Carmelo to Boston (a good fit?)

[Vermont Green]

Listening to Mike Gorman on the radio this AM on Celtics @7 on 98.5. Says there is a prevalent thought in C's basketball operations that Carmelo would be a fantastic fit in the C's system.

Not exactly how I wanted to start my Saturday.

Mike Gorman is not a guy that says stuff just to get attention so I suspect there is truth to this.  I think Carmelo would make us better but I fear he is not as durable as Pierce was late in his career so I am not sure how much he has left.  Bottom line for me is that I would trade for Carmelo but I would not include a BKN pick and without one, I am not sure NYK do it.

Matching salaries is not so easy either.  I guess Amir ($12M) would have to be in.  Crowder would make sense ($6M) but that is only $18M and Carmelo is $24.5M.  Would we have to inlcude Zeller too?  Then add a bunch of picks or rights holds (such as Yabusele).  I don't know, tough deal to pull off.

Not that complicated.

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=hpjpmqh

You have Smart instead of picks and Jerebko instead of Crowder.  So for NYK it is basically Smart as all the others are expiring.  I like Smart but maybe.  I think I would rather do Crowder/Rozier in place of Jerebko and Smart as I think Carmelo takes Crowder's minutes and Crowder is of much more interest to NYK over Jerebko.

[tazzmaniac]

Somehow Knick fans think Melo worth Brooklyn pick. Wishful thinking.

Delusional thinking.  Brooklyn probably would be willing to give them their 2020 1st for Melo.  Now I might be willing to give up both Brooklyn picks for Melo and Porzingis.   
http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=zkx2dzg 

[Phantom255x]

So Carmelo Anthony is worth a 2017 Brooklyn Pick...

Yet people around here are like "I would try to snag Cousins or Butler without giving up the 2017 Nets Pick" 

[tazzmaniac]

So Carmelo Anthony is worth a 2017 Brooklyn Pick...

Yet people around here are like "I would try to snag Cousins or Butler without giving up the 2017 Nets Pick" 

Well played.  TP.   

[Monkhouse]

Say  people are high as !@#$, but then you offer up the Brooklyn pick which is one of the most valuable asset this year for Carmelo Anthony.

Lol, I could say the same for you. What are you smoking?

Anthony is a great player, but he's not worth a top 5 pick.

[Monkhouse]

I should've saved the Klay Thompson thread.

I offered the 2016 Brooklyn pick, years ago for Klay, and I think Bradley added onto with either Memphis or Clippers.

You have no idea how badly some user castrated me.

And now we're talking about Carmelo for a Brooklyn pick? LOL HAHAHA. You're better off with Crowder if you're just going to deal two of your most prized possessions.

I found it.

I would argue that I would still do the Brooklyn pick for Klay, but I would try to push it to next year. In hopes that the Nets somehow make enough financial and advantageous moves to get them ahead in the game.

Either way, I'm not budging any of the Brooklyn Nets pick for a player like Melo.

Nets 2016 pick unprotected, Clippers pick, any of the Celtics 2nd rounder, Avery Bradley, and KO for Draymond Green/Klay Thompson.

I read these threads all the time without commenting and finally registered because this is by far the most moronic trade proposal I've ever seen. Seriously.

You want the Celtics to give up:
An unprotected 1st round pick two years out from an already disappointing team of aging veterans (lottery is very possible)
AND
A late 1st round draft pick
AND
A second round pick
AND
A solid role-playing SG who is a lockdown defender and improving offensive player that can be likely be signed for $7 million/year (12.80 PER)
AND
A 2nd year, 7-foot, potential nightly mismatch who improved down the stretch and averaged 8.7 PPG and 5.3 RPG coming off of the bench (15.27 PER as a rookie)

For

A SG that is only slightly better than Bradley (14.32 PER)
AND
A former 2nd round pick that averaged 6.2 PPG in his second NBA season and wouldn't start for the Celtics (12.73 PER)

While you're at it, why not throw in Rondo for Golden State's 2nd round pick this year? Mind you, you proposed this trade in the context of the Cs having a high-lottery pick this year that can be used on a variety of star SG and SF prospects, NTM that the team you propose would still not even be close to contending. Are you completely insane?

[Phantom255x]

I should've saved the Klay Thompson thread.

I offered the 2016 Brooklyn pick, years ago for Klay, and I think Bradley added onto with either Memphis or Clippers.

You have no idea how badly some user castrated me.

And now we're talking about Carmelo for a Brooklyn pick? LOL HAHAHA. You're better off with Crowder if you're just going to deal two of your most prized possessions.

I found it.

I would argue that I would still do the Brooklyn pick for Klay, but I would try to push it to next year. In hopes that the Nets somehow make enough financial and advantageous moves to get them ahead in the game.

Either way, I'm not budging any of the Brooklyn Nets pick for a player like Melo.

Nets 2016 pick unprotected, Clippers pick, any of the Celtics 2nd rounder, Avery Bradley, and KO for Draymond Green/Klay Thompson.

I read these threads all the time without commenting and finally registered because this is by far the most moronic trade proposal I've ever seen. Seriously.

You want the Celtics to give up:
An unprotected 1st round pick two years out from an already disappointing team of aging veterans (lottery is very possible)
AND
A late 1st round draft pick
AND
A second round pick
AND
A solid role-playing SG who is a lockdown defender and improving offensive player that can be likely be signed for $7 million/year (12.80 PER)
AND
A 2nd year, 7-foot, potential nightly mismatch who improved down the stretch and averaged 8.7 PPG and 5.3 RPG coming off of the bench (15.27 PER as a rookie)

For

A SG that is only slightly better than Bradley (14.32 PER)
AND
A former 2nd round pick that averaged 6.2 PPG in his second NBA season and wouldn't start for the Celtics (12.73 PER)

While you're at it, why not throw in Rondo for Golden State's 2nd round pick this year? Mind you, you proposed this trade in the context of the Cs having a high-lottery pick this year that can be used on a variety of star SG and SF prospects, NTM that the team you propose would still not even be close to contending. Are you completely insane?

That's Celticsblog for you.

Everyone brings up "we should have gotten Greek Freak instead of KO" but I bet you almost 90% of the people arguing that didn't think about getting the Greek Freak at the time as well (I didn't also).

Oh and the infamous Fab Melo instead of Draymond Green lol.

[rayallen_35_24]

Brad Auerbach ‏@CelticsPost  5h5 hours ago
More
 Mike Gorman said "some people in the Celtics organization think that Melo would fit well in Brad's system" just now 98.5 with @AdamMKaufman

[seancally]

Obviously it needs to keep being said because you guys won't quit with the Melo ideas, but he's old, washed up, and has always been an inefficient volume scorer who doesn't defend.  Crowder right now is better, and is on an incredible value of a contract.  In two years Crowder will still be good, and Melo will be a version of Paul Pierce this year. (Sorry Paul, but you should have retired.)

Melo is 32, Pierce is 39. At 34 (08/09), Pierce averaged 20.5pts/5.6rbs/3.5asts. He went on to play 4 more years at a pretty similar clip (including a Finals berth and an ECF series against Miami). I actually think those two athletes are a good comparison - they're a similar size and have a similar game. Melo is actually, probably, a slightly better offensive player and rebounder. When unmotivated, both can be selfish, lazy and bad defenders.

Melo's contract ends in, what, 2 years after this season, so he'd be about 35 by then. At which point we could let him go and expect his productivity to be in decline anyway.

And come on - Jae Crowder is not a better player than Carmelo. Better defender, sure, but let's stop acting like Jae is anything close to Tony Allen or Kawhi defensively.

EDIT: Gonna leave this here for further reference on the Pierce / Melo comparison. Basic stats, but still:

http://www.landofbasketball.com/player_comparison/carmelo_anthony_vs_paul_pierce.htm

PP was 31 in 08/09 - not 34. That kind of busts your entire analysis above.

Let us look at PP at 32.

In 09/10, when PP was 32 and playing with two other HOFers, he was effective but no longer really a #1 option. 2010 was his last All-Star game. His last All-League was 08/09. He was 09/10 and 10/11 were truly his last two good seasons and those still weren't as good s the prime of his career. After that pretty much everything was in decline and his TS% kind of falls off a cliff. He was okay until 35 but at that point he's getting to be a 3rd option in the offense. And most of that was with Rajon Rondo feeding him the ball - a guy who would pass up a layup to get someone else an assist (he averaged over 11 assists in 3 of 4 of those years and led the league twice). That's pretty much the best case scenario for an aging PP and he still wasn't as effective. 

So this myth of playing "4 more years at a similar clip" isn't true at all. He was already playing at a diminished capacity and continued to decline. Now, let's move to Anthony. He's 32 now. His stats have taken a similar dive already. His contract has two more years to run after this year at $53m. Are you prepared to pay $27m for a #3 option in 2018/19 and knowing you lost a valuable draft pick/players (remember Crowder's OUTSTANDING contract) to do so?

Yeah, that dude made mistakes. Still not the point.

Point being, none of Pierce/KG/Ray were in their glimmering mid-or-even-late 20's when we WON. That's what it's about, winning. Pierce was 31 just a year earlier from whence you just dogged him and we won the Championship that year my man. So even though these guys were in their 30s, and their production was down across the board for all of them, they won. Melo's production of course is down. He's not at the top of his prime, but he still averages 20+, he's still an All Star. He can rebound, block shots, hit the three, make free throws AND get to the line often, he's got mad experience and poise, and he should be more motivated than he's ever been in his life if this actually happens. Sounds a lot like where KG was at in '07 to me. Ask yourself, would the rest of the league, the LeBrons and Durants and Hardens and Leonards, be happy if Carmelo went to the Celtics?? Hell no! And in today's NBA if anyone is worried about 2 years and $50 million for a 20-6-3 guy you're not paying attention. At all. If we add him and don't lose any non-Amir starters we can beat anyone. Our hat will be in the ring. That's what sports is all about no?

My point exactly. I mistyped - Pierce was 31, but the rest of my point holds true. Paul continued to play at a high level for 3-4 more years. Meanwhile, Carmelo is 32 now, plays a remarkably similar game to Pierce, has had a remarkably similar career, and has only a few years left on his (admittedly big) contract. He will be a high caliber player during that span. If Jae Crowder ever in his career hits the level Anthony is at now, I will be surprised. So if we're talking Melo for Jae / AJ / JJ / Rozier maybe and a Celtics pick (non-BKN), it's a no-brainer.

Here's a question: Which player do you think will decline first / provide less over the rest of his contract - Carmelo Anthony or Al Horford? Because if big contract / declining star isn't worth it, than we shouldn't have signed Al to that deal. But of course most of us - myself included - think that was a clear win for us.

[jpotter33]

The Knicks are about to lose at home to the Suns. It honestly wouldn't surprise me if Melo gets traded before the deadline.

I still would like him if it doesn't cost us too much to get him.

[jpotter33]

Lol Anthony looks absolutely defeated after missing the potential game winner to lose to the Suns.

[Ogaju]

I should've saved the Klay Thompson thread.

I offered the 2016 Brooklyn pick, years ago for Klay, and I think Bradley added onto with either Memphis or Clippers.

You have no idea how badly some user castrated me.

And now we're talking about Carmelo for a Brooklyn pick? LOL HAHAHA. You're better off with Crowder if you're just going to deal two of your most prized possessions.

I found it.

I would argue that I would still do the Brooklyn pick for Klay, but I would try to push it to next year. In hopes that the Nets somehow make enough financial and advantageous moves to get them ahead in the game.

Either way, I'm not budging any of the Brooklyn Nets pick for a player like Melo.

Nets 2016 pick unprotected, Clippers pick, any of the Celtics 2nd rounder, Avery Bradley, and KO for Draymond Green/Klay Thompson.

I read these threads all the time without commenting and finally registered because this is by far the most moronic trade proposal I've ever seen. Seriously.

You want the Celtics to give up:
An unprotected 1st round pick two years out from an already disappointing team of aging veterans (lottery is very possible)
AND
A late 1st round draft pick
AND
A second round pick
AND
A solid role-playing SG who is a lockdown defender and improving offensive player that can be likely be signed for $7 million/year (12.80 PER)
AND
A 2nd year, 7-foot, potential nightly mismatch who improved down the stretch and averaged 8.7 PPG and 5.3 RPG coming off of the bench (15.27 PER as a rookie)

For

A SG that is only slightly better than Bradley (14.32 PER)
AND
A former 2nd round pick that averaged 6.2 PPG in his second NBA season and wouldn't start for the Celtics (12.73 PER)

While you're at it, why not throw in Rondo for Golden State's 2nd round pick this year? Mind you, you proposed this trade in the context of the Cs having a high-lottery pick this year that can be used on a variety of star SG and SF prospects, NTM that the team you propose would still not even be close to contending. Are you completely insane?

TP to you for posting that total beatdown you got from CM0. He actually registered to deliver that knockout blow to you.

[Ogaju]

To address some of the earlier posts about KO vs Greek freak. I believe the reason Danny gets a lot of heat from the fans is that he is the one that teased the fans about Giannis. He found him and even went over to scout him. The videos of him showed a pretty athletic and versatile 6'9' guy. It was weird to see Danny trade up to pick another player before him.

Also, it is funny how most of those that support a trade for Melo are new members of CB. Ranging in status from 'Jaylen Brown' to 'Isaiah Thomas'.

[tenn_smoothie]

No

[Geo123]

No

+1