our biggest holes.

[Redz]

How did defense go from being this team's hallmark, to its weakness?

There were many pundits predicting the Celtics would be a top 2 defense in the leagut this year.

Is it as simple as an overachieving team having the underdog mindset the last two seasons, then thinking they were good enough to simply "outscore" teams this year by shooting 30 3's a night this season?

The best guys are mostly good defenders but none of them is a particularly good defensive rebounder.

On the bench, we've just got too many guys lacking experience to maintain quality team defense. That's where we really miss Turner and Sullinger.

True.  Interested to see what Sully brings to Toronto. 

[KGs Knee]

We simply need a proper center.  Horford is great as a change of pace small-ball center, but not as a primary option to protect the paint and clean the glass.

Horford has actually been doing pretty well defending the perimeter this year.  He usually stays with his man and is able to funnel the opposition into what is supposed to be the 'teeth' of the defense.  Unfortunately, there is no teeth to the defense with sieves like Amir/Zeller manning the center spot.

[jpotter33]

We simply need a proper center.  Horford is great as a change of pace small-ball center, but not as a primary option to protect the paint and clean the glass.

Horford has actually been doing pretty well defending the perimeter this year. He usually stays with his man and is able to funnel the opposition into what is supposed to be the 'teeth' of the defense.  Unfortunately, there is no teeth to the defense with sieves like Amir/Zeller manning the center spot.

I don't buy that. To me, he's looked slow and unable to reach many of the stretch 4's. He's also terrible on defending PnR's out there.

http://www.celticslife.com/2017/01/video-breaking-down-al-horfords.html

[slightly biased bias fan]

Horford has stated earlier he doesn't want to play the 5 which is a problem all in itself, but short term we should go after,

- Baynes (Detroit have too many big men)
- Bogut (probably a rental) but he is plagued by injuries
- Faried
- Chandler, 6th in total rebounding
- Ibaka

[Chris22]

Terry rozier
Gerald green
Jordan mickey
Jaylen brown

These guys (weak links) need to be replaced in the rotation by competent wing defenders in order for the defense to get better.

Also, one of the bigs - - Horford, KO, Amir, Jerebko - - needs to be replaced with somebody who grabs at least 25% of defensive boards. A real glass eater.

I'm not sure it can be boiled down just to that. They have been terrible defensively, but there have been games where Rozier, Brown, and Green have all hardly played and we still look terrible defensively. The starters have been pretty bad defensively themselves.

Moving Al back to the 5 seems to be the first and most essential move that needs to be made. Getting a better rebounder and someone mobile enough to play next to Al seems to be the next course of action.

Big challenge is finding somebody mobile enough to defend at the four but who can also defend the glass.

Who out there is a four defensively but a five offensively? Faried?

The man of few words Chris22 knows the answer. "Get Noel," he would tighten up interior defense and protect the rim. He can defend 4's and 5's. Not a star...but will be a solid defender for years to come.

Noel also runs the floor well and can dunk on the pick and roll.

[Bobshot]

Whatever Stevens is doing, it's generating a heckuva lot of shots for IT, and not a great amount of production elsewhere. This was an overtime game, and you had a bunch of guys in double figures, but that hasn't been the case recently.

With the Celtics traditionally, you look for 5-6 guys in double figures. That means the ball is being distributed for the best shots. Plus, of course, they traditionally have had a rebounder or two to get the ball. You don't see any of that right now. All I see is IT dominating. I should add that Horford has never been a big rebounder. A 7-8 rpg guy. You have to have somebody next to him who can rebound consistently (Sullinger at his best was a better rebounder than Horford), and they don't have anybody right now.

I don't think this team can get better unless the management values rebounding. I don't see that yet.

[GRADYCOLNON]

The Celtics are not going to fix the defense this season.  A lot of the issues have been tied to missing important players for periods of time throughout the season; however, the absences are not the underlying problem.  The problem the team is two-sided: the league shoots more three point shots and the roster is built for offense.  The change across the league to increase the pace of play and the number of three point attempts is something the coaching around the league will address accordingly, just as the league has evolved in the past.  The more pressing issue is the composition of the team's roster.  Although filled with many talented defenders, such as Bradley, Crowder, Johnson, and Smart, the team still has many defensive flaws, many of them are issues overlooked or unwilling to be revealed by the media and the players.  I see the woes more closely connected to the team's attempt to use offense to cover up their defensive miscues, a storyline that defines our best player.
If the NBA offered the same award as the NFL for most outstanding offensive player, no doubt  Isaiah Thomas would sweep the voting.  But unlike the NFL's easy flowing substitutions, the NBA requires players to contribute to both offense and defense.  Andy Windhorst, an ESPN reporter, clarified to the sporting world why Isaiah did not win the starting nod for this upcoming All-Star game, stating Isaiah is statistically the worst defender in the entire NBA.  Now, I hardly believe that this is fair, considering he plays for the majority of his minutes against proven NBA starting point guards, the most talented players in the game. So without a doubt, I am confident to say that Windhorst is wrong, but it does put into perspective why the defense might be having issues.  Looking more closely into Isaiah's defensive statistics, his Defensive Box score +/-  per 100 possessions has dropped to -4.0 from -2.0 last year, and his Defensive rating has skyrocketed close to 110.  While this evidence seems likely to be influenced dramatically by the performance of the entire team this season, it is not reassuring and suggests that Isaiah has taken a step back defensively, somewhat justifiably due to his dramatic increase on offensive.  Despite how the offense has managed to cover up his lack of defense, it is beginning to put unnecessary pressure on other aspects and players on the court.  The missed assignments are putting pressure on our best defenders to leave their assignments, forcing them into difficult rotations that lead to opponents getting easier looks.  These missed assignments are contributing to poor defensive rebounding position, something the team struggles with already. 
Now, it is unfair to criticize Isaiah and place this large burden as I have suggested, and I haven't intended to discredit his contributions to winning for this team as he continues to will this team to victories.  And I know other players could be doing a better job defensively; however, it seems to me that it couldn't hurt for Isaiah to tighten up his defense back to respectability. I think the Celtics will start to patch up the more blatant rebounding lapses and keep opponents scoring from reaching about 105 points.

[KGs Knee]

We simply need a proper center.  Horford is great as a change of pace small-ball center, but not as a primary option to protect the paint and clean the glass.

Horford has actually been doing pretty well defending the perimeter this year. He usually stays with his man and is able to funnel the opposition into what is supposed to be the 'teeth' of the defense.  Unfortunately, there is no teeth to the defense with sieves like Amir/Zeller manning the center spot.

I don't buy that. To me, he's looked slow and unable to reach many of the stretch 4's. He's also terrible on defending PnR's out there.

http://www.celticslife.com/2017/01/video-breaking-down-al-horfords.html

So, I watched the video, and it seems the narrators are just not seeing what is happening.  They say a lot of things that make sense, but don't actually match what is going on.

Almost every time Horford sends his assignment in the PnR where he is supposed to, Amir is either late stepping up, or fails to altogether.  Plain and simple, Amir is killing the defense with his immobility.  You need to pay attention to the nuance there.

Also, The data doesn't support their claims of Horford being poor defending the three.

Horford is contesting the 7th most three-point attempts among players > 6'10" and holding his opponent to below their season average percentage wise.  Olynyk contests a few less shots, but at a better percentage.  So, maybe Olynyk is a bit better at it, but he also gets beat much more often, it's just when Olynyk gets beat he's got Horford covering for him.  If Horford gets beat he has no one to cover for him (well, he does - Amir - but it might as well be no one).

In terms of rim protection, on shots from within 6ft of the rim, Horford is holding his opponents to slightly below their season average also, but not really any better than he is doing defending three-point attempts.

So, like I said, he's fine at both, but when you factor in his rebounding issues, it makes no sense to make him a full-time center.  If we added an athletic center to clean the glass and protect the paint not only would that help our defense, but the extra offensive rebounds would only boost our offense.  And it's not like a non-shooting big would kill our spacing.  If Amir isn't hurting us there, it's doubtful someone more mobile would.

[Smitty77]

The Celtics are not going to fix the defense this season.  A lot of the issues have been tied to missing important players for periods of time throughout the season; however, the absences are not the underlying problem.  The problem the team is two-sided: the league shoots more three point shots and the roster is built for offense.  The change across the league to increase the pace of play and the number of three point attempts is something the coaching around the league will address accordingly, just as the league has evolved in the past.  The more pressing issue is the composition of the team's roster.  Although filled with many talented defenders, such as Bradley, Crowder, Johnson, and Smart, the team still has many defensive flaws, many of them are issues overlooked or unwilling to be revealed by the media and the players.  I see the woes more closely connected to the team's attempt to use offense to cover up their defensive miscues, a storyline that defines our best player.
If the NBA offered the same award as the NFL for most outstanding offensive player, no doubt  Isaiah Thomas would sweep the voting.  But unlike the NFL's easy flowing substitutions, the NBA requires players to contribute to both offense and defense.  Andy Windhorst, an ESPN reporter, clarified to the sporting world why Isaiah did not win the starting nod for this upcoming All-Star game, stating Isaiah is statistically the worst defender in the entire NBA.  Now, I hardly believe that this is fair, considering he plays for the majority of his minutes against proven NBA starting point guards, the most talented players in the game. So without a doubt, I am confident to say that Windhorst is wrong, but it does put into perspective why the defense might be having issues.  Looking more closely into Isaiah's defensive statistics, his Defensive Box score +/-  per 100 possessions has dropped to -4.0 from -2.0 last year, and his Defensive rating has skyrocketed close to 110.  While this evidence seems likely to be influenced dramatically by the performance of the entire team this season, it is not reassuring and suggests that Isaiah has taken a step back defensively, somewhat justifiably due to his dramatic increase on offensive.  Despite how the offense has managed to cover up his lack of defense, it is beginning to put unnecessary pressure on other aspects and players on the court.  The missed assignments are putting pressure on our best defenders to leave their assignments, forcing them into difficult rotations that lead to opponents getting easier looks.  These missed assignments are contributing to poor defensive rebounding position, something the team struggles with already. 
Now, it is unfair to criticize Isaiah and place this large burden as I have suggested, and I haven't intended to discredit his contributions to winning for this team as he continues to will this team to victories.  And I know other players could be doing a better job defensively; however, it seems to me that it couldn't hurt for Isaiah to tighten up his defense and make a couple more stops a game. If he doesn't make any changes, I'm fairly confident we will end up another chapter of the teams replicating the 7 second or less Suns that failed to reach beyond the pseudo contender label.

So you MUST have INSIDE INFO that Danny is NOT going to adjust this line-up before on on the trade deadline!!!!!!!!

Please share.

Smitty77

[konkmv]

With Thomas in, Bradley underachieving defensively and no bigs...  No we will not be much better

[Evantime34]

The rebounding hasn't been much worse than it was last year when we had an elite defense. It might help but last year we saw that size isn't necessary to have a great defense.

Teams are attempting and making more 3's against us than they did last year. Maybe that is due to the new NBA where every team is shooting more 3's.

Maybe it is because we are packing icing/dropping down our bigs on pick and rolls. It might help to add a defender that can guard multiple positions so that we switch screens.

[KGs Knee]

Horford has stated earlier he doesn't want to play the 5 which is a problem all in itself

I'm not concerned about this. Al is such a smart person and professional if Brad tells him playing center full time is best for the team I see no reason he wouldn't oblige. And besides, it after all where he played the vast majority of his career.

I'm mean maybe he took his chance with a new team to be a bit selfish to play where he wanted, instead of where the team needs him but also consider the team is currently playing him in the role they need him to. Horford has to play center when he shares the court with Amir/Zeller, neither of those guys can play any where else. Horford and Kelly kind of switch, but by and large Horford plays center.

Boston is using him how they have to given the roster.

Maybe it is because we are packing icing/dropping down our bigs on pick and rolls. It might help to add a defender that can guard multiple positions so that we switch screens.

Well, keeping with the idea of Horford being the primary center, which I think he actually already is, technically, where I see the most obvious need is on the wing.

Right now usually we roll out a 'closing' lineup of Horford - Crowder - Bradley - Thomas. The 5th player in that lineup has changed over the season, but those are the 4 main guys. So the question is, what type of player do we add to that. Keeping the ability to switch as the top priority, unless we can get a truly athletic center, we're probably best off getting a combo 3/4 type who has length and athleticism to effectively guard positions 1-4, at least in switches. Someone a little bit taller and longer than Crowder.

Kawhi would be perfect, but obviously that isn't happening. If Paul George is available I would look at him. Being more realistic, a Trevor Ariza type would be huge for this team. Shoot a lot of threes and defend multiple positions.